Assault on Kiev: Russian helicopters swoop above Ukraine's capital

[thaibeachlovers]

2 hours ago, LosLobo said:

Where did you get that idea?

And to be likewise pedantic and obtrusive.!

The converse can also be true.

A white flag can very well mean a "surrender"

When it is used for a truce, a white flag does not always mean just a truce in and of itself.

Please try not to lessen or confuse Ukraine's obvious success.

 

I believe I mentioned that it can be used when surrendering, but is not in and of itself a symbol of surrender. For that, holding hands in the air is appropriate.

[Bkk Brian]

8 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I have no idea of what you are talking about.

Your post, first page of this OP

"I doubt this thread will survive long though, given it can only become political."

 

Its hardly surprising you have no idea what people are talking about here

[Rimmer]

Some bickering posts removed

[Rimmer]

Ukraine war: Accounts of Russian torture emerge in liberated areas

 

In north-eastern Ukraine, a counter-offensive has seen the nation's forces recapture swathes of territory, and drive out Russian troops.

But in the newly-liberated areas, relief and sorrow are intertwined - as accounts emerge of torture and killings during the long months of Russian occupation.

Artem, who lives in the city of Balakliya in the Kharkiv region told the BBC he was held by Russians for more than 40 days, and was tortured with electrocution.

Read more:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-62888388

[Mavideol]

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I believe I mentioned that it can be used when surrendering, but is not in and of itself a symbol of surrender. For that, holding hands in the air is appropriate.

many many ways of peeling a rabbit but the easy and logical way would have been to follow the link and read the full post.... but at the start/first page of this topic you already made it clear enough where you would stand, with all links/posts depicting Russian's failures not one time, not once did you posted any positive emojis/feed back about the topic, if you don't like it just don't follow it simple as 1,2 and 3

Edited September 14, 2022 by Mavideol

[rudi49jr]

1 hour ago, Rimmer said:

 

In north-eastern Ukraine, a counter-offensive has seen the nation's forces recapture swathes of territory, and drive out Russian troops.

But in the newly-liberated areas, relief and sorrow are intertwined - as accounts emerge of torture and killings during the long months of Russian occupation.

Artem, who lives in the city of Balakliya in the Kharkiv region told the BBC he was held by Russians for more than 40 days, and was tortured with electrocution.

Read more:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-62888388

I read the same stories, of Russians torturing people with electricity, people being kidnapped/deported, people being summarily executed, women and children getting raped, Russians stealing everything they could lay their hands on before fleeing. Absolutely horrible and appalling.
Seems to me that this is not just random stuff, this is either orders coming from higher up, or the Russian army has a serious problem with discipline. Or maybe both.

[Rimmer]

Russia Has Begun Using Iranian Kamikaze Drones On Ukraine

 

Ukrainian officials are claiming the destruction of the first example of an Iran-supplied drone used by Russia in the war in Ukraine. The assertion is backed up by photos showing the apparent remains of what looks very much like an Iranian Shahed-136 loitering munition, or ‘suicide’ drone, reportedly found in eastern Ukraine. This appears to confirm that Iranian-made drones have not only been delivered to Russia but are now being employed in combat, including in strike missions.

 

According to a statement on the Armed Forces of Ukraine’s Strategic Communications Telegram channel, the drone in question is a “Shahed-136 long-range kamikaze UAV,” which is said to have been destroyed by Ukrainian air defenses near Kupyansk, in the eastern Kharkiv region.

 

Read more

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/russia-has-begun-using-iranian-kamikaze-drones-on-ukraine

 

 

 

[rudi49jr]

 

[Bkk Brian]

24 minutes ago, rudi49jr said:

I read the same stories, of Russians torturing people with electricity, people being kidnapped/deported, people being summarily executed, women and children getting raped, Russians stealing everything they could lay their hands on before fleeing. Absolutely horrible and appalling.
Seems to me that this is not just random stuff, this is either orders coming from higher up, or the Russian army has a serious problem with discipline. Or maybe both.

