give my deposit back !

[mauroest]

in few years for the second time, two real estates disappeared the last day of long term rental with my deposit 20000/30000 THB.
I made video of rooms (all perfect as the first day, not damaged) I left the keys at Juristic office and wait...wait...wait and call the agent. I must go to the airport. I have the taxi! Where are you?
The answer was: do not worry, I will send your deposit to bank account. I never received one Baht of course.
Both real estate were well publicized on Internet with (ghost) office address, but the meeting to pay the rent was always in the condo. Uh
How to protect myself from this scam when I will rent?

[worgeordie]

Go to agents office to sign contract, don't pay last month's rent....

regards worgeordie

[ncc1701d]

I have two court cases pending for this exact problem. For the first one the court said the owner was to pay back the deposit plus court fees plus my lawyer fees. It’s ฿10,000 per month for 3 months. If he doesn’t pay, he goes to jail. 
 

second one is still pending due to covid. But i believe it will be a similar outcome. 
 

the only thing I can think of to prevent this happening in the future is to have the deposit given to a lawyer to hold. When it’s time to leave the property, it can then be determined how much should come back or go to the owner. But I’ve never seen this implemented before. Unfortunately the owner seems to think it is their money to do with as they wish. But it isn’t.

[pixelaoffy]

Legal protection in Thailand for getting back your deposit is ZERO! 

[jippytum]

The district court in Thailand  sometimes known as the small claims court will deal with your complaint .If you have a Thai partner they can file on your behalf without fees . If you have to engage a lawyer the court fees would be less than 2000 baht and the lawyer fee approx 15000 baht max.The system is designed for Thai people to represent themselves without costs therefore legal fees are usually non refundable.Judgement concluded between two and ten months.

Once you confirm to the owner and agent  your intention to take action payment usually follows .Please do not let these people take advantage of you even with  legal action you will be in profit and feel better for doing so.

[bkk6060]

A ghost office?  Doubt you will get anything.

I always go through an established RE office and never pay more then one months deposit.

You can probably get away with even less deposit now just pay a few months of the rent in advance.

[snowgard]

47 minutes ago, pixelaoffy said:

Legal protection in Thailand for getting back your deposit is ZERO! 

 

 

1. If you make a deposit, make a copy of the agent's ID-Card and take a receipt.
2. If it give problems, open a case at the Consumer Protection Board. They handle it free for you and bring it if must to the court.

[jackdd]

19 hours ago, mauroest said:

How to protect myself from this scam when I will rent?

Don't rent from people with a "ghost office".

Don't "meet them in the condo to pay the rent" but use bank transfer.

Don't leave the keys if you don't have your deposit back.

Don't schedule your flight out of the country on the same day as handing back the rental property.

And besides all of this you can tell them to take the last months rent out of the deposit, then they only owe you less than one month (one month minus electricity and water)

[thasoss]

19 hours ago, worgeordie said:

Go to agents office to sign contract, don't pay last month's rent....

regards worgeordie

agree,it's the easiest way.

[Thailand]

When I have rented out my properties I always hold the deposit and will return less cost provided terms and conditions have been met.

The agent is simply paid a commission.

[Bangkok Barry]

1 hour ago, pixelaoffy said:

Legal protection in Thailand for getting back your deposit is ZERO! 

 

What utter nonsense. As more intelligent posts have indicated.

[BenDeCosta]

Many years ago in the UK, I was an impoverished student and used to rent rooms, must have rented from at least half a dozen landlords. Much like how Thailand is now, the landlord used to think the money was theirs and would just ignore calls to return, and even had some show fake invoices with things like "removing black mark from wall £25, cleaning oven £75, replace worn mattress £100", until it covered the entire deposit. After losing hundreds of pounds that I couldn't really afford, I used to just not pay the last month's rent, often the landlord wouldn't notice until after I'd moved out but this was before internet banking. 

 

But here I don't think it would work. I suspect you might come home one to day to find the locks changed and your things outside.

 

In the UK this isn't a problem any more as landlords are obliged to use a deposit protection scheme where the money is held in escrow, not the landlord's bank account with very stiff penalties for landlords who don't do so. I think Thailand would benefit from such a scheme.  

