How safe/risky is money in the bank, 800k CD, etc.

[peeba7]

The money for the retirement visa sits in a Fixed CD I believe it is called, you can withdraw anytime but loose your interest with SCB.
Someone recently told me he lost cash in a bank during the 1997 crash but not sure the invest vehicle he was in.
So how safe is this money, are there safer ways, like savings but unfortunately savings has very low interest rates.  Apologies if this has been covered before.  Would especially like to hear from folks that were here in 1997 but all may chime in.
Thanks.

[ubonjoe]

Things have changed since 1997.

Deposits are insured up to 15 million baht for about 2 more years and will progressively go down to 1 million in 2020. See: http://www.dpa.or.th/ewt_news.php?nid=320&filename=index___EN

[meatboy]

are the banks safe? well its better putting it in the bank than given it to your gf.

we had money in the banks in 1997,the only people that lost out was those [us] who changed our currency to bahts.

[KittenKong]

18 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

Things have changed since 1997.

Deposits are insured up to 15 million baht for about 2 more years and will progressively go down to 1 million in 2020.

 

This is true. However any such guarantee is only as good as the guarantor and national bank deposit guarantees in particular are designed to reassure not to actually pay out. If there was a real catastrophe here then I would not be all surprised if they retroactively excluded farangs from the guarantee, or even altered the terms for everyone. That said, it isn't very likely and it doesnt stop me depositing (some of) my money here.

[Peterw42]

The 800k CD only needs to be in a Thai bank for 3 months of every year, for 9 months you can put it somewhere else. <removed>

Edited September 16, 2016 by ubonjoe
comment suggesting fraudulent activity removed

[4MyEgo]

I don't think you have a choice ?

 

I deposited that amount when I came her in November 2015 before going to immigration for my retirement visa in February after the 90 day tourist visa was expiring.

 

I draw down the account as living expenses and will top it up when I reach half way, which is about now, its pointless IMO having it in a CD, or term deposit account (same thing), because as you say, rates are low, especially for this amount of money.

 

Personally I wouldn't worry to much if the banks went belly up, as some others have posted, they have guarantees in place, but this is Thailand don't forget, so have the attitude, only put in or invest as much as your prepared to lose and you should be fine. 

[ubonjoe]

A off topic post and the expected replies to it has been removed.

[williamgeorgeallen]

35 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

I don't think you have a choice ?

 

I deposited that amount when I came her in November 2015 before going to immigration for my retirement visa in February after the 90 day tourist visa was expiring.

 

I draw down the account as living expenses and will top it up when I reach half way, which is about now, its pointless IMO having it in a CD, or term deposit account (same thing), because as you say, rates are low, especially for this amount of money.

 

Personally I wouldn't worry to much if the banks went belly up, as some others have posted, they have guarantees in place, but this is Thailand don't forget, so have the attitude, only put in or invest as much as your prepared to lose and you should be fine. 

you do have a choice. when i am over 50 i will go onto a retirement visa and use an agent who can get a letter to say i have the funds without having them in thailand. they normally charge 10 000thb for the document. after 10 years i will never keep any money or assets in thailand again. there is no need. just use a foreign ATM card to with draw 30 000thb at a time for living expenses. follow this method and you are less likely to have any problems in thailand. rent rent rent. been said so many times, needs to be repeated non stop for those new to this country..

Edited September 16, 2016 by williamgeorgeallen

[Strange]

8 minutes ago, williamgeorgeallen said:

you do have a choice. when i am over 50 i will go onto a retirement visa and use an agent who can get a letter to say i have the funds without having them in thailand. they normally charge 10 000thb for the document. after 10 years i will never keep any money or assets in thailand again. there is no need. just use a foreign ATM card to with draw 30 000thb at a time for living expenses. follow this method and you are less likely to have any problems in thailand. rent rent rent. been said so many times, bet seems to be needed to be said again.

 

Using an ATM is probably one of the biggest rip offs. I agree with some of what you are saying. I don't keep much money in thailand either. A guarantee is worth just about zero here. I don't know about other banks/nationalities, but in the US we are FDIC Insured and ALWAYS get your cash back in the case of fraud. Wont happen in Thailand. Happens to the locals all the time. 

