Another Marathon of paperwork -Thai Wife ext.

[foreverlomsak]

15 hours ago, EricTh said:

This is ridiculous. What if we lost our old passport?

More to the point not all embassies give you your old passport back when you get a new one, some only give certified copies of main pages to do transfer stamps

[EricTh]

3 hours ago, GreasyFingers said:

The country is divided into Regions for bureaucratic purposes. The region heads cannot trust their fellow officers at provincial level, probably think they take bribes.

 

If that's the case, then why do I hear in this forum that agents can provide 'special service' for those who don't meet the financial requirements? 

 

[Satcommlee]

More copies you have to make, more $$$ they earn on the side through thier copy shops... Covid hard times, need money.

[zyphodb]

21 hours ago, EricTh said:

This is ridiculous. What if we lost our old passport?

 

That's what I said, the rules keep on changing everytime a new immig. boss comes in.

 

Why the need for an old passport when the visa has already been transferred to the new passport? 

 

By right, they should have a scan copy of all the extensions in their own computer system. Why the need for tons of documentation when they don't keep it in their computer system?

 

Thailand is a laughing stock who still require tons of photocopying when everywhere else is going digital.

They probably can't get their PC's to link together with all the different pirate copies of Win XP or Win 7 on them lol

[The Fugitive]

20 hours ago, potless said:

It seems like pure provocation. Probably designed to "encourage" an applicant to cough up some money either directly, or through an agent, to smooth the process. Disgraceful;.

It's to promote their 'VIP' service. You telephone your contact IO for an appointment. They tell you which photocopies (minimal) to bring and they do the rest. No form filling, queing, questions or running about.   

[moe666]

17 hours ago, foreverlomsak said:

Chiang Mai are the marriage clearing office for a number of other offices, e.g. the application has to be referred to them for approval, hence the under consideration period.

Some of the offices covered by Chiang Mai are Phitsanulok, Phetchabun, Nong Khai, Chiang Khan plus probably a lot more.

Thats new always went to Bangkok before. Where did you get our info from on this.

[ubonjoe]

17 hours ago, foreverlomsak said:

Chiang Mai are the marriage clearing office for a number of other offices, e.g. the application has to be referred to them for approval, hence the under consideration period.

Some of the offices covered by Chiang Mai are Phitsanulok, Phetchabun, Nong Khai, Chiang Khan plus probably a lot more.

That is not correct.

It is the division office for the region of the country that is responsible for the office where the application is done.

Division 5 in Chiang Mai is for the northern region, Division 4 in Khon Kaen for the northeast, Division 3 in Bangkok for the central region and division 6 in Hat Yai for the southern region. Division one is for Bangkok.

[ubonjoe]

1 hour ago, moe666 said:

Thats new always went to Bangkok before. Where did you get our info from on this.

Not unless you are in the central region of the country (Division 3) or live in Bangkok (Division 1).

[wwest5829]

23 hours ago, worgeordie said:

I am going to Chiang Mai Immigration in a few days, for retirement extension not marriage, so I hope things go much smoother for me, but I have this feeling

in my gut,it might be different this time.......

 

I also have the worry that the bank will not be closed, because of covid, 4 Bangkok banks have already been closed because of Covid, collect the bank statement

tomorrow....I hope. 

 

regards Worgeordie

A decade retired in Chiang Mai, Thailand and the only concern (until Covid) has been changes to my long term status at Royal Thai Immigration changes and various office interpretations.

[connda]

It's simply mind-boggling. 

[connda]

17 hours ago, EricTh said:

 

 

I thought the office only controls Chiang Mai province. Why does it cover places like Nong Khai which is in other provinces?

There are multiple immigration "regions" in Thailand.  Chiang Mai is the head office for Region Five.   The offices in the province below report to the Chiang Mai Regional Immigration Office.
Here are the province in Region 5:

 

Tāk
Chiang Saen
Chiang Rai
Chiang Mai
Lamphun
Lampang
Mae Hong Son
Nakhon Sawan
Phetchabun
Phayao
Phichit
Phitsanulok
Sukhothai
Uttaradit
Kamphaeng
Phet Uthai
Thani Nan

You can get more info here if you Thai is up to snuff:
http://division5.immigration.go.th/index.php/th-th/

 

 

 

Edited April 23, 2021 by connda

[jesimps]

10 hours ago, GreasyFingers said:

The country is divided into Regions for bureaucratic purposes. The region heads cannot trust their fellow officers at provincial level, probably think they take bribes.

Take bribes! Who'd have thought it?

[Thalueng]

Here are my 2 cents for everyone having trouble at immigration:
1. Always be friendly and respectful. Seems like a normal thing when dealing with people, however I often hear foreigners lecturing immigration officers about what makes sense and what not. It might not make sense to us, but there is always a reason for the requests they have. If they tell you what you need to do or provide, just do it.

