Your Covid 19 papers, please

[Ryan754326]

12 hours ago, Purdey said:

I have to show proof of nationality when crossing borders. Proof of identity when flying domestically. Proof of membership at my Club. Proof of having had a yellow fever vaccination in certain countries. Proof of basic ability to drive with a driving license. Proof of identity when entering certain offices in Bangkok. Proof of membership when borrowing books from a library. 

 

One more doesn't matter. 

If it were just another card in my wallet that I had to show when I crossed a border, it wouldn’t be so bad. Showing your passport when you enter a country is one thing, but would you choose to live in Thailand if you were required to show it every time you entered a restaurant? 

Having the mobile phones and apps involved makes it that much more off-putting. Yes, I know my phone is tracking me all the time, but I can still leave it on the dresser and go out for dinner. 

 

[VocalNeal]

I'm surprised no one has suggested getting a vaccination card on Khaosan Road. Surely they will be available and therefore useless.

[geisha]

19 hours ago, Surasak said:

This could be a two edged sword. If asked for my vaccine status at the establishment I am visiting, how do I know it is safe to enter? Will there be a clear sign at the entrance to confirm all staff are vaccinated?

Well, if it was in EU , I live in France for example, everyone who works with the public, bars, restaurants, shops, bigger offices , etc etc must be vaccinated or present a negative PCR test every 72 hrs to their boss/ workplace. You also have a vaccination Pass, where your COVID vaccinations are noted with their dates, your name. This you show and your QR code is scanned before entering the establishment. It’s a government app. Paper copy can be used. It’s easy and rapid to do, hold up your phone/paper, they flash it. Personally I am reassured by this, and it doesn’t bother me in the least.

Where Thailand is concerned, I’m not sure that they are capable of organizing this . 

[hioctane]

22 hours ago, theonetrueaussie said:

If what you say is true then why are they calling vaccinated in the U.S.A "Super Spreaders"??? Why is it that Israel the most vaccinated country in the world is currently having a massive outbreak and the majority of people hospitalized/dying are those vaccinated?? So many things we don't know about covid still, lot more research and statistics need to be done/gathered still!

Why is it you can have had 20 other vaccine shots but if you refuse covid vaccine you are now an anti-vaxxer?

The data from Israel needs to be put in context. 87% of the vaccinated that are infected and hospiitalized are over  60. This doesn’t account for all the vaccinated and infected that DO NOT need to be hospitalized. That is why it is recommended that seniors and immuno-compromised will need boosters.

[Nurseynutcase]

17 hours ago, hugocnx said:

So do tell me. the virus hops on a vaccinated person and thinks...oops this person is vaccinated, better not get inside and let's hop over to that other person there and try my luck again.

The vaccinated are still spreaders and as dangerous to other people as the unvaccinated are.

So very true but those who are jabbed don't see it that way.

I find it interesting that as soonas a 'vaccine' roll-out occurs cases and infections rise.

 

Remember last year in Thailand?  The daily road death was greater than the TOTAL number of covid deaths.

[placeholder]

7 minutes ago, Nurseynutcase said:

So very true but those who are jabbed don't see it that way.

I find it interesting that as soonas a 'vaccine' roll-out occurs cases and infections rise.

 

Remember last year in Thailand?  The daily road death was greater than the TOTAL number of covid deaths.

This assertion is nonsensical. You got evidence that shows "cases and infections" rise at a faster rate among the vaccinated than among the unvaccinated? In fact the opposite is the case. Stop making things up.
 

[hugocnx]

14 hours ago, placeholder said:

"From end May to beginning July 2021 in England, where there has been a highly successful vaccination campaign with high vaccine uptake, infections were increasing exponentially driven by the Delta variant and high infection prevalence among younger, unvaccinated individuals despite double vaccination continuing to effectively reduce transmission. Although slower growth or declining prevalence may be observed during the summer in the northern hemisphere, increased mixing during the autumn in the presence of the Delta variant may lead to renewed growth, even at high levels of vaccination."

https://spiral.imperial.ac.uk/handle/10044/1/90800

 

"One massive analysis of Delta transmission comes from the UK REACT-1 programme, led by a team at Imperial College London, which tests more than 100,000 UK volunteers every few weeks. The team ran Ct analyses for samples received in May, June and July, when Delta was rapidly replacing other variants to become the dominant driver of COVID-19 in the country. The results suggested that among people testing positive, those who had been vaccinated had a lower viral load on average than did unvaccinated people."

