Solar panel advice & experiences

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, mistral53 said:

You are obviously not installing your system in Thailand (there are no refunds and tax credits in Thailand for residential installations) so the experiences of Thai installations are not of much help.

 

In my personal opinion, a 14.5 year payback is pushing it. In case your system includes batteries, you might never get a payback because batteries don't last 15 years. Furthermore, why would you want to use 15 year old technology to make money - this industry is moving so fast, I would not be surprised in 15 years your system is half the cost of what it is today, so you will probably replace most of it.

 

Bottom line - don't do it.

 

PS: I fully expect my 12 Kw solar system to pay for itself in 4.5 years (based on real yields)

In Australia where around 50+% of houses have solar installed there's regular short TV interviews with respected folks from this industry. And many packages available, have to follow gov't mandated specs, with fast professional installation.

 

Many positive comments about totally new battery: design, quality, lighter weight, increased length of life, costs.  (And shared battery concepts - 3 or 4 or more houses all sharing one 'community' battery). 

 

And the comments often mention that all of these points will continue to bring more new designs/benefits into the future. China companies in solar seem seems to be the preferred players.

[BritManToo]

43 minutes ago, 007 RED said:

My small scale system comprises of 4 x 415 mono half-cut panels plus a 2kW GTI.  Total cost DIY installation = 28,000 THB.  Therefore, 28K / 12K = ROI 2.33 Years.

You'll be lucky to get that much back, 5-6 units a day max = around 8,000bht year ROI.

(Unless your 1660W of panels produces a lot more than my 1670W of panels)

= Payback in 4 years.

If you want to reduce your payback time, add another 2 panels to your system.

 

2021 I generated 1,939 units @4.2bht/unit = 8143bht

Edited January 1, 2022 by BritManToo

[007 RED]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

You'll be lucky to get that much back, 5-6 units a day max = around 8,000bht year ROI.

(Unless your 1660W of panels produces a lot more than my 1670W of panels)

= Payback in 4 years.

If you want to reduce your payback time, add another 2 panels to your system.

 

2021 I generated 1,939 units @4.2bht/unit = 8143bht

As mentioned in my previous post, I specifically designed the system to reduce my annual electric bill by 75% (from 12K down to 3K/annum).  To achieve this I aimed at the system producing 7 units/day or 2555 units/annum, which @ 4.2 THB/unit should = 10,731 THB/annum.  These figures are of course under 'ideal' conditions e.g. good sunshine for approximately 6 hours/day.  I know that we are living in a real world, hence I anticipate my ROI being nearer 3.1 years.

 

Last month (Dec) my system produced a total of 202 units as shown by the chart below.  202 units/month equates to 6.5 units/ day which is slightly below my aim of 7 units/day.  You will notice that on 14th and 15th the production was only about 3 units/day.  This was because the system was switched to 'NO EXPORT' because of meter reader's visit.  You will also notice that on several occasions the system was producing 8 plus units/day.

 

 

FYI.....  As at 15.00hrs today my system had produced 7.4 units as shown in the chart below, and may well hit 8 before sundown.

 

 

So yes, my 4 x 415W panel system seem to be producing a bit more than your system.

Edited January 1, 2022 by 007 RED
Typo

[MJCM]

Can I hire you guys to install our System?

[Tropposurfer]

My installing (having a system engineered for us) had one focus in mind; not using coal or hydro energy and installing system's (I have two wind turbines as well) that are as clean and renewable as possible. Having the resources to get a primo fully engineered system installed (I have a buddy who's an electrical engineer and he drew up the entire system specs/plans for us).

The benefits of not having any inconvenience from blackouts and brownouts from a patchy mains system is a wonderful benefit and one which I also wanted but it was the former that motivated me. 

[JBChiangRai]

5 hours ago, CygnusX1 said:

Mate of mine in Australia with rooftop solar reckons he often gets less from his feed-in tariff on bright sunny days than on cloudy days. He says reason is that there’s so much rooftop solar in his suburb that the grid can’t handle the amount of power produced on sunny days, and his inverter is automatically switched off. 

If you’re going grid-tied and exporting to the grid, sometimes it pays to get inverters where you can get to the settings.  Mine have had their voltage limits tweaked upwards so that (a) they are the last ones to switch off and (b) they are cadenced in 2volt increments so they don’t all go off at once.

 

My ROI is about 5 years with batteries.

