US expats plead for vaccine help in viral Thailand

[w94005m]

Just now, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

You can call it what you want, but the pertinent point and detail re your earlier comment is the following, just as I said above. From your same NYT article:

 

"Pfizer did not accept federal funding to help develop or manufacture the vaccine, unlike front-runners Moderna and AstraZeneca."

 

 

 

It's really not important. They received tax money for which US citizens here have received nothing, but they were part of Warp Speed. Whether they received as much as other participants is a separate matter as the development was not directly funded is a separate issue, but they were part of Warp Speed and misleading statements to the contrary have been corrected.

 

https://factcheck.afp.com/pfizers-role-operation-warp-speed-misconstrued-online

[Liverpool Lou]

14 hours ago, 10baht said:

I didn't realize you were reading IndiaVisa or BrazilVisa and keeping up with the American Expat's efforts in those countries to get the US Gov't off its ass and do what it should do for all Americas.

So, presumably, you think that every country should be making arrangements to vaccinate all it's citizens wherever they may be?  A logistical nightmare.   

 

Or do you think that is it just Americans, worldwide, that should be looked after in that special way?

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

15 minutes ago, w94005m said:

 

It's really not important. They received tax money for which US citizens here have received nothing, but they were part of Warp Speed. Whether they received as much as other participants is a separate matter as the development was not directly funded is a separate issue, but they were part of Warp Speed and misleading statements to the contrary have been corrected.

 

https://factcheck.afp.com/pfizers-role-operation-warp-speed-misconstrued-online

 

Ya, but the only part that got corrected was an initial statement by a Pfizer exec claiming the company was NOT part of OWS... They were... but they still didn't take any federal funds to develop their vaccine.

 

From your fact check above, just the same as from the NYT:

 

"While Operation Warp Speed provided research and development money to several pharmaceutical firms, including Johnson & Johnson, Moderna, and AstraZeneca, Pfizer accepted government funds to supply and distribute their shot, not develop it."

 

In other words, the feds later paid Pfizer money to buy vaccine doses as a customer after the vaccine was developed. But the feds did NOT pay any money to Pfizer upfront to support development of the vaccine.

 

If Pfizer's vaccine had ended up after one to two years of development being a failure/not effective against the CV, the feds wouldn't have paid a dime to Pfizer.

 

So it's simply not correct to say -- as both the NYT and your fact check source confirmed -- that the U.S. government had any investment in the development of the Pfizer vaccine.

 

 

 

Edited May 31, 2021 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[nattaya09]

15 hours ago, tonray said:

They are providing them...to citizens of other countries 

True, I filled out a short form for the vaccine and nowhere did it ask and nowhere did it ask my citizenship status. In fact, they didn't even check my ID.

 

 

[shdmn]

15 hours ago, cardinalblue said:

Logistically it would be a nightmare to pull off - all countries Americans are in...

 

easier to just book a flight home and get it within a few days...

 

and then get a gym workout and a lap swim in which one can’t do in thailand...

This.  If you want a vaccine fly there and get it.  Embassies don't have medical fridges so that's kind of a big problem right there.  So then they would have to make some deal with a hospital which would open up a can of worms politically.

[Jingthing]

26 minutes ago, shdmn said:

This.  If you want a vaccine fly there and get it.  Embassies don't have medical fridges so that's kind of a big problem right there.  So then they would have to make some deal with a hospital which would open up a can of worms politically.

But they managed to vaccinate all of their staff, etc. 

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

The Thai government has said, at various points in the process, that they were going to prioritize vaccines based on health risk...

 

And then, shortly thereafter, they turned all that on its head and started making vaccine priorities based more on economics (the Phuket sandbox notion) and tourism (vaccinating airline staff and public transit workers), etc etc...

 

Every other day or so, it seems they come up with some new kind of priority, even though it's not entirely clear that they have sufficient vaccines now or in the near future to cover any of them.

 

The latest which presumably supersedes  all previous is that provinces are free to set their own priorities. 

