UN Cuts Death of Women and Children in Gaza by Half

[Social Media]

 

The United Nations made a significant adjustment downwards around 50% to the casualty figures for the ongoing conflict in the Gaza Strip, sparking questions and debates about the accuracy of the data and the methods used to gather it.

 

The United Nations Office for Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs (OCHA) revised its child fatality figure from the Gaza war sharply downward, reporting more than 14,500 deaths on May 6 but then 7,797 on May 8. OCHA also revised downward its figure for women fatalities from more than 9,500 deaths to 4,959 deaths. 

 

The sudden change in figures has raised eyebrows and led to speculation about the UN's sources and methodologies. David Adesnik, director of research at the Foundation for Defense of Democracies, suggests that the UN may have stopped using figures provided by the Hamas-run Government Media Office (GMO), opting instead for data from the Gaza Health Ministry.

 

The shift in numbers underscores the challenges of accurately reporting casualties in conflict zones, especially when there are multiple sources providing conflicting information. Gabriel Epstein of the Washington Institute for Near East Policy has highlighted the discrepancies between the Hamas-run institutions, noting that they yield "wildly different and irreconcilable results." As has Elliott Abrams from Council on Foreign Relations.

 

Critics argue that the UN's approach to monitoring casualties in Gaza differs from its methods in other conflict zones, raising concerns about bias and reliability. Hillel Neuer, executive director of UN Watch, suggests that the UN's reliance on Hamas for casualty figures perpetuates an anti-Israel narrative.

 

Neuer points out that while the UN employs rigorous methodologies in other conflict situations, its approach to Gaza lacks transparency and accountability. He argues that the UN's credibility is at stake when it relies on sources with questionable credibility, such as Hamas-affiliated institutions.

 

The revision of Gaza casualty figures comes amid ongoing scrutiny of Hamas's tactics and propaganda. In recent months, Hamas has faced criticism for its handling of casualty data and its use of civilians as human shields. 

 

The controversy surrounding casualty figures underscores the complexity of reporting on conflicts, where misinformation and propaganda often cloud the truth. As the conflict in Gaza continues, it is essential to critically evaluate the sources and methodologies behind casualty data to ensure accuracy and accountability.

 

The UN has this following disclaimer on its footer on the Gaza deaths:

 

"Disclaimer: The UN has so far not been able to produce independent, comprehensive, and verified casualty figures; the current numbers have been provided by the Ministry of Health or the Government Media Office in Gaza and the Israeli authorities and await further verification. Other yet-to-be verified figures are also sourced."

 

According to the Times of Israel, the latest revision would bring the ratio of combatants to civilians killed in the conflict to nearly 1:1. “Either way, the number would be historically low for modern urban warfare,” West Point’s urban war studies chair John Spencer wrote in late March.

 

 

 

Related Topics

 

Hamas admits one-third of its data on Gazan deaths is ‘incomplete’

Scrutiny Over Gaza Death Toll Figures: UK Statistics Watchdog Investigates Hamas's Data

How the Gaza Ministry of Health Fakes Casualty Numbers

 

Credit: National Post 2024-05-14

 

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[thaibeachlovers]

I'd like to know who made the revised figures.

[Hawaiian]

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I'd like to know who made the revised figures.

The revisers, of course.

[Bkk Brian]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I'd like to know who made the revised figures.

Why would you prefer there were more dead, the same as the fake figures before?

[Neeranam]

4 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I'd like to know who made the revised figures.

[Bkk Brian]

31 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

UN revises Gaza death toll, almost 50% less women and children killed than previously reported

https://www.foxnews.com/world/un-revises-gaza-death-toll-50-less-women-children-killed-previously-reported

 

Direct quote from UN:

“The revisions are taken … you know, of course, in the fog of war, it’s difficult to come up with numbers,” Haq told JNS. “We get numbers from different sources on the ground, and then we try to cross check them. As we cross check them, we update the numbers, and we’ll continue to do that as that progresses.”

https://www.clevelandjewishnews.com/jns/un-blames-fog-of-war-for-major-overcounting-of-gazan-child-fatalities/article_4f4fe664-3f78-59f1-aa35-83e67c784323.html

 

 

 

[Hanaguma]

You mean Hamas was....lying....when they reported casualties?!?  Be still my racing heart.

