Considering retirement visa using income only

[brianthainess]

8 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

There are about 2.8 million people in Australia receiving the OAP, although some may only be receiving a part pension due to other assets. That is 63% of Australians aged 65 and over, which makes people living solely off superannuation a minority.

I am guessing you are not Australian, when you post a comment which is factually wrong.

Exactly that is why I posted as I did, whether Jack is Australian or not, he does not know "Most Folks" In OZ over the age of 65.

Edited January 1 by brianthainess

[NanLaew]

1 hour ago, impulse said:

 

I can't help but wonder if anyone's been caught out by a paperwork snafu that would delay one month's deposit.

 

I'd certainly have tight sphincter condition based on some experiences with international wire transfers where a single digit or errant letter caused me grief.  Usually it was my paycheck and quickly straightened out.  I'd hope SS deposits would go smoothly once they were dialed in.  But...

 

Anyone have a horror story?

 

 

There have been reports of some immigration offices getting anal about the monthly stipend arriving on-or-about the same date each month. For example, the BoT decided that they would take a New Year holiday last Friday 29 December in lieu of taking it on Tuesday 2 January. For me, a transfer due to post last Friday won't post until next Tuesday.

 

There has also been reports of some immigration offices requiring that anyone filing for a Retirement Extension needs to provide proof that the funds are from their homeland's government pension agency and not being very happy with self-funded or private pension funding.

 

It behoves anyone pursuing any Extension to enquire at the Immigration office where they are filing to make sure they are compliant and avoid surprises.

 

It's a pity that despite the well known fact that Thailand's various Immigration offices do NOT apply the same rules and regulations, people asking for advice here seldom state where they will be applying. Similarly, those offering their advice based on personal experience seldom state where that good or bad experience took place.

Edited January 1 by NanLaew

[Lacessit]

I tried the income method for one year. I found it to be such a PITA keeping track of exchange rates, and losing money on transfers, that I went back to the 800K on deposit.

The 800K was deposited when the AUD exchange rate was about 29 baht, so it looks like I will always be ahead, even if I don't touch it.

[hotandsticky]

1 hour ago, impulse said:

 

 

Anyone have a horror story?

 

 

 

No. 

 

I do mine on the 1st of each month  -  it usually gives me 29 days to rectify any c0ck ups.

 

 

I haven't experienced any when using WISE.

[EVENKEEL]

2 hours ago, brianthainess said:

 

So who is Right??? I think EVENKEEL  as the OP did state one year in advance.

For extensions 800K is not required. To obtain Non O 90 day visa to start the 800 K is required. 

[Sheryl]

AN off topic post has been removed

[EVENKEEL]

2 hours ago, flexomike said:

If you have twelve months of deposits in the bank,none can be below 65,000, you do not need 800'000 in the bank

To start the non o 90 day visa, you need 800k in bank. Then for 12 month extension the 800k is not needed

[EVENKEEL]

2 hours ago, Lacessit said:

I tried the income method for one year. I found it to be such a PITA keeping track of exchange rates, and losing money on transfers, that I went back to the 800K on deposit.

The 800K was deposited when the AUD exchange rate was about 29 baht, so it looks like I will always be ahead, even if I don't touch it.

I have excess of 100K a month coming in. Exchange rates won't change things for me. Honestly if I had 800K in thai bank I'd find a way to spend it.

[Lacessit]

47 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

I have excess of 100K a month coming in. Exchange rates won't change things for me. Honestly if I had 800K in thai bank I'd find a way to spend it.

Fair enough, not all of us are that lucky or good.

IIRC you were in the US military.

[Liverpool Lou]

4 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

Always surprises me why folk have pensions or whatever deposited directly into Thai bank account.

I have them deposited into my Oz account and then WISE transfer into my Thai bank account.

Am I missing something. 

Some people no longer have accounts in their home countries.

[KhunBENQ]

4 hours ago, NanLaew said:

There has also been reports of some immigration offices requiring that anyone filing for a Retirement Extension needs to provide proof that the funds are from their homeland's government pension agency and not being very happy with self-funded or private pension funding.

At KK immigration I was advised to show home country documents about source of funds.

No problem for me, pension statement comes in July plus company pension sometime in the year.

I am keeping a schedule of transferring > 65k once in a calendar month since September.

Self transfer via WISE. Watching rate up to the 20th or so and then decide whether just 65xxx Baht or more. Before I just sent when the rate "looked good".

Still having > 800k (if my car doesn't break down )

So far also possible to get income statement from German consulate in Pattaya. He told me that this year I can handle it via postal mail. Quite convenient while German consulate in Bangkok is a PITA. But with consulates I am cautious that they might decide to drop the service (see what US and others did).

The 12x transfer method seems quite "waterproof". So I hope it will go smooth first week of October.

[billd766]

8 hours ago, bigt3116 said:

 

The cost of having my pension paid direct to my Thai bank is 70 baht, far cheaper than using an ATM and also many banks in England are closing accounts of people who no longer reside there.

