Thai waiters/waitresses spreading Covid19.....

[LukKrueng]

18 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

Do you still need it explained to you ???

 

No one is saying or suggesting that vaccinated people ‘cannot’ or ‘do not’ spread Covid-19...  However, there is less transmission within a vaccinated community than an unvaccinated community.

 

There will always be examples with any illness with any vaccine that a vaccinated person transmitted a disease - this is not proof that vaccines are ineffective.

 

How is it that this is such a struggle for some people to understand ?

 

 

It can be explained to you, but it can’t be understood for you, you’ll have to engage the grey matter and think, just a little bit should do it, it's not a difficult concept.

Read my reply above re numbers and % and then try to explain your panic. 

We already know the vaccine protection doesn't last long (some counties started planning a 4th jab only 3-4 months after the 3rd (which was rolled 6 months after the 2nd...) and due to the fast changes in the virus (mutations and variants) no one even knows how effective the original vaccines are. 

With the infection rate over the last 2 years and the number of serverly sick people (Currently 0.07% of the population of Thailand is "infected" with covid 19 [active cases/ population] and 0.0019% of the population considered seriously ill)  it's wrong to look at every person around you as a disease spreading machine. It is pretty much as the fear of aids was in the 80's-90's when aids was considered a gay's disease and all know gays were looked upon as pure danger.

[Danderman123]

On 12/11/2021 at 2:06 PM, Liverpool Lou said:

How come?  Vaccinations don't stop you from passing on the virus to others!

You don’t understand that vaccinated people are less likely to spread Covid? Really?

 

 

[Danderman123]

On 12/12/2021 at 2:37 PM, LukKrueng said:

Enough with the stupid panic!!!

Currently 0.07% of the population of Thailand is "infected" with covid 19 (active cases/ population). If you happen to be next to a really infected person (not just pcr positive that we should all know by now means nothing) AND get infected AND get seriously sick (0.0019% of the population)  you should run out and buy a lottery ticket. 

 

Below is the stats from worldmeter.info today, 12 Dec 2021.

So, you are saying that Thailand has been successful in reducing Covid infections, via vaccination and other measures.

[Danderman123]

On 12/12/2021 at 2:50 PM, LukKrueng said:

Yes, from the 0.29% (total active cases around the world) to what? 0.27% (at 95% protection as claimed by some vaccine manufacturers)?

As someone already mentioned above - wrap yourself in cotton and plastic bag and house under the bed. That'll give 100% protection from everything (sickness, accidents, bad marriage, crimes against you - you name it) 

Because people who are not crazy don’t do that.

 

Most people get vaccinated and follow social distancing measures, which serves to reduce new infections. Unfortunately, there remain some poorly educated people who don’t understand the nature of Covid, right up till they get intubated.

Edited December 13, 2021 by Danderman123

[fjb 24]

27 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

You don’t understand that vaccinated people are less likely to spread Covid? Really?

 

 

Give it up already. Everybody can spread covid equally, it should be obvious by now.

Conclusions As this field continues to develop, clinicians and public health practitioners should consider vaccinated persons who become infected with SARS-CoV-2 to be no less infectious than unvaccinated persons. These findings are critically important, especially in congregate settings where viral transmission can lead to large outbreaks.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.07.31.21261387v6.full-text

Edited December 13, 2021 by fjb 24

[richard_smith237]

14 minutes ago, fjb 24 said:

27 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

You don’t understand that vaccinated people are less likely to spread Covid? Really?

 

 

Give it up already. Everybody can spread covid equally, it should be obvious by now.

Conclusions As this field continues to develop, clinicians and public health practitioners should consider vaccinated persons who become infected with SARS-CoV-2 to be no less infectious than unvaccinated persons. These findings are critically important, especially in congregate settings where viral transmission can lead to large outbreaks.

how are people still struggling with this ???

 

 

Vaccinated people have less chance of contracting Covid-19 in the first place... thus, those who don’t contract Covid-19 won’t spread it !!!!....  unless of course we have a waiter handling a glass which is all some posters seem concerned about !!! ????

 

Additionally, in aggregate vaccination reduces the symptoms in breakthrough cases, thus those who suffer breakthrough cases suffer symptoms for a more brief period than those who are not vaccinated and are thus contagious for a shorter period of time and cough less, sneeze less and generally transmit less. 