[shdmn]

31 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

But they managed to vaccinate all of their staff, etc. 

The vaccine is shipped in dry ice and could probably sit in those boxes for a few days.  You could unthaw it and vaccinate the staff in a couple hours. No need for storage.  Not at all the same as trying to run a vaccination clinic.  Embassies don't do that.

Edited May 31, 2021 by shdmn

[nattaya09]

16 hours ago, skorp13 said:

LOL. The U.S. is supposed to send personalized vaccines to each citizen in every other country?. Wow, talk about entitlement syndrome.

Ten million expats living abroad globally. Of that, six million likely to even want the vaccine...the size of one small US state. Speaking as someone living in the US and already vaccinated, I'm not asking for anything but  think that should be a fundamental service government provides for my fellow citizens abroad during this pandemic. 

[nattaya09]

34 minutes ago, shdmn said:

The vaccine is shipped in dry ice and could probably sit in those boxes for a few days.  You could unthaw it and vaccinate the staff in a couple hours. No need for storage.  Not at all the same as trying to run a vaccination clinic.  Embassies don't do that.

 

There's a lot of things that weren't done pre-pandemic that make sense now.

[Mike k]

Another site posted that Vietnam sent a letter to biden requesting covid aid 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I know where Thailand might be able to pick up some J&J vaccines on the cheap.... You remember J&J, the single dose vaccine approved in Thailand but never publicly seen here as yet...  Thailand shouldn't be fazed too much by some little quality control issues....

 

FDA, J&J Near Deal for Covid-19 Vaccine Production at Baltimore Plant

 

"WASHINGTON—The Food and Drug Administration and vaccine maker Johnson & Johnson JNJ 0.26% expect to announce within days that contamination problems at a Covid-19 vaccine plant in Baltimore are resolved, clearing the way for millions more doses to become available.

...

The emergency use authorization for the plant to produce Covid-19 vaccine could be made next week, the U.S. officials said. That could help toward fulfilling President Biden’s pledges to share 20 million doses from J&J, Pfizer Inc. PFE 0.21% and Moderna Inc. MRNA 3.05% with the rest of the world by the end of June.

 

The Baltimore plant has produced millions of doses that were in inventory awaiting authorization, but most aren’t finished and are placed in vials, the officials said, adding it could take months before all those doses are ready for use."

 

(more)

 

https://www.wsj.com/articles/fda-j-j-near-deal-for-covid-19-vaccine-production-at-baltimore-plant-11622154824

 

These may be the CV vaccine doses that the U.S. ends up "sharing" with the rest of the world.

 

 

Edited May 31, 2021 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[phills2k1]

For another page:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/apr/22/britons-left-stranded-by-japans-slow-vaccine-rollout

 

 

"Briton Expats Frustrated London Isn't Helping with Vaccines"

 

 

Guarantee you that expats from almost every country are hoping their government could help them with a vaccine and have posed the question. It's not some US superiority or entitlement BS as so many of you are basking in accusing. But for whatever reason, and article was written about us

 

That being said, it's nice to see how much derision there is for us Americans no matter what we do. Will just store it away for later...

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, shdmn said:

The vaccine is shipped in dry ice and could probably sit in those boxes for a few days.  You could unthaw it and vaccinate the staff in a couple hours. No need for storage.  Not at all the same as trying to run a vaccination clinic.  Embassies don't do that.

Not normally. 

[oslooskar]

1 hour ago, Mike k said:

Another site posted that Vietnam sent a letter to biden requesting covid aid 

 As far as I'm concerned the Vietnamese should have priority over everyone. So, I hope Biden sends them all the vaccines they want.

[waders123]

21 hours ago, sqwakvfr said:

Why only in Thailand or SE Asia?  If the US Government vaccinates Americans in Thailand then what about every country in the world that Americans are in?  This list would be long and possibly there are more Americans in other countries than Thailand?  A lot of Americans are in the PI as well.  It is not what "the Government owes us or has a duty to do", most of us came to Thailand voluntarily.  I have never met any American who was forced to come to Thailand or is on asylum status.  We can leave Thailand anytime.  

