2 minutes ago, Doctor Tom said:

Batteries, the most expensive item on an EV , are lifed items, some reports suggest for Chinese produced cars, somewhere between 6 to 10 years.  That effectively  means that after 2 years or so,  any 'run of the mill'  EV will have no resale value, especially as the Chinese are discounting to grab market share. My ICE Vios is 7 years old, has a resale and part X  value of around 250K and its engine parts can all be replaced relatively cheaply. EVs are a monumental scam, sold on misinformation, bad economics, unproven environmental statements and to  folk who think they are cool and trendy.   

The batteries all have 20-year warranties now, and many have lifetime warranties. 

Just now, Yellowtail said:

The batteries all have 20-year warranties now, and many have lifetime warranties. 

HaHa good one. Who's life is that then, my 17 year olds? 

2 minutes ago, Doctor Tom said:

HaHa good one. Who's life is that then, my 17 year olds? 

It's true. All the Chinese companies are doing it. 

32 minutes ago, Doctor Tom said:

Batteries, the most expensive item on an EV , are lifed items, some reports suggest for Chinese produced cars, somewhere between 6 to 10 years.  That effectively  means that after 2 years or so,  any 'run of the mill'  EV will have no resale value, especially as the Chinese are discounting to grab market share. My ICE Vios is 7 years old, has a resale and part X  value of around 250K and its engine parts can all be replaced relatively cheaply. EVs are a monumental scam, sold on misinformation, bad economics, unproven environmental statements and to  folk who think they are cool and trendy.   

you claim to be a physicist, so you must have an advanced degree, so I shouldn’t have to explain to you what a citation is, so how come you’ve forgotten how to use them? 
 

“some reports suggest for Chinese produced cars, somewhere between 6 to 10 years”

But you can’t name them so clearly you just made that up.

 

My BYD came with an 8yr 160,000km warranty after which it’s guaranteed to have at least 80% of it’s original capacity. In my case over 400km of range.

https://www.byd.com/en-th/support/service/warranty-policy

“after 2 years or so,  any 'run of the mill'  EV will have no resale value”

 

Fact checked and it turns out to bs

 

 

“EVs are a monumental scam, sold on misinformation, bad economics, unproven environmental statements and to  folk who think they are cool and trendy”

 

No citations, so no proof.

 

You drive a 7 year old vios and have demonstrated a complete lack of knowledge about EVs.

16 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

It's true. All the Chinese companies are doing it. 

Check the numbers.  In 2023 China sold circa 39 million EVs World Wide. If they keep up this rate of growth, possible, maybe,  in the average 8 year span life of most EV batteries, think of how many customers will be looking for them to replace the key component.  You either end up with a massive supply problem on lithium (lots of other technologies have a call on the chemicals, not least mobile devices and aircraft, civil and military), or the whole thing comes to a grinding halt. Lot's of EVS parked up with nowhere to go. However you cut it, the economics of EVs just doesn't add up. 

2 minutes ago, Bandersnatch said:

you claim to be a physicist, so you must have an advanced degree, so I shouldn’t have to explain to you what a citation is, so how come you’ve forgotten how to use them? 
 

“some reports suggest for Chinese produced cars, somewhere between 6 to 10 years”

But you can’t name them so clearly you just made that up.

 

My BYD came with an 8yr 160,000km warranty after which it’s guaranteed to have at least 80% of it’s original capacity. In my case over 400km of range.

https://www.byd.com/en-th/support/service/warranty-policy

“after 2 years or so,  any 'run of the mill'  EV will have no resale value”

 

Fact checked and it turns out to bs

 

Well we will see won't we.  

2 minutes ago, Bandersnatch said:

you claim to be a physicist, so you must have an advanced degree, so I shouldn’t have to explain to you what a citation is, so how come you’ve forgotten how to use them? 
 

“some reports suggest for Chinese produced cars, somewhere between 6 to 10 years”

But you can’t name them so clearly you just made that up.

