Electric Vehicles in Thailand

[Gweiloman]

11 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

 

Cue: @transam

 

or in English, let's have some more ridiculous statements

 

17 hours ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

The CCP voice monitoring and cabin video recording should already be active just in case you criticize Beijing. Some Chinese cars just return a smile face 😀 if you say the word China.

How is the Fortuner taking the new family member, still feeling loved ❤️?

or that Tik Tok is spying on you and/or collecting data on 15 year olds in order to blackmail them in case one of them becomes POTUS in 60 years time lol

[Bandersnatch]

I have posted a new topic in the Thailand Motor Discussion

 

“Factchecking 21 misleading myths about electric vehicles“

[ExpatOilWorker]

12 hours ago, Bandersnatch said:

I’m keen to know more about Mr @TimeMachine  and his theory. 
 

He clearly doesn’t own an EV himself because he said

 

@TimeMachine doesn't have one, but many EVs as shown in this leaked picture from his man-cave.

 

[TimeMachine]

I can't reject much of the evidence against my argument. I may very well be wrong. I am being very critical of the quality of future batteries and how they handle Thai conditions.

 

I stand by my argument that the quality of batteries produced in upcoming cars in Thailand will not be able to follow the statement that my car's batteries are great after a long period. If you have trust in buying an EV, you are more trusting than me. I can see a lot of complaints in the future while some will be ok with a car that they spend lots of money on to replace batteries. When they offer 20 year warranty I'll pay the money they are asking. 

 

 

[vinny41]

On 11/3/2023 at 3:34 PM, Bandersnatch said:

Most of what you have posted is unsubstantiated rubbish. You are clearly not interested in buying an EV.

 

If you want to discuss EVs v ICE then do it in the EVs V ICE discussion. 
 

This discussion is about EVs in Thailand

 

If you persist I will report you for attempting to hijack this topic

 

On 11/3/2023 at 3:37 PM, Bandersnatch said:

You did not post anything about the price of EVs in Thailand.

 

This is off-topic. Start your own discussion somewhere else.

 

3 hours ago, Bandersnatch said:

 

Tesla’s best selling state is California where Death Valley is located. Tesla has the highest repeat purchase of any brand in America at nearly 70%. Maybe heat doesn’t cause that big a problem after all Mr @TimeMachine

 

 

 

It seems when it suits posts about EV outside Thailand are acceptable and when it doesn't suit out comes the waffle EVs in Thailand Can't have it both ways

[vinny41]

On 11/3/2023 at 3:34 PM, Bandersnatch said:

Most of what you have posted is unsubstantiated rubbish. You are clearly not interested in buying an EV.

 

If you want to discuss EVs v ICE then do it in the EVs V ICE discussion. 
 

This discussion is about EVs in Thailand

 

If you persist I will report you for attempting to hijack this topic

 

1 hour ago, Bandersnatch said:

I have posted a new topic in the Thailand Motor Discussion

 

“Factchecking 21 misleading myths about electric vehicles“

Are you planning to report yourself as the "Factchecking 21 misleading myths about electric vehicles“ seems to be a UK based website and not relevant to the topic Electric Vehicles in Thailand

[Bandersnatch]

 

1 hour ago, vinny41 said:

It seems when it suits posts about EV outside Thailand are acceptable and when it doesn't suit out comes the waffle EVs in Thailand Can't have it both ways

 

Did you read @TimeMachine original post?

 

No just jump into a discussion half way through and reply without any context

 

He said "Batteries don't last in Thai weather."

 

He was claiming that batteries in Thailand would die in 5 years.

 

Thailand is not the only hot country in the world with EVs unfortunately they have only been sold in any number here for 4 years, so we had to look at examples elsewhere.