 

Additionally would countries like India or possibly Brazil be higher on any potential list to vaccinate Americans?  If the pandemic poses an imminent threat to Americans then the State Department would deploy it's ultimate overseas tool:  the NEO program, Noncombatant Evacuation Operations.  If the pandemics gets really bad the US Embassy in Bangkok would offer all Americans a chance to evacuate(of course it would not be free).  In essence Americans who want to be evacuated would pack one carry on bag and meet at a designated meeting point and fly out to the US or the nearest safe country. 

 

This is issue is "DOA".  

You are saying, if you are an American citizen traveling/working/living outside of the USA, you are NOT entitled to Catastrophic assistance from the US government?  I find that at best, absurd.  As an American citizen, your obligation to pay taxes to the US government doesn't stop when you travel, work, or reside in another country. 

Why wouldn't federal mandates obligate the US government to give assistance in this pandemic to their citizens in the form of covid vaccine?   This statement is displayed boldly by the US government regarding their mission statement for their embassies around the world on their embassy website:  "The primary purpose of an embassy is to assist American citizens who travel to or live in the host country.", (this statement was taken from https://diplomacy.state.gov/diplomacy/what-is-a-u-s-embassy/ website). 

US citizens in a "host" country should be offered vaccinations for covid-19 in that country to assist them in staying alive, whether they are traveling, working, or living there.  American citizens deserve the same respect, benefits, and vaccines as afforded to citizens living at home. The US government needs to immediately step up and take care of their citizens, both on US soil as well as abroad with immunization for covid.   So please, don't say just because Americans leave American soil they are on their own; that's just so much BS.  May no mistake, this covid pandemic is a catastrophic situation, not just for the US, but the world.

 

  

[bkkcanuck8]

8 minutes ago, waders123 said:

You are saying, if you are an American citizen traveling/working/living outside of the USA, you are NOT entitled to Catastrophic assistance from the US government?  I find that at best, absurd.  As an American citizen, your obligation to pay taxes to the US government doesn't stop when you travel, work, or reside in another country. 

Why wouldn't federal mandates obligate the US government to give assistance in this pandemic to their citizens in the form of covid vaccine?   This statement is displayed boldly by the US government regarding their mission statement for their embassies around the world on their embassy website:  "The primary purpose of an embassy is to assist American citizens who travel to or live in the host country.", (this statement was taken from https://diplomacy.state.gov/diplomacy/what-is-a-u-s-embassy/ website). 

US citizens in a "host" country should be offered vaccinations for covid-19 in that country to assist them in staying alive, whether they are traveling, working, or living there.  American citizens deserve the same respect, benefits, and vaccines as afforded to citizens living at home. The US government needs to immediately step up and take care of their citizens, both on US soil as well as abroad with immunization for covid.   So please, don't say just because Americans leave American soil they are on their own; that's just so much BS.  May no mistake, this covid pandemic is a catastrophic situation, not just for the US, but the world.

 

  

Assist is mainly for government assistance.  If you are arrested overseas, they will give you a list of local lawyers that can provide services needed (they do not vet them or rate them in any way).   They will not provide you with legal services, or pay for them.    If you need medical services, they will provide you a list of hospitals and doctors (similarly).  If you require your passport replaced, they will accept your application (for a fee) -- this is truly a government service, so they provide it.   If the situation in a country deteriorates rapidly, the US government may organize and provide evacuation for government employees and citizens.  Citizens however will not get a 'free ride', you will have to sign a promissory note to reimburse the government.   [I believe if you don't repay promptly you will be charged fees and interest - and when you go to get your passport next time.... you will find you have to pay them back first].   etc.  I could go on, but there is a pattern developing here... the government is not a provider of anything other medical, legal or other services normally provided by the private sector. 

[Stargeezr]

I am wondering what the term expat  means?  Is a US expat more special than the other expats?