 

My BYD came with an 8yr 160,000km warranty after which it’s guaranteed to have at least 80% of it’s original capacity. In my case over 400km of range.

https://www.byd.com/en-th/support/service/warranty-policy

“after 2 years or so,  any 'run of the mill'  EV will have no resale value”

 

Fact checked and it turns out to bs

 

Just now, Doctor Tom said:

Well we will see won't we.  

I’m already seeing as I own 2 EVs and an electric motorbike all powered by solar. I don’t have a meter so no PEA bills or gasoline bills.

 

 

1 hour ago, Doctor Tom said:

Check the numbers.  In 2023 China sold circa 39 million EVs World Wide. If they keep up this rate of growth, possible, maybe,  in the average 8 year span life of most EV batteries, think of how many customers will be looking for them to replace the key component.  You either end up with a massive supply problem on lithium (lots of other technologies have a call on the chemicals, not least mobile devices and aircraft, civil and military), or the whole thing comes to a grinding halt. Lot's of EVS parked up with nowhere to go. However you cut it, the economics of EVs just doesn't add up. 

Although the Chinese are good - even they would blush with your wildly exaggerated number of 39 million........ but I like your attempt to discredit yourself in a total FUBAR 

5 hours ago, Doctor Tom said:

Well we will see won't we.  

 

the ev owner (ww 40+ mil) can see it already ... you for sure won't see it even in an other 10 years time ... you will create again some made up claims, we got it ... anyway, better not to feed someone like you ....

7 hours ago, Bandersnatch said:

My BYD came with an 8yr 160,000km warranty after which it’s guaranteed to have at least 80% of it’s original capacity. In my case over 400km of range.

https://www.byd.com/en-th/support/service/warranty-policy

“after 2 years or so,  any 'run of the mill'  EV will have no resale value”

 

Fact checked and it turns out to bs

FactCheck and it turns out to be BS, that part you got right.

Percentage is again an insurmountable challenge for EV owners, probably from tuning in to AC/DC rock music 🎶 while charging.

Why is it that EV owners always have to throw in a cherry 🍒 and make of fake data?

70% is an OK warranty, why pretend it is 80%?

 

24 minutes ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

FactCheck and it turns out to be BS, that part you got right.

Percentage is again an insurmountable challenge for EV owners, probably from tuning in to AC/DC rock music 🎶 while charging.

Why is it that EV owners always have to throw in a cherry 🍒 and make of fake data?

70% is an OK warranty, why pretend it is 80%?

 

Because they have to justify the price and create value in their own minds in order to feel good about it.

8 hours ago, Doctor Tom said:

Batteries, the most expensive item on an EV , are lifed items, some reports suggest for Chinese produced cars, somewhere between 6 to 10 years.  That effectively  means that after 2 years or so,  any 'run of the mill'  EV will have no resale value, especially as the Chinese are discounting to grab market share. My ICE Vios is 7 years old, has a resale and part X  value of around 250K and its engine parts can all be replaced relatively cheaply. EVs are a monumental scam, sold on misinformation, bad economics, unproven environmental statements and to  folk who think they are cool and trendy.   

There is some truth to what you say above.  Resale value is an issue for the reasons you "overstated".  Your whole argument though comes crumbling down if your 6-10 year isn't realized. You state "SOME" reports "SUGGEST"...  I think you can make my conclusions form what you wrote 🙂  It is much more complicated and in the end you just may be right but the probability is tiny considering the  mountain of data that is accumulating on EVs. 

 

If you are determined to be right and don't consider the MANY that believe you are wrong what usually is the outcome?  I'm a probability guy 🙂 

4 minutes ago, atpeace said:

There is some truth to what you say above.  Resale value is an issue for the reasons you "overstated".  Your whole argument though comes crumbling down if your 6-10 year isn't realized. You state "SOME" reports "SUGGEST"...  I think you can make my conclusions form what you wrote 🙂  It is much more complicated and in the end you just may be right but the probability is tiny considering the  mountain of data that is accumulating on EVs. 