Thats one of the aspects of these events that unfolds some of the realities of what its like under Russian occupation. I have to say it can be a little heartbreaking to see all the videos of the residents greeting the Ukraine soldiers with open arms having had their towns, villages and settlements liberated. What a nightmare it must have been for them, their own homes and land under the control of another unwanted country, life as you know it suddenly gone and a new dark era of misery. So happy for them its now over but so much more to do to free all of Ukraine.

[Bkk Brian]

6 hours ago, LosLobo said:

The reality bites...

 

 

Now also available on youtube

 

 

 

[rudi49jr]

37 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

I have to say it can be a little heartbreaking to see all the videos of the residents greeting the Ukraine soldiers with open arms having had their towns, villages and settlements liberated.

Indeed. I was born not long after WWII, and I had plenty of relatives who were there when the allied forces liberated The Netherlands, and I heard plenty of stories from them how they welcomed the (mostly Canadian and English) soldiers and they partied for days, knowing that their ordeal was over, after being occupied for five years by the Germans, who became increasingly more brutal and repressive as the war dragged on.
Fortunately the Ukrainians in Charkiv Oblast didn’t have to wait that long, but I can very well imagine how immensely glad and relieved they must have felt when their towns and villages were liberated from Russian occupation by the Ukrainian army. I hope they can keep up their momentum and keep pushing the Russians back further and further.

[Mavideol]

2 hours ago, Rimmer said:

Russia Has Begun Using Iranian Kamikaze Drones On Ukraine

 

Ukrainian officials are claiming the destruction of the first example of an Iran-supplied drone used by Russia in the war in Ukraine. The assertion is backed up by photos showing the apparent remains of what looks very much like an Iranian Shahed-136 loitering munition, or ‘suicide’ drone, reportedly found in eastern Ukraine. This appears to confirm that Iranian-made drones have not only been delivered to Russia but are now being employed in combat, including in strike missions.

 

According to a statement on the Armed Forces of Ukraine’s Strategic Communications Telegram channel, the drone in question is a “Shahed-136 long-range kamikaze UAV,” which is said to have been destroyed by Ukrainian air defenses near Kupyansk, in the eastern Kharkiv region.

 

Read more

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/russia-has-begun-using-iranian-kamikaze-drones-on-ukraine

 

 

 

great news  and has been reported by other outlets as well, it shows how reliable Iranian stuff is maybe made with China parts, now let's wait for the stuff from North Korea to start falling as well 555

Russia-Ukraine updates: Ukraine shoots down Iran-made drone used by Russia

The UK has confirmed that Ukraine likely downed an Iranian-made war drone.

https://www.dw.com/en/russia-ukraine-updates-ukraine-shoots-down-iran-made-drone-used-by-russia/a-63112897

[Hellfire]

 Russia buying “modern” weaponry from Iran and North Korea. This, in itself, fully symbolizes what a joke Putin’s Russia has become in the recent decade or two. They don’t have (and never had) any chances against the free people of Ukraine. 
 

 

Edited September 14, 2022 by Hellfire

[rudi49jr]

Even more proof (not that we need more proof by now) of Russian army’s depravity.

 

[Bkk Brian]

More proof this was never about NATO

 

Exclusive: As war began, Putin rejected a Ukraine peace deal recommended by aide

PARIS, Sept 14 (Reuters) - Vladimir Putin's chief envoy on Ukraine told the Russian leader as the war began that he had struck a provisional deal with Kyiv that would satisfy Russia's demand that Ukraine stay out of NATO, but Putin rejected it and pressed ahead with his military campaign, according to three people close to the Russian leadership.

But, despite earlier backing the negotiations, Putin made it clear when presented with Kozak's deal that the concessions negotiated by his aide did not go far enough and that he had expanded his objectives to include annexing swathes of Ukrainian territory, the sources said. 

https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/exclusive-war-began-putin-rejected-ukraine-peace-deal-recommended-by-his-aide-2022-09-14/

 

UN secretary-general: "We are far away from the end of the war" after call with Putin

UN Secretary-General António Guterres said Wednesday he feels a peace deal to end the war in Ukraine isn't close.