 

I can move up to 50K USD by bank transfer for 35 USD and the exchange rate is pretty close to the daily market rate. No 200 Baht fees on the Thai Side, No Foreign ATM fees on the US Side, And a good exchange rate. For example I just moved $1500 and the market rate was 35 to a dollar. The Atms were charging their fees on both sides, and a 32 baht exchange rate. Do this once a month and your throwing ALOT of cash away. 

 

Personally I think its more important to protect your cash from theft & fraud (Forget about the "Guarantee") than to find a decent investment vehicle. I would move the 800k in one bank transfer into a thai bank and draw the document for the required seasoned cash, get your extension, and then use the money for living until the next extension. 

[RogerP]

Does the 800K have to be in a Thai bank ?

I was under the impression that evidence of the same in your home country bank; which means statement plus a letter from the bank, satisfied this.

I provided that info for retirement visa in Australia; so is it a requirement to have the money in a Thai bank after that ?

[chiang mai]

It needs to be in a bank in Thailand, not necessarily a Thai bank, my banks are UOB and CIMB, Singaporean and Malay, both covered by the DPA.

[4MyEgo]

28 minutes ago, williamgeorgeallen said:

you do have a choice. when i am over 50 i will go onto a retirement visa and use an agent who can get a letter to say i have the funds without having them in thailand. they normally charge 10 000thb for the document. after 10 years i will never keep any money or assets in thailand again. there is no need. just use a foreign ATM card to with draw 30 000thb at a time for living expenses. follow this method and you are less likely to have any problems in thailand. rent rent rent. been said so many times, needs to be repeated non stop for those new to this country..

 

10,000 baht sounds like a lot, I mean you could it yourself, but depends o your circumstances.

 

I keep all of my capital out of Thailand except for the 800,000 a year and just draw down on that.

 

10,000 baht is short change for us, yes I know, but f you can do it yourself, its 10,000 baht more in your pocket, as much as its a hassle to compile all of the paperwork for the retirement visa, its only once, the rest is just 90 visits to get a fresh 90 days, you can do it by post I am told, or on line.

 

Each to their own.

[Peterw42]

8 minutes ago, RogerP said:

Does the 800K have to be in a Thai bank ?

I was under the impression that evidence of the same in your home country bank; which means statement plus a letter from the bank, satisfied this.

I provided that info for retirement visa in Australia; so is it a requirement to have the money in a Thai bank after that ?

 

Australian bank for your initial Visa, Thai bank for your extension.

[williamgeorgeallen]

13 minutes ago, Strange said:

 

Using an ATM is probably one of the biggest rip offs. I agree with some of what you are saying. I don't keep much money in thailand either. A guarantee is worth just about zero here. I don't know about other banks/nationalities, but in the US we are FDIC Insured and ALWAYS get your cash back in the case of fraud. Wont happen in Thailand. Happens to the locals all the time. 

 

I can move up to 50K USD by bank transfer for 35 USD and the exchange rate is pretty close to the daily market rate. No 200 Baht fees on the Thai Side, No Foreign ATM fees on the US Side, And a good exchange rate. For example I just moved $1500 and the market rate was 35 to a dollar. The Atms were charging their fees on both sides, and a 32 baht exchange rate. Do this once a month and your throwing ALOT of cash away. 

 

Personally I think its more important to protect your cash from theft & fraud (Forget about the "Guarantee") than to find a decent investment vehicle. I would move the 800k in one bank transfer into a thai bank and draw the document for the required seasoned cash, get your extension, and then use the money for living until the next extension. 

i get my nz rental income paid into my account in nz. dont keep alot in that account but more than i need to live. 200thb is not a lot to get 30 000thb out from the thai ATM.  as far as i can tell this system is fullproof. no need to keep any more than a couple months living expenses in thailand. just make sure you have a couple back up methods to access money if required. KISS keep it simple stupid, being a general in the special forces taught me that.

[williamgeorgeallen]

11 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

 

10,000 baht sounds like a lot, I mean you could it yourself, but depends o your circumstances.

 

I keep all of my capital out of Thailand except for the 800,000 a year and just draw down on that.

 

10,000 baht is short change for us, yes I know, but f you can do it yourself, its 10,000 baht more in your pocket, as much as its a hassle to compile all of the paperwork for the retirement visa, its only once, the rest is just 90 visits to get a fresh 90 days, you can do it by post I am told, or on line.

