Why doesn't Trump refer to the US $280bn trade surplus in areas such as financial services and social media when he's 'calculating' the trade deficit?

In the ten years from 2001 when China joined the WTO and gained free access to US markets, living standards, growth, profits and the stock markets boomed in the US with all the cheap exports from China.

US services thrived and US consumer brands boomed worldwide, relying on the very efficient supply chains from China and Asia. The downside, however:

A loss of 1 million manufacturing jobs and 2.4 million jobs overall.

A failure to distribute the wealth evenly across the country. America's aversion to 'socialist' policies, silly billies.

Too late now, imo. The rest of the world will form their own alliances though the US still holds 25% of the world's GDP.

 

 

 

 

30 minutes ago, bannork said:

Why doesn't Trump refer to the US $280bn trade surplus in areas such as financial services and social media when he's 'calculating' the trade deficit?

In the ten years from 2001 when China joined the WTO and gained free access to US markets, living standards, growth, profits and the stock markets boomed in the US with all the cheap exports from China.

US services thrived and US consumer brands boomed worldwide, relying on the very efficient supply chains from China and Asia. The downside, however:

A loss of 1 million manufacturing jobs and 2.4 million jobs overall.

A failure to distribute the wealth evenly across the country. America's aversion to 'socialist' policies, silly billies.

Too late now, imo. The rest of the world will form their own alliances though the US still holds 25% of the world's GDP.

 

I don't understand all the details but it's inherently unsustainable. The US is trading currency reserves for real goods. Every year the US is creating more money which gets sent abroad and becomes digits in a database. The debt grows higher and higher and the total money supplies grows.

 

How long can that go on? There must be some point at which they're tired of taking money they can't spend in the US economy because we're not making things they need. I think this is more about the global monetary system than anything else and Trump realizing we're backed into a corner we need to get out of.

13 minutes ago, NorthernRyland said:

I don't understand all the details but it's inherently unsustainable. The US is trading currency reserves for real goods. Every year the US is creating more money which gets sent abroad and becomes digits in a database. The debt grows higher and higher and the total money supplies grows.

 

How long can that go on? There must be some point at which they're tired of taking money they can't spend in the US economy because we're not making things they need. I think this is more about the global monetary system than anything else and Trump realizing we're backed into a corner we need to get out of.

It's not just the debt. It is also the interest on the debt. $36 trillion at 5% interest means the debt grows by $1.8 trillion every year, with compounding.

 

I can't see the USD being the world reserve currency much longer. A basket of stable currencies makes much more sense.

9 hours ago, KhunLA said:

Compare ?  what ... apples & orange ?  No other country is like the USA.   It's a democratic republic, with electoral college, that elects/appoints the administrative branch (pres & vp), no matter what the popular vote is.

 

In the USA ...

 

... You have freedom of speech / press

... You are innocent till 'proven' guilty

... You can own & use a firearm to protect you & yours

 

I'm far from a representative of that country, as don't consider myself an ignorant idiot.   Apparent ~90% of the people are still dependent on 'the system'.   Have no clue how to be independent of it.

 

 

I left 25 yrs ago, and could give 2 sh!ts what happens over there, as it simply has NO EFFECT on me or mine.

 

You were the first 'pleasant dude' to call my opinion (actually all facts) ...

... rubbish.  Why I rarely bother to have discussions with ignorant people such as yourself.

 

BYE BYE

 

 

Oh, you left 25 years ago.....................not affect you...............but still care, right?

Actually, it's very easy: just ignore the clown in the White House.

 

Gov Gavin Newsom is calling other nations and working out trade deals between California and other nations, ignoring the nonsense of POTUS. California is a huge and attractive market, and CA Produces lots of goods for export. Win-Win, and for POTUS, Lose-Lose.

 

CA doesn't need DC. It's the world's 5th largest economy. POTUS HAS no authority to impose tariffs, so States are not under obligation to abide by the clownshow.

 

Once Newsom succeeds, expect other States to do the same, perhaps forming a trade block. OR, WA, MA, NY, NJ, CT and PA can all join in and do business. Companies able to benefit can see their stock prices soar again.

7 hours ago, jvs said:

Having the secret service stay at his place paying an inflated price?

Selling hats,bibles,guitars and trying to make money off his Trump coin?

I am sure there is a lot more.

You have to come up with something better in order for me to believe he is some kind of saint.

And ripping students off with Trump university, stealing from his charity. How dumb can one be to support that.

18 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

And ripping students off with Trump university, stealing from his charity. How dumb can one be to support that.

MAGAdumb. That's how dumb. It's its own category of ignorant.

