When the farang do gooders take over

[Mac Mickmanus]

6 minutes ago, still kicking said:

There are 7 places in the world named Sydney!

Although when people say Sydney, they do mean Sydney Australia .

 

 

 

[markclover]

Yes there are lot of these missionaries around.  They are millionaires from America but become a teacher in Thailand to 'spread the word.'

 

And there's the Filipino club.

Edited March 26, 2023 by markclover

[spongeworthy]

1 hour ago, BangkokReady said:

I think you're confusing rational with maybe instinctual or innate?  Even if the fear is learnt through socialisation, it doesn't mean that it is irrational.  An irrational fear is being scared of something that you have no reason to be scared of.

 

I think what you're talking about it "nature vs. nurture".  That is, something that is innate that we are born with and something that we "learn" from some aspect of our lived experiences.

I definitely could have worded that better, and I left out the part relative to learnt experiences. I was trying to say it would be a rational fear if "men" have been assaulting women while they do their business to such an extent that it has become instinctual. Likewise it would be rational if there were reports of this happening in the present day, yet I can't remember ever hearing of such a thing. If the only reason women are scared when they see a "man" (in this case a transgender woman) in the woman's restroom is because it's outside of our normal experiences, then I question if that's not an irrational fear (again, the fear that a transgender woman would assault a woman in the restroom). If a transgender woman who makes little or no effort to look like a woman, decides it would be a good idea to use the woman's restroom, I would certainly agree in that case the fear is completely rational.

 

Quite a lot of our points thus far have obviously been based around the idea that people would be able to ascertain who was born male vs. female while that isn't always the case. Trans women who take female hormones from puberty can be impossible to discern by most people with the exception of perhaps doctors or experts on anatomical differences (differences which may be apparent in these cases). Do they have to use the men's bathroom? Should there be somebody checking IDs at all restrooms denying these otherwise impossible to discern trans women from using the women's restroom? If the fear is only based on our assumption of a persons sex at birth, is this a fear that should be entertained to such an extent in modern society that we take actions which discriminate against one group of people so another group can "feel" safe?

 

Sorry for clipping the rest of your post as it's getting late, but you made good points and I think I agreed with all of your ideas on the potential origins of learnt and inherited fears and behaviors.

Edited March 26, 2023 by spongeworthy

[patman30]

13 hours ago, ozimoron said:

Promote is a pretty big word. Don't you mean "explain"?

No.

[patman30]

13 hours ago, spongeworthy said:

Are you asking me to spoon feed you? First you couldn't read the one paragraph on the site explaining the list, now you're stating you can't read the list of books yourself to determine which aren't LGBT related?

 

Sigh

 

Perhaps you can explain how these fit into the "LGBT propaganda" category in case I've missed it.

 

The Life of Rosa Parks

 

Roberto Clemente: Pride of the Pittsburgh Pirates

 

 

Indian No More

 

Hiawatha and the Peacemaker

 

 

 

no, i was asking a simple question, which you continue to avoid answering
but you already knew that.

[animalmagic]

16 hours ago, proton said:

what books have they banned, apart from LGBT propaganda in kiddies libraries?

Their definition of unsuitable books for children would also include the bible; it's quite a raunchy read!

[AP2019]

13 hours ago, spongeworthy said:

Are you asking me to spoon feed you? First you couldn't read the one paragraph on the site explaining the list, now you're stating you can't read the list of books yourself to determine which aren't LGBT related?

 

Sigh

 

Perhaps you can explain how these fit into the "LGBT propaganda" category in case I've missed it.

 

The Life of Rosa Parks

 

Roberto Clemente: Pride of the Pittsburgh Pirates

 

 

Indian No More

 

Hiawatha and the Peacemaker

 

 

 

What you are showing is a list from an online bookstore selling books, making money. Please show the list from the school district banning rosa parks.  There is a lot of misinformation about which books are banned - links below from USA Today and Snopes showing that some of the banned book lists are fake:

 

Fact check: Fake list of banned Florida books circulates widely online

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2022/08/25/fact-check-fake-list-banned-florida-books-circulates-widely-online/7876468001/

 

Also:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/florida-book-bans-schools-libraries/

 

87% of Books Removed From Florida Schools Were Pornographic, Violent, Inappropriate, Data Shows

The school districts are trying to prevent porn and violence in the classrooms.

