Aussies. I haters please. Genuine discussion.

[Pedrogaz]

Thailand is not cheap. Certain things that had a high labour component were cheap and still are...items such as housing, renting or buying, land, and agricultural produce (stuff from the fields, not processed things), maids and handy men, and hotel rooms are cheap. What eats me up is the poor quality of the stuff sold in Thailand....it seems to be returns or seconds or fakes at sky high prices. What is lacking in retail is any competition.,..in my town we have rows of shops all selling the same rubbish for the same price....all the car battery stores are next to each other, all the new tire stores are next to each other etc There is no real discounting and in certainly US and UK it is discounters who stretch the consumers budget....stores like Lidl and Aldi (incidentally, they just opened a Lidl near my home in the US) nearly destroyed Tesco, Sainbury's and Waitrose. Lidl/Aldi seem to have good quality stuff at half the price of Tesco. There is nothing like that here...and don't talk about all the faux sales they have in the malls.

 

Medical care has gone through the roof: whereas 10 years ago going to a private hospital like Bumrungrad were affordable, now their prices have been jacked up to the absolute maximum of what medical tourists can bear.I had a root canal here last year in Thailand that cost over 30,000 Baht. I was quoted 6000, but then told I needed extras. I can get a root canal for close to that in the US.

Stuff produced by companies is the same or higher than the global price....new medicines, processed foods, tech gadget and electronics....iPhones are cheapest in the US....I bought mine there....a good 20% cheaper than Thailand.

When the baht was weak, it mattered much less, but with the aussie dollar being weak and the British pound also weak, a lot of people I know are having difficulty renewing their visas legally....and 400,000 for a marriage extension renewal is not a lot of money to have put by, or to have as total income. I know I spend at least 5 or 6 times that per year, so I have no idea how anyone lives on that. It's about 24,000 AUD...how far does that go? And what happens if you get sick, have an accident or a car wreck?

I think a lot of people, myself including are thinking it is time to leave Thailand, feeling, as I do, like an unwelcome guest and poor value for money.

[JimHuaHin]

Some interesting comments here.

 

I suppose the first questions are what is your lifestyle and cost of living in Australia and Thailand, as well as where do you live in these countries?

 

Before coming to Thailand, I lived in Cairns, Queensland - 230 sq metre house on 1361 sq metre block of land backing onto a golf course, 5 minutes drive to the beach.  The propery sold in early 2013 for Baht 12 million in today's Baht (Baht 18 million at the time).  Renting a similar property close by now would set me back about Baht 40,000 a month (according to recent research via Google).  Now I live near the beach in Hua Hin.

 

In the 2 years prior to coming to Thailand, I kept a record of all my expenses in Australia, down to each coffee, each lottery ticket, etc.  In my first year in Thailand, my cost of living was about 65% of what it was in Australia (I owned my house in Australia, but rented in Thailand, so I made some adjustments to the figures to take these differences into account).

 

Recently, when the Aus dollar dipped below Baht 24 to the dollar, I looked again at the cost of living in Australia.  And as several posts here have noted, the cost of living has gone up substantially over the past 6 years, as have some costs in Thailand.

 

Buying a new Honda or Toyota car is now about 70% more expensive in Thailand than in Australia; but on most other factors, Thailand is still much cheaper than Australia.  Dental work is certainly much cheaper in Thailand, as are most medications.  I go to a Thai government hospital when necessary, or to a private clinic, never a private hospital.  Overall, medical costs are less here than in Australia.

 

For now I am staying in Thailand.  But, if, and I hope not 'when', the Australian dollar falls to Baht 15, I shall relook at the issue of moving back to Australia.

 

Good luck.

 

[Orton Rd]

10 minutes ago, Pedrogaz said:

 

 

Medical care has gone through the roof: whereas 10 years ago going to a private hospital like Bumrungrad were affordable, now their prices have been jacked up to the absolute maximum of what medical tourists can bear.I had a root canal here last year in Thailand that cost over 30,000 Baht. I was quoted 6000, but then told I needed extras. I can get a root canal for close to that in the US.

 

Good post but root canal should only be about 4k, there is even a dentist at victory monument that will do it for that. My local dentist charges 4k in Bangkok.

[Jaxxper]

On ‎6‎/‎16‎/‎2019 at 2:47 PM, fishtank said:

Things are not cheaper here.

You try being a Brit. 