 

I suspect MAGAs bring down the collective IQ of humanity by at least 20 points.

20 hours ago, biervoormij said:

You seem very reliant on Social Security and I would point out that it is part of the system and it is currently taking care of you. I know we paid into Social Security and should get the benefits but your current checks come from money being paid by workers in the US now and the money you and I paid in was spent a long time ago.

 

 

In NZ pensions are paid by current taxation, and if it all turns to <deleted> I'm probably screwed.

3 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

In NZ pensions are paid by current taxation, and if it all turns to <deleted> I'm probably screwed.

The fear is all politically motivated and nobody would be saying it if Biden were president. More likely than that is worldwide recession in which case you will be glad you are living in a developed country 

Penguins in US zoos face an uncertain future 

 

20 hours ago, pomchop said:

 

 

  Why so angry?

 

Lefites are miserable people.   Many of them suffer from mental illness. 

 

Conservatives Are Happier than Liberals

Although the study by Gimbrone et al. was focused on trends among young people, the well-being gap between conservatives and liberals is not unique to youth. The gap manifests clearly across all age groups and is present as far back as the polling goes. In the General Social Survey, for instance, there has been a consistent 10 percentage point gap between the share of conservatives versus liberals who report being “very happy” in virtually every iteration since 1972 (when the GSS was launched).

Academic research consistently finds the same pattern. Conservatives do not just report higher levels of happiness, they also report higher levels of meaning in their lives. The effects of conservatism seem to be enhanced when conservatives are surrounded by others like themselves. However, in an analysis looking at ninety countries from 1981 through 2014, the social psychologists Olga Stavrova and Maike Luhmann found “the positive association between conservative ideology and happiness only rarely reversed. Liberals were happier than conservatives in only 5 out of 92 countries and never in the United States.”

 

https://americanaffairsjournal.org/2023/03/how-to-understand-the-well-being-gap-between-liberals-and-conservatives/

 

 

From a major Trump backer. He may not have been the guy we thought he was. Woops. 

 

The president is losing the confidence of business leaders around the globe...this is not what we voted for,” wrote Bill Ackman, billionaire head of Pershing Square, on X. “The President has an opportunity on Monday to call a time out and have the time to execute on fixing an unfair tariff system. Alternatively, we are heading for a self-induced, economic nuclear winter, and we should start hunkering down.”

3 hours ago, bannork said:

Penguins in US zoos face an uncertain future 

 

 

4 hours ago, hotsun said:

The fear is all politically motivated and nobody would be saying it if Biden were president. More likely than that is worldwide recession in which case you will be glad you are living in a developed country 

Of course it's all politically motivated and the sheeple are swallowing the BS hook line and sinker. Baaaaah.

12 hours ago, bannork said:

A failure to distribute the wealth evenly across the country. America's aversion to 'socialist' policies, silly billies.

Rich people are like Stingy in Lazy Town. "That's mine, and that's mine, and that's mine, it's all mine, mine, mine."

"Trump tells Americans ‘it won’t be easy’"!

 

What was the slogan back along?

"Guns before butter"!

 

12 hours ago, bannork said:

The rest of the world will form their own alliances though the US still holds 25% of the world's GDP.

Wouldn't that be a good thing? Why do so many think the US should be the big dog? It's been exploiting way above other countries to provide a lifestyle other countries can only dream about.

That can only last so long before it doesn't. Perhaps now is when it doesn't happen any more.

On 4/7/2025 at 7:35 AM, biervoormij said:

You seem very reliant on Social Security and I would point out that it is part of the system and it is currently taking care of you. I know we paid into Social Security and should get the benefits but your current checks come from money being paid by workers in the US now and the money you and I paid in was spent a long time ago.

I give the majority, if not all, of SS to the wife, and she invests it for her and my daughter's future.  Reality, neither needs it, as both sitting fine already.

 

Posted elsewhere how SS gets saved & invested.  Haven't touched it this year, or my pension, as still working from leftovers from last year's budget.

 

This will give you an idea where the my SS goes, well most of it ...

https://aseannow.com/topic/1334362-budget-again-keto-ish-diet/#findComment-19263439

 

13 hours ago, bannork said:

n the ten years from 2001 when China joined the WTO and gained free access to US markets, living standards, growth, profits and the stock markets boomed in the US with all the cheap exports from China.

Yeah, but a shame about all those once up a time people that had a job in the US after their jobs got transferred to exploited people in Asia. Your benefits that you like so much were created by consigning thousands of Americans to poverty and the exploitation of the poor in Asia. That's nothing to be proud of.