[Bandersnatch]

1 hour ago, vinny41 said:

Are you planning to report yourself as the "Factchecking 21 misleading myths about electric vehicles“ seems to be a UK based website and not relevant to the topic Electric Vehicles in Thailand

 

That's why I didn't post it here but started a new discussion 🙄

[Rimmer]

An off topic post has been removed.  Please see our Community Standards

[Pib]

On 11/3/2023 at 4:39 PM, Pib said:

Update on wall charger installation:  We picked up the Atto 25 Oct/Wed and the dealership said once again a wall charger installer will call in 1 to 3 days to schedule installation.  Call didn't come.   We started pinging the dealership again by phone.  After pinging the dealership again we then got a call from BYD Reves on 30 Oct/Mon saying wall charger installer would call in 1 or 2 days---but no call came. It's now 1 Nov....7 days after car pickup....still no initial contact from the installer....just a BYD rep saying the installer will call.

 

On 1 Nov/Wed started pinging the dealership again via phone...more excuses...dealership "acting" surprised call hasn't come yet...but I expect that was an acting job.     Today/3 Nov/Fri morning we go to the dealership to get facetime on this issue.  Once again....surprise...excuses...calls to be made to Rever to see what's going on.  We go home with another promise the dealership will follow-up on the delay and call us before 5pm today.

 

Finally at 1:30pm today the charge "installer" finally makes initial contact.  Asked a few questions such as size of electric service (we have 100A single phase) and confirmation of our address.  Installation is now scheduled for 6 Nov/Mon morning. 

 

Hopefully it will indeed be an installation team vs a scouting team to checkout what they will need for later installation.  But the call indicated it would be "installation."  If installation does occur it will have taken 12 days BUT with us having to ride the dealership hard on why no contact from the installer.  Time will tell.  Granny charger still working well.

 

Final Update:  my 7KW wall charger was installed today/6 Nov....12 days after picking up the Atto.   Two technicians from the ENSUS company did the install....took them about 6 hours including a 1 hour lunch breaker.  Although they only had to use approx 10 meters of wire (the free install includes up to 15 meters free) weaving the wire thru a maze of concreate and ceilings took some time....it was a complicated 10 meters.   But a minimum number of small holes was required.

 

From the main circuit box where a single pole 40A circuit breaker was used THW 10mm2 wire (rated at 69amps) was run to a RCBO (40A/30ma) close to the charger and the from the RCBO box a short piece of VCT 10mm2 cable was run to the ZHIDA charger.   

 

I was the official flashlight holder all day and backseat supervisor.  I was very happy with the installation....they did a very good and professional job.  See picture below.

 

I've only used the charger twice today for a few minutes...once right after install to insure it worked...and again for a few minutes this evening....as I do not want to charge the Atto until it gets down to around 40%.  After this evening's drive it down to 65%.  So, it may be a few more days before I use the charger for X-hours to fully charge the Atto.   I can now put my portable granny charger (that served me well for 12 days) back into its carrying case for emergency use in the future.

 

 

 

 

 

[Pib]

And just to add one bit of technical information regarding "charging efficiency" of my Atto.  During the initial (and brief...only a few minutes) test right after the wall charger install today to ensure it worked when plugged into the car the car showed a charging rate of 6.1KW.   The Atto charge was at 70% during the brief test.

 

Using two clamp-on ammeters and two AC voltmeters (the installer's and mine) where they both agreed almost exactly in their measurements the amount of current being drawn was 29.4A at 232.5V.   Using the formula of Power=Current x Voltage (i.e.., P=IE....like pie you eat) 29.4 times 232.5 = 6.836KW....this was the amount of power being fed into the Atto....but of course "all" of that power does not end-up in the battery due to losses.

 

6.1KW divided by 6.836KW = 89.2% charging efficiency which means 10.8% in losses  (inefficiency).   Losses associated with heat, onboard rectifier, BMS, etc.   This amount of efficiency is normal when I compare it to a variety of Youtube videos where other people have done similar/more detailed tests on their EV.  Like a snapshot from below video who ran a efficiency charging test on his EV at various charging currents (amps).

