7 hours ago, RichardColeman said:

 

So much for the bureaucratic EU ! Hopefully all these companies will now move to the UK where they can do normal business without EU officialdom telling them who, where and when they can ship their goods ! 

 

 

Nothing to do with EU bureaucracy. The manufacturer has a contract with the EU and has suddenly declared they’ll only deliver about 25% of the contracted quantity. The EU suspects foul play and the vaccins being exported  to  get a (much) higher price than the one agreed upon in the contract. Hence the reaction while this is being investigated.

3 minutes ago, damascase said:

Nothing to do with EU bureaucracy. The manufacturer has a contract with the EU and has suddenly declared they’ll only deliver about 25% of the contracted quantity. The EU suspects foul play and the vaccins being exported  to  get a (much) higher price than the one agreed upon in the contract. Hence the reaction while this is being investigated.

Yes, it is a little strange that there's a surplus in Italy which certainly needs a lot of vaccine to vaccinate Italians yet somehow they can export vaccines.

 

I wonder where this consignment of vaccine is coming from? Is it coming from the UK but being delivered via Italy for some reason or being purchased from an Italian company?

 

It sounds to me like something is slightly amiss with the procurement process here.

 

6 hours ago, soi3eddie said:

The European Union (EU) are now starting to show their bullying stance on this. Threatening the UK if we don't supply them with vaccine, whilst at the same time restricting EU supply to Thailand. Shameful. 

Talking about shameful: does that apply too when a manufacturer unilaterally decides to deliver to the EU only a quarter of the agreed quantity?

3 hours ago, champers said:

Not so. The Astra Zeneca vaccine is being sold at cost.

Sure bet that it wont be injected into farangs arms in thai hospitals as 'cost'

4 hours ago, smedly said:

We're "dirty farangs" again lol

 

The EU is interfering with a privately owned company and its business operations because Brussels couldn't get its plans in order 6 months ago - AZ should tell them to get stuffed

Ahhh, a contract between AZ and the EU, AZ doesn’t fulfill the contractual obligations and when the EU protests you tell them to get stuffed? Good to know that that is your approach to contracts.....

8 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Wow.

Thailand is really getting the short end of the stick on this one.

The vaccine nationalism going on is truly tragic as without timely global vaccinations, the world won't be on a path of recovery. 

Way too slow in ordering / securing their requirements for the Vaccine.

Its just the same as the que in the Bakery. Last in line and everybody else has eaten the jam Doughnuts.

Disgraceful action by any country or laws that put ideology before lives, but I did say

that something like this could happen when the world works more on the almighty Dollar 

before people.

What happened to the MOU re vaccine that was to have no borders ?

This was predictable after the news came out that Italy was suing the EU over its incompetence in rolling out the AZ vaccine. Why would they allow it to be exported to Thailand?

 

Anutin may be reconsidering his bizarre decision to reject the offer of 2 million doses of AZ vaccine for immediate delivery from India at $3 a dose, vs the estimated cost of $6 from the Thai jv that is supposed to be able to start deliveries only in May.

 

There is also no sign of the 200,000 doses of Sinovac vaccine that he said would arrive in February at the whopping price of $17 a dose vs the international price of $5.. 

 

Prayut said that vaccinating the elderly would be a priority but so far he has yet to order any vaccines that are rated for use in the elderly. Sinovac is only for use in the 18 to 59 age group because no trials been undertaken outside that group.  Now Germany is saying it will not use the Astra Zeneca vaccine for over 64s because there is no evidence that is either safe or useful in that age group.   

12 minutes ago, natway09 said:

Disgraceful action by any country or laws that put ideology before lives, but I did say

that something like this could happen when the world works more on the almighty Dollar 

before people.

What happened to the MOU re vaccine that was to have no borders ?

 

Thailand wouldn't hesitate to do the same. Remember the ban on export of rubber gloves and masks in the first wave that it turned out was not a total ban for those with money to get around it.

