Combined use of AstraZeneca and Pfizer jabs starts in October in Thailand

[snoop1130]

(Photo by Lillian SUWANRUMPHA / AFP)

 

Thailand is tentatively set to extend its “mix and match” approach to COVID-19 mass vaccination in October, using the AstraZeneca viral vector vaccine as the first dose, followed by a dose of the Pfizer mRNA vaccine 4-12 weeks later. About 10 million doses of Pfizer-BioNTech are expected to arrive monthly, said Dr Sophon Iamsirithavorn, deputy director-general of the Disease Control Department today (Friday).

 

He said that the combination of AstraZeneca and Pfizer is the second such adaptation of inoculation regimens by the Thai health authorities, following the combined use of Sinovac and AstraZeneca, with doses given 3 to 4 weeks apart, which was recommended by the country’s committee of the Medical and Health Emergency Operations Centre on August 25th.

 

He maintained that the recommendation is based on data derived from new technologies and research conducted both abroad and in Thailand, including initial research papers on the safety and immune responses in the mixed use of Sinovac and AstraZeneca vaccines from the Siriraj Clinical Research Centre at Chulalongkorn University.

 

Full Story: https://www.thaipbsworld.com/combined-use-of-astrazeneca-and-pfizer-jabs-starts-in-october-in-thailand/

 

-- © Copyright Thai PBS 2021-09-03

 

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[ThailandRyan]

As I posted in another OP:

 

A true mixed cocktail then....Hey Doc I will take a jab of Sinovac, then jab me with that AZ stuff, and now for my booster only 8 weeks or maybe 16 weeks after my Sinovac shot give me that Pfizer jab. So 3 jabs in 4 months.

 

Has the body even built up the immunities in full by the time the booster is given?

Does anyone see an issue here, or is it just me.

[Emdog]

I'm slated to get second shot of AZ at BPH  October 22.... will they sub Pfizer or do AZ again? I wonder

[Gold Star]

Finally they are listening to the experts and the data, and are coming up with an acceptable combination. The delay caused by the Sinovac may be coming to an end.

[fondue zoo]

26 minutes ago, Gold Star said:

Finally they are listening to the experts and the data, and are coming up with an acceptable combination. The delay caused by the Sinovac may be coming to an end.

 

Which experts and what studies?

 

[Gold Star]

12 minutes ago, fondue zoo said:

 

Which experts and what studies?

 

Many. Google for more. Here's a few study summaries with links to get started:

https://www.healthline.com/health-news/heres-how-well-covid-19-vaccines-work-against-the-delta-variant#Vaccines-vs.-Delta-variant

[3NUMBAS]

overkill  ,its not needed one or the other is fine

[Airalee]

52 minutes ago, Gold Star said:

Many. Google for more. Here's a few study summaries with links to get started:

https://www.healthline.com/health-news/heres-how-well-covid-19-vaccines-work-against-the-delta-variant#Vaccines-vs.-Delta-variant

I don’t see anything in your linked article with regards to any studies regarding mixing different kinds of vaccines.  I myself would prefer just one.  Preferably (for my own personal reasons) the J&J.

[Gold Star]

11 minutes ago, Airalee said:

I don’t see anything in your linked article with regards to any studies regarding mixing different kinds of vaccines.  I myself would prefer just one.  Preferably (for my own personal reasons) the J&J.

As I mentioned, lots of information on the success of mixing AZ - Pfizer.

Hard to find any successful tests reported with Sinovac to Pfizer.

I would go with what is proven to work:

 

https://www.pharmaceutical-technology.com/features/covid-19-vaccine-mixing-astrazeneca-pfizer/

 

https://theconversation.com/covid-vaccines-combining-astrazeneca-and-pfizer-may-boost-immunity-new-study-163667

 

https://www.manchester.ac.uk/discover/news/covid-vaccines-combining-astrazeneca-and-pfizer-may-boost-immunity--new-study/

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-57636356

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-57636356

 

[Airalee]

4 minutes ago, Gold Star said:

As I mentioned, lots of information on the success of mixing AZ - Pfizer.