“We are far away from the end of the war," he told reporters following a call Wednesday with Russian President Vladimir Putin.

"A ceasefire is not in sight,” he said, adding, "I would be lying if I said it would happen.”

https://edition.cnn.com/europe/live-news/russia-ukraine-war-news-09-14-22/h_edfda4a983ff7e4702265fe333a2a221

 

[rudi49jr]

And another one bites the dust, they’re dropping like flies. Apparently, over the last six months or so, it’s been very unhealthy for some people to belong to Putin’s inner circle:

 

https://www.newsweek.com/vladimir-sungorkin-dead-death-putin-ally-komsomolskaya-pravda-1742913

[PPGuy]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOTx0aLabVg

 

This is an interview conducted by Tim Sebastian for DW. it is with Andrei Kolesnikov who is based in Moscow and has very forthright views on Putin and the war. How long he remains at liberty to express such views remains to be seen. He finishes with a rather chilling conclusion that, win or lose, Putin will remain dangerous, but defeat may make him more dangerous because he has a nuclear weapon.

[rudi49jr]

This is the grim reality of Russian occupation in Ukraine. Mass grave with more than 400 bodies found in Izium. How anyone in the West - or on this forum - can keep defending this Russian invasion is beyond me.

 

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/ukraine-says-mass-grave-found-izium-where-russians-ousted-days-ago-2022-09-15/

Edited September 16, 2022 by rudi49jr

[Bkk Brian]

Just now, rudi49jr said:

This is the grim reality of Russian occupation in Ukraine. Mass grave with more than 400 bodies found in Izium.

 

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/ukraine-says-mass-grave-found-izium-where-russians-ousted-days-ago-2022-09-15/

I guess it was just a matter of time when towns and cities getting liberated find more evidence of atrocities. We've been hearing for weeks now of Russians recruitment campaign in prisons, offering convicts pardon after 6 months service in Ukraine. 

 

However this new video that has surfaced of the head of Wagner group doing the actual recruiting and his demands from the convicts is chilling:

 

Video shows the head of a shadowy mercenary group recruiting at a Russian prison, offering inmates freedom if they fight in Ukraine but death if they run

 

"Nobody goes back behind bars," Prigozhin, founder of the Russian private military company Wagner, can be seen telling men in a video from a Russian prison yard, per a translation from The Wall Street Journal's Yaroslav Trofimov. "If you serve six months, you are free. If you arrive in Ukraine and decide it's not for you, we execute you."

He gives the men 5 minutes to make a choice.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/video-shows-head-shadowy-mercenary-204444445.html

[Mavideol]

maybe their "no limits" friendship has some limits as question start to rise 555

 

Putin surprisingly reveals China’s ‘concerns’ over Ukraine at summit

Vladimir Putin has hinted at frictions in Russia’s relations with China by publicly admitting Beijing has “questions and concerns” about Moscow’s military operation in Ukraine, which has suffered devastating setbacks in recent days.

 

“We understand your questions and concern about this. During today’s meeting, we will of course explain our position.”

 

https://au.yahoo.com/news/friends-indeed-putin-thanks-china-124545726.html

 

[Mavideol]

cracks start to show on Vlad's team

Another Putin Ally Dead After ‘Suffocating’ on Business Trip

https://www.yahoo.com/news/another-putin-ally-dead-suffocating-182142397.html

Former Kremlin Aide Says Putin Ouster Could Be Right Around the Corner

https://www.yahoo.com/news/former-kremlin-aide-says-putin-181415661.html

 

[placeholder]

24 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

cracks start to show on Vlad's team

Another Putin Ally Dead After ‘Suffocating’ on Business Trip

https://www.yahoo.com/news/another-putin-ally-dead-suffocating-182142397.html

 

 

Given the enthusiastic support Komsolmolskaya Pravda has always lent Putin, I think we can give him a pass on this one.