 

I wonder how long it will take this information to percolate down to the mainstream media, and how many of them will issue retractions and apologies for their error...

[simple1]

Given the level of infrastructure destruction, 2000lb bombs and so on I find the ratio of 1:1 deaths in a very crowded urban environment not credible.

[Yellowtail]

1 minute ago, simple1 said:

Given the level of infrastructure destruction, 2000lb bombs and so on I find the ratio of 1:1 deaths in a very crowded urban environment not credible.

Of course you can't. 

[Hanaguma]

8 minutes ago, simple1 said:

Given the level of infrastructure destruction, 2000lb bombs and so on I find the ratio of 1:1 deaths in a very crowded urban environment not credible.

Or, perhaps it is evidence that the IDF actually HAS tried to reduce civilian casualties as much as possible, given the difficult combat environment. Credit where credit is due? 

[vinny41]

UN says total number of deaths in Gaza remains unchanged after controversy over revised data

The United Nations on Monday clarified that the overall number of fatalities in Gaza tallied by the Ministry of Health in Gaza remains unchanged, at more than 35,000, since the war broke out between Israel and Hamas on October 7.

The number was reduced because the UN says it is now relying on the number of deceased women and children whose names and other identifying details have been fully documented, rather than the total number of women and children killed. The ministry says bodies that arrive at hospitals get counted in the overall death count.

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/05/13/middleeast/death-toll-gaza-fatalities-un-intl-latam/index.html

 

[Bkk Brian]

16 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

UN says total number of deaths in Gaza remains unchanged after controversy over revised data

The United Nations on Monday clarified that the overall number of fatalities in Gaza tallied by the Ministry of Health in Gaza remains unchanged, at more than 35,000, since the war broke out between Israel and Hamas on October 7.

The number was reduced because the UN says it is now relying on the number of deceased women and children whose names and other identifying details have been fully documented, rather than the total number of women and children killed. The ministry says bodies that arrive at hospitals get counted in the overall death count.

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/05/13/middleeast/death-toll-gaza-fatalities-un-intl-latam/index.html

 

The ministry says bodies that arrive at hospitals get counted in the overall death count.

 

Except that:

 

April 6 report said that Hamas had “incomplete data” for 11,371 of the 33,091 recorded Palestinian deaths it claims, and is missing one or more key data points including identity number, full name, date of birth, or date of death. In a report three days earlier, the ministry admitted the “incompleteness” of 12,263 records. It was not immediately clear why, after three more days, that figure dropped to 11,371.

Before its admissions of incomplete data, the ministry asserted that the information in more than 15,000 fatality records had stemmed from “reliable media sources.” However, the ministry never identified the sources in question and Gaza has no independent media.

https://aseannow.com/topic/1325030-hamas-admits-one-third-of-its-data-on-gazan-deaths-is-‘incomplete’/

 

[simple1]

41 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

Or, perhaps it is evidence that the IDF actually HAS tried to reduce civilian casualties as much as possible, given the difficult combat environment. Credit where credit is due? 

 

Sure, if proven to be true. Personally I very much doubt the 1:1 ratio given the extremely close proximity of civilians to Hamas targets and the power of weapons used. You only have to look at the size of craters and local housing destruction by the 2000ib bombs; looks like the Russian / Syrian bombing of Aleppo in Syria.

[Bkk Brian]

3 minutes ago, simple1 said:

 

Sure, if proven to be true. Personally I very much doubt the 1:1 ratio given the extremely close proximity of civilians to Hamas targets and the power of weapons used. You only have to look at the size of craters and local housing destruction by the 2000ib bombs; looks like the Russian / Syrian bombing of Aleppo in Syria.

However you are taking a 1:1 quote out of context and not followed the link to it

 

That would mean some 18,000 civilians have died in Gaza, a ratio of roughly 1 combatant to 1.5 civilians. Given Hamas' likely inflation of the death count, the real figure could be closer to 1 to 1. Either way, the number would be historically low for modern urban warfare.

https://www.newsweek.com/israel-has-created-new-standard-urban-warfare-why-will-no-one-admit-it-opinion-1883286

[transam]

7 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Oh dear, what are you going to do now, now you don't have your genocide.......🤔

[Bkk Brian]

Unbelievable. The WHO is just as bad as the UN

 

https://twitter.com/EFischberger/status/1790325530044010628

 

The new data released last week attributes close to 10,000 reported deaths as coming from “reliable media sources,” and also reduces by more than half the number of women and children that it previously said had been killed during the war.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/who-defends-gaza-death-toll-figures-following-revision/

 

They are are also still not acknowledging the 14,000 Hamas fighters killed in those figures and the hundreds killed by Hamas's own rockets that failed.