 

I'll do more tests over the coming month to see if the efficiency is a little better or a little worst than today's test....tests where the battery is at different charge levels (i.e., 25%, 40%, 80%, etc).  But I doubt there will be much of any change in efficiency "except" when the battery approaches full charge and the charging current drops down to around 10A and less since losses will probably remain almost the same but carrying a great weight in the PIE formula 

 

Snapshot of charging efficiency and inefficiency (losses) from the Youtube video at bottom.

 

 

 

 

[Melpomene]

2 hours ago, Pib said:

Final Update:  my 7KW wall charger was installed today/6 Nov....12 days after picking up the Atto.   Two technicians from the ENSUS company did the install....took them about 6 hours including a 1 hour lunch breaker.  Although they only had to use approx 10 meters of wire (the free install includes up to 15 meters free) weaving the wire thru a maze of concreate and ceilings took some time....it was a complicated 10 meters.   But a minimum number of small holes was required.

 

From the main circuit box where a single pole 40A circuit breaker was used THW 10mm2 wire (rated at 69amps) was run to a RCBO (40A/30ma) close to the charger and the from the RCBO box a short piece of VCT 10mm2 cable was run to the ZHIDA charger.   

 

I was the official flashlight holder all day and backseat supervisor.  I was very happy with the installation....they did a very good and professional job.  See picture below.

 

I've only used the charger twice today for a few minutes...once right after install to insure it worked...and again for a few minutes this evening....as I do not want to charge the Atto until it gets down to around 40%.  After this evening's drive it down to 65%.  So, it may be a few more days before I use the charger for X-hours to fully charge the Atto.   I can now put my portable granny charger (that served me well for 12 days) back into its carrying case for emergency use in the future.

 

 

 

 

 

So you're all set up and ready to drive now! 12 days is, I think, pretty good given all the cars they've been selling.  The guys fitting these must be busy. 

 

Did you get an additional TOU meter fitted first or have you just gone from your original meter ? 

[Pib]

18 hours ago, Melpomene said:

So you're all set up and ready to drive now! 12 days is, I think, pretty good given all the cars they've been selling.  The guys fitting these must be busy. 

 

Did you get an additional TOU meter fitted first or have you just gone from your original meter ? 

No additional meter....just using my current electrical setup which is non-TOU single phase 100A service.   

 

Wires run from a 40A breaker in my main circuit breaker panel to the RCBO/charger located in my home carport.   

 

I may switch to a TOU meter in the future.

[DrJoy]

BYD Atto 3 battery replacement charges-

 

Normal Range -      THB 565,741

Extended Range -  THB 701,952

 

7 % Vat inclusive.

[KhunLA]

"NETA V EVs to carry the first 4C LFP battery that adds 400 km after 10-minute charge"

[Andrew Dwyer]

17 hours ago, Pib said:

No additional meter....just using my current electrical setup which is non-TOU single phase 100A service.   

 

Wires run from a 40A breaker in my main circuit breaker panel to the RCBO/charger located in my home carport.   

 

I may switch to a TOU meter in the future.

If you go only TOU meter it might not be as economical as you think.

 

 

 

 

NOTE: this is only a temporary price drop, better to wait and see what happens next year before committing to only TOU meter.

[vinny41]

2 hours ago, KhunLA said:

"NETA V EVs to carry the first 4C LFP battery that adds 400 km after 10-minute charge"

In the article is states "The first electric car to carry the battery will be Changan’s Avatr 12, presented at Munich Auto Show. Avatr is a joint venture between the car maker and CATL."

https://carnewschina.com/2023/10/09/neta-evs-to-carry-the-first-4c-lfp-battery-that-adds-400-km-after-10-minute-charge/

Nothing in the article that indicates current Neta models will receive the new  Shenxing battery

This article does state that Production Costs for the Shenxing battery are higher that other lithium-ion batteries

https://www.car250.com/neta-catl-shenxing.html

[TimeMachine]

Not only the humid hot weather but Keep your EVs on shallow waters during the floods. Reports of cars catching on fire after flooding. How well sealed are EV batteries ? Anyway may be just media hype. A couple cars catch fire. Not a big deal.