You need to take a balanced view. Agreed PG Tips tea bags are twice the price here. Housing is a fraction of UK prices, as are utilities and most general services. Like I said , a balanced view.

[monkeycu]

11 hours ago, skippybangkok said:

 

5.8% gross return - not bad




Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

But look at the low lifes who move in and wreck it for you 

[Old Croc]

The downward trend in exchange rates is worrying for all expats relying on income from home country.

However, any in depth examination of living costs proves Thailand is still substantially cheaper than Australia, as long as you are not living on a Thai wage. There is so much more to the cost of living than just being able to buy a bottle of wine or block of cheese cheaper in Australia. You will always find some individual items at lessor cost somewhere else. The only true comparison has to be all encompassing, and on that basis Thailand is substantially cheaper than Australia for people with an Australian income (pensioners).

A lot of the current malcontent targeting Thailand's costs, emanates from people affected by the tightening up of Immigration procedures regarding proof of funds for visas/permits.  These fees are a basic charge for the right to live in this country, and most have allowed for it. For those who found ways to avoid these costs in the past, it's unfortunate the system has caught up with you and you now find Thailand to be expensive.  

However, those fees are extraneous and not part of the daily COL.

[OzMan]

I live in BKK and it is not cheap, currently I am spending about 800k baht a year. Partly my rent is high (30k/month) although I would not rent a condo this good in Australia. Cheaper rent places are further out and not so convenient. I go out more here because it is fun but also because I need to meet people. Because of the cost of living in BKK I may move to Ho Chi Minh next year. I can only live in large, capitol cities. You can live cheaply in Issan but not everyone could survive the social deprivation and boredom of living there.

[Nemises]

Parking fees kills you . Just come back and I think most money I had spent was on parking meters.  

Sydney eastern suburbs all you see is parking meters and if you 2 mins late, ticket waiting right there for you, $112

insane. 

 

 

 

Yep. Spot on. I can verify the $112 parking ticket madness in this boring, expensive, once good but now sh**hole. My ticket (below) was for parking in an EMPTY beach car park (winter here) for 5 minutes when left car to check if any waves.

Australia is now an expensive joke.

Latest news here is that some Sydney apartment buildings have been shoddily built in recent years and are now falling apart. Unfortunate owners who paid around $AU800,000.00 for their apartments are tossed out into the streets. No one will ever buy into their structurally damaged buildings and there’s no recourse as developers and builders and all levels of Government refuse to take blame. Insurance companies say they won’t pay up either. Sad really.

 

 

 

 

 

[rob48]

Sometimes it is good to compare what you save, as opposed to the costs of items.   I come from Melbourne, heating with gas is very costly there, here, NIL cost, water is costly there, here very cheap, car / motor bike registration, far cheaper here, electricity, far cheaper here, food way cheaper here, rents far cheaper here, dental cheaper here, trademen services way cheaper, I could go on and on

[monkeycu]

23 hours ago, toofarnorth said:

Imported wine and beer should of gone down in price I think but being manipulated somewhere along the way.

Even up here a beer out is about 3 quid ! If Chang is Elephant Pee , Leo is Leopard Pee , what is My beer ?

????

[Rimmer]

Baiting post removed

[Lacessit]

3 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Had my first problem a month or two back after 6 years, this years drought caused the earth to shrink and rip my water pipe out under the patio. Called a guy who turned up with a pal and a chisel, dug down through the patio, fixed the pipe and filled in the hole.

1,000bht, I'm thinking cheaper than the same repair in Oz.

Probably in the vicinity of 3000 - 4000 baht. Plumbers in Oz charge for the callout before they even start to work.

[Nemises]

Sometimes it is good to compare what you save, as opposed to the costs of items.   I come from Melbourne, heating with gas is very costly there, here, NIL cost, water is costly there, here very cheap, car / motor bike registration, far cheaper here, electricity, far cheaper here, food way cheaper here, rents far cheaper here, dental cheaper here, trademen services way cheaper, I could go on and on

Sydney same as Melbourne... everything’s way cheaper in Thailand except wine and cheese and not much else from what I can see. However the MASSIVE savings in Thai accommodation alone, sure buys a lot of imported AU wine and cheese!

[Kwasaki]

On 6/17/2019 at 12:00 PM, toofarnorth said:

Imported wine and beer should of gone down in price I think but being manipulated somewhere along the way.

Even up here a beer out is about 3 quid ! If Chang is Elephant Pee , Leo is Leopard Pee , what is My beer ?