27 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

I give the majority, if not all, of SS to the wife, and she invests it for her and my daughter's future.  Reality, neither needs it, as both sitting fine already.

 

Posted elsewhere how SS gets saved & invested.  Haven't touched it this year, or my pension, as still working from leftovers from last year's budget.

 

This will give you an idea where the my SS goes, well most of it ...

https://aseannow.com/topic/1334362-budget-again-keto-ish-diet/#findComment-19263439

 

Sorry but I found your original post irritating. You are asking for hard working Americans to suck it up while you set in Thailand living it up and getting your monthly government check. Then saying lucky me my government check will get bigger with my new COLA.

 

I feel for all the Americans that are living pay check to pay check and are going to have to suck it up. I just wanted to point out that these working Americans are the reason you get that government check and they may never receive one themselves.

31 minutes ago, biervoormij said:

Sorry but I found your original post irritating. You are asking for hard working Americans to suck it up while you set in Thailand living it up and getting your monthly government check. Then saying lucky me my government check will get bigger with my new COLA.

 

I feel for all the Americans that are living pay check to pay check and are going to have to suck it up. I just wanted to point out that these working Americans are the reason you get that government check and they may never receive one themselves.

So I'm irritating because ...

... I chose better income streams

... didn't rely on govt or employers

... planned my retirement

... get to use and or save what I paid into

 

Not my fault, they are left to struggle and fix the system they allowed the corrupt politicians to destroy.   You are either part of the solution or you are the problem.

 

I suggested, if people want the tariffs to work, as Pres Trump suggest, 'it isn't going to be easy'.   And it definitely is not going to be.

 

These same people that need to make the sacrifice, are the same people that allowed the system to screw them royally, and now this is where they are at.  Their fault, their problem ... not mine.   I chose a different path.   We live by our choices.

 

At their own doing, for not being intelligent enough to pay attention a long time ago, to make govt accountable, while their taxes and deficit continued to go up, with NO positive result from the increases.

 

... They allowed the Gulf war to take place.

... They allowed the market bail out

... They allowed healthcare to be unaffordable

... They allowed lock down and shut downs during pandemic.

... Most importantly, they continued to allow corrupt politicians drain the SS fund, because they, politicians can't seem to balance a checkbook, while enriching themselves.

... After realizing the failure of the politicians, they, USA citizens kept reelecting them 

 

Som nam naa

 

And it's too late now.  Unless of course, they make the sacrifice, and trust the man they elected.   But we all know that's not going to happen, or that the deep state will allow it to.

 

Look at it on paper, and you realize it's a theory, business strategy that will work.  'BUY USA' ... it really is too simple a solution.  Invest in yourself.

 

Won't be solved this year, not this administration, but in 10 years, if manufacturing came back to the USA, and the deficit is reduced, and balance budgets passed instead of the ever rising deficit ceiling, then the USA 'citizens' can dig themselves out of the hole, THEY put themselves in.

 

Two very smart businessmen, have a plan that will work, IF YOU WORK IT.

 

Good luck with that ... 

 

34 minutes ago, biervoormij said:

Sorry but I found your original post irritating. You are asking for hard working Americans to suck it up while you set in Thailand living it up and getting your monthly government check. Then saying lucky me my government check will get bigger with my new COLA.

 

I feel for all the Americans that are living pay check to pay check and are going to have to suck it up. I just wanted to point out that these working Americans are the reason you get that government check and they may never receive one themselves.

I dont feel for americans. Even the homeless ones and the ones in prisons are still living better lives than most the rest of the world

13 hours ago, Lacessit said:

It's not just the debt. It is also the interest on the debt. $36 trillion at 5% interest means the debt grows by $1.8 trillion every year, with compounding.

 

I can't see the USD being the world reserve currency much longer. A basket of stable currencies makes much more sense.

then unless you wish for the demise of the USA, you show why tariffs work. Cant even get your economics

straight except hate the USA

15 minutes ago, Yagoda said:

then unless you wish for the demise of the USA, you show why tariffs work. Cant even get your economics

straight except hate the USA

I don't hate the USA. I despise Americans who were so dumb they elected a felon and economic illiterate as their President. I feel sorry for the Americans who still have sense and integrity.

 

The Smoot Hawley tariffs of 1930 were a key factor in exacerbating the Great Depression. Obviously you and the orange idiot are incapable of learning from history.

23 minutes ago, Yagoda said:

then unless you wish for the demise of the USA, you show why tariffs work. Cant even get your economics

straight except hate the USA

Well he's showing why tax increases work. High tariffs arr taxes that are just a particularly inept way to raise revenue for the government . 