Hard to find any successful tests reported with Sinovac to Pfizer.

I would go with what is proven to work:

 

https://www.pharmaceutical-technology.com/features/covid-19-vaccine-mixing-astrazeneca-pfizer/

 

https://theconversation.com/covid-vaccines-combining-astrazeneca-and-pfizer-may-boost-immunity-new-study-163667

 

https://www.manchester.ac.uk/discover/news/covid-vaccines-combining-astrazeneca-and-pfizer-may-boost-immunity--new-study/

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-57636356

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-57636356

 

All those links are to the same preliminary study which is neither peer reviewed nor does it consider long term effects.  I’m not anti vaccine…but when it comes to mixing up a cocktail of different vaccines, I think I’ll sit this one out until time has proven the efficacy and safety of it.

[Gold Star]

1 minute ago, Airalee said:

All those links are to the same preliminary study which is neither peer reviewed nor does it consider long term effects.  I’m not anti vaccine…but when it comes to mixing up a cocktail of different vaccines, I think I’ll sit this one out until time has proven the efficacy and safety of it.

OK, suit yourself. If you have the time to wait for all the formalities to come in, while  being unvaccinated, that's fine.  From the results of all the testing so far done in a lot of places, you have a pretty good idea what works and what doesn't.

 

Some things they come up with are quite questionable like those that have gravitated to the horse parasite drug invermectin.

 

The mixed approach of AZ then Pfizer is being done by many countries already.

 

For me, I have Pfizer first and soon Pfizer second, however, I'll boost it with Moderna, which is interchangeable with Pfizer.

[Bkk Brian]

Well its certainly a better combination than Sinovac as first shot then AZ as second.

 

A 2 shot regime of AZ or 2 shots of Pfizer is fine by me, not sure exactly why you would want to mix it up, there maybe a small benefit to having the Pfizer as second dose but I've also read in a study that vaccine waning with AZ is not as rapid as it is with Pfizer. 

 

Anyway its not for me as I'll have my second dose of AZ in a couple of weeks, I'm happy with that for the moment.

[Airalee]

30 minutes ago, Gold Star said:

OK, suit yourself. If you have the time to wait for all the formalities to come in, while  being unvaccinated, that's fine.  From the results of all the testing so far done in a lot of places, you have a pretty good idea what works and what doesn't.

I do have the time to wait.  I’m ok with that.  And seeing as the science changes so frequently, I (nor anybody else) don’t have a “pretty good idea what works and what doesn’t.  We have already seen that what was thought to have high efficacy levels actually doesn’t.  Time will tell if the mix and match method is better or perhaps even some tweaks to the original vaccines are in the future.

 

33 minutes ago, Gold Star said:

Some things they come up with are quite questionable like those that have gravitated to the horse parasite drug invermectin.

 

I’m not sure why everybody seems to feel the need to say “horse parasite drug” when referring to ivermectin.  Many drugs are used for both animals and humans.  I’m pretty sure that the doctor who just prescribed me some ivermectin as a “just in case you come in contact with someone diagnosed with Covid” prophylactic, didn’t order it from an equine supply store.  If a well respected pulmonologist feels that it’s ok to use then why not?  Trotting (pun intended) the “horse medicine” line doesn’t bolster your argument nor make anything else you say sound more convincing….especially when I hadn’t even mentioned Ivermectin.  But you just had to get that in there?

 

39 minutes ago, Gold Star said:

For me, I have Pfizer first and soon Pfizer second, however, I'll boost it with Moderna, which is interchangeable with Pfizer.

Up to you.  Your body, your choice.  I hope all goes well for you.

[Airalee]

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/09/03/us/coronavirus-booster-shots.html?smid=tw-share

 

“WASHINGTON — Top federal health officials have told the White House to scale back a plan to offer coronavirus booster shots to the general public later this month, saying that regulators need more time to collect and review all the necessary data, according to people familiar with the discussion.

