How many of us are stuck outside Thailand due to virus? ?

[uhuh]

5 hours ago, bwpage3 said:

How many in America out of 330,000,000 people do you call gawd awful infected?

About 1,600,000 tested plus maybe 2,000,000 or 3,000,000 waiting to be tested by the president who promised them a test. 

[Mr Natural]

14 hours ago, sirineou said:

Why not , as you said" have a test, and if you are clean be allowed to enter, then quarantine for 14 days to eliminate the possibility of infection in transit.

 

Here in the US they are talking of fast tracking a vaccine this Fall. And soon there will be reliable antibody tests that will indicate immunity by many of us. 

 

In Georgia, our neighboring State, they reopened the economy two weeks ago, everyone said there will be an explosion of new cases. Yesterday I read they have a 12% decrease.

You are throwing out various things here that may or may not be true. 

 

First,  all of the testing is very suspect for accuracy,  particularly the fast ones that could be done at airports.  And there have been more than a few cases that have lasted much longer than 14 days so quarantine isn't a guarantee either.  In any event it would be a logistical nightmare to quarantine huge numbers of travelers.

 

Fast tracking a vaccine will be dangerous, there are good reasons why all of the testing normally takes so long. In addition to potential unforeseen problems,  there are already a lot of people leery about vaccines.  Cutting corners on safety and efficacy will mean even fewer willing to take them.  And reliable testing for antibodies will be anything but soon, it isn't even known yet if people will have real immunity or not.

 

Also,  new cases can depend on how much or how little testing is done.  Don the Con has shown his disdain for testing because more cases make his numbers/leadership look bad,  and all he seems to care about are the optics and his reelection.  But the democrats seem to actually want the numbers to be higher so they can blame it all on him.  So I wouldn't trust those numbers in the USA either way.

 

Point being,  a lot of these things just aren't known yet.

[Canuck1966]

On 5/12/2020 at 8:57 PM, Berti said:

The goal is zero new Covid cases. Extermination of the virus in Thailand.

They have so few active cases now, European countries would have a big party to celebrate it. But Thailand still has partial lockdown.

How can you exterminate a virus which has no vaccine?

They will have to allow people to enter the country at some point in the future

[uhuh]

26 minutes ago, Canuck1966 said:

How can you exterminate a virus which has no vaccine?

Countries/territories that have exterminated the virus:

 

Taiwan (24 million population)

Macao

Mauritius

Greenland

Faeroeer

 

Probably soon to follow:

Vietnam (100 million inhabitants)

New Zealand

Hong Kong (about the same population as New York)

 

[Canuck1966]

20 minutes ago, uhuh said:

Countries/territories that have exterminated the virus:

 

Taiwan (24 million population)

Macao

Mauritius

Greenland

Faeroeer

 

Probably soon to follow:

Vietnam (100 million inhabitants)

New Zealand

Hong Kong (about the same population as New York)

 

Yeh but all it takes is for one traveller with the virus to slip into a country and get the ball rolling again

[Berti]

2 hours ago, Canuck1966 said:

How can you exterminate a virus which has no vaccine?

They will have to allow people to enter the country at some point in the future

I wanted to say with my post that there are two groups of countries which are not compatible now:

1.) Thailand, HK, NZ, ....: Extermination of the virus. Only possible with closed doors for at least one more year or longer. Will totally destroy international travel and tourism.

2.) Countries which want to keep the virus under control: European countries and the US.

 

Travel between these two groups will need extraordinary good leaders to facilitate it or someone who is responsible finally finds out how much money is lost. See Thailand.

[Berti]

3 hours ago, Mr Natural said:

 

First,  all of the testing is very suspect for accuracy,  particularly the fast ones that could be done at airports.  And there have been more than a few cases that have lasted much longer than 14 days so quarantine isn't a guarantee either.  In any event it would be a logistical nightmare to quarantine huge numbers of travelers.

The standard PCR test is expensive but very accurate. Problem: It needs about 2-3 days until you find the virus RNA after you get infected. So a second test is needed. Upon departure and after arrival would be ok.

14 days is very seldom and nobody could prove it this virus is still infectious. Don't forget that the PCR test only sees the virus RNA even if the virus is already dead.

