Everything that's wrong with EVs ... an endless list

[KhunLA]

Rant your little hearts out, as the EV fanboys, we would prefer you stop posting in the 'positive' and 'informational' thread.

 

Especially when not on topic.  Now y'all have to threads to enlighten us:

... Everything that's wrong

... ICEV vs ICE debate thread

 

PLEASE BOOKMARK ... so you can return & post every negative YouTube and Op-Ed/news-blip.

 

[retarius]

Khun LA do you get paid for promoting EVs?

[KhunLA]

This should cover everything you missed:

https://www.youtube.com/@serpentza

 

https://www.youtube.com/@AutoExpertJC

 

 

[KhunLA]

1 minute ago, retarius said:

Khun LA do you get paid for promoting EVs?

Just tired of good, informative threads being ruined by the haters.

[Gweiloman]

One thing that I can think of is the loss of fuel tax for the government. The government might have to increase the fuel tax to make up for this.

[retarius]

13 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Just tired of good, informative threads being ruined by the haters.

It isn't hatred. You seem to spend good portion of your life defending your decision to buy an EV. That's totally OK, but you can't seriously expect to avoid criticism from people whop don't agree with you.

 

I bought a Japanese made Toyota Alphard last year, petrol engine and I am very happy with it. I don't ever feel the need to have to defend my purchase to anyone. You or all the forum members might think vans are the stupidest things on the planet, but I like mine and need to convince myself that I made the right decision buying it.

As for EVs, I don't want an EV....yet. If I had lots of money and wanted a 4th car, I might buy a high end one to use occasionally. I think EVs might be a sensible choice in 5 years time when we have charging stations at every PTT and other distributor garages. Trouble is the chargers are costly and have an uncertain payback period for a franchisee. 

 

I think the jury is still out as to whether there will be any significant benefit to the environment. The only information available now tends to be sponsored by EV manufacturers, who are not disinterested parties. I have been lied to by corporations enough over the years to know that I want to see much better data from more unbiased parties that don't have a vested interest in telling me how marvellous EVs are.

 

Think of it this way, if EVs are the wave of the future, you are right in your decision. If it turns out they are an expensive gimmick, you will have been wrong. We simply don't know at the moment. My personal view is that like other technologies, EVs will improve over the next few years, prices will come down relatively speaking, and some of the disadvantages will be overcome, like range, or concerns about child labour and environmental damage. It is like computers, I was an early adopter and found out that two years later I could get 10 times the computer for half the money I had paid. I realised then I would like to be a later adopter. 

[quake]

Oh dear was someone triggered.

 

[sirineou]

There are negatives with every technology, but I must say, the negatives of an ICE vehicle far outweigh the negatives of an EV

I don't have an EV.

We bought a new ICE car two years ago and if you traded it in for an EV we would take a financial bath. 

But in two or three years from now  I foresee an EV in our future, in fact all those who posts all the negative will probably own an EV also. 

And two or three years from now also works out good for me, who knows where the battery technology will have advanced in three years? Or how many mor companies would be offering EVs in Thailand. 

[Crossy]

36 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

One thing that I can think of is the loss of fuel tax for the government. The government might have to increase the fuel tax to make up for this.

 

Yeah, I do worry we are heading for another "diesel trap".

 

Way back, the UK government encouraged everyone to go diesel, they burned less of a cheaper fuel and produced less CO₂ as well, what's not to like.

 

Once we were all hooked, they taxed the heck out of it and then decided that they were horribly polluting after all and taxed that too.

 

 

 

[KhunLA]

35 minutes ago, retarius said:

It isn't hatred. You seem to spend good portion of your life defending your decision to buy an EV. That's totally OK, but you can't seriously expect to avoid criticism from people whop don't agree with you.

 

I bought a Japanese made Toyota Alphard last year, petrol engine and I am very happy with it. I don't ever feel the need to have to defend my purchase to anyone. You or all the forum members might think vans are the stupidest things on the planet, but I like mine and need to convince myself that I made the right decision buying it.

