American motorcyclist killed in head on collision in Phrae

[Andre0720]

10 hours ago, nahkit said:

That's because more people have motorcycles than covid.

 

(Actually, it was reported that the deaths from covid yesterday, 47, were equivalent to the daily death rate from motorcycle accidents).

Nah, a prime factor seems to be the FEAR that Thai people have of Covid, they follow the rule, wear a mask, and remind others in their surrounding to wear one, and lift it up over their nose.

And then strangely, they very obviously have no fear at all driving on these roads. No rules. None.

[RocketDog]

20 hours ago, seajae said:

the car is on the wrong side of the road plus the bits of bike are on the shoulder so looks like the driver pulled out to overake without checking for oncoming traffic which is the usual norm here, so many thai drivers seem to  think they can pull out and any oncoming traffic will move off the road so they dont have to slow down, they also think flashing their headlights gives them right of way. Cant cant the amount of times I have had to swerve to the extreme side of the road due to drivers/riders doing this at the last minute to pass a slower car/bike without eevn signalling their intent, I have got to the stage when they pull out and flash their headlights I flash mine back then hold them on and no longer move for them so they have no choice but to pull back in, actually learning the road rules would save many lives here especially if the police enforced them

I recognize this scree. You've used it verbatim at least once before.

However, no harm done because you are correct and the story itself repeats endlessly, so why not the reply?

 

In the end its just a waste of digital ink as the situation will never change because Thai people care nothing about killing or dying. (yes, I've used that phrase several times myself. Rather pithy I think.)

[Moonlover]

12 hours ago, jvs said:

13 hours ago, vangrop said:

It appears to me that the car driver had the right to overtake according to the interupted line. The motorcycle driver should have keep far left and he would be still alive.

 

12 hours ago, jvs said:

Over take in a curve?You must be joking but it is not funny.

The really sad part is I don't believe he is joking! It's just about the ultimate in victim blaming IMO.

[seajae]

22 hours ago, VocalNeal said:

 

They are usually Thais driving in Thailand, so which bit don't they understand. 

 

 

by all means show us the road rule that states flashing your lights means you can drive on the wrong side of the road so you dant have to slow down and the car on the right side of the road has to move off the road so you can do it. You would have to be a total idiot to think that flashing your lights changes the road rules, the only ones that do it are the arrogant a holes that think their s**t dont stink or are just plain stupid/ignorant, then again if you think that flashing is ok it explains a lot

[Rampant Rabbit]

6 hours ago, mikebike said:

Ahhh was waiting for this... the rubber-stamp response of those who fear riding.

 

The answer is no, I cannot.

 

But I do accept that there is an element of danger in the recreational activities I love.

 

It seems likely that for some percentage of people the danger is the attraction and for others it is the source of repulsion.

 

To each his/her own.

Its  not repulsion, I drove a bike  in my  home  country from 16-25 going from 50 to 1100cc last was a  Suzuki GsxR  1100n, if  anything here its  actually  getting worse daily, is  what Ive noticed.

[Kinnock]

6 hours ago, mikebike said:

It would seem that the major contributing factor to this very unfortunate incident would be the Department of Transport's penchant for dashed center-lines on curves... often where they have no business being.

 

I have seen dashed center-lines on mountain pass hairpins...

 

In this case, the curve seems gentle enough that, under ideal conditions, (and all vehicles travelling at legal speed or under) passing could be done safely.

 

BUT... this was obviously not the case in this instance.

 

The car driver should not have attempted the pass - full stop.

 

The PCX rider was woefully unprepared to make an evasive manoeuvre in a situation where he should have been hyper-aware of the possibility of oncoming traffic passing on the dashed-line curve.

 

This sad accident was avoidable in so many ways.

Agree .... but target fixation is a real problem with bike riding.  The car driver clearly made the first error by pulling out when he could not see far enough ahead, then he made the second by not moving over to give the bike space to pass, but I suspect the rider then looked at the oncoming car (understandably) but that means that's where he'll go.

 

It would take a lot of experience to look at the narrow edge of the road and head there to slip passed the oncoming car.

 

Even after 40 years of riding motorcycles I head straight for the odd tree when riding off road.

[Lacessit]

17 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

I’m not sure if this was a factor in this accident or not.

 

But, I used to wear glasses before I had lasik. My eyesight was better than a lot of my Thai friends, but I noticed a degradation to the point I wanted to wear glasses when driving, especially if driving at night time. 

 

I suspect there are lot of accidents which are a consequence of poor eyesight. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I am required to wear glasses on my Australian driving licence. On my Thai driving licence, I am not, but I wear them anyway.

I avoid driving at night, poor peripheral vision. Plus that's when the majority of drunks, drug users and plain idiots are on the roads.