Dr. Janet Woodcock, the acting commissioner of the Food and Drug Administration, and Dr. Rochelle P. Walensky, who heads the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, warned the White House on Thursday that their agencies may be able to determine in the coming weeks whether to recommend boosters only for recipients of the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine — and possibly just some of them to start.”

[Chris.B]

Where is it going to start? Who is going to get it?

 

 

[chessman]

This is already happening. At my vaccination appointment this week I was offered AZ or Phizer. When I had the first dose 3 months ago I was offered Sinovac or AZ.

[rbkk]

1 hour ago, Bkk Brian said:

Well its certainly a better combination than Sinovac as first shot then AZ as second.

 

A 2 shot regime of AZ or 2 shots of Pfizer is fine by me, not sure exactly why you would want to mix it up, there maybe a small benefit to having the Pfizer as second dose but I've also read in a study that vaccine waning with AZ is not as rapid as it is with Pfizer. 

 

Anyway its not for me as I'll have my second dose of AZ in a couple of weeks, I'm happy with that for the moment.

Large  benefit = 6x antibodies, as a mix in that order compared with 2 doses of AZ.

https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/mixed-astrazeneca-pfizer-shot-boosts-covid-antibody-level-study-2021-07-26/

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-57636356

[rbkk]

20 minutes ago, chessman said:

This is already happening. At my vaccination appointment this week I was offered AZ or Phizer. When I had the first dose 3 months ago I was offered Sinovac or AZ.

The Pfizer postcode lottery! Some areas have it and some don't. Last Monday at my 2nd appt I got AZ but I would have prefered the Pfizer, it wasn't available. Not complaining. Next question; what's the best booster after having had 2 doses of AZ?

[Bkk Brian]

10 minutes ago, rbkk said:

Large  benefit = 6x antibodies, as a mix in that order compared with 2 doses of AZ.

https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/mixed-astrazeneca-pfizer-shot-boosts-covid-antibody-level-study-2021-07-26/

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-57636356

Yea I've not researched it much but obviously a benefit. However there is also another study that says 2 shots AZ after a period of a few months then actualy retains a higher antibody level than 2 shots of Pfizer. No link for that as I'm on my phone.

 

Angela Merkel went for AZ then Moderna, even better perhaps? 

 

To be honest its all a step up from Sinovac used as a dose so thats a bonus.

Edited September 3, 2021 by Bkk Brian

[Srjs]

I had an AstraZeneca shot on July 23, 2021.  I am scheduled to get a second AstraZeneca shot on October 15, 2021.  Since I am booked to have AstraZeneca, am I ineligible to get Pfizer as a second shot?  The prime minister of Canada and chancellor of Germany both had AstraZeneca first shots followed by mRNA seconds shots of vaccine.  I assume they had good medical advice to mix the vaccines after getting the first AstraZeneca shot.  Anyone have any idea who I can contact to see if having a first AstraZeneca prior to October precludes you from get a Pfizer second shot.  I will reach out to Bumrungrad Hospital, where I got my first shot, to see if I can get the Pfizer as a second shot.  Twice they have advised me I am ineligible for Pfizer second shot and must take AstraZeneca.  I hope this new news on mixing AZ and Pfizer will allow them to give me the Pfizer as a second shot.  My research on the internet leads me to believe that the mixing of vaccines gives a superior protection over two doses of AstraZeneca.  I have another 6 weeks to see if there are any more studies on the AZ and Pfizer mixing of vaccines and their benefits and downsides.

[lujanit]

Australia will not administer Pfizer to 60+ years old people.  There was an article in the OZ news yesterday saying the PM says this cohort of people will die if they are waiting for a Pfizer shot so get AZ.

