Not only is Brexit a failure, but the damage Brexit is doing to the UK continues and is cumulative.

 

Brexit will continue to damage the UK until it is reversed.

 

 

9 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

If you would have listened to him, you would have heard that he is saying that the Tory Government have failed to deliver the Brexit that the U.K voted for and that they have failed in their task

What is this Brexit that the UK voted for? How would it have been delivered?

3 minutes ago, RayC said:

What is this Brexit that the UK voted for? How would it have been delivered?

Listening to an interview with Nigel Farage  , he said that Brexit was done to get rid of the E.U  bureaucracy and the Tories have just made more bureaucracy and Brexit was supposed to secure the U.K borders and the Tories have let more foreigners in 

14 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

You can read all about them here 

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/the-uks-trade-agreements

 

Can't find anything in that link about the 'new' trade deals that the UK has with India and numerous African countries.

 

An 'approach' or a 'consultation' is completely different to a deal.

4 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Listening to an interview with Nigel Farage  , he said that Brexit was done to get rid of the E.U  bureaucracy and the Tories have just made more bureaucracy and Brexit was supposed to secure the U.K borders and the Tories have let more foreigners in 

I get that Mr. Farage would have done things differently (wouldn't we all????). However, apart from reducing immigration, which would have exasperated the labour shortages, neither you nor he can offer an alternative approach. 

2 minutes ago, RayC said:

Can't find anything in that link about the 'new' trade deals that the UK has with India and numerous African countries.

 

An 'approach' or a 'consultation' is completely different to a deal.

The link provided contains this link 

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/uk-trade-agreements-in-effect

 

 

And here is the proposed trade deal with India from a few years ago and

 

 https://www.mayerbrown.com/en/perspectives-events/publications/2023/04/proposed-uk-india-free-trade-agreement-progress-update#:~:text=In May 20211%2C the,negotiate FTAs with other countries. 

 

and fair enough , the U.K and India are still negotiating that deal 

 

   

 

2 minutes ago, RayC said:

I get that Mr. Farage would have done things differently (wouldn't we all????). However, apart from reducing immigration, which would have exasperated the labour shortages, neither you nor he can offer an alternative approach. 

Yes, I am not a Politician and it would be quite a bit above my capabilities and I don't know how Nigel would have handled it 

9 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

You can read all about them here 

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/the-uks-trade-agreements

 

As commented by RayC, these countries already had (or are negotiating) an agreement with the EU. So the added benefit of not being in the EU is close to epsilon.

21 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Listening to an interview with Nigel Farage  , he said that Brexit was done to get rid of the E.U  bureaucracy and the Tories have just made more bureaucracy and Brexit was supposed to secure the U.K borders and the Tories have let more foreigners in 

The increase in bureaucracy was predicted  by Remain and filed under ‘Project Fear’ by Leave.

12 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Yes, I am not a Politician and it would be quite a bit above my capabilities and I don't know how Nigel would have handled it 

But previously you suggested that this was not the Brexit that was voted for? I assume that you voted for Brexit so, presumably, you had a vision of what a post-Brexit UK might look like? Fair enough, you might not know how it might be achieved but the politicians such as Nigel Farage who were  peddling this concept of a 'Brave New World' should be able to detail what it is and how we were going to get there. 

3 minutes ago, RayC said:

But previously you suggested that this was not the Brexit that was voted for? I assume that you voted for Brexit so, presumably, you had a vision of what a post-Brexit UK might look like? Fair enough, you might not know how it might be achieved but the politicians such as Nigel Farage who were  peddling this concept of a 'Brave New World' should be able to detail what it is and how we were going to get there. 

It was Nigel Farage that said this isn't the Brexit that was voted for , I wasn't in the U.K at the time and didn't take much interest and I didn't vote .

   You will have to ask him , as I cannot speak on his behalf

14 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

It was Nigel Farage that said this isn't the Brexit that was voted for , I wasn't in the U.K at the time and didn't take much interest and I didn't vote .

l'll rephrase my original question (and add some supplementaries): Do you support Brexit? If so, in your opinion has it been a success up to now? If not, what actions should/ should not have been taken by the UK government to avoid getting to where we are? What does the UK government need to do to make Brexit a success?