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-02187-1

 

 

 

A lower viral load is still a viral load.

Concerning your link, I don't trust media nor science and the reasons why I don't need to tell you I guess.

[hugocnx]

21 minutes ago, Nurseynutcase said:

So very true but those who are jabbed don't see it that way.

I find it interesting that as soonas a 'vaccine' roll-out occurs cases and infections rise.

 

Remember last year in Thailand?  The daily road death was greater than the TOTAL number of covid deaths.

Don't forget the deaths from the experimental jab (now so called approved) of which you read nothing in the press. Alternative media speak of tens of thousands, excluding serious other problems.

[johng]

12 minutes ago, hugocnx said:

Don't forget the deaths from the experimental jab (now so called approved) of which you read nothing in the press.

I saw reports of 2 separate "incidents" on Thai TV news yesterday.

There where quite a few reported at the start of the Thai vaccine rollout  but most where later attributed to  "other causes"

[placeholder]

15 minutes ago, hugocnx said:

Don't forget the deaths from the experimental jab (now so called approved) of which you read nothing in the press. Alternative media speak of tens of thousands, excluding serious other problems.

Almost invariably this nonsense comes from those who believe the misleading reports about VAERS or similar systems.

21 minutes ago, hugocnx said:

A lower viral load is still a viral load.

Concerning your link, I don't trust media nor science and the reasons why I don't need to tell you I guess.

And a kilo is a kilo. But it isn't 2 kilos. You don't even need science to refute such nonsense. Just a basic grasp of arithmetic.

I don't care why. Ignorance is always finding excuses for itself.

[rbkk]

58 minutes ago, johng said:

I saw reports of 2 separate "incidents" on Thai TV news yesterday.

There where quite a few reported at the start of the Thai vaccine rollout  but most where later attributed to  "other causes"

That would be the "Whitewash" committee at work.

[Surasak]

11 hours ago, geisha said:

Well, if it was in EU , I live in France for example, everyone who works with the public, bars, restaurants, shops, bigger offices , etc etc must be vaccinated or present a negative PCR test every 72 hrs to their boss/ workplace. You also have a vaccination Pass, where your COVID vaccinations are noted with their dates, your name. This you show and your QR code is scanned before entering the establishment. It’s a government app. Paper copy can be used. It’s easy and rapid to do, hold up your phone/paper, they flash it. Personally I am reassured by this, and it doesn’t bother me in the least.

Where Thailand is concerned, I’m not sure that they are capable of organizing this . 

Exactly the point. However, they are more than capable of false promises.

[hugocnx]

2 hours ago, placeholder said:

Almost invariably this nonsense comes from those who believe the misleading reports about VAERS or similar systems.

And a kilo is a kilo. But it isn't 2 kilos. You don't even need science to refute such nonsense. Just a basic grasp of arithmetic.

I don't care why. Ignorance is always finding excuses for itself.

And arrogance never excuses itself. Stick that somewhere you like.

And I never mentioned VAERS; you think that is alternative media?

[placeholder]

2 hours ago, hugocnx said:

And arrogance never excuses itself. Stick that somewhere you like.

And I never mentioned VAERS; you think that is alternative media?

Well, thanks for confirming my guess that you do think citing the raw numbers from VAERS is a valid way to question the safety of vaccines.

[hioctane]

19 hours ago, placeholder said:

This assertion is nonsensical. You got evidence that shows "cases and infections" rise at a faster rate among the vaccinated than among the unvaccinated? In fact the opposite is the case. Stop making things up.
 

This is based on misleading stats out of Israel that doesn’t show the complete picture. Recently it was announced that 60% of the hospitalizations were vaccinated. They took this to mean that the vaccinated get infected more. If you look deeper at the numbers… 87% those vaccinated with breakthrough infections was over 60. It is expected because the elder and immuno compromised produce less antibodies and therefore more susceptible to infection. It also doesn’t take into account the vast majority of the vaccinated that got infected but didn’t need to be hospitalized. 

 

They continually ask, why get the vaccine if you can still get infected? It is to prevent hospitalization and death. Your body will already have the  antibodies to fight off the virus vs the unvaccinated who will have to fight off an unknown virus.

