Israel is at War - General discussion (pt2)

[Wobblybob]

3 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Congratulations on a post that is actually thoughtful, and not the usual israel good, Hamas and all Gazans need to be killed type of post I'm used to seeing.

However, to answer your last paragraph, IMO it's because we don't like to see 2.3 million people that have been confined to what has to be the largest open air jail on the planet slaughtered by israeli and American  bombs from safety high in the sky. The phrase "shooting fish in a barrel" applies here with bells on.

The Gazans have no army, no air defense, hardly any military structure at all to resist ( Hamas is a small group armed with rifles and RPGs, no tanks, no artillery, no Iron Dome etc, and is hardly an "army" ), and now they have no hospitals to speak of, can't get clean water, even food is a problem, and they have no means of escape to anywhere, so all they can do is try and dig their dead children and women out of the rubble with hammers and bare hands while the slaughter continues.

 

There is no equivalent in Ukraine; they have best weapons the west can send them, and they can certainly run away to another country. Perhaps they are victims of their own success in halting the Russian advances. They are not "us" and they are holding their own, so why would the common man with enough problems of their own go and demonstrate for that unfortunate country?

 

Many of us don't like to see the laws that are supposed to govern conflict so brazenly flouted- the israelis don't even try to abide by the humanitarian laws, and simply ignore any protest. It's just so blatantly unfair to use a huge army armed with tanks, artillery, bombers etc to crush a mostly unprotected population with no escape, so while israel will win the conflict ( I won't call it a war ), they are going to get a hiding in world public opinion. The world has been watching, and is not impressed.

Don't start wars, simple.

[thaibeachlovers]

11 hours ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

 

More lies from you; in an earlier comment you said “If this is true, then Palestinians had a right to retaliate” …. this directly supports the atrocities carried out by Hamas on 7th October. You hide your support for Hamas for a few comments, and then it comes bubbling to the surface once again.

I see the old "if you support Palestinians that resist the israeli illegal occupation and land theft then you must be a Hamas supporter" attack is still being used. Sad.

 

If a thousand or so israelis killed by Hamas is an atrocity, what is 6,000 dead children and thousands more children injured, if not an attrocity?

[thaibeachlovers]

13 hours ago, Thorgal said:

 

Can you provide any of my post or snippet that I've been cheering for Hamas ? Thanks...

 

Of course he can't, and it's used to try and make us shut up and slink away, so doesn't matter that it's not true.

[Morch]

4 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I see the old "if you support Palestinians that resist the israeli illegal occupation and land theft then you must be a Hamas supporter" attack is still being used. Sad.

 

If a thousand or so israelis killed by Hamas is an atrocity, what is 6,000 dead children and thousands more children injured, if not an attrocity?

 

@thaibeachlovers

 

Don't start wars you can't win. Don't use your civilian population as shield. Invest in means to protect civilians.

You don't seem to think Hamas action, agenda had anything to do with this.

[thaibeachlovers]

12 hours ago, Jeff the Chef said:

You try to be civil, oh well.

It's that sort of post that I put them on ignore for, but they don't seem to realise that we don't have to put up with insults anymore, as ignore is just a click away.

[thaibeachlovers]

12 hours ago, Neeranam said:

That guy said something siilar about me, so did his buddies. It's pathetic, as neither you or I have ever shown any support for Hamas.

They said that to me as well, and for all I know they still are, even though I don't see their posts any more.

[Morch]

13 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Congratulations on a post that is actually thoughtful, and not the usual israel good, Hamas and all Gazans need to be killed type of post I'm used to seeing.

However, to answer your last paragraph, IMO it's because we don't like to see 2.3 million people that have been confined to what has to be the largest open air jail on the planet slaughtered by israeli and American  bombs from safety high in the sky. The phrase "shooting fish in a barrel" applies here with bells on.

The Gazans have no army, no air defense, hardly any military structure at all to resist ( Hamas is a small group armed with rifles and RPGs, no tanks, no artillery, no Iron Dome etc, and is hardly an "army" ), and now they have no hospitals to speak of, can't get clean water, even food is a problem, and they have no means of escape to anywhere, so all they can do is try and dig their dead children and women out of the rubble with hammers and bare hands while the slaughter continues.

 

There is no equivalent in Ukraine; they have best weapons the west can send them, and they can certainly run away to another country. Perhaps they are victims of their own success in halting the Russian advances. They are not "us" and they are holding their own, so why would the common man with enough problems of their own go and demonstrate for that unfortunate country?