 

Quote

Fast tracking a vaccine will be dangerous, there are good reasons why all of the testing normally takes so long. In addition to potential unforeseen problems,  there are already a lot of people leery about vaccines.  Cutting corners on safety and efficacy will mean even fewer willing to take them.  And reliable testing for antibodies will be anything but soon, it isn't even known yet if people will have real immunity or not.

It needs so long because you have to wait until the tested persons get infected in normal life. You could infect them intentionally (voluntarily). But the WHO seems to have a problem with this. This refers to vaccine development

 

Edited May 17, 2020 by Berti

[SAFETY FIRST]

16 hours ago, bermondburi said:

Currently stuck on a military base in Saudi. Not seen my family since early January. Had planned on us all going to the UK in March but cancelled a week before in the end, and very glad that I did. 

 

Hoping to make it to Thailand for the Haj holiday in July, but we'll see what happens. 

 

Only positive is saving more money then usual. I have a job, full salary, and good health. 

 

Missing the family, but I consider myself one of the lucky ones right now. 

Stuck in Saudi and you consider yourself one of the lucky ones. 

I love your attitude. 

 

I never thought I'd see Saudi and lucky one in the same sentence. 

 

Keep it up mate, TVF needs more of you glass half full guys making comments. 

 

[sirineou]

I Hate to have you at the scene of an accident where while people are trying to reassure the victim that he will be alright,  you say 

No you won't, you will die, and it will be a horrible , painful death!!   LOL

6 hours ago, Mr Natural said:

First,  all of the testing is very suspect for accuracy,  particularly the fast ones that could be done at airports.

Which is why I  did not say that there is one now bur said  " soon there will be reliable antibody tests"   Second Nowhere was it said that virus test had to be done at the airport, and to eliminate the danger of false negatives, quarantine upon arrival. 

You might not be able to eliminate every possibility, but create a reasonable probability. 

All the dangers you mentioned exist for repatriating Thais, and to a larger degree because there are many more of them, so why not for repatriating long term residents??

6 hours ago, Mr Natural said:

And there have been more than a few cases that have lasted much longer than 14 days so quarantine isn't a guarantee either.

"The median incubation period was estimated to be 5.1 days (95% CI, 4.5 to 5.8 days), and 97.5% of those who develop symptoms will do so within 11.5 days (CI, 8.2 to 15.6 days) of infection. These estimates imply that, under conservative assumptions, 101 out of every 10 000 cases (99th percentile, 482) will develop symptoms after 14 days of active monitoring or quarantine. "

https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M20-0504

6 hours ago, Mr Natural said:

Also,  new cases can depend on how much or how little testing is done. 

No they dont! the wirus does not care how much or how little testing we do. In fact it is not even aware of us. 

Testing is a snapshot , it tells you that you do or do not at the time of the test, and allowed you to either be isolated and treated or to proceed with your travels. Which is why I said "then quarantine for 14 days to eliminate the possibility of infection in transit. "  

6 hours ago, Mr Natural said:

Fast tracking a vaccine will be dangerous,

Sure. no one disagrees with that, the question is, what is more dangerous? 

 

Edited May 17, 2020 by sirineou
typo

[bwpage3]

Bangkok Post is reporting NO International Flights before July 2020

 

https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/1919272/no-international-flights-in-before-july#cxrecs_s

[Pattaya46]

2 minutes ago, bwpage3 said:

Bangkok Post is reporting NO International Flights before July 2020

//

 

[sirineou]

 

16 hours ago, RotBenz8888 said:

Same as me. When this is over, i'm gonna take a 1 year holiday to stay with my family. 

If one good thing about all of this, it has given us a new appreciation for what we had. 

14 hours ago, Isac Szwarc Brasil said:

I am stuck in Sao Paulo Brazil , came here because of a health problem , was flying back on the 21 st of march ,arrived Dubai for a connecting flight , waited there for 4 hours and my flight to Bangkok was cancelled. Could not fly anywhere in Southeast Asia due to enter restrctions. Needed to buy a new ticket (full fare ) to Sao Paulo .A 42 hours ,non stop, journey. All this with Emirates.I want to go home,is getting cold...