2. It is correct that paper work in Thailand is much more extensive than back home. Although almost all information has already been transferred to computers there are still a lot of loop holes in the system. My Thai wife for example learned when she renewed her passport the last time that another person is registered with the very same name and internal ID. In fact, the officer found out about this when pulling a picture from the computer which was not my wife's. It took us quite some effort at the ministry of foreign affairs, and the local Ampoe where we live, to resolve this.

3. It is also correct that sometimes licenses, certificates, and visas were issued which probably should not have been issued. It is less than it used to be, but it still happens, I guess. To get all these mistakes and problems out of the (computer) system requires thorough investigation of all papers which might include previous passports. You should never throw away previous passports anyway, but if you did ask the immigration officer how to deal with it and he or she will tell you the steps you need to take.

4. I have no experience in CM, but here in Hua Hin there is an officer at something like a welcome desk who hands out forms and checks that documents are in order. Copying and even taking required photos can be done at the immigration office, just show the helper at the copy machine your form (which tells her what kind of visa you are applying for), and she will know exactly which pages need to be copied, form and passport and all.

5. After your documents are checked for completeness you will be given a queue number and enter the immigration office itself, where you will be served by a second officer, usually without further delay or troubles.

6. During the most recent renewal of my marriage visa the officer in charge made a mistake, he stamped expiry of my visa after 14 months instead of 12. It was "silently" corrected during my next visit reporting my 90 days. True, back home they probably make less mistakes of this nature, but is it really a big deal?
7. Finally I would like to give you a tip how to make the marriage visa application procedure easier: go back to the immigration office 31-45 days before expiration of the current marriage visa for extension. Since it is mandatory to send the documents to Bangkok for approval you can avoid getting a 1 month visa which later is extended by another 11 months.

[CharlieH]

18 minutes ago, Thalueng said:

Here are my 2 cents for everyone having trouble at immigration:
1. Always be friendly and respectful. Seems like a normal thing when dealing with people, however I often hear foreigners lecturing immigration officers about what makes sense and what not. It might not make sense to us, but there is always a reason for the requests they have. If they tell you what you need to do or provide, just do it.

2. It is correct that paper work in Thailand is much more extensive than back home. Although almost all information has already been transferred to computers there are still a lot of loop holes in the system. My Thai wife for example learned when she renewed her passport the last time that another person is registered with the very same name and internal ID. In fact, the officer found out about this when pulling a picture from the computer which was not my wife's. It took us quite some effort at the ministry of foreign affairs, and the local Ampoe where we live, to resolve this.

3. It is also correct that sometimes licenses, certificates, and visas were issued which probably should not have been issued. It is less than it used to be, but it still happens, I guess. To get all these mistakes and problems out of the (computer) system requires thorough investigation of all papers which might include previous passports. You should never throw away previous passports anyway, but if you did ask the immigration officer how to deal with it and he or she will tell you the steps you need to take.

4. I have no experience in CM, but here in Hua Hin there is an officer at something like a welcome desk who hands out forms and checks that documents are in order. Copying and even taking required photos can be done at the immigration office, just show the helper at the copy machine your form (which tells her what kind of visa you are applying for), and she will know exactly which pages need to be copied, form and passport and all.

5. After your documents are checked for completeness you will be given a queue number and enter the immigration office itself, where you will be served by a second officer, usually without further delay or troubles.

6. During the most recent renewal of my marriage visa the officer in charge made a mistake, he stamped expiry of my visa after 14 months instead of 12. It was "silently" corrected during my next visit reporting my 90 days. True, back home they probably make less mistakes of this nature, but is it really a big deal?
7. Finally I would like to give you a tip how to make the marriage visa application procedure easier: go back to the immigration office 31-45 days before expiration of the current marriage visa for extension. Since it is mandatory to send the documents to Bangkok for approval you can avoid getting a 1 month visa which later is extended by another 11 months.

Perhaps you could share your wisdom on the possible need for copies of passport/travel information for 5 years prior to even setting foot in Thailand and over 15 years ago ? What possible relevance can that have on application made this week ?

Or the need to print a full 3 word name 94 times ? Also whilst doing so, knowing the clock is ticking and if it runs out,  the financials have to be redone at the bank the next day.

I would be very interested in your justification (excuse?) of that requirement that has NEVER been required in the 15 years prior.

Unfortunately forum rules disable further comment.

[RobMuir]

6 hours ago, phutoie2 said:

Your post suggests you are one of those expats that you see in Tesco/Makro etc, velcroed to the side of their wives. 

 

I sometimes go to Tesco, but usually just send the maid, especially with all the covid.