..

51 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

So I'm irritating because ...

... I chose better income streams

... didn't rely on govt or employers

... planned my retirement

... get to use and or save what I paid into

IMO you are being unfair. I haven't quoted your entire post or I'd be replying to it for far too long.

 

Be honest, you were lucky. No one has a crystal ball and no one knows if what they choose is the right path. Only looking back will we know that.

 

Of course you rely on other people and government. You didn't invent or create everything you use to have a good life. You didn't make your EV, or the electricity that makes it work- other people did that, and it was by companies.

 

Not everyone has their retirement plan work. I had one, till the rules got changed. I'll never believe anything any government official says ever again.

 

There are no guarantees- you were just lucky you were not conscripted and left disabled ( I'm assuming you are American of an age to be conscripted for Vietnam- apologies if that is wrong. OR disabled in a car accident or disabled after being hit by a bus etc etc.

 

We all live a life that was given to us- no one makes everything that happens around us, so if one is lucky, one should rejoice in one's good fortune, but one should not assume that it was because of one's choices, or be critical of those less fortunate. Had you been born in a Brazilian slum, would you have the life you have?

 

My life ain't great now, but getting here was amazing. I had a fantastic life, interspersed with crappy bits, but it was all down to luck and being in the right place at the right time. Had I had the life I chose when in school, I'd have milked cows for 50 years, be divorced with children that hate me, and no great memories. Just lucky it didn't turn out like that.

57 minutes ago, hotsun said:

I dont feel for americans. Even the homeless ones and the ones in prisons are still living better lives than most the rest of the world

Ain't that the truth. Even worse, the worse off ones are being exploited to make western lives better than theirs.

It seems that most of Trump's promises of immediate benefits turn into "it won't be easy". 

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

 It's been exploiting way above other countries to provide a lifestyle other countries can only dream about.

 

Tell that to the poor people in the USA: https://www.census.gov/library/publications/2024/demo/p60-283.html

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

IMO you are being unfair. I haven't quoted your entire post or I'd be replying to it for far too long.

 

Be honest, you were lucky. No one has a crystal ball and no one knows if what they choose is the right path. Only looking back will we know that.

 

Of course you rely on other people and government. You didn't invent or create everything you use to have a good life. You didn't make your EV, or the electricity that makes it work- other people did that, and it was by companies.

 

Not everyone has their retirement plan work. I had one, till the rules got changed. I'll never believe anything any government official says ever again.

 

There are no guarantees- you were just lucky you were not conscripted and left disabled ( I'm assuming you are American of an age to be conscripted for Vietnam- apologies if that is wrong. OR disabled in a car accident or disabled after being hit by a bus etc etc.

 

We all live a life that was given to us- no one makes everything that happens around us, so if one is lucky, one should rejoice in one's good fortune, but one should not assume that it was because of one's choices, or be critical of those less fortunate. Had you been born in a Brazilian slum, would you have the life you have?

 

My life ain't great now, but getting here was amazing. I had a fantastic life, interspersed with crappy bits, but it was all down to luck and being in the right place at the right time. Had I had the life I chose when in school, I'd have milked cows for 50 years, be divorced with children that hate me, and no great memories. Just lucky it didn't turn out like that.

Lucky had nothing to do with it.

 

After getting laid off from my 3rd airlines, 1985 (30 yrs old), I simply realize self employment was the way to go, after 15 ish years of playing the employee.  The rest was easy after that realization.

 

Instead of a measly $9 an hour, I paid myself $50-$100 an hour.  Work smarter, not harder.

 

Investing in RE, then teaching myself how to trade successfully in the stock market.

 

Living within my means, actually way below my means, with minimal waste, and 'look at me toy purchases'.   Living in crap neighborhoods, driving old 2nd hand cars, MCs, trucks.

 

If I couldn't buy something I wanted with cash, then I simply couldn't afford it.   I knew how to balance a check book.  Unlike most & govt.

 

All extra money going toward retire plan.  Actually very structured, with a play money budget, and sticking to it.  Paid off mortgages ASAP, and never borrowed money for depreciating toys.  Economics 101

 

RE allowed living rent free.  Working for airlines again, later, 2 days a week, supplemented self employment, and allowed near free travel and health ins (never needed), along with allowing 5 days off for myself; working or playing.

 

Avoiding most of the mistakes that I saw others making, that made it impossible for them to get ahead.  Mainly living way beyond their means and in debt for their 'look at me toys & house'.

 

It's not rocket, it's simply common sense.