Come back Farangs! Tourism in Chiang Mai decimated by Chinese exodus

[LomSak27]

Good deflection but ... 

 

Western tourism was trending down for a couple reason, one of which was a long term policy by the powers that be from both colors and non color governments to find another tourist base as in NOT western tourists. they had there reasons   BUT I doubt any of them will say what they were NOW.

 

More specific. Three years of massive overbuilding. The Chinese market was looked upon as the next cash cow, A Gold Rush, so lots of money poured into CM and now the tide goes out and you have massive oversupply for what western tourists still come despite all the reasons the powers that be have given NOT TO COME. Those tourists should get a medal.

 

 

 

 

[neeray]

4 hours ago, vinegarbase said:

I will never recommend Thailand again to anyone and vehemently encourage them to stay away after the way I and others I know have been treated by Thai immigration. 

 

Why on earth would I tell anyone I know to come to a place that has dictatorial 24 hour address registrations, useless burdensome 90 day check ins, racist dual pricing policies, insane customs bureau that will scam you on duty and taxes any chance they get, and an immigration system that will deny, change, and says and does whatever it wants regardless if you are just trying to do the right thing and follow the law. 

 

I hope their economy gets slammed hard for the crap good honest foreigners have had to put up with these last few years. 

Your post is true to your screen name vinegarbase.

[Lancelot01]

13 hours ago, ezzra said:

Yes dear Farangs, please come back, we want you now we need you now, never minds that when the Chinese were here we didn't even gave a second look, but now, please come back dears...

We don't really want you, just leave your wallets and go.

[spidermike007]

This most hapless of administrations has enjoyed very little success. One of the few successes they have had has been to decimate the number of Western tourists visiting Thailand. It happened for so many reasons. Five years ago I knew several wealthy families from Europe that would come and spend $1000 a night on hotels and drop $50,000 on a ten day trip here. Few of those high end western tourists come to Thailand anymore. 

 

No amount of wishing is going to bring them back. Thank Prayuth for this blunder. They gambled on the zero baht Chinese. It was a disastrous decision. A historic mistake that the Thai people are paying for, and will continue to pay for, for decades to come. 

[Bournville]

Thailand. You really messed up big time. Hospitality is not your strong point.

Chiang Mai Immigration is a confusing disgrace and a very unwelcoming vibe.

The air and water pollution is awful.. Smokey season or not.

Restaurants need to learn how to care for customers.. Greeting.. Menu.. WAIT.. take order.. Serve food.. Check if customer needs anything.. Let them enjoy. Then take the money. Easy peasy.

Less motorbike scams.. Less greedy bastards period. Then we will enjoy Thailand more.

[totally thaied up]

9 hours ago, simoh1490 said:

My wife and I were discussing this issue at lunch today, shortly afterwards the lovely Lemon, my wife's Chinese language teacher of two years ago called so wifey put the question to her - by way of background: Lemon is Chinese aged 25 years, she came to Chiang Mai to teach Mandarin for six months before returning home to study for her MBA. she and wifey became close friends and they speak almost weekly.

 

Lemon says there are a number of reasons why the Chinese aren't visiting currently: some are unhappy with Mr Loadsa Watches remarks following the sinking of the boat in Phuket, blaming the Chinese owner went down like a lead balloon and there is resentment which spread quickly. Without prompting she added that currency weakness is an issue, mass-market tours operate on slim margins which have now been eroded to almost nothing hence that sector is hurting. The final point she made was that whilst Thailand is still a prefered destination for many the cleaner air and scenic beauty of the South is prefered by many to the pollution in the North. Those things said she tells that several of her friends from school will visit the North at Xmas/New Year but they have money so exchange rates not so much of an issue.

My wife is half-blood Chinese. Her Mum is full-blood and they have a pretty solid Chinese connection still but came from poor farming stock but became landowners here. What is written above is pretty true. There was a CNN report that was very damaging over the Boat incident and it really went down like a lead balloon and as mentioned, that resentment has not faded. In fact, from what I can tell, it is still very fresh.

 

The Yuan is weaker as well and my wife says the Chinese get very bored very quickly. Just a few days here, they want to go South as after doing just the "Valley" and the "Temples" and few other things, Chiang Mai has become as boring as hell. Yet for the Chinese, what simoh1490 said is pretty right. One of my wifes good friends went back to Shanghai last week and she said she won't be back until after April due to smoke.