[essex boys]

Hi gents, some very interesting stuff on here, I’m looking into a solar powered system that is enough to run household interior and exterior lighting and possibly AC units, I always think with the amount of sunshine in Thailand that solar power is the way to go just got to read up about it now and then probably come back here for advice on what’s the best kit to buy

[MJCM]

41 minutes ago, essex boys said:

Hi gents, some very interesting stuff on here, I’m looking into a solar powered system that is enough to run household interior and exterior lighting and possibly AC units, I always think with the amount of sunshine in Thailand that solar power is the way to go just got to read up about it now and then probably come back here for advice on what’s the best kit to buy

For Exterior Lighting you can buy the Solar Lights that switch on when it gets dark and off when it gets light!

 

https://www.lazada.co.th/products/jd-solar-lights-45w-90-smd-3-jd-8845-solar-cell-i698216795-s5409386874.html

 

We have these.

 

Re: Running AC (need some more info)

 

Do you want to run them at night as well? How big are your AC Units?? How many?

 

Another question, what is your quest?

 

1. Be independent (so NO outside Electric)
2. Reduce your Electric Bill
3. ....?

Final question, what do you think you want to spend on this Solar system approximately? 

Edited January 1, 2022 by MJCM
Changed link to actual shop where we bought the Solar lights from

[Crossy]

This ^^^

 

28 minutes ago, MJCM said:

Final question, what do you think you want to spend on this Solar system approximately? 

 

Probably the most important question.

[BritManToo]

Managed to find 2 XINJING 330W solar panels on shopee for 6,200bht delivered.

Not so bad and match 3 of my existing panels.

 

I'm gonna try 330W x 5 on my 1000W GTI, the existing 330W x 3 never beat 500W so hopefully no bang.

Edited January 1, 2022 by BritManToo

[MJCM]

13 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Managed to find 2 XINJING 330W solar panels on shopee for 6,200bht delivered.

Not so bad and match 3 of my existing panels.

 

I'm gonna try 330W x 5 on my 1000W GTI, the existing 330W x 3 never beat 500W so hopefully no bang.

Useful info and good to know, but may I ask what to look for in the specs of panels so they match the ones you have? (different brands that is)

 

[Crossy]

In reality, Madam doesn't know just how much we've spent. She knows how much the panels cost as she was with me when collected them, she doesn't really know what the inverters and batteries cost.

 

She does know how much (little) our power bill is (because I tell her).

 

I'd like to keep it that way

 

[BritManToo]

23 minutes ago, MJCM said:

Useful info and good to know, but may I ask what to look for in the specs of panels so they match the ones you have? (different brands that is)

 

Allegedly operating Voltage is the number to look for if connecting in parallel.

And operating Current is the number to look for if connection in series.

Apparently ALL in the string will work at the lesser value.

@Crossy has mixed a few together. 

Edited January 1, 2022 by BritManToo

[xtrnuno41]

WHat do you want to buy? You got an estimate of $32k, for what, where?

How many panels, output, mono or poly, thin film ?

What kind of inverter? Included with batteries, if so what kind , how big?

For that amount of money you have a real big house to cover. Or there are special batteries included?

[sandyf]

11 hours ago, easydoor said:

In Thailand, with the prices of electricity, and I speak as professional engineer, it will be very hard to make benefit with solar panels. 

For a professional engineer you have a narrow minded view of benefit, it is not always about money.

[scorecard]

Seems to be difficult to find sparkies (in business) who are highly knowledgeable, qualified and experienced re solar.

 

I'm hoping that some of our online members who have acquired high levels of knowledge and deep experience and insight might branch out and provide (paid) advisory to members who want to start solar but are (like me and family) lost as to what we really need and how get started. 

 

Perhaps just by phone call or a once only home visit.

 

comments appreciated. 

[BritManToo]

16 minutes ago, scorecard said:

Seems to be difficult to find sparkies (in business) who are highly knowledgeable, qualified and experienced re solar.

 

I'm hoping that some of our online members who have acquired high levels of knowledge and deep experience and insight might branch out and provide (paid) advisory to members who want to start solar but are (like me and family) lost as to what we really need and how get started. 

 

Perhaps just by phone call or a once only home visit.

That would be me, but .........

1. I'm not allowed to work in Thailand.

2. If I were allowed to work you probably couldn't afford me.

 

Currently generating 750W from my 1600W of panels, which is about as good as they get.