As for EVs, I don't want an EV....yet. If I had lots of money and wanted a 4th car, I might buy a high end one to use occasionally. I think EVs might be a sensible choice in 5 years time when we have charging stations at every PTT and other distributor garages. Trouble is the chargers are costly and have an uncertain payback period for a franchisee. 

 

I think the jury is still out as to whether there will be any significant benefit to the environment. The only information available now tends to be sponsored by EV manufacturers, who are not disinterested parties. I have been lied to by corporations enough over the years to know that I want to see much better data from more unbiased parties that don't have a vested interest in telling me how marvellous EVs are.

 

Think of it this way, if EVs are the wave of the future, you are right in your decision. If it turns out they are an expensive gimmick, you will have been wrong. We simply don't know at the moment. My personal view is that like other technologies, EVs will improve over the next few years, prices will come down relatively speaking, and some of the disadvantages will be overcome, like range, or concerns about child labour and environmental damage. It is like computers, I was an early adopter and found out that two years later I could get 10 times the computer for half the money I had paid. I realised then I would like to be a later adopter. 

Don't need to defend our decision, as one of the best for us.  I wouldn't mind people disagreeing with me, who actually owned one, or at least test drove one.   Presented facts to back up their silliness, instead of guessing and what if scenarios.  What if they just STFU.

 

Just now, we have a thread about the imports & production of EVs in TH, do we really need an off topic post about Hertz rental car experience with EVs, not in TH.  Especially when it's been posted at least 3 other times.  Once with it's own dedicated thread, I think.

 

Or how everyone is so unhappy with their EV purchases in the UK, and how expensive CSs are, and not enough or inop, when we're discuss how great the price is in TH, and more than enough CS, at present.

 

Or one of the totally false YT vids how CH dumps EVs in  giant graveyard, to keep the sales #s up, when it reality, it was a couple rent a car companies that failed.

 

Or posting from all the ignorant, misinformed that post completely false or inaccurate info, that's been corrected time & time again.   Only to repeat the same BS on different thread, and nobody is suppose to notice.

 

Some people are actually interested, wish to buy in the future maybe, or just trying to learn from the experienced owners.  Instead they get a bunch of false, out dated, inaccurate info from a bunch of total F'g idiots, for lack of a kinder descriptions.

 

People ... do some research before posting and appearing really ignorant, or worst, extremely stupid.

 

Just a thought.

[KhunLA]

9 minutes ago, Crossy said:

 

Yeah, I do worry we are heading for another "diesel trap".

 

Way back, the UK government encouraged everyone to go diesel, they burned less of a cheaper fuel and produced less CO₂ as well, what's not to like.

 

Once we were all hooked, they taxed the heck out of it and then decided that they were horribly polluting after all and taxed that too.

We noticed the same here with E85, as when bought the MG ZS (ICE) designed for E85, and at the time, 2020, price per 100 kms was about the same as 91, though 28% cheaper than 91.   Just a wee bit better performance with E85.

 

Now they are basically the same price, so why bother, especially when getting about 3 kms more per liter out of 91.   Besides, E85 was/is harder to find than an EV CS now 😂

 

Actually surprised they haven't fazed it out, along w/E20.  Why would anyone buy either.

[BenStark]

31 minutes ago, sirineou said:

There are negatives with every technology, but I must say, the negatives of an ICE vehicle far outweigh the negatives of an EV

 

https://www.autoweek.com/news/industry-news/a43625242/tesla-is-the-most-recalled-car-brand/

 

Tesla Is the Most-Recalled Car Brand—By Far—of All Cars, Trucks, and SUVs

Elon Musk’s cars take 4 of the top 5 spots.

[tomazbodner]

I still think Tesla would sell more cars and probably have better reputation, if Elon wasn't associated with it.

 

A divisive figure so closely associated with a brand can't be good for their business.

[KhunLA]

6 minutes ago, BenStark said:

 

https://www.autoweek.com/news/industry-news/a43625242/tesla-is-the-most-recalled-car-brand/

 

Tesla Is the Most-Recalled Car Brand—By Far—of All Cars, Trucks, and SUVs

Elon Musk’s cars take 4 of the top 5 spots.