 

Other Australian friends of mine come yearly but only come from October to February due to the same reasons. My parents come during the wet season to get away from Winter in Australia and the air quality to them is also important to them during these times. I really do not know how much damage is getting done via air control for Chiang Mai, but I think it is starting to hurt. This year I will not be in Chiang Mai for Choking Season.

 

My wife says for free Visas to be issued, they are trying to get back into damage control but it may be a bit late. A good friend of mine is in Bali and said it is loaded with Chinese this year more so than others. It will be interesting to see what is going to happen.

Edited November 21, 2018 by totally thaied up

[Winky Wilson]

Lately, tourists are universally treated like second class citizens. Unmotivating to spend money at a holiday destination when you feel unwelcome. 

[cyberfarang]

I`ve got news for you. It`s not only the Chinese that get very bored very quickly, just spend a few days in Chiang Mai, then decide to go South as after doing just the "Valley" and the "Temples" and few other things.

 

Many of my British and American friends, some married to Thais but living abroad, used to holiday in Thailand every year and during their holiday would visit Chiang Mai. Now none of them when they holiday in Thailand bother travelling up to Chiang Mai any more. All said the same thing, nothing new here, virtually no nightlife and boring, so they stopped coming.

 

Regarding my British friends, another factor that`s putting them off Thailand, is the fact that Sterling has crashed through the floor and with the continuing strong Thai baht, visiting Thailand works out to be a very expensive holiday indeed. They can obtain much better deals elsewhere, especially considering Chiang Mai has so little to offer, it`s just not good value for money and not worth the trip.

[user343434]

The only thing I liked last year was the road from Chiang Mai to Pai on a Motorbike, still one of the best in Thailand.

Chiang Mai itself was simply boring,

no real Thailand anymore hence no attraction for Tourists experience the Thai way of living

but also not a Tourist place with all its necessary attractions.

At 22:00 I had already the feeling I am in a Ghost Town somewhere in the middle of nowhere. 

 

 

[Fairynuff]

What was it Joni Mitchell said...”don’t it always seem to be that you don’t know what you’ve got till it’s gone” come back farangs we were only kidding 

[quandow]

16 hours ago, webfact said:

She was now forced to offer rooms by the month at discounts. These traditionally might attract more Westerners on longer stays. 

How unusual. From what I've seen in the past, hotels usually RAISE their prices to try and make up for lack of business - and we know how well THAT works!

[quandow]

2 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

This most hapless of administrations has enjoyed very little success. One of the few successes they have had has been to decimate the number of Western tourists visiting Thailand.

I'm currently in the states, helping a dying relative pass over to the other side. Because of this new round of clueless, hapless administration decisions, I'm returning to Thailand in January, closing out the apartment I still have, and will start looking to relocate elsewhere once this caregiving bout is over. There is a radical change permeating throughout LOS. It's been a slow creep coming in, but it feels like a tsunami is about to break. It's just not fun any more!

Edited November 21, 2018 by quandow

[joecoolfrog]

12 hours ago, gamini said:

I think all the moaning about Chinese tourists is done by the bar owners massage parlours and bar girls. The Chinese avoid these sort of places. I think the real problem is the decline of sexpats and sex tourists.

You honestly believe Chiang Mai was ever a major destination for sex tourists ?

[neeray]

2 hours ago, totally thaied up said:

 

 

My wife says for free Visas to be issued, they are trying to get back into damage control but it may be a bit late. A good friend of mine is in Bali and said it is loaded with Chinese this year more so than others. It will be interesting to see what is going to happen.

I have been to Chiang Mai many times (for a reason) but must admit that I have often wondered what a tourist finds to do after about 3 or 4 days.

I have been to Bali once and unless I missed something, I find even less of interest for a tourist to do there.

I would also personally rate CM well above Bali as it relates to safety.

[Scott]

Off-topic post removed.  

 

[simoh1490]

34 minutes ago, joecoolfrog said:

You honestly believe Chiang Mai was ever a major destination for sex tourists ?

I do, ten or fifteen years ago there was far more of it around, there was never lots of neon and flashing lights advertising the fact but it existed nevertheless, most of it however was an extension of the Thai market rather than anything purposely targeted at farangs.

[joecoolfrog]

18 minutes ago, simoh1490 said:

I do, ten or fifteen years ago there was far more of it around, there was never lots of neon and flashing lights advertising the fact but it existed nevertheless, most of it however was an extension of the Thai market rather than anything purposely targeted at farangs.

