Expats angry at huge concessions in latest Thai visa announcements

[pacovl46]

Yeah, well, the indefinite border runs won't last. They used to have that 20 years ago and then did away with it. 

[UWEB]

17 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Page six, paragraph seven in the Thai version.

You are Tax exempt for 180 days, but that is everybody else as well. Only LTR Visa Holders don't have to pay Taxes.

 

https://www.thailandelitevisas.com/comparing-thailand-privilege-card-vs-destination-thailand-visa-dtv/

[AgMech Cowboy]

7 hours ago, webfact said:

American expat Dan Silverman

Poor guy...  

 

I just got my first retirement extension of stay for one year last month and I'm HAPPY that I got it.  I've had a marriage Non-O visa from Savannakhet and Cambodia for most of the last 10 years.  When Ban Phu Nam Ron border crossing was open I enjoyed driving there every 3 months from Bangkok, now it's either a plane ticket 'somewhere' or a drive to Cambodia.  No Thank You!!! 

 

I'll gladly do the Retirement extension and report every 90 days. Much cheaper and much safer.

[Maestro]

5 hours ago, mokwit said:

If you don't extend DTV in country and just do border runs for a new 180 you would never under current enforcement have to do a TM30* or TM47 whilst living here for 5 years. So, those of us on extensions have to deal with "retentive" address confirmations via TM30 and 90 day reports, while the DTV people fly under the radar and Immigration may not know where they are.

 

Where in the official announcement of the DTV does it say that the legal requirement to notify the arrival of foreigners at a hotel or private place is waived for foreigners who  arrived with a DTV?

[geisha]

5 hours ago, mokwit said:

If you don't extend DTV in country and just do border runs for a new 180 you would never under current enforcement have to do a TM30* or TM47 whilst living here for 5 years. So, those of us on extensions have to deal with "retentive" address confirmations via TM30 and 90 day reports, while the DTV people fly under the radar and Immigration may not know where they are.

 

In an interview a senior IO said that the reason for TM30 enforcement was that it was embarrassing when they could not find people when requested by foreign police forces or when a tourist hadn't posted on Facebook for 48 hours [and for some reason people back home assumed they had been murdered].

 

*Landlord might file TM30.

Well the senior IO doesn’t «  tink too Mut »  Even if you do a TM30 it doesn’t mean you can’t be on the other end of Thailand robbing and murdering does it. Or that a young mongering tourist in Hua Hin is out in Pattaya trying out all Soi 6. 

[Presnock]

2 hours ago, bdenner said:

I understand where you're coming from, living in retirement for over 20 years, and commend you for your efforts putting this post together, obviously English is not your first language.

 

A pox on the "ba ba bor bor" (idiots) who think you are confused!

well I have been a forum user for a few years and am amazed at all the confusion among the users and no matter the subject either, quite intertaining to say the least.  Good luck to all.

[Maestro]

A lot of people don't seem to know that different visas are for staying in Thailand for different purposes and that different criteria exist for applying for different visas.

[kingstonkid]

5 hours ago, jippytum said:

I think in recent times the advantages of  holding a retirement extension has diminished compared to the promotion of easy visa on entry to allcomers

I think you are wrong. Then again, I am Canadian.  

Why is being Canadian important? That is because of the way the CDN government does Retirement letters,. They were able to keep down the monthly payment system.

 

I don't have t have 800 k in the bank here 

 

The retirement visa is a simple thing once you get the hang of it and understand what they want. I have been here since 2010 and have always been on retirement, and really, there have been no changes.  There is no need for border runs or flying out of the country.

 

With the online system for 90 day even that is a simple few clicks to get done.

 

The annual report is simple and quick 

 

If they want to make other types of visas available, that is OK, but as history has shown, people will abuse them (working without a permit) and start to pull them back again.  It reminds me of my dad  he used to give me all sorts of leeway until i stepped over the line and then is was start from scratch and go at it again. LOL

 

[cedel]

5 hours ago, G_Money said:

That is an option.

 

I will continue to transfer the required 65k or more every month to meet the needs for my retirement extension until I decide I’ve had enough of the Land of Smiles.

 

Don’t burn one’s bridges.

in theory from 2024 onwards, you will be taxed on your worldwide income as a thai fiscal resident and maybe a double tax treaty could be invoked to prevent it but it seems that you will need to file a tax report in Thailand...with all the fees and bother associated

 

[Presnock]

36 minutes ago, Mike Teavee said:

Where does it say DTV Holders are exempt from paying tax on their remitted income? 

 

guys can't do math or they don't unbderstand what makes a foreigner a tax resident according to the Thai Revenue Department

[pookett]

4 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Tourism numbers are increasing each year despite the inaccuracies you churn out.

Well done Einstein! Of course they are increasing year on year SINCE the Covid low. If they were not there would be very severe problems.

That the figures have not RECOVERED faster is the disappointment, there's a long way to go and Thailand, obviously, wants to get back to and beyond the 2019 high a.s.a.p.