 

Fortunately there will be no problem with supply of Thailand's own production of Astra Zeneca vaccine. Although it was intended mainly for export to Southeast  countries, by the time it is ready all the other Southeast countries will have finished their vaccination programmes and wouldn't want to pay $6 for the Thai vaccine when the identical product is available from India at $3 anyway.

i read a lot of anti EU critics, but the UK has refused  to sell covid vaccine to the EU as well! i don't think the UK is less bureaucratic after the brexit

2 hours ago, Moonlover said:

 

Reading between the lines, it's interesting to note that AZ could declare the pandemic over by July 2021. That's about the time that they expect Siam Bioscience to start production, making Thailand the regional hub for their vaccine.

 

The last thing that they, especially Siam Bioscience, will want is someone else, India for instance, sneaking onto their trading patch. That's why I think the Indian offer was rejected.

Interesting theory, Astrazeneca UK stops Astrazeneca from India being delivered to Thailand because the Thai patch belongs to Astrazeneca Siam Bioscience. Despite the fact that the Indians Ambassador to Thailand has publicly stated that he is still willing to facilitate the deal if asked. Oh what a web of intrigue goes on in your thoughts.

 

The plot thickens 

1 hour ago, RichardColeman said:

Sure bet that it wont be injected into farangs arms in thai hospitals as 'cost'

Without a doubt we will all be paying. How much is to be determined. 

1 hour ago, damascase said:

Talking about shameful: does that apply too when a manufacturer unilaterally decides to deliver to the EU only a quarter of the agreed quantity?

 

The EU have been too slow during the purchase of these vaccines. Pfizer, Moderna, and now AstraZeneca have all complained about the EU being too slow. 

 

What the EU doing now, is typical bullying a nation they feel they have leverage on - the UK. If you notice, they have not suggested the delay from Pfizer be made up by reducing vaccines to the USA, and redirecting them to the EU - oh no, they wouldn't do that to the USA. Nor, have they suggested that the Pfizer vaccines produced in Europe going to Israel be stopped either. But how dare the UK allocation go to the UK , and shame them up. 

 

Furthermore, they have taken a soft stance on Pfizer (a US COMPANY), who have also delayed their vaccine to the EU. 

 

AstraZeneca was funded and supported by the British, hence they are going to get some privileges of the vaccine - in the way the USA is being given huge doses of Pfizer and Moderna.

 

The EU was dependent on a vaccine from France called Sanofi which unfortunately failed. 

 

The EU reject the idea of first come first approach - mainly because they were the last to order. They want THEIR CONTRACT honoured , at the expense of others who also have contracts like the UK, Thailand, etc - yet Astra Zeneca and Pfizer have suggested that the contract was a best time delivery contract. 

 

Furthermore, let's be honest the bullying is because the UK so far has shown them to be ineffecient and beauracatic mess during this phase. 

 

Back when the pandemic started, the UK had little agents for testing, and a lack of PPE. Germany had loads. I don't recall them giving us any of their PPE or reactive agents for the testing kits. 

 

As someone who voted to remain in the EU, i have found the rhetoric coming out of the EU these past few days as horrific.  It is the EU who are playing vaccine nationalism, and reverting back to some horrendous tendancies amongst certain nations. 

 

They do have leverage i suppose because of the size of their market, and they will most likely put pressure on the vaccine makers to deliver to them. I'm hearing today they will stop all exports of the vaccine manufactured in Europe. This will ultimately harm the EU in the long run, as companies may think twice about setting up there. Ideally they probably should have just set up in the UK. 

 

 

This from the Moderna CEO back in Novemeber warning the EU to stop dithering - but they kept on.

 

Thank goodness Britain is out of the EU.   Sounds like Thailand is in though, the EU doing its usual trick of wanting to control everything.

6 hours ago, JonnyF said:

The EU showing it's true colours, yet again. 

 

First their cumbersome bureaucracy meant they ordered the vaccine several months after the UK. So now they are trying to bully their way out of the situation that they themselves created by stealing the vaccines that the UK ordered.

