Education inequality – The state school teachers’ dilemma

[snoop1130]

 

At 332.4 billion baht, for yet another year Thailand’s Ministry of Education has received the largest budget of any ministry. In 2021, this major agency received budget just under 358.4 billion baht. The enormous amount of money pouring into the country’s education system has produced disappointing results.

 

Thai students’ academic performance has scored very low in international evaluations for several consecutive years. According to the IMD World Competitiveness Yearbook 2020, Thailand was placed 55th out of 63 countries. In the EF English Proficiency test, organised by Education First in 2019, Thailand was placed 74th out of 100 countries, which means the country ranks third from the bottom for English proficiency among ASEAN nations.

 

We all know something has gone wrong in our education system, but what exactly is it? Thai PBS World spoke to public school teachers about Thai education, which they describe as being in a dilemma.

 

Full Story: https://www.thaipbsworld.com/op-ed-education-inequality-the-state-school-teachers-dilemma/

 

-- © Copyright Thai PBS 2022-01-17

 

- Aetna offers a range of visa-compliant plans that meet the minimum requirement of medical treatment, including COVID-19, up to THB 3m. For more information on all expat health insurance plans click here.

 

- Follow ASEAN NOW on LINE for breaking COVID-19 updates

[StayinThailand2much]

1 hour ago, snoop1130 said:

2019, Thailand was placed 74th out of 100 countries, which means the country ranks third from the bottom for English proficiency among ASEAN nations.

Let me guess...

 

Last in ASEAN: the "stone-age" Tasaday 'nation' in the highland rainforest of Mindanao. Second-last: Korowai ("unaware of any other peoples") nation in West Papua. Third from the bottom: the glorious ("We are #1 in everything, so why bother learning English?") Thai nation!

 

Edited January 17, 2022 by StayinThailand2much

[mtls2005]

The MoE can now afford a submarine.

 

 

 

 

[trainman34014]

When you have sub standard Teachers you will always end up with sub standard Education; especially when Nationalism is preached first and Rote system is in use.    Time to kick out everyone at the Education Ministry; it's full of Dinosours, very similar to Government House !

[ikke1959]

Send students to schools in closest to their homes.. There are schools with mixed classes because a lack of students and other schools are overloaded with 55 kids in a room...and besides that cancel the always pass law.. Teach kids that they have to work to get something instead of doing nothing every day and pass to the next grade..And stop with boyscout in school, extra classes to fill the pockets of the teachers in the evening or weekends, and all non learning activities...there is so much wasted time in schools...... and send  the whole Education Ministry, and departments  to other countries to get an education of how to make a good currucilum, and manage the system.. 

[arick]

Secondary school have had approximately 3 weeks of school in the last year. Primary school nil. The teacher in the village is lucky to have three students logged in to her lesson. 

[Geir Rasch]

They must have a currucilum that preper the students for a modern world, not kling to old traditions. Students must be encouraged to question what the teachers teach and sack teachers that leave the students to them self because the teacher have other business.  

[RandiRona]

This is when they have imported lots of discarded garbage english language teachers from outside. Go for more indigenous language teachers and they shall grow. 

Edited January 18, 2022 by RandiRona

[seedy]

I have been asked by more than one school if I would be interested in part time English language teaching.

I then explain the work and visa limitations I am under, even if willing to work for nothing.

End of conversation.

[hotchilli]

14 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

The enormous amount of money pouring into the country’s education system has produced disappointing results.

I was going to say a huge sum for little return... but they already spotted that.

[hotchilli]

14 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

We all know something has gone wrong in our education system, but what exactly is it?

Thailand knows best that's whats gone wrong.

It doesn't want help form native speaking foreign teachers, it doesn't want advice from education people who know other methods, it doesn't want external ideas or input

it wants the Thai way or the highway..

It takes the cheapest labour it can find with people who's English ability is a 2nd or even 3rd language.

[ikke1959]

19 minutes ago, hotchilli said:

Thailand knows best that's whats gone wrong.

It doesn't want help form native speaking foreign teachers, it doesn't want advice from education people who know other methods, it doesn't want external ideas or input

it wants the Thai way or the highway..

It takes the cheapest labour it can find with people who's English ability is a 2nd or even 3rd language.

There is nothing wrong with non native English teachers....It is the whole system that is <deleted>....copy always  passing, don't do anything til you are graduated from the University.. low grades means that you are a bad teacher, so every teacher gves high grades.. Students are not stupid they know... and nobody loose face...because impossible to fail and impossible to have a low grade....That damage the education more than if a non English native teaches... Better a bit English than after 6 years still not knowing the answer on how old are you

[hotchilli]

9 minutes ago, ikke1959 said:

There is nothing wrong with non native English teachers..

So why does my next door neighbours daughter ask me to help with her school work because her "non-native English teacher" from Cameroon cannot be understood by anyone in the class?

[klauskunkel]

Education reform, police reform, military reform, all have been vowed then started, then sputtered to a halt numerous times over the years... - which leads me to believe that there are mysterious forces arrayed who do not want reforms to be successful.