Im sure you are correct but im fairly certain that the post I was responding to was a swipe at western tourists.

[hotchilli]

19 hours ago, Wiggy said:

You reap what you sow, Thailand.

Exactly, they came. they saw, they posted on social media... "don't bother"

Fed up of cr@p street food, tours that get you ripped off at every stop, copy souvenirs etc etc etc

plus the chance of being killed on the road, or out at sea...

plenty of other destinations to go see...

Pattaya is showing much the same thing, same old same old, time for a change away from the flogged to death recipe of cheap sex cr@p street food!!!

[cnx355]

21 hours ago, ThreeEyedRaven said:

It seems abundantly clear that wherever the Chinese go en masse, is subsequently avoided by everyone else. Sihanoukville is a classic example. Five years ago it was packed with tourists from everywhere, the Chinese invaded and everybody else has left. And once the good tourists have gone, they don't come back. Thailand put its eggs in the Chinese basket, and are now paying the price.

Also, many Western tourist come to experience a relaxing night life in restaurant and Pubs. They do not want to go home at Midnight when the city become dead except a few bars that local expats  know are open late around 3 am.  What about going to a restaurant or 7-11 and not being able to have a beer or wine between 2 and 5 PM.   In Bangkok, Pattaya, Phuket and Samui it is not applied as strictly as Chiangmai.

[SupermarineS6B]

13 hours ago, fanjita said:

Thanks, Mavideol.  I can confirm that your average UK economy class tourist just hasn't got the funds for a two week holiday in LOS.  If they have then it's going to be an expensive holiday at that.

 

Brexit has killed the exchange rate for all currencies for well over two years now.  

Brexit made me bird run off as well..........

[simoh1490]

Was out in Muang last night watching the Loy Kratong start up, plenty of people around and the wait time at the River Market was at least thirty minutes, their web site says there's no tables to be had between 7pm and 9:30pm for the next two days when dinner costs THB 3,500 pp. Nobody is spending money you say! 

 

Stopped by Rimping near the Iron Bridge, it was chocka with Chinese, all anecdotal data of course but it doesn't point at business being stone dead.

[Cereal]

The Thai are like most Asian countries I've been to. They love tourist dollars but would be perfectly content if the tourists stayed home and put the cheque in the mail.

[0815]

Wherever money comes from, it's welcome.
"We built a lot new hotels and stuff for our great new Chinese friends. Please farangs come and bring the money to pay our bills now, our friends leave us alone in the (pigeon)s**t !"
After you keep away again please... ???? 

 

[Jiggo]

21 hours ago, smedly said:

maybe those complaining have themselves to blame, perhaps they have done what many Thai pub and grub owners do - get greedy and put up prices when the going is good and get into a vicious circle as custom dwindles - the effect - they price themselves out of the market and wonder why customers not come back, I see it all around Pattaya - there are several good well priced pubs in Pattaya and they are all booming - others not so much.

 

A fine example of this type of mentality is on a little street in Ban Chang just outside Pattaya, years ago it was a great little place to escape for a few hours or even a couple of days, it is now barren because they are charging ridiculous prices for drinks - they effectively destroyed what was once a little goldmine, 90-100baht for a 25ml measure of sangsom costing 9baht is quite frankly shocking, 750ml at 280 baht a bottle, are they blaming lack of farang tourists - probably but that is just so wrong, they have only themselves to blame, to an extent Walking Street and soi 6 in pattaya have gone the same way.

 

I can sit in in a busy bar in Soi 6 in Pattaya drinking a 60baht bottle of beer and look 15 feet across the road to an empty bar who are charging 90 baht for the same beer and they likely blame lack of tourists for having no customers and these bars are very likely Thai owned

 

 

Totally Agree took a trip down there a few weeks ago, Offshore Bar and Camel closed, not much else....good bye Ban Chang

[roo860]

Quality ? bai nai khun china , bai ban khun thai !  mai chop farang wai [emoji120]wai[emoji120] chop muk farang prunee bai chiang mai [emoji120] cup pom

Early start on the sauce Mick?

Sent from my SM-G920F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[lannarebirth]

17 hours ago, fanjita said:

All very valid points but don't forget the ever continuing strong Thai Baht in all of this.  It's a relevant part of the jigsaw that is tourism.