 

14 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

 

 

1 hour ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

If you would have listened to him, you would have heard that he is saying that the Tory Government have failed to deliver the Brexit that the U.K voted for and that they have failed in their task

Did he mention that Brexit was a stupid idea?

Or did he pretend that the idea was great, but politicians didn't do what he somehow thought they should have done.

And obviously the EU is to blame that they didn't agree to everything he wanted. Bastards! 

1 hour ago, RayC said:

But previously you suggested that this was not the Brexit that was voted for? I assume that you voted for Brexit so, presumably, you had a vision of what a post-Brexit UK might look like? Fair enough, you might not know how it might be achieved but the politicians such as Nigel Farage who were  peddling this concept of a 'Brave New World' should be able to detail what it is and how we were going to get there. 

There never was any idea or any plan.

 

It was simply vandalism.

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Not only is Brexit a failure, but the damage Brexit is doing to the UK continues and is cumulative.

 

Brexit will continue to damage the UK until it is reversed.

 

 

Was it ever going to be anything other than a failure, if the EU has any sense they will leave the U.K. where it is now, in deep do-do.

2 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Did he mention that Brexit was a stupid idea?

Or did he pretend that the idea was great, but politicians didn't do what he somehow thought they should have done.

And obviously the EU is to blame that they didn't agree to everything he wanted. Bastards! 

Please watch the interview , I am not a go between to tell you what he said 

At least Britain does not have to keep supporting the bankrupt or nearly bankrupt countries of the EU. Greece, Italy,

maybe Spain for sure. The extra unemployed immigrants and refugees that have landed on the UK shores have not

helped the situation as well, thanks France.  Just saying that Brexit was ill timed, but would staying in the Eu

been such a great alternative?

1 hour ago, Stargeezr said:

At least Britain does not have to keep supporting the bankrupt or nearly bankrupt countries of the EU. Greece, Italy,

maybe Spain for sure.

The OBR estimates that leaving the EU has cost the UK 4% of its' GDP per annum (+/-£120bn). This dwarfs what was the UK's annual contribution to the EU (+/-£18bn).

 

1 hour ago, Stargeezr said:

 

The extra unemployed immigrants and refugees that have landed on the UK shores have not

helped the situation as well, thanks France.

If legal immigrants are unemployed, then that's a problem for the UK government to solve and has nothing to do with France or anyone else.

 

Refugees fleeing their home countries and illegal immigration presents a (bigger) problem for many EU nations. It is not a uniquely British problem caused by the French. 

 

1 hour ago, Stargeezr said:

  Just saying that Brexit was ill timed, but would staying in the Eu

been such a great alternative?

Imo there would never have been a good time.

 

Maybe remaining in the EU wouldn't have been a "great alternative", but I'd suggest that the evidence points to it as being a better option.

12 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

The U.K and India have agreed on trade deals between the two Countries since the U.K left the EU and they are currently in talks about  Free trade deal .

   The U.K has also agreed trade deals with Australia ...........and Singapore and numerous African Countries .

  So, it did indeed happen 

Nobody need bother arguing with you.

 

The "deals" are there........but the "numbers" do not equate to anything like the "gain" that was foretold........nothing like it.

 

And everybody knows it.......you know it.

 

No problem for me..........I expected it to be ****, and I am not, in any way, now taken aback at the dire results.

 

In fact I am cheered by the fact that the ***** that voted for are now feeling the pain.........silly *******!

 

Cheer up Remainers, after a respectable pause.........we'll be back in!

 

 

8 hours ago, Stargeezr said:

Just saying that Brexit was ill timed, but would staying in the Eu been such a great alternative?

Yes.

8 hours ago, Stargeezr said:

At least Britain does not have to keep supporting the bankrupt or nearly bankrupt countries of the EU. Greece, Italy,

maybe Spain for sure. The extra unemployed immigrants and refugees that have landed on the UK shores have not

helped the situation as well, thanks France.  Just saying that Brexit was ill timed, but would staying in the Eu

been such a great alternative?

You do know which nation took a dive to the bottom of the G7 don’t you?

In admitting Brexit is a failure, Farage is stating the bleeding obvious.

 

But then he adds one of his characteristic lies, implying there could ever be such thing as a ‘successful Brexit’.

 

There was never a successful Brexit for three very good reasons.

 

1. There was never an agreed definition of what Brexit was, ‘Brexit is Brexit’ became the response as the extremists Brexiteers ignored options of ‘Norway deals’, ‘Switzerland deals’.

 

’Hard Brexit and we’ll live with the consequences’ was the battle cry.

 

2. There never a plan, probably because nobody knew what Brexit was.

By example: To this day the UK still hasn’t put in place the border checks that are a requirement that is a direct consequence of Brexit. (Remember’Control of our borders’?)

 

The UK’s ports are essentially a free entry point for smugglers, there is little if any control over what is entering the country and vast sums of duty are undoubtedly going uncollected.

 

3. Ripping the UK out of the world’s largest developed free trade market was always going to damage the UK economy. 
 

You’ll recall the Leave argument ‘They need us more than we need them’.

 

Well how’s that going?!

 

No there is no alternative good Brexit in which the UK prospers more outside the EU than in.

 

The UK’s Brexit experience will improve as Brexit is reversed, and that is already underway.

 

The UK moves on the ‘Windsor Framework’ were the inflection point at which the UK Government ceased its antagonism for the sake of antagonism, signed a workable agreement with the EU and the ERG were powerless to do anything about it.

 

The UK is already moving back towards the EU.

 

In the short term the UK could improve matters by not listening to the likes of Farage, he’s done enough damage as it is.

 

 

13 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Listening to an interview with Nigel Farage  , he said that Brexit was done to get rid of the E.U  bureaucracy and the Tories have just made more bureaucracy and Brexit was supposed to secure the U.K borders and the Tories have let more foreigners in 

Well, to give them credit where credit is due, the Tories did delay and dither about hiring personnel to staff the bureaucracy of customs and immigration which was mostly an EU responsibility before the breakup. That played out briliantly.

13 hours ago, RayC said:

What is this Brexit that the UK voted for? How would it have been delivered?

I don't mean to offend you, but why don't you understand the simple explanation that Brexiters have been offering since the referendum was passed? Namely, "Brexit means Brexit".

17 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

The people vigorously defending Brexit yesterday are a no show in this thread.

Don't worry! I'm still here trying to sort through the garbage. But it could be a long day!

Silly idea. Woeful execution.

2 hours ago, nauseus said:

Don't worry! I'm still here trying to sort through the garbage. But it could be a long day!

I voted for Brexit but sadly I have no vote left in the UK though it is supposedly being restored this year. Over 15 years out of the UK and lose your right to vote.

 

30 minutes ago, billd766 said:

I voted for Brexit but sadly I have no vote left in the UK though it is supposedly being restored this year. Over 15 years out of the UK and lose your right to vote.

 

What did you expect from Brexit (if you want to answer of course)?

42 minutes ago, stevenl said:

What did you expect from Brexit (if you want to answer of course)?

A whole lot more than has happened since 2016.

 

I did expect problems with customs etc at the channel ports.

 

I had hoped that so many EU rules and regulations  would have been swept away in the last 9 years but that hasn't happened..

 

I didn't expect the fiasco at the NI borders that is going on now.

 

As for treaties from different countries, that has always been a 2 way thing.

 

I always expected problems from the EU and am not surprised so far.

 

As for Tory PMs and politicians, very little surprises me with that bunch of spineless wimps.

 

I am surprised and saddened by the attitude of France and illegal immigrants, and the UK government though, I should not have been. 

 

All in all I am disappointed with Brexit, but I cannot do anything about it.

 

5 minutes ago, billd766 said:

I had hoped that so many EU rules and regulations  would have been swept away in the last 9 years but that hasn't happened

Ah! Thank you!

 

Finally... Somebody who can actually tell us which particular EU regulations he's unhappy with.

 

Please do list a couple. We've all been waiting years for somebody to step up to the challenge and come forward with some.