 

Each to their own.

the 10 000thb was a fee from a bank manager for a letter to say you have had 800k in his bank for more than 3 months. need to pay for the visa ontop of that.

[natway09]

For savings in Thailand stick to the big 5 banks.They went through the 1997 debacle with only a scratch.

I had money with 3 of them

Your money up to 1mil per account is possibly as safe as any bank in the world.

 

[Strange]

13 minutes ago, williamgeorgeallen said:

i get my nz rental income paid into my account in nz. dont keep alot in that account but more than i need to live. 200thb is not a lot to get 30 000thb out from the thai ATM.  as far as i can tell this system is fullproof. no need to keep any more than a couple months living expenses in thailand. just make sure you have a couple back up methods to access money if required. KISS keep it simple stupid, being a general in the special forces taught me that.

 

But its not just "200 baht to get 30,000 baht" 

 

Your bank is going to charge a fee for using a foreign banks ATM system, You are charged a fee for the Thai Banks ATM System, and you will be getting a substandard exchange rate, and you are doing it monthly. There may also be a flat fee for just strictly "International Service" from your NZ Bank. 

 

By fool proof, yes you can easily go to the ATM and "Get Money" but the banks on both sides are going to be LOVING you for it. 

 

Im happy you like your system but I just want to clarify for anyone else reading this and doing the same thing. 

 

I don't know what your fees are but again, it may be cheaper, even on a monthly transfer, to wire the cash for a flat rate to your Thai Bank once a month and then ONLY use your thai ATM for free. 

[chiang mai]

13 minutes ago, natway09 said:

For savings in Thailand stick to the big 5 banks.They went through the 1997 debacle with only a scratch.

I had money with 3 of them

Your money up to 1mil per account is possibly as safe as any bank in the world.

 

 

Safe up to 15 million baht - http://www.dpa.or.th/main.php?filename=index___EN

 

And actually UOB is the safest, consistently rated as on of the top twenty safest banks globallly.

[Strange]

12 minutes ago, natway09 said:

For savings in Thailand stick to the big 5 banks.They went through the 1997 debacle with only a scratch.

I had money with 3 of them

Your money up to 1mil per account is possibly as safe as any bank in the world.

 

Again I just want to clarify here that your last sentence is false. 

 

If you are the victim of fraud (This is Thailand we are talking about) the banks will most likely NOT return your money. They may give you some guarantee that in the case of a crash your money will not evaporate into thin air, but in the event of someone stealing your cash, from your account, witch is FAR more likely than a banking crash, you are out of luck. It happens here all the time. 

[williamgeorgeallen]

9 minutes ago, Strange said:

 

But its not just "200 baht to get 30,000 baht" 

 

Your bank is going to charge a fee for using a foreign banks ATM system, You are charged a fee for the Thai Banks ATM System, and you will be getting a substandard exchange rate, and you are doing it monthly. There may also be a flat fee for just strictly "International Service" from your NZ Bank. 

 

By fool proof, yes you can easily go to the ATM and "Get Money" but the banks on both sides are going to be LOVING you for it. 

 

Im happy you like your system but I just want to clarify for anyone else reading this and doing the same thing. 

 

I don't know what your fees are but again, it may be cheaper, even on a monthly transfer, to wire the cash for a flat rate to your Thai Bank once a month and then ONLY use your thai ATM for free. 

i have done both methods and it does cost a bit extra to use the ATM card over doing a transfer but i am happy to pay for the convenience. so simple to go to an ATM machine and get cash as required. no waiting for funds, logging onto internet banking, dealing with other hassles.

[Strange]

5 minutes ago, williamgeorgeallen said:

i have done both methods and it does cost a bit extra to use the ATM card over doing a transfer but i am happy to pay for the convenience. so simple to go to an ATM machine and get cash as required. no waiting for funds, logging onto internet banking, dealing with other hassles.

 

The convenience will always be there you are not giving it up. If you get behind you can always go to the ATM with your foreign card. 

 

Banks are bastards I just don't want to see them get anymore than they deserve.