 

https://www.dailysignal.com/2023/02/15/87-books-removed-florida-schools-pornographic-violent-inappropriate-data-shows/

 

This is an example.  Is this ok for kids?

 

 

[jesimps]

I've lived in Pattaya for 16 years and never come across Christian, or any other religious protests come to that. There's a whole street here dedicated to gay bars; a plaza in Jomtien too. Could this be another excuse to bash Pattaya, the greatest place in Thailand? I think if it happened here, any foreigners protesting would find themselves on the next plane home. I'm off to town this morning so I'll keep an eye out for those nasty protestors.

[Red Forever]

13 hours ago, ozimoron said:

The language of this forum is English and nowhere will you find a definition of woke to support what you claim it means. Your use of the word is as an epithet, nothing more. In fact the dictionary definition of the word is precisely the opposite of what you claim it to mean.

Spot on Oz.

I love it when the Gammon get angry cos they (gammons) can't get a rise out of people who are tolerant, against racism, misogyny and homophobia.

Woke n proud!

[herfiehandbag]

14 hours ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

Well, the ones holding up anti-trans signs are probably just protesting about men in frocks using women’s toilets, the women’s changing rooms in department stores, and taking part in women’s sporting events. I’m absolutely with them on that one; still it was good to learn that Sydney is in Australia ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Well it could have been Sydney North Dakota, although I doubt if it has much in the way of LGBT proponents or opponents, given that it has a population of two!

 

Doesn't have an Opera House or a bridge. Does have a derelict wriggly tin grain elevator though!

[fredwiggy]

14 hours ago, ozimoron said:

The truth is that 100% of sexuality is determined by genetics and nothing will transform a straight person into a gay person. Banning books achieves nothing other than promoting ignorance, unless the book advocates violence. And calling gays an abomination against God is advocating violence.

Actually, in many studies, genetics play a small role in sexuality. Maybe up to 20% at most. It's also hormonal and environmental.

[Salerno]

13 minutes ago, jesimps said:

I've lived in Pattaya for 16 years and never come across Christian, or any other religious protests come to that.

Extremely rare, but not unheard of ...

 

 

[fredwiggy]

8 hours ago, BangkokReady said:

Funnily enough, I've been asked a few times by Thais if I go to bars, or if I go to Pattaya or Khaosan Road.  It's interesting that that's a question worth asking in Thailand to get a feel for someone.

 

(And before someone chimes in with "that must be because you look like a degenerate whoremonger", that's not it. ????)

As I have by many women here. My girlfriend took a long time to trust me, even though I had been married previously to a Thai woman and have a child. She still thinks I might go back with that one, even though I have reassured her many times, I don't go back to a narcissist, cheating woman who failed to learn communication skills from her parents. All the women that I've talked to here ask the same questions. Have you been to Pattaya? (no) Do you go to bars? How long have you lived in Isaan? Do you have girlfriend?

[wwest5829]

17 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

There is so much more media coverage today that's the only thing that's changed. 

Certainly some validity there. Historically, looking at the USA and earlier in England the religious cycles can easily be seen. My Quaker forebears were imprisoned in Leeds and Yo4k Cas5les for not conforming. The Puritans under Cromwell and in Massachusetts would ban the celebration of Christmas due to so many pagan traditions (it would be like Thai Buddhism trying to root out any earlier influences on the current practice. I agree with the poster about coming to try to change native cultures but that is the message of Christianity and Islam … an obligation to bring all to their religious beliefs = cover those breasts in the hot countries! Ha!

[wwest5829]

12 minutes ago, Salerno said:

Extremely rare, but not unheard of ...

 

 

Good god!!! Ah, for the younger years. So refreshing to come to a country (generalized Asian attitude)  … as I told my students in western conservative Kentucky … you eat … do you feel guilty? You breathe … do you feel guilty? You make love … why feel guilty … thanks to our Puritan forebear beliefs. (College students when touching on the founding of the country).