Edited January 2, 2022 by BritManToo

[Crossy]

The best we've had from our 10kWP array is 8.3kW at the meter, that day also produced 41.7kWh. But that was a stand-out day.

 

 

Currently (12:30 on 02 Jan 2022) we are banging 2.7kW into the batteries with the remainder being 2.9kW so the total is a more common 5.6kW.

 

[Bob12345]

On 1/1/2022 at 1:21 PM, 007 RED said:

Yes, the panels will require cleaning every so often, depending upon how dirty they become.  Lets say in the worse case scenario they need cleaning once a month.   A bucket of water and a soft brush plus 15 minutes of time at 50 THB/hour will give a grand cost of say 30 THB /month or 360 THB /year.  Not really going to break the bank.

For most it will not be the risk of breaking the bank, but the risk of breaking their neck climbing on the roof of the house at age 60+. It is something to keep in mind when deciding where to install the panels as you do need to be able to reach them for cleaning.

[MJCM]

Just now, Bob12345 said:

For most it will not be the risk of breaking the bank, but the risk of breaking their neck climbing on the roof of the house at age 60+. It is something to keep in mind when deciding where to install the panels as you do need to be able to reach them for cleaning.

2 options for that.

 

1- place them on the ground on a stand! (if you have the room for them that's it)

2- Ask the BIL (or any Thai) to go upon the roof and clean them. For a Bottle or 2 of Leo he would gladly do it.

[007 RED]

43 minutes ago, Bob12345 said:

For most it will not be the risk of breaking the bank, but the risk of breaking their neck climbing on the roof of the house at age 60+. It is something to keep in mind when deciding where to install the panels as you do need to be able to reach them for cleaning.

 

Each time I go up onto the car port roof I've noticed that my better half digs out the telephone number of my life insurance provider.  I think she's trying to tell me something.

 

40 minutes ago, MJCM said:

2 options for that.

 

1- place them on the ground on a stand! (if you have the room for them that's it)

2- Ask the BIL (or any Thai) to go upon the roof and clean them. For a Bottle or 2 of Leo he would gladly do it.

Option 3..... get one of these 

 

 

Definitely a potential future project for @Crossy

[BritManToo]

I'm considering this as my next upgrade.

5k5W hybrid inverter(normal +wifi) for 14Kbht delivered.

https://shopee.co.th/อินเวอร์เตอร์ไฮบริดนอกกริด-5.5KW-MPPT-48V-Inverter-off-grid-hybrid-สามารถทำงานได้โดยไม่ต้องใช้แบตเตอรี่-รองรับ-WIFI-i.428988356.12724725647

 

10x 330w XinJing panels for 31K1bht delivered.

https://shopee.co.th/แผงโซล่าเซลล์-XINJING-POLY-330W-วัตต์-37.70V-Solar-Cell-Panel-Polycrystalline-i.182095584.13655824843

 

12KWhr of battery another 50Kbht

https://www.lazada.co.th/products/nmc-catl-48v-232ah-12kw-smart-bms-active-jikong-150a-i2937766522-s10775080147.html?&search=pdp_same_topselling

 

(maybe I should save on the batteries and get 7KWhr for 29Kbht)

https://www.lazada.co.th/products/nmc-48v-132ah-14s-683kw-i2646833087-s9512437008.html

 

So around 95Kbht (or 74Kbht with the smaller battery) for the lot, plus some wire and breakers, which would just about take me off grid.

@10 units a day, ROI would be 15kbht/year ........ so 6 years to get my money back (if nothing breaks) ...... 5 years with the smaller battery.

 

Edited January 2, 2022 by BritManToo

[Muhendis]

1 hour ago, MJCM said:

2 options for that.

 

1- place them on the ground on a stand! (if you have the room for them that's it)

2- Ask the BIL (or any Thai) to go upon the roof and clean them. For a Bottle or 2 of Leo he would gladly do it.

3- Mount them on your flat car port roof with walking space between rows.

4- Buy a cherry picker. 

[MJCM]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

I'm considering this as my next upgrade.