   As it was pointed out, many expats likely do have the means to fly back to their home countries and get their COVID shots. Or fly back part way to some country that has Pfizer or Moderna shots, take a 2 month vacay there, pay for the shots,  and come back to Jolly old Thailand all protected. Problem solved.  But  No. lets just go on Thai visa and complain and plead.  Just think of the poor Thais who do not have this option.

   Something to ponder indeed.

Geezer

[waders123]

24 minutes ago, bkkcanuck8 said:

Assist is mainly for government assistance.  If you are arrested overseas, they will give you a list of local lawyers that can provide services needed (they do not vet them or rate them in any way).   They will not provide you with legal services, or pay for them.    If you need medical services, they will provide you a list of hospitals and doctors (similarly).  If you require your passport replaced, they will accept your application (for a fee) -- this is truly a government service, so they provide it.   If the situation in a country deteriorates rapidly, the US government may organize and provide evacuation for government employees and citizens.  Citizens however will not get a 'free ride', you will have to sign a promissory note to reimburse the government.   [I believe if you don't repay promptly you will be charged fees and interest - and when you go to get your passport next time.... you will find you have to pay them back first].   etc.  I could go on, but there is a pattern developing here... the government is not a provider of anything other medical, legal or other services normally provided by the private sector. 

You are taking what I said and turning it into a different issue.  In my response that you are quoting, I said that US citizens abroad should be entitled to the same treatment as US citizens on US soil.  The "spirit" of the statement content of my response was toward the covid pandemic and the catastrophic situation that is happening now.   I am not indicating that US citizens should be "spoon fed" while they travel by the US government.  I'm certainly not advocating a "free ride" for anyone.  I am simply stating that the US government has an obligation to assist their citizens, regardless of where they are at in the world, in gaining immediate access to an American approved covid vaccine in this catastrophic situation where their life is in danger.  

[Jingthing]

Nobody is saying U.S. expats are more special in general. To our embassy, one would hope so though!

[waders123]

17 minutes ago, Stargrazer9889 said:

I am wondering what the term expat  means?  Is a US expat more special than the other expats?

   As it was pointed out, many expats likely do have the means to fly back to their home countries

and get their COVID shots. Or fly back part way to some country that has Pfizer or Moderna shots,

take a 2 month vacay there, pay for the shots,  and come back to Jolly old Thailand all protected. Problem solved.  But  No. lets

just go on Thai visa and complain and plead.  Just think of the poor Thais who do not have this option.

   Something to ponder indeed.

Geezer

Expat means many things; depends on the person you talk to.  Why should an "expat" have to leave their family or their job just to get vaccinated?!?  He pays his tax dollars to their government just like all citizens are obligated to do. Why can't they ask for and receive their immunization shots against covid in the country they are presently in?   

Edited May 31, 2021 by waders123

[sqwakvfr]

Waders123:

 

I never said that:" you are NOT entitled to Catastrophic assistance from the US government?  "

 

So Thailand is currently in a Catastrophic State???

[placeholder]

10 hours ago, natway09 said:

When you left your "Nanny State" to live in a 3rd world country by choice you leave many of the trimmings behind. Not being vaccinated when you click your finger is one of them.

Settle down, take care & be patient like we all are having to be

Another instance of "misery loves company."
 

[10baht]

9 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

So, presumably, you think that every country should be making arrangements to vaccinate all it's citizens wherever they may be?  A logistical nightmare.   

 

Or do you think that is it just Americans, worldwide, that should be looked after in that special way?

I think those that can should and those that can't will be bailed out by you know who.

[jacko45k]

13 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

 

Has the U.S. government actually asked Thailand for such a thing?  I think not.

 

Has the U.S. government donated to Thailand the vaccines that would be used for such a program. I think not.

 

Is there any reason Thailand would deny a request from the U.S. government for something it's already granted permission to China for? I think not.

 

Good points although I might add that perhaps China was more successful as it used a carrot and stick approach.... here are some 'free' vaccines, 'if'..... 