 

If you are determined to be right and don't consider the MANY that believe you are wrong what usually is the outcome?  I'm a probability guy 🙂 

I think many EV owners are forgetting the elephant 🐘 in the room, the infotainment and user interaction flat-screen system. 

Just like our smartphones of today, that part of an EV will be woefully outdated 6-8 years from now, rendering the car worthless. 

Just now, ExpatOilWorker said:

I think many EV owners are forgetting the elephant 🐘 in the room, the infotainment and user interaction flat-screen system. 

Just like our smartphones of today, that part of an EV will be woefully outdated 6-8 years from now, rendering the car worthless. 

Doesn't that apply to most new ICE cars?  EVs  do have that nice shiny object vibe to them but that really never excites me much.  I just care about the main function and for an EV that would be getting me from point A to B in the cheapest manner. Boring - yes but I save my energy for other facets of my life 🙂

 

My brothers EV in the states has lost 60k in value in the last 12 months.  Definately a concern but he is more  about image than me and bought a ridiculously expensive Porche. Maybe my past wealthy self would do that but the new me that lives in the sticks on a comfortable budget isn't interested in the slightest.

 

It will be choppy transition from ICE to EV if it even happens but I do feel the probability is quite high it will.  EVs have many issues at the moment but to not recognize the benefits IMO is stupid.  

1 hour ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

FactCheck and it turns out to be BS, that part you got right.

Percentage is again an insurmountable challenge for EV owners, probably from tuning in to AC/DC rock music 🎶 while charging.

Why is it that EV owners always have to throw in a cherry 🍒 and make of fake data?

70% is an OK warranty, why pretend it is 80%?

 

Have you been spending time with Transam? 

 

35 minutes ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

I think many EV owners are forgetting the elephant 🐘 in the room, the infotainment and user interaction flat-screen system. 

Just like our smartphones of today, that part of an EV will be woefully outdated 6-8 years from now, rendering the car worthless. 

The infotainment system is updated over the air, so it will keep up with advances

9 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

The batteries all have 20-year warranties now, and many have lifetime warranties. 

Well that's a bold faced lie. 8 years warranty is the standard for EVs sold in Thailand (and only 70% capacity).

10 hours ago, Doctor Tom said:

My ICE Vios is 7 years old, has a resale and part X  value of around 250K and its engine parts can all be replaced relatively cheaply. .   

Being a particle physicist must pay well.

It would be interesting if we had number of EVs still on the roads.  In the USA the average ICE car on the road is 12 years which has increased dramatically the last 20 years.  I have a 10 yo truck that drives just like a new one!  That is anecdotal 🙂 and shouldn't be used to measure expected lifespan. Floods, accidents, lemon....

 

You can find data that supports 100k to 500k EV lifespan which is confusing.  I "expect" from my semi-unbiased research that EVs manufacture in the last few year will at least match ICE's lifespan.  Just my opinion from looking at the limited data with an open mind.

 

The EV's that are on the roads 12 years from now won't be worthless as some suggest. Nissan leaves from over 10 years ago with terrible batteries and range(150k!) vs today are selling for roughly $5,000 to 8,000 (source google) ~30% of their original value . Most of these cars only provide around 50 miles ranges but there is a segment of the market that fits this range.

 

So many ways to construct an argument either way but I bet in 5 years the data will confirm that EVS are the overwhelming best choice for consumers ( not businesses- I have no clue) that are only interested in economical functionality.

3 hours ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

FactCheck

70% is an OK warranty, why pretend it is 80%?

 

Fact check ... you're wrong as usual.

 

Our warranty is 8 yrs / 180 k kms

4 other models of the same brand (MG) are lifetime, for past, present or future owner, which you know, but fail to acknowledge as doesn't fit your spin.

 

1 hour ago, JBChiangRai said:

Have you been spending time with Transam? 

 

The infotainment system is updated over the air, so it will keep up with advances

The hardware remain the same, the updates you get over the air are ever beloathed software. Try using an iPhone 6 with today's app and your crayons 🖍 will look high tech.

7 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Fact check ... you're wrong as usual.