Don't know about worldwide, but in USA, per # of vehicles affected, Tesla didn't even make the top 10 last year:

 

 

*** how accurate, don't know, don't care, just happen to be link at top of search results.

[phetphet]

I read an article a few months ago (can’t find the link) that insurance companies were working on flexible policies for EV’s that would increase or decrease insurance rates depending on where and what time of day the car was being driven. This would be done through charging stations.

[VinnieK]

Cars are financial sinkholes imo.

The moment you step out the showroom, you take a 10-20 percent devaluation.

Devaluation continues apace until it drops to almost 0.

 

Now.. regarding the topic.

It's clear, gooberments are full on behind EVs.

Translation...good luck fighting it.

On the technical side of things, ICE engines win clearly. (Range, autonomy)

..but like I said, it's a political decision at the end of the day.

 

[Lacessit]

1 hour ago, KhunLA said:

D

 

Or posting from all the ignorant, misinformed that post completely false or inaccurate info, that's been corrected time & time again.   Only to repeat the same BS on different thread, and nobody is suppose to notice.

 

Some people are actually interested, wish to buy in the future maybe, or just trying to learn from the experienced owners.  Instead they get a bunch of false, out dated, inaccurate info from a bunch of total F'g idiots, for lack of a kinder descriptions.

 

People ... do some research before posting and appearing really ignorant, or worst, extremely stupid.

 

Just a thought.

Here's a thought for you.

 

If you are going to call every poster who does not share your EV opinions idiots, they are going to set about proving you are the idiot in response.

 

 

[vinny41]

Post of repair bill for MG4

MG4 doesn't have modular batteries like other MG EV where it is possible just to replace a single faulty battery module

1st inspection repair cost B195K

some concerns raised about battery 

There is a bump around the frame of the battery, the frame can be changed)

Contact to inform that it's true that the battery is not damaged but there are scars from impact. Are you afraid that there will be long-term effects on usage?

2nd inspection repair cost B757K

https://www.facebook.com/groups/2389905174463399/permalink/7022103224576881

 

Major concern within the comments section is the number of people that think they are capable of buying the damaged car and repairing it themselves to sell on at a profit

[KhunLA]

58 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

Major concern within the comments section is the number of people that think they are capable of buying the damaged car and repairing it themselves to sell on at a profit

Ouch ... the quoted part is a bit scary  😮

[KhunLA]

1 hour ago, Lacessit said:

Here's a thought for you.  If you are going to call every poster who does not share your EV opinions idiots, they are going to set about proving you are the idiot in response.

 

 

Far from it ... just the trolls, or idiots if the shoe fits.   Is it really that hard to stay on topic, at least close to the topic.

 

I'm impressed with the posts on this thread already.  None of the hater BS, and some decent posts with real concerns.   No what ifs, not false info, no silly vids from EV/CH haters.  

 

Kudos 👍

 

Here's an example of silliness ...

... Aussie Rugby forum, and talking about the finals 

 

... I come along and state ...  Why do you people watch pro sports.  In the USA pro Football is fixed, and if you want to know who's going to win the game, just watch the Vegas betting spreads. 😂

 

Welcome to TH EV threads .... 

 

 

[Gweiloman]

3 hours ago, retarius said:

It isn't hatred. You seem to spend good portion of your life defending your decision to buy an EV. That's totally OK, but you can't seriously expect to avoid criticism from people whop don't agree with you.

 

I bought a Japanese made Toyota Alphard last year, petrol engine and I am very happy with it. I don't ever feel the need to have to defend my purchase to anyone. You or all the forum members might think vans are the stupidest things on the planet, but I like mine and need to convince myself that I made the right decision buying it.

As for EVs, I don't want an EV....yet. If I had lots of money and wanted a 4th car, I might buy a high end one to use occasionally. I think EVs might be a sensible choice in 5 years time when we have charging stations at every PTT and other distributor garages. Trouble is the chargers are costly and have an uncertain payback period for a franchisee. 