[fredwiggy]

Farangs aren't going to do much by themselves to change anything here or in any other country, but it is every person's duty to not let things that are bad get out of hand and take over good behavior. Christians have a duty to spread the word. It's up to anyone else if they want to listen or not. Fact is, nothing in the world changes unless people complain about it. An example would be the driving behavior and subsequent daily deaths and injuries that happen here. People have the right to complain, whether they are born here or not. Nothing much is being done about it, which is why it will continue. That is, until some of the government heads lose family members in an accident, especially with a drunk, underage or unlicensed driver. They obviously don't care about others here, because enforcing the rules already on the book is easy. If you get enough people together that are like minded and will not stop until changes are made, that will make them happen. Morality everywhere, from the breakdown of the family, to parents telling their kids to go to Pattaya to become prostitutes so they can send money home, to the human trafficking which is part of it all, is part of the worlds slow destruction. If no one cares enough to do anything, the behavior continues. True, farangs can't do much here, except to pass values onto their wives and children who then could do the same. Slowly, things can change. Not caring is why they don't. My only son is gay, and I've accepted that in him, full well knowing it's a wrong choice. No one in my family, as far back as I have heard, has been gay, at least that anyone knows. What can I do? I've told him how I feel, and that's all I can do. I tried, and then could only accept, because pushing things would only hurt our relationship. I also think transgender is wrong. if you are born one way, that's what you are, period. A lot of others do things because other people they somehow respected did them. Just like becoming our parents unless we make changes early on not to develop their habits for ourselves. What you are attracted to isn't a choice. What you do with that attraction is. Thailand or any other Asian country isn't going to be overrun by "do gooders" They will always be here, trying to stop bad behavior. Something that is everyone's duty, although many are afraid to talk or do anything. Mai pen rai is okay with some things, but it's over used here to let others run all over people.

Edited March 27, 2023 by fredwiggy

[PETERTHEEATER]

15 hours ago, Tarteso said:

Then, a Christian burial does not ensure reincarnation..As Thais believe????

Not reincarnation per se but rebirth into a better life

[Eloquent pilgrim]

8 hours ago, still kicking said:

There are 7 places in the world named Sydney!

Posting comments in all bold font, all capital letter font, or oversize font, is the online equivalent of shouting, and is consequently rude.

We can all hear you clearly, no need to shout.

I politely suggest that you read the rules regarding the “Standards of Conduct” for this forum.

[SportRider]

17 hours ago, KhunLA said:

That's why I pretty much ignore everybody ... they're all wacked.   I find most people to be total hypocrites anyway.

 

Live & let live, just don't mess with me.   

Everybody is wacked and most are total hypocrites.

 

That would be depressing, if true.

 

One good thing about the rise of social media is the availability online of smart, thoughtful, respectful debate and discussion about all the nonsense.

 

Check out Konstantin Kisin and his YouTube channel Triggernometry. He does great interviews with some really intelligent thinkers.

[SportRider]

45 minutes ago, Salerno said:

Extremely rare, but not unheard of ...

 

 

This crazy self-righteous woman terrorising tourists and scolding ordinary folk trying to support their family.

[2baht]

2 hours ago, Red Forever said:

Woke n proud!

I "woke" up at 5.00am. The word is already in use, it's the past tense of wake!

[Kalasin Jo]

17 hours ago, proton said:

what books have they banned, apart from LGBT propaganda in kiddies libraries?

A number of American literary classics.

Not just books but recognised classical art. A school head teacher in Tennessee was forced to resign or be sacked because she put up a photo of Michael Angelo's sculpture of David in an art class for 12 & 13 year olds. It famously is nude with detail of David's genitalia and buttocks. Some parents had complained and the governors admitted that they were staunchly in favour of Republican right wing Christian values. At this level of prejudice it's difficult to distinguish them from the Muslim extremists.

[Tropposurfer]

18 hours ago, proton said:

what books have they banned, apart from LGBT propaganda in kiddies libraries?

'The Rosa Parkes Story' for one. Anyone remember her? Black woman growing up in a vile racist southern states of America and her life story during the times of Freedom Marches, desegregation of schools, M L King Jnr etc.

