Thailand’s once mighty foreign tourism industry lastingly damaged with lower spends and numbers

[Paul Henry]

Goverment attitude to tourists will keep middle class good quality tourists away.

Maybe the Gov needs to employ some Vietnamese and Cambodian tourist offficials to show them how its done

[herfiehandbag]

56 minutes ago, wombat said:

Curious wants to know what the correlation between the Frogs and LOS is?

Nothing "per se" I suspect, but it may indicate an increasing reluctance on the part of independent tourists to face the hassles of crossing a bureaucratic minefield to come here.

 

As ever perception is everything, and the actions/reactions of the government agencies to COVID may have rather replaced the image of a carefree holiday experience, exotic temples, delicious food, sundrenched beaches and exciting nightlife; with one of masked uniformed officialdom at every turn. "Welcome to amazing Thailand" has rather been replaced by "cannot".

 

The perception of Thailand as unwelcoming is not helped by all the TATtery blethering on about only wanting various favoured groups, which all seem to have one thing in common, suitcases of cash!

 

The old "Amazing Thailand" campaign was effective whether you were a backpacker with a £15 Millets rucksack or business class with Louis Vuitton luggage.

 

As so often the damage has been done by those in ( largely unaccountable and self serving) positions of authority rather than the people of the country themselves.

 

Thailand had a dominant place in the South East Asian tourist market. They were in the same boat as everyone else with Covid but have regulated it away. Others are challenging it. "Luring" Indian billionaires isn't going to fix it; it's rather sad.

 

 

 

[RichardColeman]

Seriously, what did they expect ? 2 years of closure and using your savings up, world in recession, utility bills and gas up 80%, expensive flights, fear of Thailand yoyo'ing and getting stuck far from home, crazy high baht, some airlines still not flying direct to Thailand yet. The Thai government themselves caused more pain than the disease.

 

If Thailand seriously wanted more tourists they could start offering discounted rooms more, sub the national carrier to drop flight costs, try to get the baht weaker, loads more they could do, but they still think Thailand as some golden tourist hotspot that tourists will flock to - they are now finding out, people still wont come and those that come wont spend much , simply as they dont have much !

[BE88]

Incompetence at all levels of the TAT as it is possible to hope that rich families will come to do their marriages in Thailand when there is no place of high society in Thailand.

[Homburg]

Comparing France with Thailand is not comparing like with like.  France has been open to travellers for some time - without any need for a "France Pass".Thailand has only dropped its "Thailand Pass" and testing requirements in recent weeks. Obtention of a Thailand Pass was difficult enough for one, but for a family?  Plus the risk of just one of your party testing positive and ruining the holiday for all.  Who needs that when you just want a holiday? Flights booked close to the departure date in the holiday period are very expensive so most europeans booked their holidays before the Thailand Pass and testing was dropped and so many potential visitors have gone elsewhere this year.

[ozz1]

I think most of my friends rich included come to Thailand for a relaxing cheap holiday but this government has really stuffed this up with restrictions bad exchange rates and getting ripped off a lot of other places to go visit but unfortunately this government thinks that the world revolves around Thailand it doesn't

[steven100]

4 hours ago, webfact said:

wealthy Indian families to come to Thailand

they are joking right   !

[Tropposurfer]

4 hours ago, BarraMarra said:

Watched a video on u-tube walking down Bangla Rd the guy was filming all the bars and side soi's. It was early all the bars were empty just the girls sat around waving their boards most walking up and down were Indians drinking water none were filmed in a bar.

We drove past Bangla 2 nights ago and the crowds were decent. Nothing like pre-Covid of course but it appeared there was a moderate flow of customers.

Tim of 'TNT' uTube vlog did a vid there this last week and pretty much all the bars were open and doing moderate business. I go to and through Patong maybe once a week or so and the business is definitely picking up. Further south (Kata, Karon etc) its really still very, grim.  

[Cake Monster]

4 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Seems all good to me. The country was being destroyed by the tourist hordes prior to covid, so any serious reduction can, IMO, allow a rethink of the tourist model.

I doubt there will be a return to the cheap and cheerful model as in the 90s, but Thailand could concentrate on providing a quality experience for tourists that want more than to blob around a swimming pool, or get drugged up on a beach.

 

We put up with low quality accommodation and transportation back then because it was cheap. Probably not cheap any more, so wise up and do more than mouth platitudes about so called "quality" tourists. They ain't going to come unless the destination is worth it.

 

Who knows, this could be the time to return Thailand to the Land of Smiles for real.

To make a serious effort in changing the Tourism Model for the Country , would , IMO, be the best thing that could happen right now for Thailand.

The " cheap and cheerful " Model worked well, - too well !.