 

[Yellowtail]

40 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Unbelievable. The WHO is just as bad as the UN

 

https://twitter.com/EFischberger/status/1790325530044010628

 

The new data released last week attributes close to 10,000 reported deaths as coming from “reliable media sources,” and also reduces by more than half the number of women and children that it previously said had been killed during the war.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/who-defends-gaza-death-toll-figures-following-revision/

 

They are are also still not acknowledging the 14,000 Hamas fighters killed in those figures and the hundreds killed by Hamas's own rockets that failed.

 

You're just finding that out? 

 

Move the UN to Turkey

[vinny41]

UN denies Gaza death toll of women and children has been revised down

After the Gaza health ministry’s revised totals of those killed first appeared on the website of the UN’s office for the coordination of humanitarian affairs (Ocha), they were quickly seized on as proof by pro-Israel media and commentators that the UN had previously been exaggerating the toll.

They showed 24,686 dead which appeared to be a downward revision from the figure of about 35,000 which had been reported earlier in May, with 7,797 children and 4,959 women confirmed dead, about half the toll cited in previous reports. But the UN said on Monday that estimated overall death toll remained about 35,000.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/may/13/gaza-ministry-revises-figures-for-women-and-children-killed

[Bkk Brian]

6 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

UN denies Gaza death toll of women and children has been revised down

After the Gaza health ministry’s revised totals of those killed first appeared on the website of the UN’s office for the coordination of humanitarian affairs (Ocha), they were quickly seized on as proof by pro-Israel media and commentators that the UN had previously been exaggerating the toll.

They showed 24,686 dead which appeared to be a downward revision from the figure of about 35,000 which had been reported earlier in May, with 7,797 children and 4,959 women confirmed dead, about half the toll cited in previous reports. But the UN said on Monday that estimated overall death toll remained about 35,000.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/may/13/gaza-ministry-revises-figures-for-women-and-children-killed

Miss leading Guardian headline. There is no quote of the UN saying that. 

 

“The United Nations’ teams in Gaza are unable to independently verify those figures given the prevailing situation on the ground and the sheer volume of fatalities,” an Ocha spokesperson, Jens Laerke, said. “It is for this reason that all figures used by the UN clearly cite the health ministry in Gaza as the source. The UN will verify these figures to the extent possible when conditions permit.”

 

 

[vinny41]

13 May 2024

Daily Press Briefing by the Office of the Spokesperson for the Secretary-General

The following is a near-verbatim transcript of today’s noon briefing by Farhan Haq, Deputy Spokesman for the Secretary-General.

Deputy Spokesman:  It’s not quite the case.  No.  What I can tell you is this:  The overall number of fatalities that has been tallied by the Ministry of Health in Gaza, which is our counterpart on dealing with the death tolls.  That number remains unchanged.  And it’s at more than 35,000 people since 7 October.  What’s changed is the Ministry of Health in Gaza has updated the breakdown of fatalities for whom full details have been documented.  So, what they recently published was that they gave figures for 24,686 out of 34,622 overall fatalities recorded in Gaza.  And those 24,686 people are the ones for whom full details have been documented

https://press.un.org/en/2024/db240513.doc.htm

[Bkk Brian]

3 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

13 May 2024

Daily Press Briefing by the Office of the Spokesperson for the Secretary-General

The following is a near-verbatim transcript of today’s noon briefing by Farhan Haq, Deputy Spokesman for the Secretary-General.

