Royal gift or 'stolen' gem? Calls for UK to return 500 carat Great Star of Africa diamond

[Scott]

 

Calls are growing in South Africa for Britain's royal family to return the world's largest known clear-cut diamond in the wake of Queen Elizabeth II's death.

 

Known as the Great Star of Africa or Cullinan I, the diamond is cut from a larger gem that was mined in South Africa in 1905 and handed over to the British royal family by South Africa's colonial authorities. It is currently mounted on a royal scepter belonging to the Queen.

 

Demands for the return of the Great Star of Africa and other diamonds -- along with calls for repatriations -- have intensified since the Queen's death.

https://www.cnn.com/style/article/great-star-of-africa-diamond-intl-lgs/index.html

[thaibeachlovers]

Perhaps they should return it, but only if Sth Africa pays what it's worth. That might fund a few NHS hospitals.

I expect that might change a few minds in Sth Africa.

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Perhaps they should return it, but only if Sth Africa pays what it's worth. That might fund a few NHS hospitals.

I expect that might change a few minds in Sth Africa.

Since when did the rightful owners have to pay thieves to have their stolen goods returned?

[stevenl]

We should not judge history from today's perspective, which unfortunately is happening more and more.

[stevenl]

3 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Perhaps they should return it, but only if Sth Africa pays what it's worth. That might fund a few NHS hospitals.

I expect that might change a few minds in Sth Africa.

NHS should be well funded by now from all the Brexit profits.

[jak2002003]

In possession of stolen goods.  They are supposed to be a good influence of the British people...

[Bluespunk]

5 hours ago, Scott said:

Known as the Great Star of Africa or Cullinan I, the diamond is cut from a larger gem that was mined in South Africa in 1905 and handed over to the British royal family by South Africa's colonial authorities

That seems fair enough. 

[Justtaste]

Who's the rightful owner of this dismond? I see India, Pakistan  Afghanistan, Iran and South Africa asking for the return of the diamond????

[metisdead]

An off topic post and a reply has been removed. 

[malathione]

2 hours ago, Justtaste said:

Who's the rightful owner of this dismond? I see India, Pakistan  Afghanistan, Iran and South Africa asking for the return of the diamond????

You're confusing the Kohinoor with the Cullinan. Two different diamonds both part of the Crown Jewels.

[youreavinalaff]

5 hours ago, stevenl said:

NHS should be well funded by now from all the Brexit profits.

It may well have been if not for the worst pandemic in over 100 years.

Did you forget about that? Undermines your attempt at humour.

[Foghorn]

The Crown Jewels belong to the British people not the monarchy,  if Africa wants it back then give back all the monies that have been given to it over the last 100 years first ,didn’t think so 

[candide]

1 hour ago, Foghorn said:

The Crown Jewels belong to the British people not the monarchy,  if Africa wants it back then give back all the monies that have been given to it over the last 100 years first ,didn’t think so 

Are you claiming that the British colonisation has been made for altruist reasons and that the economic balance has not been hugely positive for the UK? ????

[Bluespunk]

1 hour ago, Foghorn said:

The Crown Jewels belong to the British people not the monarchy,  if Africa wants it back then give back all the monies that have been given to it over the last 100 years first ,didn’t think so 

There's a difference between voluntary aid and imperial theft.

[PETERTHEEATER]

15 hours ago, Scott said:

It is currently mounted on a royal scepter belonging to the Queen.

Sceptre please, we're British! 

[hotchilli]

Hands orf my jewels I say... 

[metisdead]

An incomprehensible troll post has been reported and removed.

[VocalNeal]

On 9/17/2022 at 7:58 AM, Chomper Higgot said:

Since when did the rightful owners have to pay thieves to have their stolen goods returned?

Not stolen.

The stone was purchased by the Transvaal government and offered to the King. I simply Googled that as anyone else may.

Lots of diamonds have been dug out of what is now South Africa and sold to gullible potential husbands. Should they all be given back.

[digger70]

On 9/17/2022 at 5:17 AM, Scott said:

Known as the Great Star of Africa or Cullinan I, the diamond is cut from a larger gem that was mined in South Africa in 1905 and handed over to the British royal family by South Africa's colonial authorities. It is currently mounted on a royal scepter belonging to the Queen.

So what's the gripe,If this is true. Who says that this ain't the Truth.