It worked so well that the Business Operators over the last 15 Years or so, have fallen into a Pit of " any old Cr1p will do ! ", and this mindset reflects upon the service, and experience, that Thailand offers to todays Travelers to the Country.

And therein lies the problem

Its trying to change the mindset of the people, and not just the Business Operators, who have been able to rip-off, scam, and give poor service over that period without being reigned in.

Good luck with that, as old habits die hard.

 

[phetphet]

With the world economies suffering due to the fallout from both Covid and Ukraine, most people just haven't got the money for long haul holidays anywhere. Not only to Thailand.

 

Trying to become the cannabis hub of Asia isn't going  to be enough to overcome such an obstacle.

Thailand is just going to have to be happy with the numbers they are getting until things improve.

 

It also seems that they are shooting themselves in the foot with this obsession of trying to attract high spending arrivals at the expense of their usual 'bread and butter' lower spending ones. One minute they want the Europeans, next the Chinese, then the Indians. Then only the big spenders. No cohesive plan.

 

Of course, adding new tourist arrival charges, dual pricing etc will always make the news and deter some travellers. But these are all secondary issues to the current world economy.

[bunnydrops]

2 hours ago, AsianAtHeart said:

I am well aware that people can hold multiple passports.  That is not the issue.  Thailand, technically, does not care.  But a Thai citizen is never supposed to use another passport, other than his or her Thai passport, to enter Thailand.  That is what we were told in no uncertain terms.

 

You may not appreciate the information....yet.  You may regret having gone this route with your wife later when the experience becomes your own.  Some get away with it, some don't. 

You never know what to expect when you are put in the back room. I do know of one Thai woman that had problems when she entered with her US passport, but it was when she flew out. She came in on a visa exempt. She decided to stay longer than the visa, thinking since she was Thai citizen it wouldn't matter, When she flew out she got hit with overstay fine.

[carlf]

I think that Thailand has certainly committed some major gaffes whilst trying to open up again for tourism (eg. complicated Thailand Pass, going back 'n forth about additional 300 THB "tourist" surcharge, slow in lifting restrictions, etc).  But I suspect that the different % numbers between France and Thailand are also due to very different tourist profiles.  I think that Thailand purposely decided to heavily develop Chinese tourism, and that faucet has just run dry and nothing that Thailand can do to force the Chinese to allow their citizens to come back to Thailand.

[morrobay]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

These numbers make no sense,

If Thailand is expecting a max 4M visitors

And those visitors are spending 11% less

that's a 90+% loss.

11% less ?. In an article last week in the English newspaper on the commentary pages. A Thai PhD who seemed very knowledgeable reported the the average tourist spend/holiday has gone from 50000 to 30000 baht. Down 40% . And also states that GDP this year about 1%

[NorthernRyland]

4 hours ago, ukrules said:

Auditing peoples bank accounts is fine if they want to move and live in a country permanently - doing the same thing for someone who wants to go on holiday is absolute insanity.

It also makes Thailand look kind of retarded. Do they think there's some large percent of the population around the world that's going to spend their last $1000 on plane ticket to Thailand and arrive with literally zero dollars in the bank? They must think they're pretty clever by putting an end to this scam which totally was going to happen if not for that visa requirement. 

[JimmyJ]

2 hours ago, malibukid said:

CM is looking pretty tacky lately.  literally starting to stink.  tree branches hanging down blocking the sidewalks, time for a trim.  sidewalks are in shambles.  wires dangling down from power polls.  unsafe crossings with lack of pedestrian signals and or crosswalks.  town needs a makeover.

CM has needed a graffiti cleanup for years.

 

 

 

[brommers]

The state of personal finances in most western countries is deteriorating rapidly so discretionary expenditure is under threat which means much less demand for long haul travel. We have noticed that our customers split into two groups, higher income well behaved and lower income badly behaved. We have never before suffered theft and crass behaviour like we have in the last 3 months. In fact we will soon introduce measures to keep the loso creatures away in order to protect the decent customers. It will impact our already stressed revenue in the short term but should enhance our appeal long term. We see no chance of the country meeting the breathlessly optimistic rantings of TAT, not that we ever paid much attention to them anyway.

[spidermike007]

Note to the grand saboteur: The closing of tens of thousands of massage shops, bars, restaurants and hotels is your fault. You have caused a stupid degree of destruction to the nation your profess to love and be loyal to. Is it possible, just once, for you to give us a demonstration of that supposed loyalty to anything other than your rich cronies, who are above the law, and the sacred cow of cash money? We know this. Nothing you say will change this. You will be held responsible. You are destroying the progress of your nation. This may be remembered as the Prayuth Decimation. 