 

Or as to a non existent request being approved, what is the incentive? 

[Stargeezr]

And I thought that an ex pat was a bit like an ex husband or wife.  Not really part of the family

as they were as husband or wife.   Being a half a world away from the home country is a pretty good separation

as well, and being in a tropical country also means warmer or hotter Winter months. an ex patriot,

also does not have to pay the same amount of taxes as well,  as an in country patriot. if I am not mistaken. 

  Geezer

[John Drake]

12 hours ago, natway09 said:

When you left your "Nanny State" to live in a 3rd world country by choice you leave many of the trimmings behind. Not being vaccinated when you click your finger is one of them.

Settle down, take care & be patient like we all are having to be

 

Didn't the people in the US embassy also choose to take their job and go outside the US? They were vaccinated.

 

Same goes for the military. It's a volunteer military, so they all chose to take a job that might get them posted in Europe or Asia. Aren't they getting vaccinated?

[Presnock]

to TVF contributors complaining about Americans wanting the US govt to provide vaccines for ex-pats in other countries -  In case you are ignorant to the fact that unlike most other countries of the world, that is the developed countries,  AMERICANS are required by our laws to pay US taxes on all of our income no matter where we live.  I realize that there are those that illegally do not pay their share of taxes to the US but I do and have done my entire adult life.  If an American here in Thailand is also a resident of some states in the USA, that person also pays state taxes.  The vaccines approved in the US were and are being produced with US tax monies collected by the US govt.  That is why we feel we should be entitled to the vaccine.  If they provided it to the Embassy and the Embassy contracted a local hospital to give the jabs (although almost every embassy/consulate has medical facilities and in Thailand there is also a joint US military presence with doctors), I would be willing to pay whatever the hospital charges to give the jabs to me and my family.  As for embassy support of Americans, now that they no longer provide income letters, I haven't had any reason to use their services.  I would appreciate it if they did help us as they apparently had vaccines for the Thai local employees who do not pay US taxes as far as I know!

  

[kingstonkid]

21 hours ago, phills2k1 said:

I'm sorry, but do you really think that US citizens are the ONLY expats throughout the world that would prefer that their local embassy provide them with a vaccine if their host country offers no help?

 

I'm an American who can't STAND almost every aspect of my country, but this is such a ridiculous and simple-minded comment

 

Especially considering the fact that in my experiences, most Americans traveling this far abroad are doing so to learn about and appreciate and support the cultures of others, and are extra vigilant in trying to destroy the traditional stereotype that we all face

 

 I fully agree that there are more Americans that are GREAT EXPATS ADN tourist but it is things like this that make people think of the entitled spoiled brat Americans of past.  

 

The fact that people come here to get away from their country for whatever reason and then expect their country to provide them as if they are in their country be they Brit American or even Canadian is ridiculous.  

 

[Berkshire]

12 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

FWIW, I think ANY country that has a policy and program to give all its citizens COVID vaccinations SHOULD be extending those to its citizens living abroad -- in situations where for whatever reason they're not able to get vaccines abroad.

 

Agree.  The irony is that America is not only providing jabs to Americans, but foreigners as well.  Which is why foreigners--rich foreigners that is--are flocking to America to get free vaccines.  So we can say that US expats' tax dollars are going towards getting foreigners vaccinated but not ourselves. 

 

[Wealthy Asians are escaping vaccine shortages and flying thousands of miles to the US to get their life-saving jabs.

[The US obtained enough to inoculate its citizens twice over – a surplus that travel companies are eager to take advantage of.]

[Around half of US states, including Texas, Arizona, and California, will accept any official form of identification with a photograph to administer a vaccine, regardless of where you legally live.]

[The US government is paying for the vaccines and for the cost of giving the shots to anyone who does not have insurance.]

 

https://www.yahoo.com/news/wealthy-asians-flying-us-organised-155007911.html

  

Edited June 1, 2021 by Berkshire