[steve187]

9 hours ago, Emdog said:

I'm slated to get second shot of AZ at BPH  October 22.... will they sub Pfizer or do AZ again? I wonder

i was think that for my 2nd jab of AZ due at phyathai2 on the 13th oct

 

3 hours ago, Srjs said:

I had an AstraZeneca shot on July 23, 2021.  I am scheduled to get a second AstraZeneca shot on October 15, 2021.  Since I am booked to have AstraZeneca, am I ineligible to get Pfizer as a second shot?  The prime minister of Canada and chancellor of Germany both had AstraZeneca first shots followed by mRNA seconds shots of vaccine.  I assume they had good medical advice to mix the vaccines after getting the first AstraZeneca shot.  Anyone have any idea who I can contact to see if having a first AstraZeneca prior to October precludes you from get a Pfizer second shot.  I will reach out to Bumrungrad Hospital, where I got my first shot, to see if I can get the Pfizer as a second shot.  Twice they have advised me I am ineligible for Pfizer second shot and must take AstraZeneca.  I hope this new news on mixing AZ and Pfizer will allow them to give me the Pfizer as a second shot.  My research on the internet leads me to believe that the mixing of vaccines gives a superior protection over two doses of AstraZeneca.  I have another 6 weeks to see if there are any more studies on the AZ and Pfizer mixing of vaccines and their benefits and downsides.

get pfizer or moderna as a booster next year if all else fails

[Gottfrid]

10 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

Does anyone see an issue here, or is it just me.

You do not walk alone! Reacted on this already the first time I read about mix-and-match. It takes years to perfect a vaccine, and they are made to work with one or two doses of the same vaccine. 

[sungod]

10 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

As I posted in another OP:

 

A true mixed cocktail then....Hey Doc I will take a jab of Sinovac, then jab me with that AZ stuff, and now for my booster only 8 weeks or maybe 16 weeks after my Sinovac shot give me that Pfizer jab. So 3 jabs in 4 months.

 

Has the body even built up the immunities in full by the time the booster is given?

Does anyone see an issue here, or is it just me.

'Using the AstraZeneca viral vector vaccine as the first dose, followed by a dose of the Pfizer mRNA vaccine 4-12 weeks later.'

 

This does not seem to be for those who had sinovac, the way forward on that is if you had 2 jabs of that then you will get a AZ or Pfizer booster. Not seen the mixing of 3 vaccines mentioned anywhere apart from on here, I may have missed it though.

[hotchilli]

10 hours ago, fondue zoo said:

 

Which experts and what studies?

 

Thailand has thousands of experts and studies.

But cannot create a home grown recipe.

[hotchilli]

8 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

Well its certainly a better combination than Sinovac as first shot then AZ as second.

 

A 2 shot regime of AZ or 2 shots of Pfizer is fine by me, not sure exactly why you would want to mix it up, there maybe a small benefit to having the Pfizer as second dose but I've also read in a study that vaccine waning with AZ is not as rapid as it is with Pfizer. 

 

Anyway its not for me as I'll have my second dose of AZ in a couple of weeks, I'm happy with that for the moment.

Same for me, Ill get my 2nd AZ next month.... no mixing for me thanks

[lightsidecat]

7 hours ago, chessman said:

This is already happening. At my vaccination appointment this week I was offered AZ or Phizer. When I had the first dose 3 months ago I was offered Sinovac or AZ.

Wondering what hospital.  I'm do up for my 2nd AZ at Phyathai 2 in two weeks and would like the Pfizer 2nd jab option but can live with the AZ. 

[crazykopite]

No Thanks when I go for my 2 nd jab on 1 October it’s AZ or nothing I refuse to be an experimental human for an untested mix and match vaccine 

[koratkarlos]

In my humble opinion the mix of Astra Zeneca and mRNA will work and be safe.  But the truth here is that these decisions are not based on science, they are based on the available vaccine supply.  So any reference to good science while may be true is just cover for the fact that SB does not make enough AZ, they did not order enough AZ, they did not order enough mRNA vaccine and that Sinovac although somewhat helpful is not as good as the other widely used vaccines.  I truly wish they would stop trying to reinvent this vaccination plan and stick to what has proven to work in other countries.

[mtls2005]

So AZ supplies are limited.

 

Don't ask why.