 

I am sorry to hear about that, it must have being a nightmare. 

IMO if the airline was unable to deliver you to your final destination , they should have returned you to you departure point. If I was you, I would insist reimbursement from the airline , and if they do not comply , contact the appropriate consumer protection agencies in your country.  

[sirineou]

4 minutes ago, Pattaya46 said:

7 minutes ago, bwpage3 said:

Bangkok Post is reporting NO International Flights before July 2020

//

 

This does not make a lot of sense. Countries hit a lot harder than Thailand are opening up international Travel . 

"Summer Travel To Europe: Many Of These 20 Countries Plan To Be Open "

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tamarathiessen/2020/05/14/summer-travel-europe-many-countries-plan-to-be-open/#35d6c535369e

Yet Thailand who claims to have Zero new cases , extends an international lockdown .TIT

 

[Pattaya46]

1 hour ago, sirineou said:

This does not make a lot of sense. Countries hit a lot harder than Thailand are opening up international Travel . 

"Summer Travel To Europe: Many Of These 20 Countries Plan To Be Open " //

Yet Thailand who claims to have Zero new cases , extends an international lockdown .TIT

Read carefully: Europe doesn't plan to open to International (no-european) tourists.

[sirineou]

1 hour ago, Pattaya46 said:

Read carefully: Europe doesn't plan to open to International (no-european) tourists.

A good start and two countries that I plan to visit as soon as I am allowed since I have close family in both. But I Think I will wait until August -September to see how it is working out. 

I am sure there will be limitations, but i suggest Thailand opens with limitations also. expats with Work permits, long term residencies, married and with families and homes in Thailand. All I am asking is for some common sense 

"Italy seeks to boost tourism by opening regional and international borders June 3 "

https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/news/2020/05/16/italy-open-tourists-june-3/5205784002/

" Greece says it'll reopen to tourists on July 1 as it claims success over Covid-19"

https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/greece-tourists-july-covid-19/index.html

 

Edited May 17, 2020 by sirineou

[vinny41]

4 hours ago, sirineou said:

This does not make a lot of sense. Countries hit a lot harder than Thailand are opening up international Travel . 

"Summer Travel To Europe: Many Of These 20 Countries Plan To Be Open "

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tamarathiessen/2020/05/14/summer-travel-europe-many-countries-plan-to-be-open/#35d6c535369e

Yet Thailand who claims to have Zero new cases , extends an international lockdown .TIT

 

Makes perfect sense, see how these countries do in June, if they suddenly need to go in lockdown again because numbers are increasing then travel ban is likely to be extended, however if the numbers remain the same and these countries don't have to revert back to lockdown mode then it likely that International travel to Thailand will be open for certain countries, I don't think they will resume travel for all countries

[Berti]

29 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

Makes perfect sense, see how these countries do in June, if they suddenly need to go in lockdown again because numbers are increasing then travel ban is likely to be extended, however if the numbers remain the same and these countries don't have to revert back to lockdown mode then it likely that International travel to Thailand will be open for certain countries, I don't think they will resume travel for all countries

I think it makes no sense to switch between total lockdown and open everything without rules.

 

I hope governments and people have enough logic and common sense to obey the rules which will prevent higher infection rates, even with tourism.

Test capacities are already very high, this will help. If health offices do a good job and people follow the rules it should work.

[sirineou]

58 minutes ago, Berti said:

I think it makes no sense to switch between total lockdown and open everything without rules.

 

I hope governments and people have enough logic and common sense to obey the rules which will prevent higher infection rates, even with tourism.

Test capacities are already very high, this will help. If health offices do a good job and people follow the rules it should work.

But no one advocates that. 

Open with certain restrictions, test the waters. If cases go up, pull back. If cases do not increase then take another step forward and see how that works. 

  Let those who work here, and were caught outside the country when the lockdown happened return. It is good for Thailand, it is good for the companies they work for.   and it is good for expats who work there .Do it as safely as possible.

 Let those married to Thai nationals with long term lives here, rejoin their families. It is good for Thailand, it is good for the Thai families and it is good for the expats who miss and worry about their families.Not only is it stupid. it is cruel to separate husbands from wives, and fathers from their children. Do it as safely as they did for repatriating Thais.

