Be safe out there. Some are playing roulette.

[Dumbfounded]

On 1/13/2022 at 6:41 PM, Danderman123 said:

And yet, hospitalizations in the US are at a peak, and over 2,000 died yesterday. So, maybe it is possible that the scientists and doctors are right, and you are wrong.

 

On 1/14/2022 at 12:00 PM, Dumbfounded said:

yes, the total average. Just wanted to have an idea what 2000 alleged deaths from covid represented in the total average number

 

14 hours ago, Credo said:

It's a common tactic of a certain group to deflect and minimize the seriousness of the pandemic.   How many times have you read it's no worse than the flu, or a bad cold or if people weren't obese or otherwise unhealthy?   It's how they roll and how they troll.   

Really? So I'm a troll for wanting to see what 2000 covid deaths represented in the total ave daily figure for all deaths? From where I'm sitting it's people like you who are the trolls, just parroting anything MSM tells you, and berating the likes of me for thinking differently to you. Well, 2000 x 365 = 730,000 out of a pop of approx 330 million. Want to work that out as a percentage? Maybe you can discuss what a <deleted> I am with your super vaxed triple boostered mates down the pub while you reinfect yourselves and just blame it all on the unvaxed

[Danderman123]

9 minutes ago, Dumbfounded said:

 

 

Really? So I'm a troll for wanting to see what 2000 covid deaths represented in the total ave daily figure for all deaths? From where I'm sitting it's people like you who are the trolls, just parroting anything MSM tells you, and berating the likes of me for thinking differently to you. Well, 2000 x 365 = 730,000 out of a pop of approx 330 million. Want to work that out as a percentage? Maybe you can discuss what a <deleted> I am with your super vaxed triple boostered mates down the pub while you reinfect yourselves and just blame it all on the unvaxed

The troll part comes from attempting to disguise your Covid Denier role by just asking questions.

 

Just lay out your position, don’t try to camouflage it.

[Dumbfounded]

10 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

The troll part comes from attempting to disguise your Covid Denier role by just asking questions.

 

Just lay out your position, don’t try to camouflage it.

Covid Denier? Where have I ever said that it doesn't exist, just proves my point that you are the troll - people who don't want the vax isn't because they deny covid exists, it's because they don't trust a drug with no long term studies and trust their own immune system

[Danderman123]

8 minutes ago, Dumbfounded said:

Covid Denier? Where have I ever said that it doesn't exist, just proves my point that you are the troll - people who don't want the vax isn't because they deny covid exists, it's because they don't trust a drug with no long term studies and trust their own immune system

Okay, so you are not a Covid Denier, but instead are an anti-vaxxer. You should check out the Herman Cain Award:

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/HermanCainAward/

 

plenty of people there who spouted the same nonsense as you, before they died of Covid.

 

 

[Dumbfounded]

6 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

Okay, so you are not a Covid Denier, but instead are an anti-vaxxer. You should check out the Herman Cain Award:

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/HermanCainAward/

 

plenty of people there who spouted the same nonsense as you, before they died of Covid.

 

 

And plenty of vaxed people have died from it too, and that number is growing, just look at how many athletes have dropped during games from suspected heart attacks lately in USA & UK. If you want to vax then I'm happy for you, I have nothing against anyone who wants to have it, but I don't. I really don't understand your argument, I imagine you've been double vaxed and maybe a booster too, so why do you fear people like me and troll us, as though we're the only point of infection/spread?

[KhaoNiaw]

9 minutes ago, Dumbfounded said:

just look at how many athletes have dropped during games from suspected heart attacks lately in USA & UK. 

That is just utter nonsense. Already proven to be a complete lie

[Dumbfounded]

7 minutes ago, KhaoNiaw said:

That is just utter nonsense. Already proven to be a complete lie

Ok, if you say so, I'm going off what I've read and what I've seen on YT/FB. If I'm wrong on that then I'm wrong. Can you point me towards refuted reports or a link please

Edited January 15, 2022 by Dumbfounded

[Scott]

20 minutes ago, Dumbfounded said:

And plenty of vaxed people have died from it too, and that number is growing, just look at how many athletes have dropped during games from suspected heart attacks lately in USA & UK. If you want to vax then I'm happy for you, I have nothing against anyone who wants to have it, but I don't. I really don't understand your argument, I imagine you've been double vaxed and maybe a booster too, so why do you fear people like me and troll us, as though we're the only point of infection/spread?