[Lacessit]

9 hours ago, Andre0720 said:

Nah, a prime factor seems to be the FEAR that Thai people have of Covid, they follow the rule, wear a mask, and remind others in their surrounding to wear one, and lift it up over their nose.

And then strangely, they very obviously have no fear at all driving on these roads. No rules. None.

What amuses me most is Thais dutifully wearing a mask on a scooter, no helmet. Statistically, they are far more likely to die of head injuries in an accident than they ever would from COVID.

Or perhaps it's the fact the fines for not wearing a mask are draconian compared to the fines for not wearing a helmet.

[Rampant Rabbit]

9 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

I am required to wear glasses on my Australian driving licence. On my Thai driving licence, I am not, but I wear them anyway.

I avoid driving at night, poor peripheral vision. Plus that's when the majority of drunks, drug users and plain idiots are on the roads.

I  find the  opposite , most are tucked up  in bed the roads are quieter and there's way  more  room except for  lorries  who then like to hog the outside  lane.

[Lacessit]

4 minutes ago, Rampant Rabbit said:

I  find the  opposite , most are tucked up  in bed the roads are quieter and there's way  more  room except for  lorries  who then like to hog the outside  lane.

Touch wood, I've been driving here for 11 years, car and scooter, accident-free. So I must be doing something right.

I don't have the data, but my guess would be the statistics here say the serious accidents happen at night.

The three factors in accidents are speed, alcohol/drugs, and fatigue. We all know many Thais speed beyond their driving capabilities, that's a given. IMO fatigue is far more likely to come into play at night.

[sherwood]

On 5/27/2021 at 3:24 PM, VocalNeal said:

 

Never said it was law. He who flashes first assumes that he has the right of way! This is understood by locals. 

I hope you are having a laugh there fella. Otherwise you need your head examined.

[mikebike]

3 hours ago, Kinnock said:

Agree .... but target fixation is a real problem with bike riding.  The car driver clearly made the first error by pulling out when he could not see far enough ahead, then he made the second by not moving over to give the bike space to pass, but I suspect the rider then looked at the oncoming car (understandably) but that means that's where he'll go.

 

It would take a lot of experience to look at the narrow edge of the road and head there to slip passed the oncoming car.

 

Even after 40 years of riding motorcycles I head straight for the odd tree when riding off road.

Also agree.

 

If the rider had more experience and/or was aware of the issue of point fixation, I believe he would have positioned himself on the outside of the lane and been looking for any cage making that (ill advised, full-stop wrong) pass and have give himself ample time and options.

 

I am not victim-blaming. The car driver was wrong. But the biker made some very bad choices.

[impulse]

On 5/27/2021 at 12:51 AM, mikebike said:

Oh how I love irrational generalizations...

 

I accept that for you and many others riding a bike here is madness.

 

For me it is breathing. Riding is my church and I worship everyday.

 

Scooter, cruiser, street fighter, dirtbike, and track bike. I have one of each and they all get overused.

 

16 yrs in Thailand and zero issues on two wheels.

 

To each his own.

 

I suspect the guy in the OP felt the same.  Right up until it happened.

 

Just like most scooter victims who figure, so far- so good. 

 

[Freigeist365]

On 5/27/2021 at 5:47 PM, bojo said:

Is it just me or has onyone else ever noticed that the locals hang behind you on the straight for ages and then suddenly, just as one is approaching a blind bend, they overtake, swerving out wide.....I've experienced that on many occasions...................

Yupp, they then have to pass you and push for it like their life depends on it... Once they have passed, most of them get slower and slower until you have to pass them again... OR - even better - they hit the brakes hard when pulling in front of you to then turn left into a Soi, not indicating either, what goes without saying... It's a jungle out there...

[Freigeist365]

3 hours ago, mikebike said:

Also agree.

 

If the rider had more experience and/or was aware of the issue of point fixation, I believe he would have positioned himself on the outside of the lane and been looking for any cage making that (ill advised, full-stop wrong) pass and have give himself ample time and options.

 

I am not victim-blaming. The car driver was wrong. But the biker made some very bad choices.

The only bad choices made were made by the irresponsible car driver! It is quite possible that the cement truck blocked the view of the biker for a very long time, with the car just pulling out, thus being positioned on the rear right corner end of the truck in a "dead spot". The biker did not stand a chance unless he would have suddenly pulled to the left and ending up in the ditch or being ripped in half by a concrete pole... 

I'm a biker for 40 years now and I have even driven through harsh, European winters on my XT-500 back then in the golden days, have driven everything from 80cc to 1,300cc, and drive a 1,000cc now. Hence, I know what I am talking about. The black car was in a "dead spot". If the unfortunate biker would have had a helmet cam, that video would certainly prove me right. 