[LosLobo]

1 hour ago, Mavideol said:

maybe their "no limits" friendship has some limits as question start to rise 555

 

Putin surprisingly reveals China’s ‘concerns’ over Ukraine at summit

Vladimir Putin has hinted at frictions in Russia’s relations with China by publicly admitting Beijing has “questions and concerns” about Moscow’s military operation in Ukraine, which has suffered devastating setbacks in recent days.

 

“We understand your questions and concern about this. During today’s meeting, we will of course explain our position.”

 

https://au.yahoo.com/news/friends-indeed-putin-thanks-china-124545726.html

 

China's trade with Russia is miniscule compared to that with the West, it would lose a lot of it because of sanctions if it were to show to much support for Russia.

 

The only gain would be moral support from Russia.

 

A Russian victory would definitely not be in the interest of China and there are still some old scores to settle.

 

Like Russia's 1 million square mile land grab from China in the 19th century. Choice parts of mineral rich Siberia with it's sparse population now look more inviting than ever. with over- populated China now stronger and Russia weaker than ever before.

 

Possibly Xi should keep smiling that inscrutable smile and nod his head and do nothing, and keep getting Russia's oil and gas at bargain basement prices. He is in full control of this situation.

 

Was China Betting on Russian Defeat All Along

 

Was China Betting on Russian Defeat All Along? | Geopolitical Monitor

Edited September 16, 2022 by LosLobo

[Mavideol]

2 hours ago, LosLobo said:

China's trade with Russia is miniscule compared to that with the West, it would lose a lot of it because of sanctions if it were to show to much support for Russia.

 

The only gain would be moral support from Russia.

 

A Russian victory would definitely not be in the interest of China and there are still some old scores to settle.

 

Like Russia's 1 million square mile land grab from China in the 19th century. Choice parts of mineral rich Siberia with it's sparse population now look more inviting than ever. with over- populated China now stronger and Russia weaker than ever before.

 

Possibly Xi should keep smiling that inscrutable smile and nod his head and do nothing, and keep getting Russia's oil and gas at bargain basement prices. He is in full control of this situation.

 

Was China Betting on Russian Defeat All Along

 

Was China Betting on Russian Defeat All Along? | Geopolitical Monitor

have said it since the beginning of the invasion once China claimed to be neutral, there is no such thing as neutral and China had to make a choice in regards to their choice of trading partners, so far  China still playing both sides trying to take advantage as much as they can, Chinese are like that, double face people as long as they can make a buck, however now that things, in Ukraine,  are going into the right direction and Russia is loosing ground on a daily basis, as always, China is already preparing for the next move thus starting to bring up concerns about Vlad's decisions and his real grip on power as many of Vlad previous "gang" members are seeing their money flying away and so does Xi.... long story short, let's wait for the next move as China still can not swallow the land grabbing by USSR back in 19th century as you mention, not only that there's also some bad blood with the coal mining in Mongolia & Manchuria (Heilongjiang province) as one claims the other is taking advantage of their friendship

 

https://www.csis.org/analysis/china-and-russia-economic-unequals#:~:text=To be clear%2C the European Union as a,15.5 percent of its total trade in 2018.

 

Not only does Mongolia host an impressive coal reserve, the land-locked country shares a border with China, the world’s largest coal consumer, as well as resource-hungry Russia.

 

https://investingnews.com/daily/resource-investing/industrial-metals-investing/coal-investing/coal-mining-in-mongolia/#toggle-gdpr

 

 

 

 

 

[candide]

13 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

have said it since the beginning of the invasion once China claimed to be neutral, there is no such thing as neutral and China had to make a choice in regards to their choice of trading partners, so far  China still playing both sides trying to take advantage as much as they can, Chinese are like that, double face people as long as they can make a buck, however now that things, in Ukraine,  are going into the right direction and Russia is loosing ground on a daily basis, as always, China is already preparing for the next move thus starting to bring up concerns about Vlad's decisions and his real grip on power as many of Vlad previous "gang" members are seeing their money flying away and so does Xi.... long story short, let's wait for the next move as China still can not swallow the land grabbing by USSR back in 19th century as you mention, not only that there's also some bad blood with the coal mining in Mongolia & Manchuria (Heilongjiang province) as one claims the other is taking advantage of their friendship

 

https://www.csis.org/analysis/china-and-russia-economic-unequals#:~:text=To be clear%2C the European Union as a,15.5 percent of its total trade in 2018.