Posting false or misleading information will earn a warning and possible suspension.   Please provide a citation for the people dying and dropping from suspected heart attacks.   The last two athletes I read about who died from heart attacks were related to massive amounts of cocaine in their system.   

 

 

[KhaoNiaw]

7 minutes ago, Dumbfounded said:

Ok, if you say so, I'm going off what I've read and what I've seen on YT/FB. If I'm wrong on that then I'm wrong. Can you point me towards refuted reports or a link please

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2021/nov/19/blog-posting/dozens-prominent-athletes-did-not-die-heart-attack/ 
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2021/06/20/fact-check-christian-eriksen-didnt-receive-covid-19-vaccine/7713275002/ 
https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-coronavirus-sport-idUSL1N2T81NY

Edited January 15, 2022 by KhaoNiaw

[Danderman123]

2 hours ago, Dumbfounded said:

And plenty of vaxed people have died from it too, and that number is growing, just look at how many athletes have dropped during games from suspected heart attacks lately in USA & UK. If you want to vax then I'm happy for you, I have nothing against anyone who wants to have it, but I don't. I really don't understand your argument, I imagine you've been double vaxed and maybe a booster too, so why do you fear people like me and troll us, as though we're the only point of infection/spread?

Because to support your crazy position, you must post misinformation.

 

Posting misinformation during an epidemic should be criminal.

Edited January 15, 2022 by Danderman123

[Danderman123]

3 hours ago, Dumbfounded said:

Ok, if you say so, I'm going off what I've read and what I've seen on YT/FB. If I'm wrong on that then I'm wrong. Can you point me towards refuted reports or a link please

You are going to risk your life by refusing to vaccinate because you read something on Facebook?

[shdmn]

25 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

You are going to risk your life by refusing to vaccinate because you read something on Facebook?

Anti-vaxxers in a nutshell.

[thaibeachlovers]

On 1/15/2022 at 12:07 PM, Danderman123 said:

If 300 die in an airplane crash, do you reflect on how many other people died that day from something else?

Yes.

[WEBBYB808]

On 1/15/2022 at 9:27 PM, Dumbfounded said:

 

 

Really? So I'm a troll for wanting to see what 2000 covid deaths represented in the total ave daily figure for all deaths? From where I'm sitting it's people like you who are the trolls, just parroting anything MSM tells you, and berating the likes of me for thinking differently to you. Well, 2000 x 365 = 730,000 out of a pop of approx 330 million. Want to work that out as a percentage? Maybe you can discuss what a <deleted> I am with your super vaxed triple boostered mates down the pub while you reinfect yourselves and just blame it all on the unvaxed

Isn't  one preventable  death one too many?  How can you not understand  this?

[WEBBYB808]

19 hours ago, shdmn said:

Anti-vaxxers in a nutshell.

When you refuse a vaccine  you risk the virus mutating  into a deadlier  virus to be unleashed  on the world, as the virus mutates in the unvaccinated. 

[WEBBYB808]

21 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

Because to support your crazy position, you must post misinformation.

 

Posting misinformation during an epidemic should be criminal.

Not wearing  a mask should be punishable.   Knowing that one has the virus and still going to work exposing  others should be punishable.   Knowing  you have the virus  and having sex with another should be punishable  just like an HIV positive  person. 

[DavisH]

On 1/15/2022 at 9:27 PM, Dumbfounded said:

 

 

Really? So I'm a troll for wanting to see what 2000 covid deaths represented in the total ave daily figure for all deaths? From where I'm sitting it's people like you who are the trolls, just parroting anything MSM tells you, and berating the likes of me for thinking differently to you. Well, 2000 x 365 = 730,000 out of a pop of approx 330 million. Want to work that out as a percentage? Maybe you can discuss what a <deleted> I am with your super vaxed triple boostered mates down the pub while you reinfect yourselves and just blame it all on the unvaxed

"alleged deaths due to covid"..."MSM"....anti-vaxxer troll key words. Ignored. 