[charliechoc]

Ive always just stopped paying the rent in the last month or 2 depending upon the deposit. I just tell the landlord that I always do it this way and will pay the elec bills. Actually the last time I gave 2000 so that the landlord didnt have to worry about non payment of elec/ water bills. I will never be screwed over by an uneducated thai

[DaLa]

I live here in Thailand and can imagine it would be difficult to settle any dispute like this so I have sympathy.  When I return to the UK I have no problem with renting property and resolving issues. It works both ways and either side can be at fault. I had several properties in the UK that I rented out. I would always try to be fair when it came to rent/deposits/maintenance/ fair wear and tear. However there's another side to the story.

 

1. Phone call at 2:30 AM because a tenant had forgotten her keys

2. Phone call to replace potato peeler because someone else had thrown it out in the garbage

3. All tenants were equally responsible for the rent. On default of one of them I kept part of the deposit of the others. When I asked them to get in touch with the defaulter they said they didn’t know the person that well! Despite living with them for 10 months.

4. Asked why they had to pay rent over Xmas, Easter and after May as that was when exams finished.

5. Changing Gas/Elec/Tel company half way through the year and then defaulting on payments

6. Refusing to pay rent because someone had stolen their mobile phone and said it was my responsibility.

7. Reluctant to clean the oven because there were chemicals in the cleaning agents.

8. Having the university inspect one of the properties and take me to task for the piles of the tenants personal possessions piled up in hallways.

9. Allowing them to paint their rooms on the condition they didn’t use dark colours. Tenant proceeds to paint her entire room BLACK.

 

Some were great. Mix of sexes were usually ok. All girls would fight after a week. All men were so so. Eventually I only had couples, specifically foreign couples as they were the most focussed on their studies and didn’t spend half their lives figuring out who to screw over.

[DaLa]

1 hour ago, bkk6060 said:

A ghost office?  Doubt you will get anything.

I always go through an established RE office and never pay more then one months deposit.

You can probably get away with even less deposit now just pay a few months of the rent in advance.

When I return to the UK I pay all the rent up front.  This resolves the issues over credit checks, and usually allows me to negotiate both the rent and deposit. It's a two way agreement and both parties should be responsible and honourable. 

[wavodavo]

I realise this would be too much for  Thailand but in Queensland AU. when you rent a property the tennant pays 4 weeks rent as a deposit or bond and the Landlord has to deposit the money into the Government Bond Board.The money stays there until the end of the lease when the tennant applies for a refund.If there is any damages or money owing the landlord has to prove it to the Board and they make a decision on the amount of refund....not the landlord. A very good system that works very well.

[Sydebolle]

Stop paying rent for the last one/two months (depending on how many months deposit you left). They will complain but you have nothing to worry, if you keep your part of the deal and pay for all utilities until you left the premises. 

Worked wonders for me, they all went berserk but I told them that I had no interest, means nor chance to recover a dispute like that. To the big surprise of both landlords (where I moved out like that) I went to clear the last bills and all was OK. 

 

[madmen]

3 hours ago, ncc1701d said:

I have two court cases pending for this exact problem. For the first one the court said the owner was to pay back the deposit plus court fees plus my lawyer fees. It’s ฿10,000 per month for 3 months. If he doesn’t pay, he goes to jail. 
 

second one is still pending due to covid. But i believe it will be a similar outcome. 
 

the only thing I can think of to prevent this happening in the future is to have the deposit given to a lawyer to hold. When it’s time to leave the property, it can then be determined how much should come back or go to the owner. But I’ve never seen this implemented before. Unfortunately the owner seems to think it is their money to do with as they wish. But it isn’t.

Lawyer will cost more than deposit 

[pixelaoffy]

2 hours ago, Bangkok Barry said:

 

What utter nonsense. As more intelligent posts have indicated.

Without spending more than your deposit on legal fees it is zero .. continue with your own utter nonsense

[chilly07]

Firstly don't use an agent. Every Thai thinks they are a realator! Contact owner direct and maintain that contact monthly throughout tenancy. At the end of the tenancy continue to pay the rent or you will get evicted early. Locks changed services terminated. If you maintain a good relationship with the landlord you will have no problem with the deposit. Landlords should always insist on references.