 

The idea that Vaccinated and unvaccinated people present the same risk of transmission highlights how significantly some people fail to understand this very basic principle. 

 

 

 

[richard_smith237]

5 hours ago, LukKrueng said:

With the infection rate over the last 2 years and the number of serverly sick people (Currently 0.07% of the population of Thailand is "infected" with covid 19 [active cases/ population] and 0.0019% of the population considered seriously ill)  it's wrong to look at every person around you as a disease spreading machine.

You mean social isolation methods, mask wearing and more recently vaccinations have been effective ?.... 

[LukKrueng]

31 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

So, you are saying that Thailand has been successful in reducing Covid infections, via vaccination and other measures.

No, I'm saying one should look at local and world stats and not just buy into the panic spread by the media and some governments around the world. 

I'm not denying there's a Corona virus, not saying it doesn't kill in some extrime conditions (many if not most of the deaths reported as covid related are not actually caused by covid, but by other preexisting conditions). 

In about 2 years of the pandemic less than 4% of the world population got infected and only about 2% of those died. 

The panic around covid has caused much more damage and harm than the virus itself

[richard_smith237]

38 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

On 12/12/2021 at 2:50 PM, LukKrueng said:

Yes, from the 0.29% (total active cases around the world) to what? 0.27% (at 95% protection as claimed by some vaccine manufacturers)?

As someone already mentioned above - wrap yourself in cotton and plastic bag and house under the bed. That'll give 100% protection from everything (sickness, accidents, bad marriage, crimes against you - you name it) 

Because people who are not crazy don’t do that.

 

Most people get vaccinated and follow social distancing measures, which serves to reduce new infections. Unfortunately, there remain some poorly educated people who don’t understand the nature of Covid, right up till they get intubated.

 

He doesn’t even know the difference between efficacy and effectiveness as it relates to vaccines. 

[richard_smith237]

1 minute ago, LukKrueng said:

No, I'm saying one should look at local and world stats and not just buy into the panic spread by the media and some governments around the world. 

I'm not denying there's a Corona virus, not saying it doesn't kill in some extrime conditions (many if not most of the deaths reported as covid related are not actually caused by covid, but by other preexisting conditions). 

In about 2 years of the pandemic less than 4% of the world population got infected and only about 2% of those died. 

The panic around covid has caused much more damage and harm than the virus itself

Yes... Look into stats... I’ve added a link for England and Wales Stats: 

 

England & Wales total deaths Av per year from 2014-2019 ?? >> 539,083 people per year

England & Wales total deaths in 2020 ?? >> 614,114 people.

 

In England and Wales in 2020 there were 75,031 excess deaths.

Thats 14% excess deaths compared to the 5 year average (2014-2019)

 

So far in 2021 in England and Wales there have been 48600 excess deaths

Thats 10% excess deaths compared to the same period (up to week 47 in 2014-2019) 

 

When more than 10% of people die than would normally be expected to die in any given period your statements playing down Covid-19 do not match the facts unless the additional 10-14% death rate does not concern you. 

 

 

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/datasets/weeklyprovisionalfiguresondeathsregisteredinenglandandwales

 

 

 

 

 

 

[fjb 24]

CDC director says "omicron variant cases in US are mostly mild so far....More than three-quarters of those patients had been vaccinated, and a third had boosters, Walensky said. Boosters take about two weeks to reach full effect, and some of the patients had received their most recent shot within that period, CDC officials said.

https://www.adn.com/nation-world/2021/12/08/cdc-director-says-omicron-variant-cases-in-us-are-mostly-mild-so-far/

 

Seems irrelevant now who is spreading covid/omicron at a higher rate as no one (vaxxed or unvaxxed) is immune from it or protected from transmission, and with waning protection and now vaccine resistant covid mutations in Europe and N.A. the problem should be obvious by now to those fixated on pushing their anti-vaxer narrative.

[Danderman123]

11 hours ago, LukKrueng said:

 

The panic around covid has caused much more damage and harm than the virus itself

How many people have died from the panic around Covid? 