[placeholder]

4 minutes ago, hioctane said:

This is based on misleading stats out of Israel that doesn’t show the complete picture. Recently it was announced that 60% of the hospitalizations were vaccinated. They took this to mean that the vaccinated get infected more. If you look deeper at the numbers… 87% those vaccinated with breakthrough infections was over 60. It is expected because the elder and immuno compromised produce less antibodies and therefore more susceptible to infection. It also doesn’t take into account the vast majority of the vaccinated that got infected but didn’t need to be hospitalized. 

 

They continually ask, why get the vaccine if you can still get infected? It is to prevent hospitalization and death. Your body will already have the  antibodies to fight off the virus vs the unvaccinated who will have to fight off an unknown virus.

Well, but it's always the case that the elderly suffer disproportionately from Covid. But the thing is, they were vaccinated first. So now, with the passage of time, the effectiveness of the Pfizer vaccine is waning. But now they are being vaccinated with a 3rd dose. And reports show that their antibody levels have shot up. So they should be protected better again. In the future they probably will need another vaccination. Maybe next time with Moderna which seems to provide better and longer lasting protection than does Pfizer. Or AZ. Or one of the many new vaccines that will soon be on offer.

[hugocnx]

17 hours ago, placeholder said:

Well, thanks for confirming my guess that you do think citing the raw numbers from VAERS is a valid way to question the safety of vaccines.

Sorry, wrong.

[SheungWan]

On 8/30/2021 at 10:06 PM, Ryan754326 said:

If it were just another card in my wallet that I had to show when I crossed a border, it wouldn’t be so bad. Showing your passport when you enter a country is one thing, but would you choose to live in Thailand if you were required to show it every time you entered a restaurant? 

Having the mobile phones and apps involved makes it that much more off-putting. Yes, I know my phone is tracking me all the time, but I can still leave it on the dresser and go out for dinner. 

 

Nobody leaves their phone on the dresser when going out. It goes with you everywhere and at all times. Try some other excuse.

[SheungWan]

I look forward to when anti-vaxxers have to show evidence of vaccination for renewal of visa retirement extension. The discussion will end right there.

[Ryan754326]

11 hours ago, SheungWan said:

Nobody leaves their phone on the dresser when going out. It goes with you everywhere and at all times. Try some other excuse.

Speak for yourself. When I’m in Thailand, I have zero reason to carry a smart phone around with me - it stays at my room. 
My Thai SIM card goes into a $20 Nokia. That’s the phone that comes with me if I need one, and unless I’m leaving my neighborhood, it usually stays home too. 
 

[userabcd]

12 hours ago, SheungWan said:

Nobody leaves their phone on the dresser when going out. It goes with you everywhere and at all times. Try some other excuse.

Well I do leave it at home all the time and do it purposely, as I choose to do.

a) Because I do not want to lug that weight around in my pocket when out and about.

b) I do not want to be in immediate contact with anyone, they can wait until I call them back.

c) Do not want to be tracked everywhere I go.

d) Since when is it compulsory to own a smart phone and lug it around?

Edited September 2, 2021 by userabcd

[Uroller]

On 8/30/2021 at 10:35 AM, placeholder said:

Math challenged much?

COVID-19 vaccines work — misreading the data can make you think otherwise

Israel’s data shows that the COVID-19 vaccine works, but only if it’s analyzed correctly: the unfortunate story of the base rate fallacy...

When we re-analyze the same Aug. 25 data to account for the proper base rate (cases per 100,000 in the three vaccination groups), we see that the rate of severe cases in the unvaccinated group (266 per 100,000) and partially vaccinated (58 per 100,000) are much higher than in the fully vaccinated group (19 per 100,000).

 

https://thehill.com/opinion/healthcare/569730-covid-19-vaccines-work-misreading-the-data-can-make-you-think-otherwise

 

No need to shout????

[placeholder]

1 minute ago, Uroller said:

No need to shout????

You feeling a need to deflect?

[Heng]

I like the idea... if I was younger I'd help people visually display their vaccination status through fashion/tech... Maybe some kind of hologram verification app on your phone.   "I'm sorry, I only hookup with PZ+MDs.......yes, we allow food delivery from SVs but they have to walk through our UV light foyer first..." 

 

I've always wondered what living through something dystopian would be like.   

[Purdey]

On 8/30/2021 at 10:06 PM, Ryan754326 said:

Showing your passport when you enter a country is one thing, but would you choose to live in Thailand if you were required to show it every time you entered a restaurant? 

Just want to mention that according to Thai law, you have to carry your passport at all times. It is fine not to, and a fine if caught without it.