Repatriating Thais did not blow up the virus, why a few expats returning would do so???

  Let those retired here with homes to return to their lives, They let them come here, spend their last penny buying a condominium, and then don't let them come back to their homes, make them live in a hotel room, or someone's couch. living Out of a suitcase.  

DO THE RIGHT THING!!!

When I come back , I have to do some serious thinking about my Thai home and my relationship with Thailand.

[richard_smith237]

41 minutes ago, sirineou said:

When I come back , I have to do some serious thinking about my Thai home and my relationship with Thailand.

While I understand that these are exceptional times, this issue and the separation from my family has given me significant cause to reconsider Thailand as my base with serious thoughts about moving back to the UK.

 

 

Edited May 17, 2020 by richard_smith237

[ChaiyaTH]

5 hours ago, Pattaya46 said:

Read carefully: Europe doesn't plan to open to International (no-european) tourists.

Italy opens from june 3rd for anyone with a valid schengen visa. Yet we can not be outside between 11PM and 3AM, when it is the most quiet.

In the day time I can go to malls with hundreds of people, that is no issue. And it is more busy thanks to the limited opening times, we are so smart.

Edited May 17, 2020 by ChaiyaTH

[RotBenz8888]

27 minutes ago, sirineou said:

When I come back , I have to do some serious thinking about my Thai home and my relationship with Thailand.

A country were people with work permits are more important than parents with young children? And a twisted and hostile attitude towards foreigners? I'm having some serious doubts about living in Thailand. 

[ChaiyaTH]

4 minutes ago, RotBenz8888 said:

A country were people with work permits are more important than parents with young children? And a twisted and hostile attitude towards foreigners? I'm having some serious doubts about living in Thailand. 

Well that is not even a maybe, that is 100% sure. On a BOI, Business etc visa your life is super easy aside once a year. You get the special airport lanes too. 
Many even have no reporting to do too on top of that. But if you would be married and feed 100 thais, you still get hassled each time and looked upon on entry.

Just one of the harsh truths in this country, by switching to such visa or accepting it, life can still continue. I mean it is solvable for 30K baht a year.

Ive learned that to be happy in this country, you just need to pay off the problem things and thanks to that also deal at a minimum basis with Thais for anything formal or serious. Then you are left with only the social part and fun things of Thailand. Ignore the rest, don't read the news too much, ignore politics.
Because it is a waste of energy in time, we are not Thai and even we would be, it won't change here.

Edited May 17, 2020 by ChaiyaTH

[RotBenz8888]

1 minute ago, ChaiyaTH said:

Well that is not even a maybe, that is 100% sure. On a BOI, Business etc visa your life is super easy aside once a year. You get the special airport lanes too. 
Many even have no reporting to do too on top of that. But if you would be married and feed 100 thais, you still get hassled each time and looked upon on entry.

If one had any doubts before, now its crystal clear: foreign parents are worth nothing.

[ChaiyaTH]

2 minutes ago, RotBenz8888 said:

If one had any doubts before, now its crystal clear: foreign parents are worth nothing.

Nah they hassled me twice to get a single non-o before my son was 1 year old. When he was just 1.5 month old, they let us wait 6 hours in immigration for a 2 month extension. Even they noticed us from the first minute, trough out the time too, while it was freaking hot and no place to change the baby. 
Was lucky to have rented a SUV for the day. Almost wanted to throw a row of chairs to the front desk officers at certain points of the day.

Edited May 17, 2020 by ChaiyaTH

[thainet]

9 minutes ago, ChaiyaTH said:

Well that is not even a maybe, that is 100% sure. On a BOI, Business etc visa your life is super easy aside once a year. You get the special airport lanes too. 

Just one of the harsh truths in this country, by switching to such visa or accepting it, life can still continue. I mean it is solvable for 30K baht a year.
 

I think your post is very sensible, but if possible can you elaborate on the passage above. thanks.

[SAFETY FIRST]

48 minutes ago, RotBenz8888 said:

A country were people with work permits are more important than parents with young children? And a twisted and hostile attitude towards foreigners? I'm having some serious doubts about living in Thailand. 