[richard_smith237]

6 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

18 hours ago, LukKrueng said:

 

The panic around covid has caused much more damage and harm than the virus itself

How many people have died from the panic around Covid? 

I know what you are trying to suggest... but the answer is likely quite a lot....

 

When factoring in government response; closing hospitals for all but emergency cases, delayed treatments (i.e. cancer treatments),  stress related illnesses, people have lost work etc, financially ruined, suicides etc....   There is definitely an associated cost of the strong reaction many governments have taken.

 

The question is clearly was this strong response the correct response or an over reaction while more reasonable isolation methods could have been put in place ?

 

The word ‘panic’ is most definitely incorrect, Covid-19 most definitely has required a government response, but that response has not come come without cost to the economy, livelihood, health and ultimately lives. 

 

 

For the past couple of years the governments of every country have been dealing with a situation whereby there are no correct responses, just a succession of 'least wrong’ responses - this then of course provides easy fuel for criticism by those who would never be in a situation to problem solve themselves. 

 

It's extremely easy to be a critic from an armchair or even when not making any decisions or being responsible or accountable for any decisions made. I’m sure we’d all think very differently at the sharp end and likely come up with similar responses and face similar criticism (*Christmas parties excluded !)

 

 

 

 

 

 

[KhunLA]

2 of the 3 restaurants we frequent weekly, have been closed, at least once that we know of, due to 'staff' infected.

 

Guess it was safe to return ... ????

 

I dove with 100+ sharks.  A virus, seriously, you're joking right ... ????

[Trvlr55]

On 12/12/2021 at 1:17 AM, rwill said:

Is that any different from restaurants in other countries?

 

Anyway we are all going to be exposed to Covid at some point.  Best to not worry about it too much.  Getting vaccinated is the best thing you can do.

After almost 2 years of "Covid Mania" I would imagine every person on the planet has been exposed to Covid multiple times. Some contract it, some don't. Younger, Healthy people, and those vaccinated have a much greater chance of not being infected when exposed.

[Enzian]

I suspect from this thread that most of you here don't want to hear about my Thai live-in girlfriend, who I sleep with, and who has been going to work at her old massage shop nearly every day for a while.

[SunsetT]

1 hour ago, Enzian said:

I suspect from this thread that most of you here don't want to hear about my Thai live-in girlfriend, who I sleep with, and who has been going to work at her old massage shop nearly every day for a while.

Bottle to bottle, glass to glass, hum to hum....555

[teatree]

On 12/13/2021 at 4:55 PM, richard_smith237 said:

how are people still struggling with this ???

 

 

Vaccinated people have less chance of contracting Covid-19 in the first place... thus, those who don’t contract Covid-19 won’t spread it !!!!....  unless of course we have a waiter handling a glass which is all some posters seem concerned about !!! ????

 

Additionally, in aggregate vaccination reduces the symptoms in breakthrough cases, thus those who suffer breakthrough cases suffer symptoms for a more brief period than those who are not vaccinated and are thus contagious for a shorter period of time and cough less, sneeze less and generally transmit less. 

 

The idea that Vaccinated and unvaccinated people present the same risk of transmission highlights how significantly some people fail to understand this very basic principle. 

 

 

 

The data from the UK for months now has been suggesting that for certain age groups you a more likely to be infected if you are VACCINATED.

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1043608/Vaccine_surveillance_report_-_week_51.pdf

 

This is the UK Covid surveillance report.  Table 11 on p40 shows that for the ages 18 - 69 it is the VACCINATED who are more likely to be infected (per 100,000) than the unvaccinated.  For the age group 40 - 49 you are more than twice as likely to be infected if vaccinated.

 

 

[Heng]

The massage shops still open probably aren't helping either.

[Danderman123]

On 12/17/2021 at 2:43 PM, Enzian said:

I suspect from this thread that most of you here don't want to hear about my Thai live-in girlfriend, who I sleep with, and who has been going to work at her old massage shop nearly every day for a while.

I am sure you have gripping stories about her customers, but it’s off-topic.

[Danderman123]

On 12/17/2021 at 11:34 AM, Trvlr55 said:

After almost 2 years of "Covid Mania" I would imagine every person on the planet has been exposed to Covid multiple times. Some contract it, some don't. Younger, Healthy people, and those vaccinated have a much greater chance of not being infected when exposed.