Not really. There's a lot of data to suggest that tourism numbers are much more tied to the strength of the economy of nations that tourists come from than it is tied to exchange rates.

[soalbundy]

18 hours ago, sanemax said:

Isnt Karma all about the next life and nothing to do with this life ?

No

[LomSak27]

5 hours ago, simoh1490 said:

5 hours ago, joecoolfrog said:

You honestly believe Chiang Mai was ever a major destination for sex tourists ?

I do, ten or fifteen years ago there was far more of it around, there was never lots of neon and flashing lights advertising the fact but it existed nevertheless, most of it however was an extension of the Thai market rather than anything purposely targeted at farangs.

Time flies and with that .... knowledge. likely you guys never would have known anyway but.

 

Chiang Mai was a premier destination for Tiow Puying among Thai for decades. Instead of Isaan girls, girls from Chiang Rai, were known country wide as, 'girls who work the trade'; poor country girls, and lighter skin than Isaan girls. If you know where to look in CR, There are a couple villages with big houses from the girls who went to work in Japan decades back. In Chiang Mai they closed down the open air places out on Kampangdin in 95 because of that health issue ... what was it now? Now before you say thats locals .... In the 80's, in Bangkok working the Chrome poles were a bevy of CR girls, or in Thermaes, they came via CM were they learned the trade.

 

There is always something sad about mongers who don't know there own history. 

Edited November 22, 2018 by LomSak27

[spidermike007]

6 hours ago, quandow said:

I'm currently in the states, helping a dying relative pass over to the other side. Because of this new round of clueless, hapless administration decisions, I'm returning to Thailand in January, closing out the apartment I still have, and will start looking to relocate elsewhere once this caregiving bout is over. There is a radical change permeating throughout LOS. It's been a slow creep coming in, but it feels like a tsunami is about to break. It's just not fun any more!

 

Well, I have to agree with you about the changes. This administration started with such a searing, blind nationalist bent. After awhile, I assume some people far more powerful than Prayuth pulled him aside, and lectured him about the destruction he was wreaking on his nation, his tiny mindedness, his total lack of vision, and his incredibly ignorant rhetoric. He did seem to calm down after that. But, the immigration policies, constant police crackdowns targeting foreigners, alot of inflation, banking challenges, lack of public and traffic safety, the continuing power of the Thai baht, and other such nonsense, has made it a bit daunting.

 

As far as I am concerned, every ex-pat in Thailand should be given awards, for being who we are. And treated with far more respect by the authorities, and this most hapless of administration. But, that would require some wisdom and vision. A bit too much to ask from the current leadership. Most of us are very honest, law abiding, legal immigrants, who bring alot to the table, spend alot of money here, treat the local people with a great deal of respect, are some of the best drivers on the road, and contribute to the nation, in many ways culturally. I did say most! 

 

However, I tend to disagree with you about your overall assessment. I still find Thailand to be a wonderful place to live. I enjoy every day here. Have some great friends here, have a wonderful relationship with an amazing Thai woman, and I adore her family, who are really good, hard working, honest, kindhearted, fun loving, generous souls. I also like most Thai people I encounter. Of course, I do have the good fortune of not having to live on Samui (was there for many years, when it was a far better version of itself, than it is today) Phuket, or Pattaya, where the local people tend to not be as much fun to be around, as they are jaded, and have to put up with alot of fools (probably the small minority of the local ex-pats, who make it harder for all of us), and live in an area where people are delightful. 

 

I would encourage you to share your alternative choices. It is a topic that is on many minds these days, and one I have given some thought to. Other than Spain, part time, I have not come up with any viable alternatives. I would not move back to the US for anything less than a million dollars a year. Life back there feels quite forlorn to be these days. I do not like most Vietnamese people, do not find the Malaysian people to be fun loving enough, nor as light hearted as the Thais, though it is a great country, have no interest in Cambodia (been there many times, and do not like the current Chinese takeover of the nation), Burma has always been out of the question, lived in India before, and have no desire to repeat that, though I love the people. Bali used to be amazing, but has turned into an overcrowded cesspool, unless you are somehow able to avoid the southern third of the island. So, where does that leave a guy who does not have an unlimited budget? As a caveat, I would only consider living in a society that does not practice mandatory emasculation of it's men. 

[neeray]

52 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

No

Your answer contained TMI. (Too Much Information)