For me I don't Care  who owns the Rock.

[billd766]

On 9/17/2022 at 10:17 AM, jak2002003 said:

In possession of stolen goods.  They are supposed to be a good influence of the British people...

Naturally you have proof that it was stolen and not simply dug up from deep underground, owned by the company that had it dug out, and was given by the owners 117 years ago.

[Denim]

23 hours ago, malathione said:

You're confusing the Kohinoor with the Cullinan. Two different diamonds both part of the Crown Jewels.

I always thought I had the crown jewels. 

[thaibeachlovers]

20 hours ago, VocalNeal said:

Not stolen.

The stone was purchased by the Transvaal government and offered to the King. I simply Googled that as anyone else may.

Lots of diamonds have been dug out of what is now South Africa and sold to gullible potential husbands. Should they all be given back.

Beat me to it!

Seems that some are incapable of understanding that some things like the diamond were legally given to the Crown.

Some are just too eager to paint our ancestors as blackhearted and how we must make amends.

However it seems to always be other people that must pay for those amends.

Edited September 18, 2022 by thaibeachlovers

[TooPoopedToPop]

On 9/17/2022 at 10:00 AM, stevenl said:

We should not judge history from today's perspective, which unfortunately is happening more and more.

Agreed.

There is even a word for it, "presentism" - judging past actions by today's standards.

Those who do it are almost always pushing an agenda.

[baboon]

1 hour ago, TooPoopedToPop said:

Agreed.

There is even a word for it, "presentism" - judging past actions by today's standards.

Those who do it are almost always pushing an agenda.

Was imperialism ever 'right'? Basically big people picking on little people?

And invariably those who accuse others of "pushing an agenda" are the ones doing so themselves. 

[thaibeachlovers]

15 minutes ago, baboon said:

Was imperialism ever 'right'? Basically big people picking on little people?

And invariably those who accuse others of "pushing an agenda" are the ones doing so themselves. 

Imperialism was the norm back then, but of course every thing done by our ancestors was bad, according to some ( perhaps those with a guilt complex ).

I wasn't alive back then and I feel no personal responsibility for what happened, especially given my forebears lived in a colonized country.

I certainly do not feel any need to apologize for anything that happened hundreds of years ago when every country behaved the same way. Some were just more successful than others.

[jak2002003]

On 9/17/2022 at 4:17 PM, Foghorn said:

The Crown Jewels belong to the British people not the monarchy,  if Africa wants it back then give back all the monies that have been given to it over the last 100 years first ,didn’t think so 

Oh.  Thanks news to me.  If you say the crown jewels belong to us then I am off to get my share. 

[baboon]

10 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Imperialism was the norm back then, but of course every thing done by our ancestors was bad, according to some ( perhaps those with a guilt complex ).

I wasn't alive back then and I feel no personal responsibility for what happened, especially given my forebears lived in a colonized country.

I certainly do not feel any need to apologize for anything that happened hundreds of years ago when every country behaved the same way. Some were just more successful than others.

Imperialism was the norm, but hanging children for stealing bread was also once the norm. That doesn't make it right.

It is interesting that while a country would march its troops into somebody else's territory, subjugate the people and steal their sh!t, back at home there were strict laws and penalties against theft.

And in the case of 'Christian' countries, just where did Christ give the OK for it?

 

I am inclined to agree with the second part of what you wrote. I have German pals who feel they have no need to apologise to me for the third reich and I in turn feel I have no right to demand any such apology. What happened was nothing to do with us.

[baboon]

10 minutes ago, jak2002003 said:

Oh.  Thanks news to me.  If you say the crown jewels belong to us then I am off to get my share. 

You get to look at them if you pay enough money, what more do you want...?

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, baboon said:

Imperialism was the norm, but hanging children for stealing bread was also once the norm. That doesn't make it right.

It would not be "right" in today's world, and such does not happen, to my knowledge.

The list of things that were not "right" by today's standards would take several pages to detail, so I'll leave such in the past where it belongs.

[baboon]

4 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

It would not be "right" in today's world, and such does not happen, to my knowledge.

The list of things that were not "right" by today's standards would take several pages to detail, so I'll leave such in the past where it belongs.

My argument is that for a country supposedly modelling itself on the life and teachings of Christ, it could never have been right.