Thailand is only letting Thais into the country. 

 

You'll find most countries with the safety for their citizens are doing the same. 

 

Australia is following the same principles. 

 

I don't think all this negative talk about Thailand is fair. 

 

Most of you negative talkers should be accountable, look at how you dealt with this issue in the early stages, could you have done something different?

If you were proactive and made a different decision, possibly a financial decision, was work and the dollars your reason for not returning to Thailand before it was in lockdown. We all saw it coming, sitting back watching maybe you're to blame. It's much easier to lay blame on others, could be you're to blame. 

If you had to chose again maybe you would have chosen to leave and return to Thailand earlier. 

 

I reckon $$$, poor decision making and procrastination had a lot to do with your troubles.... NOT Thailand. 

 

[scotsdude]

8 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

While I understand that these are exceptional times, this issue and the separation from my family has given me significant cause to reconsider Thailand as my base with serious thoughts about moving back to the UK.

 

 

The exact same thing has crossed my mind... Once this settles down going to take them back to the UK.. Keeping me from my family is a no no... The wee one would be far better off anyway... 

[vinny41]

10 hours ago, sirineou said:

But no one advocates that. 

Open with certain restrictions, test the waters. If cases go up, pull back. If cases do not increase then take another step forward and see how that works. 

  Let those who work here, and were caught outside the country when the lockdown happened return. It is good for Thailand, it is good for the companies they work for.   and it is good for expats who work there .Do it as safely as possible.

 Let those married to Thai nationals with long term lives here, rejoin their families. It is good for Thailand, it is good for the Thai families and it is good for the expats who miss and worry about their families.Not only is it stupid. it is cruel to separate husbands from wives, and fathers from their children. Do it as safely as they did for repatriating Thais.

Repatriating Thais did not blow up the virus, why a few expats returning would do so???

  Let those retired here with homes to return to their lives, They let them come here, spend their last penny buying a condominium, and then don't let them come back to their homes, make them live in a hotel room, or someone's couch. living Out of a suitcase.  

DO THE RIGHT THING!!!

When I come back , I have to do some serious thinking about my Thai home and my relationship with Thailand.

I assume that you have a facebook group where you can provide numbers of people, countries that they are located in and are all prepared to travel on a certain date and are all willing to accept 14 day quarantine at a Goverment facility which they will pay for

otherwise I think your proposal is a non starter and logistically impossible assuming that the Goverment was to offer limited access. There maybe countries where there isn't the numbers to fill a single plane or people that aren't willing to pay for 4 day quarantine at a Goverment facility.  If such access wass permitted  and depending on the numbers it's likely to be a single plane not a regular plane service where everyone can select their chosen date, time and airline

[Berti]

Indonesia makes a first step.

Foreigners are now allowed to come in with a test and 14 day (self?)-quarantine.

 

"Foreigners are required to enter a mandatory 14-day quarantine at their own cost. They were previously banned from visiting the country, but that rule has now been eased."

https://www.ttrweekly.com/site/2020/05/indonesia-asks-for-health-certificates/

 

Thumbs up!

 

[Kalorymetr]

10 hours ago, SAFETY FIRST said:

Thailand is only letting Thais into the country. 

 

You'll find most countries with the safety for their citizens are doing the same. 

 

Australia is following the same principles. 

 

I don't think all this negative talk about Thailand is fair. 

 

Most of you negative talkers should be accountable, look at how you dealt with this issue in the early stages, could you have done something different?

If you were proactive and made a different decision, possibly a financial decision, was work and the dollars your reason for not returning to Thailand before it was in lockdown. We all saw it coming, sitting back watching maybe you're to blame. It's much easier to lay blame on others, could be you're to blame. 

If you had to chose again maybe you would have chosen to leave and return to Thailand earlier. 

 

I reckon $$$, poor decision making and procrastination had a lot to do with your troubles.... NOT Thailand. 

 

No - Australia is not most of the countries!

Most countries let people with residency/work visa/marriage visa in!

In EU you can pretty much land in any country if you transit to your own(that is part of the EU, UK or Norway/Switzerland) after that.