[Suradit69]

3 hours ago, KittenKong said:

 

This is true. However any such guarantee is only as good as the guarantor and national bank deposit guarantees in particular are designed to reassure not to actually pay out. If there was a real catastrophe here then I would not be all surprised if they retroactively excluded farangs from the guarantee, or even altered the terms for everyone. That said, it isn't very likely and it doesnt stop me depositing (some of) my money here.

 

"I would not be all surprised if they retroactively excluded farangs from the guarantee"

Based on what?

There are real things worth worrying about. No need to start imagining things that have no basis other than your jaundiced view of Thailand.

 

 

 

[KhunBENQ]

2 hours ago, RogerP said:

Does the 800K have to be in a Thai bank ?

I was under the impression that evidence of the same in your home country bank; which means statement plus a letter from the bank, satisfied this.

I provided that info for retirement visa in Australia; so is it a requirement to have the money in a Thai bank after that ?

Absolutely in a Thai bank account.

Clear wording in the immigration rules.

 

Edited September 16, 2016 by KhunBENQ

[KhunBENQ]

2 hours ago, chiang mai said:

It needs to be in a bank in Thailand, not necessarily a Thai bank, my banks are UOB and CIMB, Singaporean and Malay, both covered by the DPA.

Their parent companies are Singaporean and Malayian.

But of course they fully operate under Thai banking license.

So they are Thai banks legally.

 

[KhunBENQ]

1 hour ago, williamgeorgeallen said:

the 10 000thb was a fee from a bank manager for a letter to say you have had 800k in his bank for more than 3 months. need to pay for the visa ontop of that.

Also called forgery of documents for a  bribe.

Get caught and be kicked out.

 

I simply don't understand which immigration office accepts such a forged letter without an accompanying bank book.

Edited September 16, 2016 by KhunBENQ

[4MyEgo]

2 hours ago, williamgeorgeallen said:

the 10 000thb was a fee from a bank manager for a letter to say you have had 800k in his bank for more than 3 months. need to pay for the visa ontop of that.

 

What !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

I paid 200 baht for the letter at SCB Bank, and wasn't happy about that...lol

[4MyEgo]

1 hour ago, Strange said:

 

Again I just want to clarify here that your last sentence is false. 

 

If you are the victim of fraud (This is Thailand we are talking about) the banks will most likely NOT return your money. They may give you some guarantee that in the case of a crash your money will not evaporate into thin air, but in the event of someone stealing your cash, from your account, witch is FAR more likely than a banking crash, you are out of luck. It happens here all the time. 

 

Correction, see the link below where Kasikorn Bank refunded a customer almost a million baht, under protest of course, just for the records.

 

http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/kasikornbank-agrees-to-refund-a-customer-who-was-robbed-from-his-bank-account/

[chiang mai]

28 minutes ago, KhunBENQ said:

Their parent companies are Singaporean and Malayian.

But of course they fully operate under Thai banking license.

So they are Thai banks legally.

 

 

I don't agree that they are Thai banks, despite the obvious Thai banking licenses, they are Singaporean and Malaysian banks with branches in Thailand.

 

It's a bit like saying Citi Bank is a Thai bank, just because it has a Thai banking license, it isn't Thai at all.

[KhunBENQ]

Quote

CIMB Thai Bank

CIMB Thai Bank Public Company Limited, previously known as Bank Thai Public Company Limited, was established in 1998 with the Financial Institutions Development Fund (FIDF) as the major shareholder. On 5 November 2008, CIMB Bank Berhad became the largest shareholder in Bank Thai and on 4 May 2009, the Bank completed the registration of its new name: "ธนาคาร ซีไอเอ็มบี ไทย จำกัด (มหาชน)" in Thai and "CIMB Thai Bank Public Company Limited" in English. This name change reflects the official transition of Bank Thai from being a single company to a member of CIMB Group.

http://www.cimbthai.com/CIMB/en/about_us/

[Strange]

11 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

Correction, see the link below where Kasikorn Bank refunded a customer almost a million baht, under protest of course, just for the records.

 

http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/kasikornbank-agrees-to-refund-a-customer-who-was-robbed-from-his-bank-account/

 

My statement still stands. If you are comfortable with what you read in the link then by all means trust the local banking system. You have dis-proved nothing unfortunately. 

Edited September 16, 2016 by Strange