5k5W hybrid inverter(normal +wifi) for 14Kbht delivered.

https://shopee.co.th/อินเวอร์เตอร์ไฮบริดนอกกริด-5.5KW-MPPT-48V-Inverter-off-grid-hybrid-สามารถทำงานได้โดยไม่ต้องใช้แบตเตอรี่-รองรับ-WIFI-i.428988356.12724725647

 

10x 330w XinJing panels for 31K1bht delivered.

https://shopee.co.th/แผงโซล่าเซลล์-XINJING-POLY-330W-วัตต์-37.70V-Solar-Cell-Panel-Polycrystalline-i.182095584.13655824843

 

12KWhr of battery another 50Kbht

https://www.lazada.co.th/products/nmc-catl-48v-232ah-12kw-smart-bms-active-jikong-150a-i2937766522-s10775080147.html?&search=pdp_same_topselling

 

(maybe I should save on the batteries and get 7KWhr for 29Kbht)

https://www.lazada.co.th/products/nmc-48v-132ah-14s-683kw-i2646833087-s9512437008.html

 

So around 95Kbht (or 74Kbht with the smaller battery) for the lot, plus some wire and breakers, which would just about take me off grid.

@10 units a day, ROI would be 15kbht/year ........ so 6 years to get my money back (if nothing breaks) ...... 5 years with the smaller battery.

 

Thx for the shopping list ????

 

But my issue would be how to hook this up to the house supply!

 

I could buy 1 inverter 1 solar panel 1 small battery and try to hook it up and if it starts giving black smoke so be it and if not then ???? but even in that case (when it works) hooking it up to the house supply would be a an absolute NO GO for me!

 

I am honestly impressed with you guys who do it yourself and I take my hat off to you!!

 

[Muhendis]

5 minutes ago, MJCM said:

But my issue would be how to hook this up to the house supply!

In that case we should add this to the shopping list:

https://shopee.co.th/ATS-Automatic-Dual-Power-Transfer-Switch-2P-63A-สวิตซ์สลับแหล่งจ่ายไฟ-อัตโนมัติ-ระบบไฟฟ้าสำรอง-i.513934377.15010588499?sp_atk=d678ecb7-b254-4ffa-bb31-1e0ca9c352d2

[MJCM]

19 minutes ago, Muhendis said:

In that case we should add this to the shopping list:

https://shopee.co.th/ATS-Automatic-Dual-Power-Transfer-Switch-2P-63A-สวิตซ์สลับแหล่งจ่ายไฟ-อัตโนมัติ-ระบบไฟฟ้าสำรอง-i.513934377.15010588499?sp_atk=d678ecb7-b254-4ffa-bb31-1e0ca9c352d2

Thx, but even then I am absolutely NOT messing with our Fuse Box

 

(I would get this -> ???? from SWMBO if she can't water her precious plants!! ???? because I ... something up! (and she would be right in doing so)!

Edited January 2, 2022 by MJCM

[mistral53]

8 hours ago, scorecard said:

Seems to be difficult to find sparkies (in business) who are highly knowledgeable, qualified and experienced re solar.

 

I'm hoping that some of our online members who have acquired high levels of knowledge and deep experience and insight might branch out and provide (paid) advisory to members who want to start solar but are (like me and family) lost as to what we really need and how get started. 

 

Perhaps just by phone call or a once only home visit.

 

comments appreciated. 

That's the holy grail to a successful installation, but be wary, most installations differ too much to be copied or even of much guidance. Look up a guy with handle 'Bandersnatch' on here - he has done a very interesting installation and is certainly a recommended source of viable expertise.

His YT channel:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCnfsllbydHUBMwAGPbtGc2A

Edited January 2, 2022 by mistral53
added link

[DTL2014]

just installed 20kw system.the 455w panels come in at the best bang for buck.. 500k for installation 3.5-4 years pay back

[BritManToo]

5 hours ago, DTL2014 said:

just installed 20kw system.the 455w panels come in at the best bang for buck.. 500k for installation 3.5-4 years pay back

60 units/day = 2000 units/month = 8000bht/month = 62 months for payback.

That 5 years+ by my counting.

Edited January 9, 2022 by BritManToo

[MJCM]

55 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

60 units/day = 2000 units/month = 8000bht/month = 62 months for payback.

That 5 years+ by my counting.

I agree, but the prices you used don't not include Tax etc

 

On the PEA site: https://eservice.pea.co.th/EstimateBill/#

 

For 2000 Units, it gives a total charge of 9261,55 THB (and that price is even excluding the FT charge of 0.0139 THB per unit (which will be added since this month (no more Negative Ft charge)

 

Even without the added FT Charge it would be 500.000 / 9261,55 THB  = 53,98 / 12 = 4,49 Years! ????

 

 

Ft_JAN_APR_2022.pdf

Edited January 9, 2022 by MJCM