There is an antibody test available to check if you have been exposed to Covid.

[Broken Record]

On 12/12/2021 at 6:17 PM, connda said:

Fearful people should simply avoid restaurants if the wait staff makes them feel uncomfortable.  And if they go to a restaurant by vehicle, they should factor in the dangers of driving on Thai roads where over 12,000 have died on the road and countless tens of thousands injured.  It's best to stay safely at home, masked.

Globally there are about 1.3 Million road related Deaths and 10's of Millions of Injuries, best not to drive anywhere on the planet, and don't forget to wear a mask, don't poison yourself with Alcohol or be stupid enough to smoke cigarettes the last 2 alone kills Millions each and every year. 

Edited January 1, 2022 by Broken Record

[Enzian]

5 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

I am sure you have gripping stories about her customers, but it’s off-topic.

The only story I've heard is about the Thai man who literally ran out of the shop to avoid giving a tip.

[NanLaew]

On 12/13/2021 at 11:43 AM, LukKrueng said:

It is pretty much as the fear of aids was in the 80's-90's when aids was considered a gay's disease and all know gays were looked upon as pure danger.

Taking that viewpoint onboard, I would be pretty annoyed if I found out the punter in the next seat on the plane trying to strike up conversation with me was an anti-vaxer.

[NanLaew]

On 12/13/2021 at 5:05 PM, LukKrueng said:

In about 2 years of the pandemic less than 4% of the world population got infected and only about 2% of those died.

In the grand scheme of things, that's still a considerable amount of sick people and dead bodies, no? Just because you, like myself,** don't know anyone personally who has tested positive, got sick or died from it.

 

What %age of the global sick and the dead would you suggest is a more meaningful indicator of the risk?

 

** Just got a WhatsApp message from my mate in the UK, tested positive on New Year's Eve.

[NanLaew]

1 hour ago, Heng said:

The massage shops still open probably aren't helping either.

They typically don't massage the bits of the anatomy that we breath through.

[SunsetT]

55 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

They typically don't massage the bits of the anatomy that we breath through.

Dunno bout that...Quite a few on here talk through their a r s e.....555

 

[LukKrueng]

22 hours ago, NanLaew said:

Taking that viewpoint onboard, I would be pretty annoyed if I found out the punter in the next seat on the plane trying to strike up conversation with me was an anti-vaxer.

Wouldn't you be more annoyed if you found out he/ she is triple vaxed but actually has covid? 

[LukKrueng]

22 hours ago, NanLaew said:

What %age of the global sick and the dead would you suggest is a more meaningful indicator of the risk?

1. There has never been in human history testings in such grand scale for any contagious disease so really nothing to compare to. 

2. Statistics of comparison between deaths in the last 2 years and previous years (which also takes into account the growth in population) would help putting things in perspective. 

 

Let me make myself clear: I do NOT deny the existence of covid nor the severity in some cases.

I do claim however that most if not all measures taken against covid are way over the top, mostly not medically but politically motivated and the harm done to the mass population around the world far exceeds the harm of the actual disease. It is obvious that vaccines will not solve the problem yet not enough resources were put into developing a covid specific cure (meds) and increasing hospitals capacity to treat those who actually need treatment. 

[Scott]

11 hours ago, LukKrueng said:

1. There has never been in human history testings in such grand scale for any contagious disease so really nothing to compare to. 

2. Statistics of comparison between deaths in the last 2 years and previous years (which also takes into account the growth in population) would help putting things in perspective. 

 

Let me make myself clear: I do NOT deny the existence of covid nor the severity in some cases.

I do claim however that most if not all measures taken against covid are way over the top, mostly not medically but politically motivated and the harm done to the mass population around the world far exceeds the harm of the actual disease. It is obvious that vaccines will not solve the problem yet not enough resources were put into developing a covid specific cure (meds) and increasing hospitals capacity to treat those who actually need treatment. 

Antiviral medications are extremely important and we'll see if the ones recently approved are able to make a dent in the pandemic.  It should be understood that antivirals are strong medications and many, many people cannot take them. 

 

Antivirals don't prevent infection.