My guess would be Singha and the family company use only water to make their beer that has been passed by the management. ????

[swoods58]

On 6/17/2019 at 3:00 AM, monkeycu said:

Could not agree more

A modest 2 bedroom terrace house not far from Bondi will set you back about $850,000 plus

To rent it will be $950 A WEEK

I'm just happy to be here

You ain't been to Sydney for a while! You couldn't get a 2 bed terrace not far from Bondi for much under 2 million. Maybe a crappy unit, but not a terrace or semi.

Edited June 18, 2019 by swoods58
Typo

[4MyEgo]

On 6/16/2019 at 11:41 PM, tink2mutt said:

Genuine opinions are welcome. I am starting to wonder whether it really is cheaper here.

I live in rural Thailand with my Thai wife of 12 years and our two girls and her twin boys, we have our own house (yes ok her house), car, bike etc etc all paid for by Mr Farang. 

 

I moved here from Sydney almost 4 years ago, and planning the move for about a decade, originally back then when the planning started we thought 30,000 baht per month should cover us, excluding private school fees, private health cover which is (A MUST) in my opinion, and house and car insurances.

 

The above said, the Oz $ was around 32 baht when we started planning our move, and by the time we moved here it was around 26 baht, however with the Oz $ declining by around 5 baht to the $ since the move, which equated to about a 20%, our budget increased to our original planned budget that would now be about 40,000 baht per month, however I am struggling to keep the budget at 40,000 baht per month with the increases in certain food items, e.g. imports as I eat like a farang and mainly clean foods and some european delicacies which I cannot let go of.

 

I have always allowed for another 20,000 baht per month to cover the above mentioned private school fees, private health insurance, house and car insurance, so that my budget of 60,000 baht per month is realistic, that said, if you travel to Australia annually and have a family of 6 like I do, your monthly budget will blow out to between 80,000 and a 100,000 baht per month to be realistic, that said, it's not a fixed cost so you can chop and choose whether you go or you don't annually.

 

The above said, one could live on a tighter budget if one wanted to, and eat as the Thai's do and skip private health insurances and not travel domestically or overseas annually as stated above, but what kind of retirement would that be, as retirement in my opinion should be as equal to that of you earning a wage and living your life comfortably as you would back in Oz.

 

Everything is going up in Thailand, but Sydney is beyond most people's reaches to survive, just look at the credit card debts people have or the line of credit they have on their properties, i.e. borrowing to survive, no thanks, Thailand wins hands down by far for me, warts and all when it comes to the cost of living, but you have to pay attention to what you are spending your money on, keep an eye on the Oz $ and still try to make a coin to add to your retirement nest egg, unless your a pensioner with no other means of making a coin, e.g. fixed income which would mean you would be living a tight existence here.

 

Always stick by a simple rule, i.e. only invest as much as your prepared to lose and keep your assets/finances separate from the wife and preferably back in Oz, love is one thing, as there are wives out there who do "LOVE" their husbands, but end up pulling the rug from under their feet, and cleaning them out, e.g. can't tell you how many times I have heard a story, the latest is another Ozzie biting the dust the other day, retired from QLD, his wife borrowed money against the house without his knowledge, apparently the house he had built a few years ago, allegedly cost him 12 million baht to build with the land, the house is a big 2 bedda on 2 rai, I dare say his wife probably had a relative in on it, because that is a huge amount to build a house, should have been no more than 2 mil tops, anyways, bank moved in and ceased it, sold their cars as well, he now has found out that he has cancer and wants to return to Oz with his 5 year old son, he has nothing to his name, he is not even on the pension, is currently living with his mother-in-law in the village while his wife has left him and gone to Pattaya to work, just thought that I would throw that one in for those out there who wear their hearts on their sleeves, LOVE is LOVE and your assets/finances are your assets/finances, they should always be a fall back position for YOU, and I apologies in advance as I know it is a bit off the topic, but good advice nevertheless for those that stick to the simple rule ????

 

Happy budgeting and retirement.....

[monkeycu]

26 minutes ago, swoods58 said:

You ain't been to Sydney for a while! You couldn't get a 2 bed terrace not far from Bondi for much under 2 million. Maybe a crappy unit, but not a terrace or semi.