 

My pensions are transferred to Wise and then I transfer them to Bangkok bank. I also check the forex rates for KBank, BKK bank, Wise and XE against the actual transfer rate that I get from Wise. That rate from Wise is always higher than the quoted forex rate of the other banks websites. The transfers to my Wise account are free, but the out going transfer rate is higher than 70p and it the fee rate, depends on how much I convert each time.

[itooktheredpill]

Sorry, to all you folks that think I'm fake. I posted this question from Argentina then I went to a new years eve party...now it's morning and I will carefully read each response and answer them and ask follow up questions.

Thanks.

[Presnock]

On 1/1/2024 at 10:43 AM, brianthainess said:

 

So who is Right??? I think EVENKEEL  as the OP did state one year in advance.

once the 12 deposits of at least 65K are done monthly, upon next extension can convert to monthly only and then 800K can be removed.

[newbee2022]

On 1/1/2024 at 6:26 AM, itooktheredpill said:

I am 66 and a a USA citizen. I have Argentine citizenship and Mexican permanent residency if it matters. I want to only use my social security income, which exceeds the 65,000 baht.

Since I have 2 Thai Bank accounts can I start depositing the 65,000 a year early so that I have a history...or is that necessary. Also, if it is necessary can I remove the 65,000 each month after I deposit it? 

Thanks for all your help!

You need a proof of monthly regular income of at least 65.000 Baht. And yes, you can spend the money.

[poyai111]

On 1/1/2024 at 9:42 AM, impulse said:

 

I can't help but wonder if anyone's been caught out by a paperwork snafu that would delay one month's deposit.

 

I'd certainly have tight sphincter condition based on some experiences with international wire transfers where a single digit or errant letter caused me grief.  Usually it was my paycheck and quickly straightened out.  I'd hope SS deposits would go smoothly once they were dialed in.  But...

 

Anyone have a horror story?

In 7 years of transferring pension from Australia to BKK Bank never had a problem. 

 

[cedel]

I am from Belgium, 59 years old, so I still don't have "pension" now, but I am disabled from work and get the monthly equivalent of 54,000 to 56,000 THB depending on the rate, of course I have savings to complete this amount every month if I can and if allowed to just send 65,000 (minimum) Baht from my own bank account or my wise to my thai bank account. 

For the moment, I have the 800,000 required but not for long enough,so I will do a visa run to meet the 60 days +15 days processing time for Non-O. 

I would not like to leave the 800000 permanently and almost without interest on a savings or even fixed deposit account. So that's why I'm interested in the method of sending every month at least 65000 (if the rate is very good could I send for example 100,000 some months ? And then less than 65000 the next month or has it to be at least 65000 per month ? ) 

Is it enough to just transfer every month at least 65000 B, even if my allowance is less than that ? Do they not require in Jomtien an indemnity certification that would, in my case be around 680,000 B per year so under the 800,000 ? 

Also if asked by immigration, can I just download this statement or should that be certified by the Belgian Embassy in Bkk ? 

And last question, if we could have a mix of let's say 100,000 or maximum 200,000B Baht in money stuck on my thai book bank, then could I send the difference every month ?

In the case I would leave 200,000 B I guess I should have then to send every month (800,000-200,000)=600,000/12=50,000 B per month ? 

Once again, I don't have pension yet, only monthly indemnity from the social security, and is sending from my bank account enough or do I need any other certification ? 

 

[charleskerins]

On 1/1/2024 at 6:26 AM, itooktheredpill said:

I am 66 and a a USA citizen. I have Argentine citizenship and Mexican permanent residency if it matters. I want to only use my social security income, which exceeds the 65,000 baht.

Since I have 2 Thai Bank accounts can I start depositing the 65,000 a year early so that I have a history...or is that necessary. Also, if it is necessary can I remove the 65,000 each month after I deposit it? 

Thanks for all your help!

I am considering doing the same thing -  have you considered how you will prove the income e.g -your Social Security statement  OR is the 12 x 65   the proof?

[Martin Brit]

On 1/1/2024 at 7:37 AM, EVENKEEL said:

To get started you will need 800K in a Thai bank for the Non O, then 12 months of 65K baht deposits for the 12 month extension.

In UK it is possible to leave 800k thb equivalent in a UK bank earning 5% for a year. The interest will cover the cost of using a visa agent. Much easier. Can you do same in US?

[EVENKEEL]

29 minutes ago, Martin Brit said:

In UK it is possible to leave 800k thb equivalent in a UK bank earning 5% for a year. The interest will cover the cost of using a visa agent. Much easier. Can you do same in US?

Yes, the same. Plus you'll have an extra 25K baht to play with.

[Iamloki]

On 1/1/2024 at 6:26 AM, itooktheredpill said:

I am 66 and a a USA citizen. I have Argentine citizenship and Mexican permanent residency if it matters. I want to only use my social security income, which exceeds the 65,000 baht.

Since I have 2 Thai Bank accounts can I start depositing the 65,000 a year early so that I have a history...or is that necessary. Also, if it is necessary can I remove the 65,000 each month after I deposit it? 

Thanks for all your help!

I'm an American on a retirement extension or many years. I don't think it is necessary, but I have my Social Security direct deposited into a BKK Bank "deposit" account. Those deposits are automatically coded as FTT. This is important because only FTT transfers are counted as income by Thai Immigration.