But, I could be wrong and Thailand is just unlucky...

[dinsdale]

12 hours ago, trainman34014 said:

When you have sub standard Teachers you will always end up with sub standard Education; especially when Nationalism is preached first and Rote system is in use.    Time to kick out everyone at the Education Ministry; it's full of Dinosours, very similar to Government House !

Very difficult to teach to a high standard with 40-50+ kids in a classroom where the highest level of technology is chalk. 

[herfiehandbag]

1 hour ago, RandiRona said:

This is when they have imported lots of discarded garbage english language teachers from outside. Go for more indigenous language teachers and they shall grow. 

The weaknesses in the education system goes a lot further and deeper than the ability or otherwise of foreign teachers.

 

When I see such a blanket condemnation of foreign English teachers I always rather wonder whether the person making the comment has any knowledge of the matter, and whether in fact they are, perhaps, unsuccessful candidates for such a role.

 

 Have you ever had a conversation with an "indigenous" English teacher? There are a lot more of them than there are foreign ones. Many, if not most, cannot really speak English once away from the text book.

 

In my limited experience, after some years teaching here, the main problem is the "dead hand" of the legions of supervising beaurocracy, both within and outside the schools, which actively hinders any imaginative or enthusiastic teaching; that and corruption, which leads to pathetic textbooks, false grades and fake examinations.

Edited January 18, 2022 by herfiehandbag

[BritManToo]

18 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

Very difficult to teach to a high standard with 40-50+ kids in a classroom where the highest level of technology is chalk. 

In the 1960s my teachers all managed that.

[Andycoops]

The kids in my village have hardly had a day at school in the last 2 years, it's a scandal that these people are being paid for doing nothing.

 

Then again it's a scandal when they attend a classroom with students in it and get paid.

 

A generation of learning gone, doesn't bode well for the future of the nation. 

[hotchilli]

24 minutes ago, klauskunkel said:

Education reform, police reform, military reform, all have been vowed then started, then sputtered to a halt numerous times over the years... - which leads me to believe that there are mysterious forces arrayed who do not want reforms to be successful.

But, I could be wrong and Thailand is just unlucky...

Not wrong, you're onto to something.

A nation of worker ants with one boss.

[dinsdale]

3 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

In the 1960s my teachers all managed that.

Yep 1960's but it's now 2022. International schools and private schools have lots of tech. Tech is an essentional part of 21stC learning. 

[BritManToo]

Just now, dinsdale said:

Yep 1960's but it's now 2022. International schools and private schools have lots of tech. Tech is an essentional part of 21stC learning. 

Disagree,

Technology is generally a distraction from education.

All you need to educate children is decent text books for the kids and a blackboard with chalk for the teachers.

[Chongalulu]

Undoubtedly the Thai education system is rotten to the core,both structurally and practically with poor quality teachers and nothing less than root and branch reform (which won’t happen) will address that. I brought my 9 year old non English speaking stepdaughter to UK putting her through a good state education institution. After getting A levels including Maths and English she went on to get a first class honours in Business Economics at a decent university,thence to a good graduate level job in an established on line commercial operation where she continues to flourish. That said,I think she is considerably more intelligent than the average Thai and some of the most basic common sense errors I see so frequently in everyday Thailand makes me wonder whether there is a genetic deficiency which some of us refer to as the "Thick Gene". ???? 

[brian2f2f]

30 minutes ago, herfiehandbag said:

The weaknesses in the education system goes a lot further and deeper than the ability or otherwise of foreign teachers.

 

When I see such a blanket condemnation of foreign English teachers I always rather wonder whether the person making the comment has any knowledge of the matter, and whether in fact they are, perhaps, unsuccessful candidates for such a role.

 

 Have you ever had a conversation with an "indigenous" English teacher? There are a lot more of them than there are foreign ones. Many, if not most, cannot really speak English once away from the text book.

 

In my limited experience, after some years teaching here, the main problem is the "dead hand" of the legions of supervising beaurocracy, both within and outside the schools, which actively hinders any imaginative or enthusiastic teaching; that and corruption, which leads to pathetic textbooks, false grades and fake examinations.

I've met so many Thai English teachers with a BA in English yet they can't even begin to talk with me in English. I've had many Thais that study English as their degree program that the teacher can't speak English and 80% or more of the entire course is strictly grammar so they have little to no vocabulary and have no idea at all how to communicate. Yes that's all through a barely understandable Google translate conversation. 

[rct99q]

My daughter has been educated in both Canada and Thailand. Two years in Canada  (grades 1 & 2), two  years in Thailand (k3, grade 3), and has enjoyed both systems.

 

To those that  talk  about not passing students who fail a grade here in Thailand would help, the same issue happens in Canada. In my opinion holding students back is not a viable option.

 

I also disagree with the notion students should be able to question how teachers, teach. That should be a coordinated effort between the school, teachers, parents, and children. Based on the curriculum as decided upon by governing bodies.