[ncc1701d]

4 hours ago, madmen said:

Lawyer will cost more than deposit 

The owner has to pay your legal fees. So it doesn’t matter what the lawyer fees are. Having said that, they were only ฿5,000. 
 

and so far for the second one, just the threat of going to court has them negotiating. I’m doing it out of principle and I will still be ahead a few thousand ฿

[ncc1701d]

8 hours ago, pixelaoffy said:

Legal protection in Thailand for getting back your deposit is ZERO! 

That’s simply not true. Did you read my post directly above yours?

[BritManToo]

On 5/20/2021 at 2:11 PM, mauroest said:

How to protect myself from this scam when I will rent?

Never rent anywhere that demands more than 1 month deposit.

Accept the loss when it happens.

[London Boy]

5 hours ago, chilly07 said:

Firstly don't use an agent. Every Thai thinks they are a realator! Contact owner direct and maintain that contact monthly throughout tenancy. At the end of the tenancy continue to pay the rent or you will get evicted early. Locks changed services terminated. If you maintain a good relationship with the landlord you will have no problem with the deposit. Landlords should always insist on references.

I agree. I had a good relationship with my landlady but when I stopped paying the rent (becasue i had bought my own place and was planning to move out), she cut off the water supply after 18 days. I contacted a lawyer and was told you just rent whats in the condo, but had no rights out of it, where the main water switch was. So after 4 years of being the perfect tenant the landlady turned on me, and did i mention I had a pregnant girlfried living with me at the time.

I like to think I'm a smart bloke and own my own rental properties in London, so i went to a keymaker in a shoping mall and bought a 'star key' which universally opens all water cupboards and turned the water back on.

I got an eviction notice under the door a few days later, by which time i had left the A/C on constantly (and hadn't paid this month or last months bill). I know it was petty, childish and a tad vindictive, but I didnt complain about not getting my two months deposit back, and slept better at night.

[BenDeCosta]

6 hours ago, madmen said:

Lawyer will cost more than deposit 

 

But surely, if you win the case, then they have to cover your legal fees? Maybe I am mistaken?

 

I've only rented once in Thailand, an apartment in Bangkok. I paid a deposit, lived there for 6 months then had to go back to the UK for work. I just took my stuff, left, gave the keys to my girlfriend who was living with me and said if you can get the deposit back then it's yours. Although I dumped her shortly afterwards because I was not very impressed with having a toaster thrown at me just because I came home late from the snooker club, so I still don't know if they returned the deposit.

[Henryford]

My tgf rented in many places, she never got her deposit back. Was never worth getting a lawyer for 5000 baht.

[brianthainess]

22 hours ago, BenDeCosta said:

In the UK this isn't a problem any more as landlords are obliged to use a deposit protection scheme where the money is held in escrow, not the landlord's bank account with very stiff penalties for landlords who don't do so. I think Thailand would benefit from such a scheme.  

It is the same in OZ. But they will still try and scam some type of cleaning scam, agents must be always on the take. Also any carpets must be ''Professionally cleaned'' by a company. 

[pixelaoffy]

16 hours ago, London Boy said:

I agree. I had a good relationship with my landlady but when I stopped paying the rent (becasue i had bought my own place and was planning to move out), she cut off the water supply after 18 days. I contacted a lawyer and was told you just rent whats in the condo, but had no rights out of it, where the main water switch was. So after 4 years of being the perfect tenant the landlady turned on me, and did i mention I had a pregnant girlfried living with me at the time.

I like to think I'm a smart bloke and own my own rental properties in London, so i went to a keymaker in a shoping mall and bought a 'star key' which universally opens all water cupboards and turned the water back on.

I got an eviction notice under the door a few days later, by which time i had left the A/C on constantly (and hadn't paid this month or last months bill). I know it was petty, childish and a tad vindictive, but I didnt complain about not getting my two months deposit back, and slept better at night.

That's the sort of owners landpersons you are dealing with ! They know that can take vindictive measures and get away with it ! Consumer rights in Thailand are ZERO

[Sundown]

Next time don't speak about your business or plans with agents, they are not your friends even if they act like so. They are nice because you are making them money. The minute they understand you will move out, you become less than garbage for them. Never check out without getting the deposit in your pocket. First deposit back, after the keys. 

[Ireland32]

That’s why I do Air B Monthly usually stay 4 to 6 month 1000 b deposits , never again I lock up 35,000 b and pray they give back