 

[Bandersnatch]

On 11/2/2023 at 5:06 PM, Andrew Dwyer said:

Seal likely to make a small entry in Oct chart

@MrChart did I miss the October figures?  
 

Just watched a video quoting EV sales for 2023 estimated to be 8.7% Thought I saw we had already reached over 10% of total vehicle sales.

[Andrew Dwyer]

Just now, Bandersnatch said:

@MrChart did I miss the October figures?  
 

Just watched a video quoting EV sales for 2023 estimated to be 8.7% Thought I saw we had already reached over 10% of total vehicle sales.

i’ll be honest, when I posted that I thought it was for the preceding month, turns out it was over a month afterwards.

Not sure when October figures are due, they just pop up on my fb page.

[Bandersnatch]

3 minutes ago, Andrew Dwyer said:

i’ll be honest, when I posted that I thought it was for the preceding month, turns out it was over a month afterwards.

Not sure when October figures are due, they just pop up on my fb page.

Ok look forward to your next update

[KhunLA]

1 hour ago, vinny41 said:

In the article is states "The first electric car to carry the battery will be Changan’s Avatr 12, presented at Munich Auto Show. Avatr is a joint venture between the car maker and CATL."

https://carnewschina.com/2023/10/09/neta-evs-to-carry-the-first-4c-lfp-battery-that-adds-400-km-after-10-minute-charge/

Nothing in the article that indicates current Neta models will receive the new  Shenxing battery

This article does state that Production Costs for the Shenxing battery are higher that other lithium-ion batteries

https://www.car250.com/neta-catl-shenxing.html

OK, and ?

Didn't state it was going to be the first to have, (since posted previously about the Changan), just that it was going to use the first version of stated battery.  My reading comprehension is good, unless speed reading.  New news-blip simply having a bit more info/photos, of NATA V.

 

A good thing, as trying to talk my daughter into getting one, as not needing speed or distance, since living in Krung Thep. 

 

Has the luxury of avoiding flooding, as public trans can get her to the office when she needs to be there.   Works online mostly, and only needs a car for her own business, pick up materials, at her leisure, as needed.  Not happy with her Mazda 2 of late.  POS and needing a tweak now & then, and only 12 yrs old/175k kms.  Still beats monthly payments, and no need to add a new  one, since she's stretched a bit thin with RE investments.

 

If price stays under or near 600k, that's a good thing, as don't think she is one to keep a car till it dies.  No prob, charging at her condo, and may even be free.

[vinny41]

14 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

OK, and ?

Didn't state it was going to be the first to have, (since posted previously about the Changan), just that it was going to use the first version of stated battery.  My reading comprehension is good, unless speed reading.  New news-blip simply having a bit more info/photos, of NATA V.

 

A good thing, as trying to talk my daughter into getting one, as not needing speed or distance, since living in Krung Thep. 

 

Has the luxury of avoiding flooding, as public trans can get her to the office when she needs to be there.   Works online mostly, and only needs a car for her own business, pick up materials, at her leisure, as needed.  Not happy with her Mazda 2 of late.  POS and needing a tweak now & then, and only 12 yrs old/175k kms.  Still beats monthly payments, and no need to add a new  one, since she's stretched a bit thin with RE investments.

 

If price stays under or near 600k, that's a good thing, as don't think she is one to keep a car till it dies.  No prob, charging at her condo, and may even be free.

I get the impression that the new Shenxing battery from Neta point of view is aimed at larger vehicles and at a guess Baht 1.4 million plus 

 Neta belongs to Hozon Auto and already has several electric models on the market – such as the 4.80-metre-long Neta S sedan. The first models with Shenxing batteries will likely be larger cars.