 

Many of us don't like to see the laws that are supposed to govern conflict so brazenly flouted- the israelis don't even try to abide by the humanitarian laws, and simply ignore any protest. It's just so blatantly unfair to use a huge army armed with tanks, artillery, bombers etc to crush a mostly unprotected population with no escape, so while israel will win the conflict ( I won't call it a war ), they are going to get a hiding in world public opinion. The world has been watching, and is not impressed.

 

@thaibeachlovers

 

It's always amusing seeing your posts start with complaints about others being one-sided, then going on a tirade of exactly the same. Not to mention the usual nonsense, misleading comments, over the top statements and co-opting the general public/posters as supportive of your views. The truth is that you do not actually have much clue on what's going on - mainly because you're heavily biased and depend on a single news source that's biased as well.

[Bkk Brian]

6 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Of course he can't, and it's used to try and make us shut up and slink away, so doesn't matter that it's not true.

There are so far 22 pages of posts with information and debate in this topic, some with lots of facts and reality, others not so much. How many pages are you seeing to declare whether its true or not? @thaibeachlovers

Edited December 2, 2023 by Bkk Brian

[Morch]

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

It's that sort of post that I put them on ignore for, but they don't seem to realise that we don't have to put up with insults anymore, as ignore is just a click away.

 

1 minute ago, thaibeachlovers said:

They said that to me as well, and for all I know they still are, even though I don't see their posts any more.

 

@thaibeachlovers

 

Echo chambers ftw.

[Neeranam]

6 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

They said that to me as well, and for all I know they still are, even though I don't see their posts any more.

I hear you, I immediately ignored them after I was called a Hamas supporter. These people ruin healthy discussion. They are probably still claiming Israel doesn't have Apartheid and are justified in killing all Gazan children. 

 

 

[Morch]

3 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

I hear you, I immediately ignored them after I was called a Hamas supporter. These people ruin healthy discussion. They are probably still claiming Israel doesn't have Apartheid and are justified in killing all Gazan children. 

 

 

 

@Neeranam

 

More nonsense.

Plus both of you obviously read comments made about you anyway (not to mention drop the 'ignore' thing every now and then).

[thaibeachlovers]

14 hours ago, Danny Australia said:

 

 

You don't have to be a Palestinian. Any slightest criticism of Israel, or not fully adopting its narrative, would automatically mean to them you are a Hamas sympathiser even you were a Jew or a Holocaust survivor :) 

Apparently even the Jews for Peace demonstrating in the US have been accused of being anti Semitic.

 

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2023/11/why-jewish-voice-for-peace-is-against-israels-war-in-gaza.html

The group’s critics have been largely unmoved by the group’s professions of faith, dismissing JVP and its allies as a fringe minority at best and, at worst, as cynically using Jewish identity to fight against other Jews. For them, Zionism and Judaism go hand in hand, and the response to JVP actions from their fellow Jews who support Israel has at times been vitriolic. After recent JVP actions in New York, some online commentators accused the protesters of self-hatred, calling them “garbage Jews,” “tokens,” and “kapos” — a gravely serious accusation that recalls Jews who collaborated with the Nazis.

[Bkk Brian]

6 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

I hear you, I immediately ignored them after I was called a Hamas supporter. These people ruin healthy discussion. They are probably still claiming Israel doesn't have Apartheid and are justified in killing all Gazan children. 

 

 

 

16 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

They said that to me as well, and for all I know they still are, even though I don't see their posts any more.

@thaibeachlovers & @Neeranam you should both start up a Hamas fan page. Talk about all the posters you've got on ignore and happy clap each other.

[Neeranam]

Israel are just finishing what they started 75 years ago. Their plan has alays been to eliminate Palistinians. Isreal can't be a Jewish state if the majority of people aren't Jewish.

Israel are killing over 100 children a day and the USA are supporting this, disgusting.

[Morch]

3 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Israel are just finishing what they started 75 years ago. Their plan has alays been to eliminate Palistinians. Isreal can't be a Jewish state if the majority of people aren't Jewish.

Israel are killing over 100 children a day and the USA are supporting this, disgusting.

 

@Neeranam

 

There is no such plan, other than in your vile posts. Over the last 75 years, the number of Palestinian (in and out of Israel) has increased.

As for 'disgusting', there's no need to sign posts.