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/eu-covid-vaccine-uk-supply-b1794306.html

 

They are even raiding the AstraZeneca factory now.

 

https://www.rt.com/news/513932-eu-raid-astrazeneca-vaccine-plant/

 

What a disgrace the EU has become. We got out just in time. A corrupt, inept, bullying organization.

 

No sympathy for Anutin though. I can't imagine he'd be bending over backwards to help the "dirty farangs" if the shoe was on the other foot.

 

 

QUOTE: They are even raiding the AstraZeneca factory now.

 

NO!

FAKE NEWS!

The Belgian authorities are checking the sales, on suspicion that there were under the table sales.

You insinuate something completely different.

SHAME on you!

Just in case some of the above posters would be interested in FACTS, there is an article in the Guardian.

EU could block millions of Covid vaccine doses from entering UK

 

You wil have to copy paste, no paywall.

11 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Wow.

Thailand is really getting the short end of the stick on this one.

The vaccine nationalism going on is truly tragic as without timely global vaccinations, the world won't be on a path of recovery. 

The EU should have ordered early. Besides, all major economies should be greatly increasing production capacity, by public rather than just private companies, so that when local needs are filled production can supply the vast need of the Third World. After that, hopefully they have equipment and facilities that can be used for other vaccines and medicines in short supply. These facilities would stand ready to fight the next pandemic, hopefully to mass vaccinate people before the pandemic arrives on their shores.

3 hours ago, damascase said:

Talking about shameful: does that apply too when a manufacturer unilaterally decides to deliver to the EU only a quarter of the agreed quantity?

I'd like to see a copy of the contract. "Force majeure" is French.

12 hours ago, RichardColeman said:

 

So much for the bureaucratic EU ! Hopefully all these companies will now move to the UK where they can do normal business without EU officialdom telling them who, where and when they can ship their goods ! 

 

 

What about the UK restrictions ? Export to EU is reduced due to priority given to UK vaccination

4 hours ago, Pique Dard said:

i read a lot of anti EU critics, but the UK has refused  to sell covid vaccine to the EU as well! i don't think the UK is less bureaucratic after the brexit

 

Lets be clear about this.   The current dispute is between the EU Commission and AZ.   AZ have been producing vaccines in their UK facilities for some time and are confident that they can meet the delivery schedule promised to the UK previously.   The EU, who as I write have still not approved the AZ vaccine, have a problem with the facility in Belguim.   There is no dispute between the UK Government and the EU Commission, unless of course the EU demand that AZ transfer UK destined vaccines to them.

34 minutes ago, daejung said:

What about the UK restrictions ? Export to EU is reduced due to priority given to UK vaccination

 

Again, it is not the UK restricting the vaccine, it is the manufacturers.   The schedule of production in AZ's UK factories is to meet the UK commitment.   Their facility in Belguim, for EU has run into production problems, as indeed has Pfizer, also in Belguim.

 

Because of the two dose criteria of these vaccinations, once you've started production to meet a vaccination schedule, it cannot stop because somebody demands that this second dose stock should go elsewhere, which is what the EU is doing.

1 hour ago, pagallim said:

 

Again, it is not the UK restricting the vaccine, it is the manufacturers.   The schedule of production in AZ's UK factories is to meet the UK commitment.   Their facility in Belguim, for EU has run into production problems, as indeed has Pfizer, also in Belguim.

 

Because of the two dose criteria of these vaccinations, once you've started production to meet a vaccination schedule, it cannot stop because somebody demands that this second dose stock should go elsewhere, which is what the EU is doing.

Astrazenica was heavily subsidised with EU taxpayers money.

And we are not talking about a butcher's shop, as the EU commissioner said.

15 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Wow.

Thailand is really getting the short end of the stick on this one.

The vaccine nationalism going on is truly tragic as without timely global vaccinations, the world won't be on a path of recovery. 

I think we've got to look at where that vaccine is: Italy. They suffered long & hard. Even with our second wave, we're doing just okay. No need to be so quick. The EU is in waaay worse shape!

The contract is out. 