 

I think the jury is still out as to whether there will be any significant benefit to the environment. The only information available now tends to be sponsored by EV manufacturers, who are not disinterested parties. I have been lied to by corporations enough over the years to know that I want to see much better data from more unbiased parties that don't have a vested interest in telling me how marvellous EVs are.

 

Think of it this way, if EVs are the wave of the future, you are right in your decision. If it turns out they are an expensive gimmick, you will have been wrong. We simply don't know at the moment. My personal view is that like other technologies, EVs will improve over the next few years, prices will come down relatively speaking, and some of the disadvantages will be overcome, like range, or concerns about child labour and environmental damage. It is like computers, I was an early adopter and found out that two years later I could get 10 times the computer for half the money I had paid. I realised then I would like to be a later adopter. 

From what I have read on all the EV related threads, I don’t recall one post from anyone criticising an ICEV purchase. There is definitely still a need for ICEVs. An MPV for example, in your case. If I needed an MOV, I would probably buy an Alphard or Staria as these are the best available options. 
 

My criticism is on those posters who have never sat in or test drove an EV and then state that EVs are rubbish. These sorts of opinions based on ignorance are just moronic and reflects their relatively low intellect. It’s like saying China is a rubbish country but haven’t ever been there themselves. Sadly, such is the power of western propaganda.

 

Your post is sensible and I agree with most of it. One part that my opinion differs is about the number of public charging stations. As EV drivers, we know from first hand experience that the majority of our charging is done at home. The only time we use public chargers are when we are on a long trip. Apart from extremely busy periods like new year or Songkran, we can easily roll up to a CS in PTT or Bangchak or PT and there is almost always, never a queue. If you regularly take long trips that requires charging on-route, then an EV might not be your best choice. This has been stated numerous times by EV owners. Long trips are also relative. Would you consider a journey of 350-400 km long? If so, this journey can be easily completed by many EVs today without the need to stop to charge.

 

Another issue is the environment. Non (and often ignorant) EV owners like to claim that EV owners are virtue signalling, showoffs, wannabes etc. In my case, nothing can be further from the truth. What is undoubted is that it’s infinitely more pleasant driving behind an EV than a pickup truck belching toxic and smelly fumes. No one can argue with that. Another instance is when eating at a restaurant next to the road (which I do a lot as I eat mostly local food). The noise created by ICEVs, particularly diesel trucks are a nuisance and pain. Again, this is an undeniable fact.

 

I could go on but this post is long enough.

 

[sirineou]

2 hours ago, BenStark said:

 

https://www.autoweek.com/news/industry-news/a43625242/tesla-is-the-most-recalled-car-brand/

 

Tesla Is the Most-Recalled Car Brand—By Far—of All Cars, Trucks, and SUVs

Elon Musk’s cars take 4 of the top 5 spots.

That might be true but has nothing to do with the negatives of ICE, 

[Gweiloman]

2 hours ago, BenStark said:

 

https://www.autoweek.com/news/industry-news/a43625242/tesla-is-the-most-recalled-car-brand/

 

Tesla Is the Most-Recalled Car Brand—By Far—of All Cars, Trucks, and SUVs

Elon Musk’s cars take 4 of the top 5 spots.

This is a classic example of what I was trying to say in my post above. This poster thinks he is being clever (he’s not) in that by sharing this link, it proves that EVs are rubbish. But all it is, is that Tesla, as a vehicle manufacturer, has issues. Just because Tesla happens to be an EV doesn’t make all EVs rubbish. If Samsung does a recall on their smartphones (which they did, if memory serves), does that mean all smartphones are rubbish?

 

This is typical of anti Evers’ posts. I wonder, what is it that they actually dislike about EVs? Child labour? In that case, they should not purchase anything that has a NMC battery. But I bet they own lots of stuff with NMC batteries. It’s this hypocrisy that is bewildering.

[Gweiloman]

2 hours ago, phetphet said:

I read an article a few months ago (can’t find the link) that insurance companies were working on flexible policies for EV’s that would increase or decrease insurance rates depending on where and what time of day the car was being driven. This would be done through charging stations.