 

Where is the hope? Where is the promise of a better future? With a country that is being so badly mismanaged, and an economy that is being destroyed and sabotaged before our eyes, one can easily become despondent. How will things change, if the youth is not even allowed to show dissent? How to get rid of the dinosaurs once and for all. And unlike in the past, there is absolutely no moral leadership of any kind here anymore. Very sad. For those of us lucky enough to have a steady income, it is sad, but we live good lives. My heart really goes out to most of the Thai people. Their lives are being crushed. Woe is Thailand. 

 

You don't just open up after 28 months, and the world pours in. And the goons still don't realize and haven't acknowledged that Thailand needs tourism 50X more than tourists need Thailand. Is Thailand making any effort, on any level to address the issues that were present, pre-Covid? Traffic and public safety, air quality, road congestion, luxury taxes, wine taxes, jet ski scams? I could go on all day. My guess is nothing is being done to address anything, and every issue they currently face is being blamed on Covid. Now, they have a real scapegoat, and looking within for the source of any of the problems is less likely than ever.

I truly believe, that 20 or 30 years from now, in tourism industry, business and sociology classes, at the uni level, there will be tours of these hollowed out shells, of huge hotels that were built, and could neither find guests to stay, nor even a market for condo conversions, and ended up abandoned, after buyers could not be found, or owners refused to accept 30% of the land and construction costs, as a sales price. 
 

[peter zwart]

Next year will be much better if in the mean time the economies ww are not hit too hard. The most people in Europe stayed in Europe this year. Most of them planning their hollydays already in jan/feb. At that time Thailand was still struggeling with the Covis rules. So high season will prob be the start of a good year. Hang in there Thailand.

[NorthernRyland]

3 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

Note to the grand saboteur: The closing of tens of thousands of massage shops, bars, restaurants and hotels is your fault.

Very important point to drive home. People are already starting to backpedal but we mustn't let them. It's common now to hear "because of COVID ..." Wrong, because of YOU, it was your personal actions and your fault for implementing or supporting certain policies. Never forget, never forgive.

[Guderian]

People only have so much money, and they're aware that a lot of it is going to be needed just to heat their homes this coming winter. Add to that a 50%-100%+ rise in air fares for the coming high season and it's hardly surprising that tourists won't be spending as much as they used to. Then there's the obligation that many younger folk feel towards the plant and climate change. I've read several news articles saying that they won't give up foreign travel completely to reduce their carbon footprint, but they're much more serious about the issue than most older people are and will think very hard about whether they really need to travel long haul or take a more local holiday instead, possibly avoiding flying altogether.

[mberbae]

Motorcycles on sidewalks in Bangkok is part of

the problem.

[morrobay]

8 minutes ago, peter zwart said:

Next year will be much better if in the mean time the economies ww are not hit too hard. The most people in Europe stayed in Europe this year. Most of them planning their hollydays already in jan/feb. At that time Thailand was still struggeling with the Covis rules. So high season will prob be the start of a good year. Hang in there Thailand.

I don't know about that. The people who have found alternatives to Thailand recentely  might have found something better. And are not going to be returning on schedule.

[morrobay]

5 minutes ago, mberbae said:

Motorcycles on sidewalks in Bangkok is part of

the problem.

Of course it is. Who do they expect are going to continue putting up with that.

[Xonax]

Mass Tourism is sooooo 2019

 

[cracker1]

In light of this information, it is most surprising that the Thai Government is going to take several billion baht off international tourists before they set foot in the country with their new "Arrival Tax".

I would have thought they would be offering incentives to visitors rather than disincentives.

[connda]

European's disposable income will be going toward paying for enough energy to heat their homes this winter, so don't expect to see many except for the much touted "rich, well-heeled" farangs who collectively will do little for the average Thai engaged in the tourist industry.  Energy prices in the West will finish what Covid started.  Better shift the focus of tourism toward Eurasia, Middle East, and Global South.

[peter zwart]

18 minutes ago, morrobay said:

I don't know about that. The people who have found alternatives to Thailand recentely  might have found something better. And are not going to be returning on schedule.

People come people go and new ones will arrive

[NorthernRyland]

How is that even enjoyable? Looks like a total nightmare scenario to me. Good riddance.

 

11 minutes ago, Xonax said:

Mass Tourism is sooooo 2019

 

 

[NorthernRyland]

3 hours ago, Willy Wombat said:

A lot of people don’t want to holiday in a tropical country and wear a mask too.

Especially if they don’t have to wear masks in their home countries.

 

Maskland is really trying my patience too. I'm coming back in 10 days from 2 months in the US where basically no one has a mask anymore and I've nearly forget about them. It's going to sting when I get back to Chiang Mai and have to face "the new normal" like it's still March 2020. ????

[Clarkey611]

2 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Sidewalks, you got sidewalks........?

Luckily we have pavements. ????