 

The biggest challenge, again in my opinion, is keeping kids engaged in the learning process. In Canada parents were certainly more involved in the child's education. I see little involvement of parents here. Parents seem to be either working,  split families, children living with grandparents, or with older siblings.

 

In speaking with, and reading about, other parents and the difficulty they have had during this pandemic to keep their children entertained  being a struggle. This leads me to believe there was not a lot of parental influence before the pandemic. Just leaving the school system, by itself, to educate your child I feel is the leading cause of many of the issues going on today.

 

How to get parents, or guardians, more engaged in the process?!

 

Obviously the system here is broken. The real unfortunate part is the huge amount of money that is being spent on education,

yet it is the students who are least benefiting from it.

 

 

Just on another note about the quality of teachers. It is possible we have been very lucky, but my daughter has in her short stint so far as a student had only one teacher that has been an issue. Of the 20 or so others she has nothing but great things to say. From her K3 teacher Ms. Poi, to grade one Mrs. S, and her grade three Thai teachers whom have all been wonderful so far. Even with early struggles of online learning, she had teachers here drop off home work, provided additional learning material, and even have her assist in her English class with other students. 

 

She attends a Catholic school that follows the government education system. It is not a private school. Cost, about 6,000BHT per term. Including lunch. In Canada, government school, fees about $450 per year. No lunch provided. 

 

 

 

[Caldera]

Ultimately the system delivers the results that the ruling elite wants it to deliver. A population indoctrinated by rote learning, without too many critical thinkers (troublemakers). Sad really, but difficult to change. 

[BritManToo]

3 minutes ago, rct99q said:

The biggest challenge, again in my opinion, is keeping kids engaged in the learning process.

 

Just leaving the school system, by itself, to educate your child I feel is the leading cause of many of the issues going on today.

A cane in the corner of the classroom always kept me successfully 'engaged in the learning process'.

 

I doubt many rural Thai farmers have much education either. In the past, when the school was the only source of education there were no such issues. Treating schools as 'entertainment' venues and expecting parents to 'educate' is the source of the problem and not the answer to the problem IMHO.

Edited January 18, 2022 by BritManToo

[Bangkok Barry]

[wwest5829]

23 minutes ago, rct99q said:

My daughter has been educated in both Canada and Thailand. Two years in Canada  (grades 1 & 2), two  years in Thailand (k3, grade 3), and has enjoyed both systems.

 

To those that  talk  about not passing students who fail a grade here in Thailand would help, the same issue happens in Canada. In my opinion holding students back is not a viable option.

 

I also disagree with the notion students should be able to question how teachers, teach. That should be a coordinated effort between the school, teachers, parents, and children. Based on the curriculum as decided upon by governing bodies.

 

The biggest challenge, again in my opinion, is keeping kids engaged in the learning process. In Canada parents were certainly more involved in the child's education. I see little involvement of parents here. Parents seem to be either working,  split families, children living with grandparents, or with older siblings.

 

In speaking with, and reading about, other parents and the difficulty they have had during this pandemic to keep their children entertained  being a struggle. This leads me to believe there was not a lot of parental influence before the pandemic. Just leaving the school system, by itself, to educate your child I feel is the leading cause of many of the issues going on today.

 

How to get parents, or guardians, more engaged in the process?!

 

Obviously the system here is broken. The real unfortunate part is the huge amount of money that is being spent on education,

yet it is the students who are least benefiting from it.

 

 

Just on another note about the quality of teachers. It is possible we have been very lucky, but my daughter has in her short stint so far as a student had only one teacher that has been an issue. Of the 20 or so others she has nothing but great things to say. From her K3 teacher Ms. Poi, to grade one Mrs. S, and her grade three Thai teachers whom have all been wonderful so far. Even with early struggles of online learning, she had teachers here drop off home work, provided additional learning material, and even have her assist in her English class with other students. 

 

She attends a Catholic school that follows the government education system. It is not a private school. Cost, about 6,000BHT per term. Including lunch. In Canada, government school, fees about $450 per year. No lunch provided. 

 

 

 

Supportive of your comments.

[wwest5829]

25 minutes ago, brian2f2f said:

I've met so many Thai English teachers with a BA in English yet they can't even begin to talk with me in English. I've had many Thais that study English as their degree program that the teacher can't speak English and 80% or more of the entire course is strictly grammar so they have little to no vocabulary and have no idea at all how to communicate. Yes that's all through a barely understandable Google translate conversation. 

I do think that throughout Asia when faced with, "a loss of face" students are very hesitant to practice using their English language knowledge. I was impressed when studying in Shianghai decades ago with a taxi driver listening to the government supplied English lessons over the radio who wished very much to try out his English while I struggled with the Mandarin I was studying.

[wwest5829]

48 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Disagree,

Technology is generally a distraction from education.

All you need to educate children is decent text books for the kids and a blackboard with chalk for the teachers.

Why limit the greater knowledge to be gained through the use of technology. Having taught during the technological revolution, while I could tach history by the means you state, I could make history much more interesting for students having today's access to broader resources via computers/internet. I have certainly been impressed with Thailand's wide availability of internet access.