 

The "deposit" account can only be accessed by physically going to the bank. So it could be inconvenient if you are not in Thailand. That said, yes you can create a FTT transfer into the bank, and once posted remove the money.

 

My routine is every month I go to the bank and transfer the monthly income from the Deposit account to the account I live out of.

 

Each year at extension time, my bank letter, statement and copy of my bankbook pages only contain the monthly in the transfers and the out transfer... short, sweet and easy for Immigration to follow.

 

If you know which IO you will extend your permission to stay (retirement visa), I would suggest calling them and see if they prefer 12 monthly FTT transfers before moving to Thailand, or the 800K baht method...

 

Hope this helps.

[nglodnig]

On 1/1/2024 at 9:28 AM, EVENKEEL said:

The 800K is needed to obtain his Non O 90 day visa

I just showed a certificate showing I had a private (company) pension for over 65k THB a month - worked for me.

[KannikaP]

On 1/1/2024 at 3:20 PM, KhunBENQ said:

At KK immigration I was advised to show home country documents about source of funds.

At Phitsanulok Immigration there has never been any question about the source of my funds, simply they want to see that it arrives once per month, be it the 1st or 30th.

They also accept the Combination Method allowing me to have Bht 400k in the bank and 12 x 35k per month, totalling Bht 820k.

[EVENKEEL]

3 hours ago, nglodnig said:

I just showed a certificate showing I had a private (company) pension for over 65k THB a month - worked for me.

That would make sense but for my initial Non O 90 visa i had to show 800K and the for 12 month extensions from now on just 12 monthly deposits.

 

Was the certificate from Embassy? Curious

[nglodnig]

17 hours ago, EVENKEEL said:

Was the certificate from Embassy? Curious

No, it was from the company that is paying me the pension - which happens to be a bank (ex-employee). This was accepted - at least I got my visa so i assume all was well

[itooktheredpill]

On 1/1/2024 at 3:06 AM, EVENKEEL said:

To start the non o 90 day visa, you need 800k in bank. Then for 12 month extension the 800k is not needed

But can't I just get a 90 day visa out of country to start? Or, why do I need it at all if I enter for 30+ 30 days as a tourist?

[DrJack54]

6 minutes ago, itooktheredpill said:

But can't I just get a 90 day visa out of country to start? Or, why do I need it at all if I enter for 30+ 30 days as a tourist?

You can obtain non O outside of Thailand and enter with that.

The next step would be to apply for 12 month extension.

Unless your embassy can provide "income letter" you would need to comply with money in bank account requirements. 

[OldAjahn]

I'm confused. If someone with an existing non-o extension wants to convert from the 800,000 method to income method, when exactly can the 800,000 be removed? Presnock states, IIUC, that the 800,000 must be maintained for one year, simultaneously with 65,000 monthly deposits, until the next yearly extension. EVENKEEL's situation is slightly different, since he began fresh with a non-O 90-day visa.

 

I just did my yearly extension at CW based on 800,000, but would like next year to change to monthly income. My understanding of the rules is that three months after the date of the stamp, the bank account could be drawn down to 400,000, and the 400,000 could be withdrawn only after the new monthly income-based extension stamp became valid. When I changed from marriage to retirement status at CW, I had to present all the valid documents for a marriage visa on the day of the change, meaning I proved that I had fulfilled the requirements for my granted marriage extension throughout the previous year.

 

Does anybody have an experience changing the method at CW? And does CW just look at the date and amount of FFT transfer, or do they want to see documented proof of origin of the funds?

[ripstanley]

38 minutes ago, OldAjahn said:

I'm confused. If someone with an existing non-o extension wants to convert from the 800,000 method to income method, when exactly can the 800,000 be removed? Presnock states, IIUC, that the 800,000 must be maintained for one year, simultaneously with 65,000 monthly deposits, until the next yearly extension. EVENKEEL's situation is slightly different, since he began fresh with a non-O 90-day visa.

 

I just did my yearly extension at CW based on 800,000, but would like next year to change to monthly income. My understanding of the rules is that three months after the date of the stamp, the bank account could be drawn down to 400,000, and the 400,000 could be withdrawn only after the new monthly income-based extension stamp became valid. When I changed from marriage to retirement status at CW, I had to present all the valid documents for a marriage visa on the day of the change, meaning I proved that I had fulfilled the requirements for my granted marriage extension throughout the previous year.

 

Does anybody have an experience changing the method at CW? And does CW just look at the date and amount of FFT transfer, or do they want to see documented proof of origin of the funds?

The best way to find out is to go and ask your Immigration office. 

[OldAjahn]

1 hour ago, ripstanley said:

The best way to find out is to go and ask your Immigration office. 

Unfortunately, while that should work, it does not always. Depends on the IO. I've been given incorrect instructions a couple of times in the past at CW by the IO officers that one deals with. Once I had to contest the IO's interpretation and the matter was settled by the senior officer who sits in the desk behind. Other times I've had to do the research myself. We're lucky who use CW because they will follow the published rules more than other offices