I will admit my prices reflect the time I left finally in 2007

 

[manchega]

compared to UK - I get it you are aussie but - much cheaper living here, less tax, less housing costs, less living costs, better living standard than UK and damn site warmer

despite GBP weakening, though 

weakening GBP is a real pain and saving less and less per month

[stubby52]

11 hours ago, Traubert said:

Yeah. They told my old man he was constipated eight times until they decided to have a look and announced he had inoperable bowel cancer. At 86 he died one year short of his Diamond Wedding Anniversary.

 

Screw the NHS. Great reactionary service, but poor in all other areas. Everyone I know that works for them is seriously taking the pis*.

 

I rarely troubled them but I still paid through the nose for it.

Yes a hospital told my father he had renal cancer and had about 3mths to live when he was 75 he died by a heart attack at 85!

[khunPer]

On 6/16/2019 at 3:41 PM, tink2mutt said:

Genuine opinions are welcome. I am starting to wonder whether it really is cheaper here.

Its depending of one's lifestyle, and compared to living same kind of life-style, but not truly identical, in one's home country.

 

Some products, mainly Western life-style, are similar priced here, or even little more expensive. However, most of us moving to Thailand as "financial refuges" don't live a pure Western life-style, and thereby saving on living costs; but its true that Thailand is not that retirement life for pennies, which some books had claimed in the past, at least not anymore.

 

Major factors to take into consideration are home-costs and taxes, which of course are relative to from where you originates – I'm from European Scandinavia, so I'm not familiar with Ozzy-taxes – compared to my home country its much cheaper in Thailand. When I realized that some of my fellow countrymen could survive a whole year here for the same amount that I used to heat my home during a cold Danish winter, I decided to move...????

 

In general its like in general my money gives me two-three times better buying power here, compared to staying home; but if I look at specific fully comparable single areas it might be the same price level. However, for me dental work is quite a bit, if not a lot, cheaper, whilst beer prices in general are the same or higher, especially when buying from a super market or convenient store, but not higher in bars and nightlife. I'm lucky – or little weird – I don't like beer, unfortunately I like wine, and that is also (too) expensive...????

 

I think, a question of that one find the right life-style balance...????

[ianezy0]

I think that cost of living should not be the main reason to move to any other country. Obviously it is important.

Initially I would choose where you would like to live and then weigh up all the pros and cons. Cost could well be the deciding factor but at least you will have a balanced approach.

I moved from the UK to New Zealand then to Australia and now Thailand. Thailand was my choice. Having worked here before, I enjoyed the laid back lifestyle and people. Cost was a big plus (31 baht to the $) at the time. As you say, it is now close to 21 baht and sliding. If the cost of living was equal to Australia, Thailand would still be my choice.

Best of luck to you mate.

[Straight8]

On 6/16/2019 at 10:02 PM, madmen said:

I bet when the aud tests 15 baht a historical low there will still be the same crowd gushing how much cheaper it is, well I guess if living on boiled rice and sucking on a tall archer at home in a fan room in the jungle somewhere then that may be the case right up untill your appendix burst and your screaming on the floor not in pain but telling anyone listening NOT to take you to a hospital.

Famous last words "but but didn't think it would happen to me...

I could never get my head around that one, but you are quite right!!

 

Mind is a powerful tool.. Body won't go somewhere the mind hasn't already been to.

[natway09]

First Madmen Chang & Singh beer is available in Britain.

When I first came to Thailand to work lucky to get 15 Bht for the Oz $

Regardless of the soothsayers living in Thailand about the Thai economy being bad it is not so.

The economy is strong, exports are down 4% on last year but look at the value they exported 

last year & the 4% is not a lot. I agree Thailand does not want the Baht to strengthen too much as will hurt the tourist industry & later will affect exports.

The world economy experts look at all the figures before the currencies move.

Australia is getting terribly expensive to live & eat well & the economy is struggling with more to come. Bright coal is no longer the flavour of the month & iron ore exports will decline further

as China & other countries get their act together

eg; I purchased great chicken breasts for 52 Bht a kilo last week. Same in OZ at least $12.

ie: less than a quarter of the price

Certainly if you want to eat "European" food all the time you are correct, Stay in OZ

Spare a thought for the Brits who are really hurting & I do not see any improvement for 5 years with the Brexit debacle, the chicken farm (House of Commons) squabbling along with if they choose to leave without a deal, tariffs from the EU & industries bailing out for cheaper salaries 

in Europe.