[Presnock]

2 minutes ago, pookett said:

Well done Einstein! Of course they are increasing year on year SINCE the Covid low. If they were not there would be very severe problems.

That the figures have not RECOVERED faster is the disappointment, there's a long way to go and Thailand, obviously, wants to get back to and beyond the 2019 high a.s.a.p.

well just the other day they announced 19 million tourists so far this year....however, the money folks say that the amount of money recvd from these tourists is below what was expected.

[lamyai3]

5 minutes ago, pookett said:

That the figures have not RECOVERED faster is the disappointment, there's a long way to go and Thailand, obviously, wants to get back to and beyond the 2019 high a.s.a.p.

The current administration has set the goal of 80 million tourist arrivals by 2027, double the previous high. 

[transam]

30 minutes ago, fresher said:

Many people seem to be assuming this or have been told this. But nobody can have obtained a 30 day extension to a 60 day stamp yet. And this is Thailand. And the Thai Embassy clearly says you need a return ticket for 60 days or less to get a 60 day stamp. So will all Immigration offices be consistent and deal with this the same?

I thought any entry can be extended at immigration, that's how they make their money..😋

[newbee2022]

50 minutes ago, UWEB said:

Seems to be you simple don't understand how to become a Tax Resident. Regardless how many times you are coming and going to/from Thailand, if you stay more than 180 days in a Calendar Year in Thailand you are Tax Resident.

I didn't say anything else. But nice that you repeat it. Well done😂

[fulhamster]

2 hours ago, edwardflory said:

  I will state that MY local IO is stress free 95%, service oriented 100% and friendly 100% and they are 8 bicycle minutes from my front door.

I would guess your IO isn't Jomtien

[newbee2022]

52 minutes ago, stuarty said:

So basically if using extensions (cost not confirmed yet but either B10,000 or B1,900 prolly). You only have to leave every 360 days then return?

Seems like that. We will definitely hear more about it the next week's and months, even new regulations. My impression is they issued something and will adjust later.

[newbee2022]

56 minutes ago, Mike Teavee said:

Where does it say DTV Holders are exempt from paying tax on their remitted income? 

 

If you don't extend your stay then it's quite obvious that you don't need to pay taxes

[motdaeng]

25 minutes ago, cedel said:

in theory from 2024 onwards, you will be taxed on your worldwide income as a thai fiscal resident and maybe a double tax treaty could be invoked to prevent it but it seems that you will need to file a tax report in Thailand...with all the fees and bother associated

 

 

remitted income to thailand will be taxed from 2024 onwards ... not the worldwide income ....

 

 

[sambum]

7 hours ago, racket said:

The Elite Visas can be a total waste if you are not planning to stay for a very long time. For the same amount of money, you could open a small business or invest in an already established company and stay in Thailand long-term. The cost of the 5-year Elite Visa increased from 500,000 baht to 900,000 baht after COVID, with only minor policy changes and additional perks. Moreover, the Elite Visa does not offer a path to permanent residency or citizenship, which means you'll need to continue renewing it or find other solutions for long-term stay. With limited benefits compared to other long-term visa options, it seems like a poor investment short-term. 

 

Extending the visa-exempt entry was a wise move for Thailand, especially given Malaysia's 90-day visa exemption for tourists from many countries. This change was anticipated, as the new Thai government, under Prime Minister Srettha Thavisin, has shown a stronger commitment to boosting tourism and foreign investment compared to the previous administration led by General Prayuth Chan-o-cha. The new government’s policies are aimed at revitalizing the tourism sector, which had suffered during the COVID-19 pandemic, and attracting more international visitors and investors to stimulate economic growth.

 

Additionally, what this elite visa holder may not mention is that the Elite Visa offers the possibility of extending for up to 6 years initially. By paying an additional 400,000 baht before the initial period expires, he can extend the visa for another 10 years, making it a total of 16 years. This makes the Elite Visa a compelling option for long-term residents. In contrast, the Thailand Elite Visa provides various benefits like expedited immigration services, access to a concierge service, and no need for annual visa renewals, which can be cumbersome with other visa types. Both the Digital Nomad Visa (DTL) and retirement visas come with their own set of complications, such as requirements for income verification or ongoing compliance with specific regulations. Therefore, the Elite Visa offers a premium solution that simplifies the long-term stay in Thailand, avoiding many of the common obstacles associated with general visa options.

 

If he stays on the elite visa program for 16 years, he’ll end up paying just 6,770 baht per month, which is quite reasonable compared to other long-term residency options..

 

I pay 1990 baht per year to extend my Visa based on Marriage to a Thai National, and the same price applies to my to neighbour who has an extension based on Retirement.

6770 baht per month totals 81,240 baht per year which I do not find "quite reasonable"!!!

But it depends on how much you are prepared to pay to avoid all the hoops that Immigration make you jump through every year I suppose

[Ralf001]

9 minutes ago, newbee2022 said:

If you don't extend your stay then it's quite obvious that you don't need to pay taxes

 

But if you return within the same fiscal year... and you total goes above 180days then you are required to pay tax.