Deputy Spokesman:  It’s not quite the case.  No.  What I can tell you is this:  The overall number of fatalities that has been tallied by the Ministry of Health in Gaza, which is our counterpart on dealing with the death tolls.  That number remains unchanged.  And it’s at more than 35,000 people since 7 October.  What’s changed is the Ministry of Health in Gaza has updated the breakdown of fatalities for whom full details have been documented.  So, what they recently published was that they gave figures for 24,686 out of 34,622 overall fatalities recorded in Gaza.  And those 24,686 people are the ones for whom full details have been documented

https://press.un.org/en/2024/db240513.doc.htm

Yes I was reading that 10 mins ago and as confirmed the Guardian headline was just making things up.

 

Deputy Spokesman:  It’s not quite the case.  No.  What I can tell you is this:  The overall number of fatalities that has been tallied by the Ministry of Health in Gaza, which is our counterpart on dealing with the death tolls.  That number remains unchanged.  And it’s at more than 35,000 people since 7 October.  What’s changed is the Ministry of Health in Gaza has updated the breakdown of fatalities for whom full details have been documented.  So, what they recently published was that they gave figures for 24,686 out of 34,622 overall fatalities recorded in Gaza.  And those 24,686 people are the ones for whom full details have been documented — in other words, people who have been fully identified.  Out of those then, out of that smaller number, that subset of identified bodies, you have 7,797 children, 4,959 women, 1,924 elderly and 10,006 men.  And the Ministry of Health says that the documentation process of fully identifying details of the casualties is ongoing.  Meanwhile, as you can see, if you do the math, that there’s about another 10,000-plus bodies who still have to be fully identified. And so, then the details of those — which of those are children, which of those are women — that will be reestablished once the full identification process is complete.  We, our teams in Gaza, are unable to independently verify these figures, given the situation on the ground and the continuing combat and the sheer number of fatalities.  And so, we cite the Ministry of Health as the source for our figures.

[simple1]

3 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

However you are taking a 1:1 quote out of context and not followed the link to it

 

That would mean some 18,000 civilians have died in Gaza, a ratio of roughly 1 combatant to 1.5 civilians. Given Hamas' likely inflation of the death count, the real figure could be closer to 1 to 1. Either way, the number would be historically low for modern urban warfare.

https://www.newsweek.com/israel-has-created-new-standard-urban-warfare-why-will-no-one-admit-it-opinion-1883286

have to wait until hostilities are finished this time round and see if independent review is feasible. Personally I still do not believe the figures presented, IMO numbers do not reflect the devastation created by the Israelis and Hamas tactics. Again only my opinion, but  I don't think the Israeli government and military will emerge with their reputation intact due to the conduct of the war, in fact quite the opposite.  Hamas? as proven, no one expects them to abide by the rules of war.

[Bkk Brian]

Just now, simple1 said:

have to wait until hostilities are finished this time round and see if independent review is feasible. Personally I still do not believe the figures presented, IMO numbers do not reflect the devastation created by the Israelis and Hamas tactics. Again only my opinion, but  I don't think the Israeli government and military will emerge with their reputation intact due to the conduct of the war, in fact quite the opposite.  Hamas? as proven, no one expects them to abide by the rules of war.

Nobody believes figures presented apart from the UN conveniently forgetting the 14,000 Hamas killed and hundreds of other Gazans killed by their own rockets

[stoner]

2 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

Unbelievable. The WHO is just as bad as the UN

 

were you good with the WHO and covid ? just curious.

[Yellowtail]

Just now, stoner said:

 

were you good with the WHO and covid ? just curious.

Of course he was. 

[Bkk Brian]

3 minutes ago, stoner said:

 

were you good with the WHO and covid ? just curious.

Off topic but yes, do things ever change for you?

[stoner]

1 minute ago, Bkk Brian said:

Off topic but yes, do things ever change for you?

 

yes they do. but believing one thing they say and not another is not change. its strange. akin to cherry picking data to meet ones viewpoint.  

[Bkk Brian]

Just now, stoner said:

 

yes they do. but believing one thing they say and not another is not change. its strange. akin to cherry picking data to meet ones viewpoint.  

Its going where the evidence is. There is also evidence that WHO knew Hamas was using hospitals but never condemned them for it.

[stoner]

10 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Its going where the evidence is. There is also evidence that WHO knew Hamas was using hospitals but never condemned them for it.

 

ok brian. 

[Yellowtail]

13 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Its going where the evidence is. There is also evidence that WHO knew Hamas was using hospitals but never condemned them for it.

And never will.