[DavisH]

24 minutes ago, WEBBYB808 said:

When you refuse a vaccine  you risk the virus mutating  into a deadlier  virus to be unleashed  on the world, as the virus mutates in the unvaccinated. 

Generally, the virus will adapt to humans over time and become more contagious and less pathogenic. Omicron really cannot become more contagious - it's almost as contagious as measles already. Omicron will become endemic and end the pandemic. 

[rickudon]

30,000 deaths in USA a day? Way out. Actually under 8000 a day (2,854,000 a year)

 

https://www.prb.org/usdata/indicator/deaths/chart/

[Ryan754326]

8 hours ago, WEBBYB808 said:

Isn't  one preventable  death one too many?  How can you not understand  this?

If we’re going to try to stop every single preventable death from happening, then there are much bigger problems to focus our attention on than covid. 
 

How many starving children could have been fed with all of the money that the world has thrown at covid in the last two years? It doesn’t matter; if covid had stayed in China and killed a few million rural peasants every single year until the end of time, very few people in the west would pay any attention to it, the same way that most of them pay no attention to all of the other people dying of preventable diseases and hunger in third world countries that they couldn’t find on a map. 
 
 

[Ryan754326]

8 hours ago, WEBBYB808 said:

as the virus mutates in the unvaccinated. 

The virus has the potential to mutate in any person who becomes infected, and plenty of vaccinated people are getting infected. I was one of them. 

[thaibeachlovers]

28 minutes ago, Ryan754326 said:

If we’re going to try to stop every single preventable death from happening, then there are much bigger problems to focus our attention on than covid. 
 

How many starving children could have been fed with all of the money that the world has thrown at covid in the last two years? It doesn’t matter; if covid had stayed in China and killed a few million rural peasants every single year until the end of time, very few people in the west would pay any attention to it, the same way that most of them pay no attention to all of the other people dying of preventable diseases and hunger in third world countries that they couldn’t find on a map. 
 
 

So very true. Western people IMO are going OTT about covid because it possibly affects them or those they know, but wouldn't even care about diseases that have happened far far away, despite the consequences being exactly the same for the people affected.

Selective caring, IMO.

[Chomper Higgot]

On 1/14/2022 at 11:43 AM, thaibeachlovers said:

That would be the total death rate, surely, not the covid death rate.

 No it’s not that either.

 

The 2021 average daily death rate for all causes is under 8,000.

 

Refer link I posted

[Chomper Higgot]

On 1/15/2022 at 9:55 PM, Dumbfounded said:

Covid Denier? Where have I ever said that it doesn't exist, just proves my point that you are the troll - people who don't want the vax isn't because they deny covid exists, it's because they don't trust a drug with no long term studies and trust their own immune system

Since you ask, here you are asserting that deaths formally recorded by medical professionals as caused by COVID are ‘alleged COVID deaths’.

 

On 1/14/2022 at 12:00 PM, Dumbfounded said:

yes, the total average. Just wanted to have an idea what 2000 alleged deaths from covid represented in the total average number

I think asserting formally recorded COVID deaths are ‘alleged’ is as close to COVID denial as makes no difference.

Edited January 17, 2022 by Chomper Higgot

[Chomper Higgot]

On 1/15/2022 at 10:19 PM, Dumbfounded said:

And plenty of vaxed people have died from it too, and that number is growing, just look at how many athletes have dropped during games from suspected heart attacks lately in USA & UK. If you want to vax then I'm happy for you, I have nothing against anyone who wants to have it, but I don't. I really don't understand your argument, I imagine you've been double vaxed and maybe a booster too, so why do you fear people like me and troll us, as though we're the only point of infection/spread?

As an athlete myself this might give me cause for concern.

 

You made the claim, now present links with evidence of athletes in the US/UK dying of heart attacks related to their vaccination.

[Chomper Higgot]

On 1/15/2022 at 10:36 PM, Dumbfounded said:

Ok, if you say so, I'm going off what I've read and what I've seen on YT/FB. If I'm wrong on that then I'm wrong. Can you point me towards refuted reports or a link please

You made the claim, it’s for you to provide the evidence.

 

YT and FB won’t cut it, but at least you’ve admitted where you are getting your nonsense ideas from.