 

Our warranty is 8 yrs / 180 k kms

4 other models of the same brand (MG) are lifetime, for past, present of future owner, which you know, but fail to acknowledge as doesn't fit your spin.

 

The cherry 🍒 farmer is having a Seal 🦭,  not an MG.

Try to keep up SeñorLA. 

12 minutes ago, atpeace said:

It would be interesting if we had number of EVs still on the roads.  In the USA the average ICE car on the road is 12 years which has increased dramatically the last 20 years.  I have a 10 yo truck that drives just like a new one!  That is anecdotal 🙂 and shouldn't be used to measure expected lifespan. Floods, accidents, lemon....

 

You can find data that supports 100k to 500k EV lifespan which is confusing.  I "expect" from my semi-unbiased research that EVs manufacture in the last few year will at least match ICE's lifespan.  Just my opinion from looking at the limited data with an open mind.

 

The EV's that are on the roads 12 years from now won't be worthless as some suggest. Nissan leaves from over 10 years ago with terrible batteries and range(150k!) vs today are selling for roughly $5,000 to 8,000 (source google) ~30% of their original value . Most of these cars only provide around 50 miles ranges but there is a segment of the market that fits this range.

 

So many ways to construct an argument either way but I bet in 5 years the data will confirm that EVS are the overwhelming best choice for consumers ( not businesses- I have no clue) that are only interested in economical functionality.

I've had ICEV as old as 25 yrs (1950 in 1975), though most were 10-15 years old, as al I could afford, before the died or I killed them.  None had 100k miles them, so there's that.

 

We all know electric motors basically run forever, and with new battery tech/chemistry, expect our EV to last 20-25 yrs at least.  Along with saving us the cost of a new car, with the savings from petrol over that time period.

 

So instead of costing us the price of a car to operate & maintain, then paying for a new ICEV next time, out EV will basically bank that expense, and theoretically, next EV will be 'free' ... 

 

I love playing the long game ... 

And get to drive a superior vehicle while doing so 👍

 

We all have options ... UP2U

3 minutes ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

The cherry 🍒 farmer is having a Seal 🦭,  not an MG.

Try to keep up SeñorLA. 

Cherry and Seal emojis?

 

Accents over letters?

 

You are turning into Transman.

2 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

Cherry and Seal emojis?

 

Accents over letters?

 

You are turning into Transman.

Maybe they are one and the same ?

I mean, has anyone ever seen them under the same bridge at the same time ?

30 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

Cherry and Seal emojis?

 

Accents over letters?

 

You are turning into Transman.

When you are done trolling 🧌 we can get back on subject.

Put your crayons 🖍 away, percentage class is about to start.

30 minutes ago, Andrew Dwyer said:

Maybe they are one and the same ?

I mean, has anyone ever seen them under the same bridge at the same time ?

The Heidelberg uncertainty principle is preventing simple minds to observe two such brilliant personalities at the same time.

Now, back to EVs, shall we?

8 minutes ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

The Heidelberg uncertainty principle is preventing simple minds to observe two such brilliant personalities at the same time.

Now, back to EVs, shall we?

Do you mean The Heisenberg Principle?

21 minutes ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

The Heidelberg uncertainty principle is preventing simple minds to observe two such brilliant personalities at the same time.

Now, back to EVs, shall we?

That's rich coming from you and the other EV trolls.  

 

You obviously missed this part in the OP:

... "This is a discussion about EVs available or coming to Thailand. Not private imports but cars supported here with a dealer network.

 

Are you interested in an EV as your next car if so which one and why?

 

Do you know of any breaking news about EVs in Thailand? If so post here. "

19 minutes ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

The Heidelberg uncertainty principle is preventing simple minds to observe two such brilliant personalities at the same time.

Now, back to EVs, shall we?

 

10 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

Do you mean The Heisenberg Principle?

So let’s look at those brilliant minds, one can’t spell Heisenberg and works drilling for Dino juice and thinks it’s the future …..

 

I’n reminded of the Smash instant mashed potato advert, if you’re British you’ll know what I mean.