I don’t know what to make of this post. It doesn’t make any sense whatsoever. Most charging is done at home, in the evenings/nights.

[retarius]

2 hours ago, tomazbodner said:

I still think Tesla would sell more cars and probably have better reputation, if Elon wasn't associated with it.

 

A divisive figure so closely associated with a brand can't be good for their business.

I totally disagree. I happen to love, well like, Elon a bit. He's a huckster, like Trump, someone who shakes the world up a bit, so he's fun.

He is a hero to many folk, and a hero to me for his stand on free speech on X. Although I deplore him going to meet the vile Bibi and kowtowing to him, it made me want to vomit, and I thought Elon would stand his ground and condemn Israel but he didn't. He can't be all things to all people.

I don't drive Teslas, I like things to have a track record, like Japanese car companies, and Tesla has little behind it other than a bunch of words from Elon. Look he must be the greatest raiser of money in the world, and at least he tries to do good things with it. And he has been stunningly successful in most of his ventures. I think a lot of people buy Teslas because they believe in Elon. 

[Gweiloman]

2 hours ago, VinnieK said:

Cars are financial sinkholes imo.

The moment you step out the showroom, you take a 10-20 percent devaluation.

Devaluation continues apace until it drops to almost 0.

 

Now.. regarding the topic.

It's clear, gooberments are full on behind EVs.

Translation...good luck fighting it.

On the technical side of things, ICE engines win clearly. (Range, autonomy)

..but like I said, it's a political decision at the end of the day.

 

Could you kindly expand on where, how, what ICEVs are technically superior? Acceleration? Noise levels? Comfort? Handling? Mind you, range is not an issue for EV owners. It’s really only non EV owners who think that range is a major issue.

[Lacessit]

39 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

Could you kindly expand on where, how, what ICEVs are technically superior? Acceleration? Noise levels? Comfort? Handling? Mind you, range is not an issue for EV owners. It’s really only non EV owners who think that range is a major issue.

Range has been shown to be a major issue at low temperatures. That's because not only do batteries function less effectively, the battery also has to keep the vehicle warm. A battery is a chemical reaction, and all chemical reactions become slower as the temperature decreases. No problem for an ICE, it is using the waste heat of the engine.

Conversely, an ICE operates more efficiently in cold weather. Cooler air is more dense, and hence has more oxygen. Ever noticed many international flights are at night, when it is cooler?

An ICE can operate quite happily at -50C. I doubt an EV would have any useful range at that temperature.

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/teslas-electric-vehicles-cold-weather/

 

 

 

[BenStark]

1 hour ago, sirineou said:

That might be true but has nothing to do with the negatives of ICE, 

 

If there are more recalls for EV, that mean ICE have less negatives.
 

[BenStark]

1 hour ago, Gweiloman said:

This poster thinks he is being clever (he’s not) in that by sharing this link, it proves that EVs are rubbish. But all it is, is that Tesla, as a vehicle manufacturer, has issues. Just because Tesla happens to be an EV doesn’t make all EVs rubbish.

 

The poster you replied may not be a rocket scientist, but probably has a better conscience than you.

 

Tesla is was the most sold, and most expensive, EV in the world, so that mean that the majority of EV's sold are rubbish.

 

If the most sold, and most pricey, manufacturer can get it right, then we all know what to expect from cheap Chinese crap.

 

Of course, anyone who has ever dealt with Chinese companies know how they deal with support and recalls.

 

Hint: They are worse than Thai companies in that regard

[josephbloggs]

3 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Cooler air is more dense, and hence has more oxygen. Ever noticed many international flights are at night, when it is cooler?

Aha ha ha ha. Yeah, this is the reason, because at 40,000 feet at night there is a huge difference than 40,000 feet in the daytime.

 

Nothing to do with limited landing slots and many airports (like Heathrow) not allowing 24 hour operations or having restrictions on night time landings, it's because of the temperature of the air. Brilliant.