[Maitdjai]

1 hour ago, racket said:

 

There are millions of individuals around the world who don’t qualify for retirement but have money in the bank. Therefore, a long-term visa option should be available for these individuals. For instance, many professionals and entrepreneurs accumulate significant savings but do not meet the age requirement for retirement visas. While one might argue that the 800k THB in the bank is still ‘your money,’ it essentially becomes a deposit fund you can’t touch as long as you are in Thailand, making it inaccessible for other investments or emergencies. The Elite visa, however, has no such requirements, offering greater financial flexibility. Additionally, retirement visas are only available to those over 50 years old, excluding younger expatriates who might want to live in Thailand long-term. Considering that the Thailand Elite Visa program offers residency options ranging from 5 to 20 years with benefits such as expedited immigration services and exclusive privileges, it makes perfect sense for those planning to stay more than 10 years to choose this option.

You are confirming what I wrote.

 

But not so many, of those millions of rich young entrepreneurs, under 50 (!) years old used it.

It was a failing attempt right from the beginning and a bad deal.

 

Some people bought it, because they had no other choice, and many bought, it because they fell for the "status", and those petty "privileges", which are making everything so "simple".

 

Everything has its price.

No matter what the market brings tomorrow.

 

The "retirement" visa was just an example to compare the smart calculation.

About the bank deposit, I think, there is a little difference between having to pay up in advance, which means it's gone! Or having the 800k in my bank account.

For "Elites" maybe not.

 

 

[Mike Teavee]

Just now, newbee2022 said:

If you don't extend your stay then it's quite obvious that you don't need to pay taxes

 

It has nothing to do with the type of Visa or Extensions it's simply how many days you spend in Thailand in any 1 Calendar Year..

1. Enter on a DTV, spend 90 days, have a weekend away in Cambodia, come back for another 90 days - Tax Resident
2. Enter on a 60 day Visa Exempt, extend it, do a border run & repeat -  Tax Resident
3. Enter on a Non-IMM O, spend 90 days, go travelling for 7 months, come back for 2 months - Not Tax Resident.

 

#3 is exactly what I'm planning on doing when I take my PCLS (Pension Commencement Lump Sum) as it's Tax Free in the UK & I don't want to be paying >3Million THB in tax to Thailand when I bring it over.

[bdenner]

2 hours ago, Maitdjai said:

Oh, another "English" lecturer sharpening his profile.

Wot's wrong with you??

I'm trying to defend those who try their best to communicate on an English WEB site without full knowledge of the language.

Spare me days!!!!

Let me welcome you to "ba ba bor bor"

[AhFarangJa]

This is flip flop Thailand, anyone who has stayed here for some time, say retirees, know this will change in only a few days or weeks. They always publish without thinking, let the feedback come, then flip the rules. Sit back, and watch the chaos unfold.

[Gknrd]

I will definitely look into this. My last trip there was a Pain in the $ss. I left with no intension of ever going back. Now?  I may head back for 6 months..  Perfect for people like me that have no intension of living there full time.  I ditched my retirement visa in Thailand when they went with the 800K in the bank. The polution was killing me there and I was only staying 6 months a year anyway. 

If that is the case then I may come back for 6 months at at time. At present I travel to countries that only let you stay for 6 months a year, but it is basically free and I don't have to do border runs and jump through hoops. I love it. As I have no intension of living there anyway.

 

Thailand is only livable for 6 months a year anyway. 

[Caldera]

Fortunately nobody takes those muppets and their ridiculous moaning seriously. 

[Elkski]

All these border runs will get the tourist numbers up.   Thailand has learned that the main thing they have for their economy is tourism.   They want the money but they don't try to better the experience by cracking down on those taxis in BKK that refuse fares.   Maybe they don't know how much just one such experience bothers some of us.     This fake government is trying to make the pubes feel like they care.  

[connda]

9 hours ago, webfact said:

Longstay expats with expensive visas say the new 60 days visa-exempt policy and the 180 days Destination Thailand Visa have made the Elite visa and the annual extensions of stay for retirement and marriage worthless. Geoffrey Fisher, a Brit who recently paid 900,000 baht (about 20,000 UK pounds) for the five year Elite visa said he had wasted his money as more or less anyone can now stay in Thailand almost indefinitely for a paltry sum.

As a guy who has been here for 17 years and who is on a marriage extension to "temporarily visit my wife" this year.

He's what I have to say to Geoffrey Fisher and friends.

"Boo hoo hoo hoo hoo hoo." 

Now grow up and get over it.  You made your choice (which in my own opinion is a waste of money to begin with).  Now you have "buyer's remorse."

😢 "Boo hoo hoo hoo hoo!"  Where's the sour grapes emoti?  🍇

[JohnnyBD]

The first link is from the Revenue Department website, and the second link is on the ASEAN NOW forum, under the Jobs & Banking forum. 

 

FOREIGNERS_PAY_TAX2024.pdf (rd.go.th)