[Neeranam]

Just now, thaibeachlovers said:

Plenty of examples of such from history, if one looks.

I can understand if they are Jewish, being biased but after a week or so of kids being slaughtered every 10 minutes, they should have realized this is MUCH more than a revenge attack for 7 Oct.

[Bkk Brian]

3 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Likewise, how these people can support child civilians being killed is beyond me. It says a lot about their moral fibre.

Yea @Neeranam terrible how Hamas provides terrorist training for thousands of children in UN run schools. What's that about moral fiber?

[Neeranam]

13 minutes ago, Morch said:

Over the last 75 years, the number of Palestinian (in and out of Israel) has increased.

You are deluded.

Lets kick out a million and let a few come back in and we'll look like we are not discriminating against them

 

Edited December 2, 2023 by Neeranam

[Morch]

.

Edited December 2, 2023 by Morch

[Eloquent pilgrim]

45 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

I hear you, I immediately ignored them after I was called a Hamas supporter. These people ruin healthy discussion

 

You are a Hamas supporter, not sure why you deny it; in an earlier comment you said “If this is true, then Palestinians had a right to retaliate” The retaliation you were supporting was the appalling atrocities that Hamas perpetrated on 7th October … you can put people on ignore, and you can deny, but you can’t put the toothpaste back in the tube; you support and sympathise with Hamas, which is a choice that you are free to make.

 

[Morch]

18 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

You are deluded.

Lets kick out a million and let a few come back in and we'll look like we are not discriminating against them

 

 

@Neeranam

 

You make a claim, presented with fact, don't like it, so you post more nonsense.

Same old.

[Morch]

59 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

It's that sort of post that I put them on ignore for, but they don't seem to realise that we don't have to put up with insults anymore, as ignore is just a click away.

 

@thaibeachlovers

 

Conveniently looking the other way when these 'sort of posts' are on offer by posters you agree with. 

[Morch]

28 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Here we go again, are you wanting ignored? You are hurling the personal flames again just because my view on the slaughter disagrees with your narrative, pathetic.

 

 

 

 

@Neeranam

 

That's not much of a threat, really. All the more so seeing as you don't have the mental fortitude to adhere to it.

You do not offer a 'view' but lies, which you cannot support by anything factual.

[WDSmart]

12 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

@Neeranam

 

That's not much of a threat, really. All the more so seeing as you don't have the mental fortitude to adhere to it.

You do not offer a 'view' but lies, which you cannot support by anything factual.

And what do you accept as something "factual"? Something you've read on social media or something you've seen on TV? And, isn't presenting your "views" and opinions on a topic what discussions are all about? 

[Neeranam]

14 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

@Neeranam

 

That's not much of a threat, really. All the more so seeing as you don't have the mental fortitude to adhere to it.

You do not offer a 'view' but lies, which you cannot support by anything factual.

What lies? Here we go again. Maybe answer me this time.

[Morch]

Just now, WDSmart said:

And what do you accept as something "factual"? Something you've read on social media or something you've seen on TV? And, isn't presenting your "views" and opinions on a topic what discussions are all about? 

 

I rarely quote or link social media, prefer sticking to accepted news reports. If you have issues with what's considered 'acceptable' on this forum take it up with management and the moderation team. House rules and all that.

 

Having a personal view vs. presenting it as fact. Not too complicated.

 

Do you have any actual point to make regarding the topic?

[WDSmart]

Just now, Morch said:

 

I rarely quote or link social media, prefer sticking to accepted news reports. If you have issues with what's considered 'acceptable' on this forum take it up with management and the moderation team. House rules and all that.

 

Having a personal view vs. presenting it as fact. Not too complicated.

 

Do you have any actual point to make regarding the topic?

Morch, I made my point above. I can see and read all the new reports myself. What I can't do, and what I HOPE is the purpose of Asean Forums, is to discuss the issues with others and hearing (reading) what their point of view is on these subjects. 

[WDSmart]

4 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

 

Oh, hello …….. Alex Jones has joined the topic.

 

 

I am the polar opposite of Alex Jones. I am a far, far-left liberal.  

[Morch]

9 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

What lies? Here we go again. Maybe answer me this time.

 

@Neeranam

 

You claimed there was an Israeli long term plan afoot. You have not provided any coherent support for this. Facts run counter to your claims.

[Eloquent pilgrim]

3 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

I am a far, far-left liberal.

 

Don’t give me your hard luck stories.