 

Despite our fellow british TW users, it seems EU is in its own right to claim breach of contract. 

 

As for one user's claim, that AZ vaccine has been subsidied with british money, actually not, UK total investment in vaccine development was, last year in May, around £ 250 millions. 

EU has invested in AZ vaccine alone around £ 297 millions. 

 

The informations is out there, no need for british pride vs EU bureaucracy

 

Stay safe. 

14 hours ago, Petey11 said:

Is someone been economic with the truth. Haven't heard of the astrazenaca vaccine been produced in italy yet and think most of it is produced in uk. Problems are with supply, and just rumours/threats of EU blocking the pfizer vaccine, especially to the UK, if they don't get all their seneca vaccine. Fortunately or unfortunately think seneca have said UK will get all their contractual supply. This is what's causing EU spat as they say it cannot be on a first come basis. Can see it all turning ugly at some point. Another possible downside for Thailand is they haven't officially got a very high infection or problem with covid, very few death's, and maybe seen as a not so urgent case for supply on medical priority, discounting contractual obligations.

The situation isn,t looking good for the ex pats in thailand then.

16 hours ago, smedly said:

We're "dirty farangs" again lol

 

The EU is interfering with a privately owned company and its business operations because Brussels couldn't get its plans in order 6 months ago - AZ should tell them to get stuffed

AZ got stuffed, with money. EU paid a couple of hundred millions Euro's in advance for the production cost and now they don't get delivered.

And yes the vaccin has been approved  today by EMA.

1 hour ago, Albert Zweistein said:

AZ got stuffed, with money. EU paid a couple of hundred millions Euro's in advance for the production cost and now they don't get delivered.

And yes the vaccin has been approved  today by EMA.

.....even though there is no indication that it works on people of 65+

20 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Wow.

Thailand is really getting the short end of the stick on this one.

The vaccine nationalism going on is truly tragic as without timely global vaccinations, the world won't be on a path of recovery. 

 

Understand what you're saying, Jing. And agree in principle....

 

But the cold, hard reality is -- AFAIK -- there simply aren't enough doses of approved vaccines being manufactured right now to meet all the demand. So I think the bigger players in the vaccine development process are pushing to the front of the lines.

 

And I guess, that kinda leaves nowhere/nothing Thailand (and others) more or less out in the cold for the time being, except perhaps for the Chinese vaccine, whatever may end up getting produced here locally, and perhaps some minimal imports.

 

Heck, even states and jurisdictions in the U.S. are screaming right now that they can't get as many doses from the federal government there as they want and need.... And that's with 400,000+ CV victims dead and counting already.

 

 

 

4 hours ago, drenddy said:

The contract is out. 

 

Despite our fellow british TW users, it seems EU is in its own right to claim breach of contract. 

 

As for one user's claim, that AZ vaccine has been subsidied with british money, actually not, UK total investment in vaccine development was, last year in May, around £ 250 millions. 

EU has invested in AZ vaccine alone around £ 297 millions. 

 

The informations is out there, no need for british pride vs EU bureaucracy

 

Stay safe. 

 

 

The EU investment is their purchases - it had very little to do with the actual research into the vaccine. There's a documentary on the BBC regarding how much the British state helped and supported in getting the vaccine. 

 

The contact basically stipulates they cannot guarentee delivery, and it's just best efforts. If the EU wanted a cast iron guarentee they should have put it into the contract. 

 

Once again though, why arent they having a go at Pfizer, the US company that has also delayed vaccines?

1 hour ago, AmySeeker said:

 

 

The EU investment is their purchases - it had very little to do with the actual research into the vaccine. There's a documentary on the BBC regarding how much the British state helped and supported in getting the vaccine. 

 

The contact basically stipulates they cannot guarentee delivery, and it's just best efforts. If the EU wanted a cast iron guarentee they should have put it into the contract. 

 

Once again though, why arent they having a go at Pfizer, the US company that has also delayed vaccines?

Once again though, why arent they having a go at Pfizer, the US company that has also delayed vaccines?

 

do tell us.