 

What a terrible 'woke' book that is huh ???!!!!!!

 

Imagine?! Anyone wanting to read about the history (actual chronological) of one of the most pernicious evils in all of all mankind's history - racism and slavery in the US of A and its origins from across the seas.

How leftist and anti-American of anyone wanting to read such a book to kids in school so they can understand and be aware of the reality of all history so as to make the world a better place and to actually progress and become more enlightened more compassionate, less bigoted and less hateful.

 

One rule fundamental to all of humanities neurotic, dysfunctional, and repressed systems is - thou shalt not be aware)

 

Ignorance is not bliss mate, it is the perpetuation of said ignorance and the decline of humanity.

Edited March 27, 2023 by Tropposurfer

[robblok]

18 hours ago, PremiumLane said:

There is a lot of projection from the right-wing. If you look at who is banning books and free-speech in America, it is mostly coming from Christian nationalists and other far-right groups, and even the GOP now as they seemed to have been taken over by the MAGA crowd. 

I think they lost the plot in the USA. I mean considering David from Michalangelo porn and firing a school director for showing it to students. What a scary place.

[Enoon]

18 hours ago, georgegeorgia said:

GOP?

MAGA?

In Asia you are more likely find that it is S.Korean Christian "do gooders" who are "taking over".

 

They have been putting considerable effort into Evangelising for some years now.

 

I found them to be particularly prevalent when I was in

Cambodia.

 

 

Edited March 27, 2023 by Enoon

[Surasak]

18 hours ago, georgegeorgia said:

GOP?

MAGA?

My thoughts exactly.

[Tropposurfer]

 

If you look to history apart for the horrifically obscene violence perpetrated by all religions, almost every person who was created and is part of such zealous entities came out of rigid, religious neurotic family and communal systems e.g. The Crusades, The Spanish Inquisition and King Philip of Spain,Nazi Germany; and almost all of the leaders of that movement including Hitler, Mussolini, Stalin, Tito, Nicolae Ceausescu, Victor Orban, Slobodan Milosevic, Milan Stojadinovic & Milan Dedic (Serbia (1939, both superbly effective Nazi fascists), Idi Amin. The list is almost endlessly long.

All were brought up in homes and school systems where fear, violence, intimidation, fear, fear of and hatred of any difference was taught from birth, any human weakness or frailty was brutally punished, rigid punitive shame based rules, brutal shaming indoctrination, and religious and emotional neuroses predominated. 

Sounds exactly like the GOP and their mouthpieces today huh?

[proton]

55 minutes ago, Tropposurfer said:

'The Rosa Parkes Story' for one. Anyone remember her? Black woman growing up in a vile racist southern states of America and her life story during the times of Freedom Marches, desegregation of schools, M L King Jnr etc.

 

What a terrible 'woke' book that is huh ???!!!!!!

 

Imagine?! Anyone wanting to read about the history (actual chronological) of one of the most pernicious evils in all of all mankind's history - racism and slavery in the US of A and its origins from across the seas.

How leftist and anti-American of anyone wanting to read such a book to kids in school so they can understand and be aware of the reality of all history so as to make the world a better place and to actually progress and become more enlightened more compassionate, less bigoted and less hateful.

 

One rule fundamental to all of humanities neurotic, dysfunctional, and repressed systems is - thou shalt not be aware)

 

Ignorance is not bliss mate, it is the perpetuation of said ignorance and the decline of humanity.

Except it's built on a lie, Parks was not the first to be promoted as the black women who refused to sit at the back of a bus. That was Claudette Colivn but she was dropped when she became pregnant. Parks was selected to re stage what Colvin had done 9 months before, one reason they chose her was her lighter skin thinking that would gain her more sympathy with whites. As you say ignorance is not bliss.

[Eleftheros]

18 hours ago, spongeworthy said:

Can you name a book universally considered free of propoganda?

Excel for Dummies?

[Salerno]

3 minutes ago, Eleftheros said:

Excel for Dummies?

That was just a Microsoft propaganda piece! Very effective too, how many people remember or have even heard of  Lotus 1-2-3 nowadays ????‍♂️