I think someone on this forum has a 1 year old MG EP+ for sale 

https://www.electrive.com/2023/10/10/avatr-and-neta-to-use-catls-shenxing-battery/

[JBChiangRai]

21 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

 

I think someone on this forum has a 1 year old MG EP+ for sale 

 

 

My daughter's MG EP+ is the one you're referring to, I get a new Seal in a 3 weeks or so, my daughter gets my MG4 and so the EP+ is surplus to requirements, it's advertised here under cars for sale.

[KhunLA]

23 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

I get the impression that the new Shenxing battery from Neta point of view is aimed at larger vehicles and at a guess Baht 1.4 million plus 

 Neta belongs to Hozon Auto and already has several electric models on the market – such as the 4.80-metre-long Neta S sedan. The first models with Shenxing batteries will likely be larger cars.

I think someone on this forum has a 1 year old MG EP+ for sale 

https://www.electrive.com/2023/10/10/avatr-and-neta-to-use-catls-shenxing-battery/

That would be practical, keeping 1 model for the entry level folks, and hope to build some brand loyalty, as they budget allows an upgrade a few years later.

 

Saw the EP 4 sale, and if not for the higher seating of the ZS, along with being shorter, we'd probably have one instead of the ZS, and saved 180k 

[KhunLA]

On 11/6/2023 at 5:49 AM, Bandersnatch said:

We now have one piece of real data for Thailand EVs

Anybody else?

Make that 2 pcs of data now, as ours suffered less than 0.83% battery degradation over the past 1 year / 20k kms. 

 

As we average about 360 kms per charge, now states 357.

If using WLTP rating of 320 kms, then about 1%

If using NEDC rating of 403 kms, than only less than 0.74%

 

Time any of those by 8 years, and less than 8% over the warranty.

Along with 8X our savings of 40-54k baht on petrol last year.

 

320-430k expected while just under 8 year warranty.

Times that by another 10 years, and what do you get ....

.... your next EV for damn near FREE 🤣

 

Someone want to tell me again how much more expensive EVs are.

Edited November 8, 2023 by KhunLA

[Negita43]

Not directly on topic but I guess most of you EV supporters are keen to help the environment so I want to raise an issue that would directly help the health of children.

1. Judging by the price differential why does the government tax diesel at a lesser rate than gasoline?

2. Why don't the police stop and take of the road the many vehicles (usually pickups) I see tearing down the road spewing out fumes (this is often caused by old/badly setup injectors - which actually is not difficult to fix).

Edited November 8, 2023 by Negita43
typo

[DavisH]

2 hours ago, Negita43 said:

2. Why don't the police stop and take of the road the many vehicles (usually pickups) I see tearing down the road spewing out fumes (this is often caused by old/badly setup injectors - which actually is not difficult to fix).

They are remapped to run rich (petter performance), hence the smoke. It's deliberate in many cases. Don't expect the police to do anything tangible about it (I think culprits pay a 'fine' and then on their way). Nothing changes.

[BKKBike09]

4 hours ago, Negita43 said:

Not directly on topic but I guess most of you EV supporters are keen to help the environment so I want to raise an issue that would directly help the health of children.

1. Judging by the price differential why does the government tax diesel at a lesser rate than gasoline?

2. Why don't the police stop and take of the road the many vehicles (usually pickups) I see tearing down the road spewing out fumes (this is often caused by old/badly setup injectors - which actually is not difficult to fix).

1. Politics (rural electorate heavy users of diesel; powerful transport lobby)

2. Corruption

[BKKBike09]

7 hours ago, TimeMachine said:

Not only the humid hot weather but Keep your EVs on shallow waters during the floods. Reports of cars catching on fire after flooding. How well sealed are EV batteries ?

My EV hasn't caught fire yet that I've noticed, after wading through some substantial flooding last couple of days.

 

On "how well sealed are EV batteries" I previously posted a vid of an EV-qualified engineer in Oz dismantling a battery from an Atto. He made this comment about the battery's water resistance:

 

"There is a thick gasket all around the outside where the top plastic case bolts down onto the aluminium base and there are O rings around all the connections. The pack also had a couple screw vents on top that equalised pressure when I undid them so the pack is air tight"