All the best mate, but it is & will remain a lot cheaper in Thailand to have a good life which I have enjoyed for 29 years

 

 

[ballpoint]

I have investments in multiple countries, including quite large ones in Australia, on which I either pay no, or a small non-resident withholding, tax.  I use a tax advisor in Australia to keep everything legal, and have been informed by them that, if I moved there, I would have to pay full capital gains tax on my investments there, and declare all other overseas income, which would also likely be taxable in Australia due to my not paying any in its place of origin.  I have no obligation to declare this income in Thailand, unless I remit it here in the year it was earned.  Unless Thailand introduces the requirement to declare and pay tax on all foreign income*, the baht would have to appreciate by an enormous amount for me to be better off living in Australia, NZ or most other Western countries.  And, if that happens, I would convert my Thai investments to Aussie dollars and make a killing on that instead. 

 

One also needs to consider the "fun" factor, whereby I am free to do what I like here, as long as I cause no harm, offense or inconvenience to others.  Well, I could even get away with causing harm, offense or inconvenience, but choose not to.  (Except for a bit of offense on TV occasionally).

 

*If Thailand were to introduce taxes on foreign income, which I can't see happening for those on non-immigrant extensions, I would be looking for another country with a similar living standard that still doesn't have a foreign tax requirement, rather than flee to the West.  However, should Thailand ever start to treat long term foreigners, especially those married to locals, as true residents with a pathway to citizenship, as some are calling for, I'd imagine that paying tax would be a part of that, and you won't be able to waltz on in with 400,000 or 800,000 baht in your pocket and expect to stay here for a year at a time.  The requirements just to be considered for residency would be far tougher.  Be careful what you wish for.

 

 

Edited June 18, 2019 by ballpoint

[NoshowJones]

On 6/16/2019 at 9:01 PM, seajae said:

as an aussie I find while the dollar is bloody crap against the baht it is still cheaper to live here, food is very cheap, virtually all other costs are lower here, I have to pay doctors etc where it was free in Australia but over all I am much better off here. Housing is cheap compared to oz too, water and electricity are a lot cheaper here, while there are faults here for me it is much better than back home, in fact Thailand is now considered my home, I love being here and when I go back to Australia I am ready to return here  a few days later, oz has really changed for the worse

I think you could be talking about the UK also.

[marcusarelus]

4 minutes ago, possum1931 said:

I think you could be talking about the UK also.

Listening to CNN an immigrant lady is sending her children back to Yemen because it's safer than London.  Knives is the problem.  Not the people.  Ban them things before it gets out of hand.  No wonder so many people are staying in Thailand.

Edited June 18, 2019 by marcusarelus

[Lacessit]

2 hours ago, monkeycu said:

????

I'm always amused by the farangs who insist on drinking imported beers here, at greater cost.

Beer is not wine, which sometimes improves with time. Beer has a shelf life of three months, after which the flavour congeners are degraded. Permit me to doubt it is flown here under refrigeration to satisfy farang palates. With shipping from the point of production, it's probably one or two months old by the time it gets here and is put on display.

I can't drink Chang or Singha, they give me a headache.

IMHO Lao dark or Leo are just as good as anything coming from overseas.

[NoshowJones]

2 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

Listening to CNN an immigrant lady is sending her children back to Yemen because it's safer than London.  Knives is the problem.  Not the people.  Ban them things before it gets out of hand.  No wonder so many people are staying in Thailand.

"Knives is the problem.  Not the people." and who is it that uses the knives?

Can't talk about Australia, but apart from the roads, Thailand is a much safer place to live than the UK, knives are banned in the UK, but there are no police walking the streets to do anything about it. 

[monkeycu]

7 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

I'm always amused by the farangs who insist on drinking imported beers here, at greater cost.

Beer is not wine, which sometimes improves with time. Beer has a shelf life of three months, after which the flavour congeners are degraded. Permit me to doubt it is flown here under refrigeration to satisfy farang palates. With shipping from the point of production, it's probably one or two months old by the time it gets here and is put on display.

I can't drink Chang or Singha, they give me a headache.

IMHO Lao dark or Leo are just as good as anything coming from overseas.

Myanmar Beer is much better but almost impossible to find

Lao Dark is great 

[kevvy]

My mate came over to Bangkok to get implants . The cost of his air fares for him an his wife and hotels and the implants worked out still cheaper than Aus..And had a holiday at the same time .He has to come back again and it is still cheaper.I think his dental quote in the nanny state was $29,000 for the implants.Implants are cheap here compared to AUSTRALIA .

I do not know why you said they were the same price