 

Not only does Mongolia host an impressive coal reserve, the land-locked country shares a border with China, the world’s largest coal consumer, as well as resource-hungry Russia.

 

https://investingnews.com/daily/resource-investing/industrial-metals-investing/coal-investing/coal-mining-in-mongolia/#toggle-gdpr

 

 

 

 

 

Right, they still cannot swallow they lost these territories in the Vladivostok region (which actually were Mandchu, not Chinese).

https://www.todayonline.com/chinaindia/china/russias-vladivostok-lures-chinese-tourists-who-want-city-back

 

The irony is that they may use the same trick as Putin in Ukraine. An increasing number of Chinese is settllng across the border and they may well become the majority of inhabitants in this area one day. Them China may argue it needs to conduct a special operation in this part of historic China in order to protect Chinese inhabitants oppressed by Russian fascists. ????

[plus7]

5 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

I guess it was just a matter of time when towns and cities getting liberated find more evidence of atrocities. We've been hearing for weeks now of Russians recruitment campaign in prisons, offering convicts pardon after 6 months service in Ukraine.

BKK Brain, do you know that Ukraine seeks for soldiers in prisons too ?

And it happened after 4 days after the invasion.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/ukraine-army-russia-prisoners-jail-b2024985.html

 

Why you so much emphasize this ?

 

[placeholder]

7 minutes ago, plus7 said:

BKK Brain, do you know that Ukraine seeks for soldiers in prisons too ?

And it happened after 4 days after the invasion.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/ukraine-army-russia-prisoners-jail-b2024985.html

 

Why you so much emphasize this ?

 

As you may recall, at the time, the situation looked desperate for the Ukrainians. So, Ukraine was obviously going to try and throw everything it had at the Russians. On top of which, Ukraine was looking for convicts who were ex-soldiers. Men with combat experience. Russia is just looking for convicts.

[rudi49jr]

1 minute ago, placeholder said:

Russia is just looking for convicts.

Not just any convicts; they are specifically looking for murderers. 

[Bkk Brian]

56 minutes ago, plus7 said:

BKK Brain, do you know that Ukraine seeks for soldiers in prisons too ?

And it happened after 4 days after the invasion.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/ukraine-army-russia-prisoners-jail-b2024985.html

 

Why you so much emphasize this ?

 

Well sure, Vlad would also not like this emphasized I agree, after all he thought it would take a week or so to conquer Ukraine and install a puppet government. Instead its been over 7 months. In 4 days Ukraine has liberated more territory than Putin's army was able to capture in 4 months.

 

Putin has now resorted to calling on his private unaccountable PMC the Wagner group to recruit from convicts because he's too scared to announce a full mobilization. Not only are they recruiting convicts they are also making it clear they are just cannon fodder.

 

Some choice words directly from Prigozhin, the leader of Wagner while he's talking to the inmates:

 

"no one retreats, no one falls back into capture, during training you will be told about 2 grenades when surrendering, If you arrive in Ukraine and decide it's not for you, we execute you."

 

Would you like some more emphasis? 

 

 

[plus7]

31 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Would you like some more emphasis? 

 

I thought you were wondering that Russia takes prisoners to the war. I mentioned Ukraine does it too. Probably you also said this on 3rd or 5th page of this topic, aren't you?

In the past, as you probably know, the ones who fought for the kingdom (no matter which) got much more then just freedom.

The queen granted high ranks to some remarkable, bloody, merciless pirates. So, Prigozhin stands in a good company from historical point of view.

 

My remarks were only about that.

I don't have any objections to your other statements that Ukrainians are brave, willing to fight, liberated large territory etc.