Before ranting back, MikeBike, please take a deep breath, close your eyes and try to imagine the scene... You're on that bike, loooong stretching right curve coming, you lean in a bit, constant stream of vehicles to your right, a concrete truck at the far end of the curve... concrete truck now almost about to pass you, and there it is: Black car on your lane! Bam!!!!!!! No chance, my friend! No chance at all!!!!

Edited May 28, 2021 by Freigeist365

[mikebike]

2 hours ago, impulse said:

 

I suspect the guy in the OP felt the same.  Right up until it happened.

 

Just like most scooter victims who figure, so far- so good. 

 

Ahh the irony of commenting on my post deriding generalizations with an even bigger, more absurd generalization!! Love it!

 

Your astute observation can be applied to absolutely any activity which has an element of risk.

 

To each his own but I'm definitely not into a bubble-wrapped world.

[mikebike]

1 hour ago, Freigeist365 said:

No chance at all!!!!

If you say so...

 

I already described in detail how easy it was to avoid if the bike was positioned in the lane properly and travelling at a safe speed.

 

Apparently 40 years of riding doesn't increase common sense.

[Pravda]

Thai driver is wrong, but American should have known better. 

[scammed]

34 minutes ago, mikebike said:

If you say so...

 

I already described in detail how easy it was to avoid if the bike was positioned in the lane properly and travelling at a safe speed.

 

Apparently 40 years of riding doesn't increase common sense.

no, just no, any attempt to maneuver with a bike

ends in loss in balance.

his only option was to throw himself off the bike or turn into the wilderness with zero hope of staying upright

[scammed]

6 minutes ago, Pravda said:

Thai driver is wrong, but American should have known better. 

no, there was nothing the american could do to avoid accident at that point

[greenmonkey]

Do we know if the car driver was drunk? He said he's been celebrating a birthday so I would be very surprised if he hadn't been drinking. Then overtakes on a bend and kills someone. Most probable outcome for this driver "Accidents happen - now let that be a lesson to you and on your way". Drunk or not drunk - Until Thailand starts to punish this kind of behaviour it will happen again and again and again. It really sickens me that this s#it is allowed to go on unpunished.

 

Very sad for the guy and his family. RIP.

[whaleboneman]

16 hours ago, Stargrazer9889 said:

There is a small amount of pavement to the shoulder of the road, and the grey stuff does not look like pavement to me.

  So I am curious, that if the motorcycle is doing highway speed, was he supposed to go into the grey area and

kill him self by wiping out there.   it looks like a gravel or dirt area to the left of the 1 foot or 30 cm shoulder of the highway.

So vocalneal,?  Would you have taken the area off the pavement if you were on that motorbike?   Just wondering.

Geezer

I would have headed there rather than into an oncoming car.

[bojo]

2 hours ago, Freigeist365 said:

I'm a biker for 40 years now and I have even driven through harsh, European winters on my XT-500 back then in the golden days

I had one too, in '79. What fun and thank goodness for the decompression lever............. was looking recently at current  prices for em now in UK,,,,,anything between 4K, up to about 10K restored..............

[whaleboneman]

11 hours ago, seajae said:

by all means show us the road rule that states flashing your lights means you can drive on the wrong side of the road so you dant have to slow down and the car on the right side of the road has to move off the road so you can do it. You would have to be a total idiot to think that flashing your lights changes the road rules, the only ones that do it are the arrogant a holes that think their s**t dont stink or are just plain stupid/ignorant, then again if you think that flashing is ok it explains a lot

It's not a written road rule but it is quite a common practise in Thailand. You should be aware of it. I have been run off the road many times in Issan by these arrogant drivers and because I am aware of the practise, I have always managed to take corrective action when I see the flashers coming.

[Bangkokazy]

It's just another death, life goes on

[IraqRon]

Yes so true.  And I wish that the car driver had died also.  These people like him are never held accountable for their actions in this country.

[Pravda]

10 hours ago, scammed said:

no, there was nothing the american could do to avoid accident at that point

 

Like I said, he should have known better. 

 

Motorcycle statistics in Thailand are widely available. Certainly we hear about them every day on this forum being deadlier than covid.

 

 

[Odysseus123]

15 minutes ago, Pravda said:

 

Like I said, he should have known better. 

Bizarre...utterly bizarre.

[NanLaew]

On 5/27/2021 at 1:53 PM, VocalNeal said:

On 5/27/2021 at 12:33 PM, connda said:

Forget "flashing."  Drive with your lights on and flip them to full high beams when morons do moronic stuff. 

 

Driving with headlights on during the daytime is, I believe, illegal here. 

 

In Thailand, the term 'illegal' is notional.

[metisdead]

As to whether having your headlights on during the daytime is illegal, the following was posted in 2016: