Has Immigration lost their mind? Retirement Visa Extension requires a 1 year rental contract?

[NoDisplayName]

2 hours ago, NotReallyHere said:

I extended my three month rental contract once in the new province and here we are, it's time to renew my annual retirement visa extension. 

Talk to your landlord.

 

See if he's amenable to updating your rental contract, or writing a new one, with an appropriate exit clause.  Annual contract, but you can end early with 30 or 60 days notice, perhaps with a small fee not necessarily equal to the deposit.

[NotReallyHere]

10 minutes ago, biervoormij said:

The OP said in one of the posts that release clauses are not common in Thailand. I have one in my current lease and believe my previous lease had one as well. I just lose my deposit if I move prior to the term of my lease. Is this not the norm?

 

 

I made my comments based on information from my landlord.  Her family runs a group of hotels in town with many long term residents.  She said she didn't think a cancellation clause was legal, but she would ask her lawyer about it.

 

Good to know there are contracts with release clauses out there.  Maybe I can get one drawn up and signed before my visa extension deadline.  Not the perfect solution, considering I would lose the deposit, but better than last minute running around looking for a new room in a new province.

 

Thanks.

[DrJack54]

2 minutes ago, NoDisplayName said:

Talk to your landlord.

 

See if he's amenable to updating your rental contract, or writing a new one, with an appropriate exit clause.  Annual contract, but you can end early with 30 or 60 days notice, perhaps with a small fee not necessarily equal to the deposit.

Indeed that would be easy option.

 

Not boasting but we have few rentals. 

It's so so simple to provide a lease.

Have one joint SA guy and another USA guy ...

Could provide them with fictional 12 month  lease in a blink. 

 

 

[JackGats]

I was asked for a rental contract when I tried to renew my retirement visa on my own (without an agent) at Chonburi immigration. I was caught by surprise. Such a requirement couldn't be more akward since I renew my visa every year just before flying back to Europe for 4 months (ie just before my rent ends).

[DrJack54]

7 minutes ago, JackGats said:

I was asked for a rental contract when I tried to renew my retirement visa on my own (without an agent) at Chonburi immigration. I was caught by surprise. Such a requirement couldn't be more akward since I renew my visa every year just before flying back to Europe for 4 months (ie just before my rent ends).

I have just read several threads regarding extensions based on retirement at Jomtien have not read a post requiring rental contract. 

[NotReallyHere]

12 minutes ago, JackGats said:

I was asked for a rental contract when I tried to renew my retirement visa on my own (without an agent) at Chonburi immigration. I was caught by surprise. Such a requirement couldn't be more akward since I renew my visa every year just before flying back to Europe for 4 months (ie just before my rent ends).

This is something I have considered doing also.  Stay on the retirement visa in Thailand with longer stays out of country (90 days Malaysia with a single Thailand reentry permit?) in which I am not paying rent in Thailand.

 

So what did you do to get around it?

Edited June 8, 2023 by NotReallyHere
typo

[BritTim]

1 minute ago, NotReallyHere said:

This is something I have considered doing also.  Stay on the retirement visa in Thailand with longer stays out of country (90 days Malaysia?) in which I am not paying rent in Thailand.

 

So what did you do to get around it?

Since you are not alone in believing that outlining the rules at individual immigration offices risks retaliation from officials at strict offices, we only have scattered information (mostly from larger offices) on the practices around the country. If you indicate where you are thinking of moving, a member who is not comfortable about revealing the local rules in that province might let you know by private message.

 

Personally, I think it is pure paranoia to think that posting "office X requires a one-year lease" is going to subject you to retaliation, but there we are.

 

We do know (as you yourself found out) that Hua Hin is one of the offices most friendly to expat retirees.

[DrJack54]

2 minutes ago, NotReallyHere said:

This is something I have considered doing also.  Stay on the retirement visa in Thailand with longer stays out of country (90 days Malaysia?) in which I am not paying rent in Thailand.

 

So what did you do to get around it?

There is no such thing as a retirement visa. 

You can obtain a non O visa then subsequent annual extensions.

With that option you can buy a multi  reentry permit and enter exit Thailand as often as you wish.

Obviously you would need to be in Thailand for next annual extension.

 

Other option is to obtain a ME Non O based in retirement from Savannakhet.

That is a visa valid for 12 months and you need to exit Thailand every 90 days. 

You can exit Thailand and return same day.

There are no restrictions of time out. 

[Lorry]

2 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

 

BTW: My last extension based on retirement (Nov last year at CW) I had lease in my in my docs.

The io passed it back.

Same with me.

Last year,  they passed it back. 

This year,  I didn't even show it. No problem. 

But about 7-10 years ago,  IO at CW wanted a 1- year contract,  scrutinised the contract and was very happy that I even had a signed copy of the landlord's ID.

 

2 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

One new thing they wanted was my TM47.

CW didn't want it from me, neither last year nor this year. 

[DrJack54]

4 minutes ago, Lorry said:

CW didn't want it from me, neither last year nor this year

Thankyou.

Your post demonstrates that naming the particular immigration office can assist many.

Regards your particular post re CW  TM47 not required was the norm.

In any event as stated by myself and several others , the OP not naming immigration office provides zero info.

Bye bye to this thread. 

[JackGats]

22 minutes ago, NotReallyHere said:

This is something I have considered doing also.  Stay on the retirement visa in Thailand with longer stays out of country (90 days Malaysia with a single Thailand reentry permit?) in which I am not paying rent in Thailand.

 

So what did you do to get around it?

I ran to my usual visa agent, who then proceeded to lose my passport (or have it lost by immigration, who knows?). This debacle happened around Songkran. I described it in its own thread on Aseannow.

 

My hopes are now set on the LTR visa, for which I qualify hands-down but which I might still miss on technicalities.

 

What I liked about Thailand is that I could live in hotels and short terms rentals while not paying a rent for months when I was not in Thailand.

[DrJack54]

5 minutes ago, JackGats said:

My hopes are now set on the LTR visa, for which I qualify hands-down but which I might still miss on technicalities.

Who cares 

The OP is asking about extensions from a non O based on retirement. 

[biervoormij]

39 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

I have just read several threads regarding extensions based on retirement at Jomtien have not read a post requiring rental contract. 

I was asked for a copy of my lease at Jomtien when I did my extension in April of this year. I did not include it in my paper work but when my paper work was being reviewed the agent asked for it and I had a copy with me.

 

[NotReallyHere]

10 minutes ago, biervoormij said:

I was asked for a copy of my lease at Jomtien when I did my extension in April of this year. I did not include it in my paper work but when my paper work was being reviewed the agent asked for it and I had a copy with me.

 

Was it a 1 year lease or shorter?

[DrJack54]

27 minutes ago, biervoormij said:

I was asked for a copy of my lease at Jomtien when I did my extension in April of this year. I did not include it in my paper work but when my paper work was being reviewed the agent asked for it and I had a copy with me.

 

Assume it was not your first extension? 

If it was not you would know that lease was required.

Please clarify

Edited June 8, 2023 by DrJack54

[biervoormij]

20 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

Assume it was not your first extension? 

If it was not you would know that lease was required

Sorry DrJack I am a bit confused you said first "I have just read several threads regarding extensions based on retirement at Jomtien have not read a post requiring rental contract. "

 

Then you say I should have known I needed the lease.

 

Not a big deal just thought I would share I was asked for the lease at Jomtien. It was my first extension of a Non-imm O I received in Lao after killing off my OA which had been extended twice. They did not ask to see the lease the year before.

 

@NotReallyHere it was a one year least but only had about 5 months remaining on the lease.

Edited June 8, 2023 by biervoormij
forgot the not

[DrJack54]

3 minutes ago, biervoormij said:

I was asked for the lease at Jomtien. It was my first extension of a Non-imm O I received in Lao after killing off my OA

Read my post. 

I suggested that it was your FIRST extension and yes indeed you confirmed it was.

That was good option.

Suggest that you could have obtained a 12 month extension even without lease.

Having said that , the lease made it simple. 

 

The OP immigration office is a big secret so who knows. 

[JimTripper]

That’s bizarre they would need a lease. The tm30 and 90 reports are done so they know where you are.

 

maybe you can try leaving and returning on a different day to get another officer? Seems like they would not all ask for the same stuff.

Edited June 8, 2023 by JimTripper

[Maestro]

OP, I suggest you ask to speak to the chief of your immigration office and seek his advice about your plan to see and experience a lot of Thailand by staying less than a full year in a place at a time.

[rwill]

I have never needed a rental contract to get an extension.   I don't rent anyway. 

 

I've only dealt with 2 immigration offices.  Nakhon Pathom, at the time Ratchaburi didn't have an immigration office, and Ratchaburi.

[jimn]

There is no such requirement to have a 12 month rental contract, nor is their a requirement to spend 12 months in Thailand. Many people including myself are only in Thailand for 7 - 8 months a year. Never heard of such a rule.

 

[J Branche]

I have a simple solution.

 

Ask your landlord to draft a one year lease. Only one copy that is signed in person that you the tenant keeps.  

 

You would of course have informed your landlord that the 3 month lease is the only binding agreement and that the 1 year lease is only to fulfill the requirements of local immigration to extend your stay in Thailand.

 

Just focus on getting the result you want, give them the documents, smile, say thank you and move on.  It is usually only a couple of hours a year you spend on fulfilling your Immigration stay requirements a year.

 

To many people want to be lawyers, point at an Immigration document and challenge their statements, become offended, start with the theatrics, become emotional, threaten to contact Big Joke. STOP.

 

There is a problem and many ways and solutions to solve that problem that is your goal.  

 

The OP not knowing his place as a guest in this country is concerning.  We have zero rights to long term stay here.

Play their game, be polite, respectful, do not get angry or loud and do Not challenge an Immigration officers authority around their co workers, and superiors.  Walk away, get a Thai person to submit the paperwork while you sit down and only respond if needed.  Get an agent.  Go to another Immigration office.

 

Then thank Buddha and God you are able to afford to live in one of the greatest countries on Earth with some of the greatest people.

 

[jts-khorat]

7 hours ago, biervoormij said:

The OP said in one of the posts that release clauses are not common in Thailand. I have one in my current lease and believe my previous lease had one as well. I just lose my deposit if I move prior to the term of my lease. Is this not the norm?

And even if such clauses where not normal... has he talked to his own landlord if a yearly contract might not be adjusted accordingly for his special case?

 

I would think that making your landlord bend a bit will certainly be easier (cheaper?) then bending an unwilling immigration officer.

[edwardflory]

 

In 10 years I have never been asked to show a rental contract.

Having said that, 9 years ago a Brit friend was told he had to produce his "ORIGINAL" rental contract while doing a 90 day report - same address 12 years.  The landlord went to immigration with him  straighten things out.

[Captain Monday]

What if one owns one's own condo in this rogue province?

[Red Phoenix]

8 hours ago, NotReallyHere said:

To my knowledge, there is no requirement that two consecutive 90 day reports be from the same location.

A 90-day report is nothing more than a confirmation statement by yourself that you are STILL residing at the same address in the province where your Imm Office has registered that official address.  When you relocate - be it in same or to a different province - you have to notify the Imm Office of that new address by providing them with a TM-30 of your new official address.

[chuang]

How to help you if you are unwilling to say which office...

[Red Phoenix]

It is absolutely ridiculous that the OP does not want to disclose which Imm Office has a 1-year rental contract as a requirement. What's wrong with sharing the requirements that an Imm Office imposes? Why would they 'retaliate' to you on doing that.  The OP is confused...

NOTE: If he has a friend in the province where he located to, an option could be that the friend issues a TM-30 (can be done easily on-line) that the OP is staying at this premises.  In that case there is no lease or rental agreement required, just a copy of the house-book and the signed front/back Thai ID-card of the owner of the premises, as underlying documents for the TM-30 to be issued. 

[Dan O]

10 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

Then your thread has no credibility. 

Not sure why you make comments like that, they are not necessary and offer no useful purpose.

 

He already stated he didn't want to cause a stinking or other problems. Like many that post here, there is often a worry about reprisals. 

[Dene16]

10 hours ago, Plern said:

'm surprised the op thinks this is a thing. Most (all) of us produce one year leases. Why would op think that he should be given a one year extension based on a three month contract?

have not done a yearly extension since covid caused it to run out but in the 8 previous years of doing extensions i was never asked for a rental contract to be seen and to my knowledge was never required