[placeholder]

On 1/15/2022 at 9:55 PM, Dumbfounded said:

Covid Denier? Where have I ever said that it doesn't exist, just proves my point that you are the troll - people who don't want the vax isn't because they deny covid exists, it's because they don't trust a drug with no long term studies and trust their own immune system

ICU's are filled with those who trusted their own immune systems.

[Chomper Higgot]

3 hours ago, Ryan754326 said:

If we’re going to try to stop every single preventable death from happening, then there are much bigger problems to focus our attention on than covid. 
 

How many starving children could have been fed with all of the money that the world has thrown at covid in the last two years? It doesn’t matter; if covid had stayed in China and killed a few million rural peasants every single year until the end of time, very few people in the west would pay any attention to it, the same way that most of them pay no attention to all of the other people dying of preventable diseases and hunger in third world countries that they couldn’t find on a map. 
 
 

All very true.

 

But what the anti-vaxxers demonstrate is something entirely different.

 

They are absolutely aware that the virus is killing large numbers of people, while making many more seriously ill and filling hospital beds with its victims.

 

The facts and the science are clear, the vaccines dramatically reduces the number of serious illness, hospitalization and deaths.

 

And yet anti-vaxxers actively disseminate misinformation that undermines the fight against this wretched disease. 

Moreover, many of those actively disseminating anti-vaccines misinformation have themselves been vaccinated.

 

Your post speaks to the sin of omission, a sad reality of human failings, but propagating anti-vaccine misinformation during a pandemic is an act of informed commission.

 

A completely different order of callous behavior.

 

 

Edited January 17, 2022 by Chomper Higgot

[Chomper Higgot]

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

So very true. Western people IMO are going OTT about covid because it possibly affects them or those they know, but wouldn't even care about diseases that have happened far far away, despite the consequences being exactly the same for the people affected.

Selective caring, IMO.

Nonsense.

 

One need only look at public donations in the UK, US and Europe to help with overseas disasters, famines and health crises to reveal the holes in your characteristically negative view.

[Ryan754326]

29 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

All very true.

 

But what the anti-vaxxers demonstrate is something entirely different.

 

They are absolutely aware that the virus is killing large numbers of people, while making many more seriously ill and filling hospital beds with its victims.

 

The facts and the science are clear, the vaccines dramatically reduces the number of serious illness, hospitalization and deaths.

 

And yet anti-vaxxers actively disseminate misinformation that undermines the fight against this wretched disease. 

Moreover, many of those actively disseminating anti-vaccines misinformation have themselves been vaccinated.

 

Your post speaks to the sin of omission, a sad reality of human failings, but propagating anti-vaccine misinformation during a pandemic is an act of informed commission.

 

A completely different order of callous behavior.

 

 

I don’t pay attention to what anti-vaxxers say or post on Facebook/YouTube, so I don’t see how it affects my life. I also don’t believe that any significant number of normal people are being converted by the misinformation they post online. it’s just people gravitating towards others who already think the same way they do; the Internet has made it far easier than we ever could have imagined to do this.

To be honest, I really don’t care if someone dies after they refuse a vaccine that might have saved their life. I see it as a poor choice, the same way people smoke, drink, do drugs, eat junk food, or go skiing out of bounds. All of these things put unnecessary stress on our health systems, so why is the lifelong smoker, who always knew that cigarettes cause cancer, any more entitled to healthcare than the guy who refuses a vaccine that he should have known would lessen his chances of dying from covid?

 

I understand your argument that’s it’s about the healthcare system being overloaded, but they were overloaded long before covid. How much extra capacity might there be if we didn’t already have our hospitals full of people who are past the average life expectancy, with a bunch of chronic health problems that probably could have been avoided if they had just taken better care of themselves throughout their lives?

 

Don’t get me wrong, I think it’s pretty ridiculous myself that hospital beds are being taken up by people who refused to get vaccinated, but no more ridiculous than the paramedics here in Canada having to repeatedly revive junkies after their bi-weekly overdose. The big difference I see, is that when I say the junkies should be left to die, I get scolded for not being compassionate enough, while if I said the anti-vaxxers should be left to die, I think many would probably agree, and press the heart button.