 

Quote

Nearly all Immigration Police have a reasonable understanding of how to speak and write English. 

Guess you can't speak Thai.

 

Quote

How would an IO know your wife had a career in the bar industry?, Is it that obvious. 

 

Sometimes by the look, sometimes by the way they speak, sometimes because she is a hottie with a fat old grandpa with bad teeth.

 

Quote

You may choose to act like a door mat and leave it to the bar girl,( sorry, I meant wife), others like to know what is going on. 

I'll wager too, you are one of those who goes back next day with a basket full of goodies. 

 

I have a Thai Elite Card. It is easy. Good system.

[foreverlomsak]

4 hours ago, moe666 said:

Thats new always went to Bangkok before. Where did you get our info from on this.

History from when I was on a marriage extension 2006 Nong Kwai used to send the application to Chiang Mai for approval

[foreverlomsak]

1 hour ago, Thalueng said:

Since it is mandatory to send the documents to Bangkok for approval you can avoid getting a 1 month visa which later is extended by another 11 months.

Not all go to Bangkok see reply to my comments from @ubonjoe attached below. My name for the offices "marriage clearance" was slightly tongue in cheek, because I'm not sure what added value they bring to the exercise.

 

4 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

It is the division office for the region of the country that is responsible for the office where the application is done.

Division 5 in Chiang Mai is for the northern region, Division 4 in Khon Kaen for the northeast, Division 3 in Bangkok for the central region and division 6 in Hat Yai for the southern region. Division one is for Bangkok.

 

[fishtank]

2 hours ago, Thalueng said:

Here are my 2 cents for everyone having trouble at immigration:
1. Always be friendly and respectful. Seems like a normal thing when dealing with people, however I often hear foreigners lecturing immigration officers about what makes sense and what not. It might not make sense to us, but there is always a reason for the requests they have. If they tell you what you need to do or provide, just do it.

2. It is correct that paper work in Thailand is much more extensive than back home. Although almost all information has already been transferred to computers there are still a lot of loop holes in the system. My Thai wife for example learned when she renewed her passport the last time that another person is registered with the very same name and internal ID. In fact, the officer found out about this when pulling a picture from the computer which was not my wife's. It took us quite some effort at the ministry of foreign affairs, and the local Ampoe where we live, to resolve this.

3. It is also correct that sometimes licenses, certificates, and visas were issued which probably should not have been issued. It is less than it used to be, but it still happens, I guess. To get all these mistakes and problems out of the (computer) system requires thorough investigation of all papers which might include previous passports. You should never throw away previous passports anyway, but if you did ask the immigration officer how to deal with it and he or she will tell you the steps you need to take.

4. I have no experience in CM, but here in Hua Hin there is an officer at something like a welcome desk who hands out forms and checks that documents are in order. Copying and even taking required photos can be done at the immigration office, just show the helper at the copy machine your form (which tells her what kind of visa you are applying for), and she will know exactly which pages need to be copied, form and passport and all.

5. After your documents are checked for completeness you will be given a queue number and enter the immigration office itself, where you will be served by a second officer, usually without further delay or troubles.

6. During the most recent renewal of my marriage visa the officer in charge made a mistake, he stamped expiry of my visa after 14 months instead of 12. It was "silently" corrected during my next visit reporting my 90 days. True, back home they probably make less mistakes of this nature, but is it really a big deal?
7. Finally I would like to give you a tip how to make the marriage visa application procedure easier: go back to the immigration office 31-45 days before expiration of the current marriage visa for extension. Since it is mandatory to send the documents to Bangkok for approval you can avoid getting a 1 month visa which later is extended by another 11 months.

Good post.

People having problems are having them because they do not provide the easy correct documents.

Never had a problem in 17 years.

Immigration are easy to deal with.

Simple as that.

Edited April 23, 2021 by fishtank

[poohy]

7 hours ago, The Fugitive said:

It's to promote their 'VIP' service. You telephone your contact IO for an appointment. They tell you which photocopies (minimal) to bring and they do the rest. No form filling, queing, questions or running about.   

Like i said there's always a simpler way  (friendly immigration officer  or agent) most often the same person

Why ,make life harder than you need you would have paid a few bob and no problems

Oh and we wouldn't be reading this

i m not overly wealthy but at max its about 40 THB a day if you work it out plus no dealing with IM surely a plus your blood pressure will thank you

[foreverlomsak]

3 hours ago, CharlieH said:

Or the need to print a full 3 word name 94 times ?

On forms which probably contain your name in full already

[CharlieH]

24 minutes ago, foreverlomsak said:

On forms which probably contain your name in full already

Some of them yes, reminded me of school days and having to write " lines". Amazing how your signature starts to change too after about 25 times...lol

[Maybole]

I did my new extension for marriage on Monday 19th. at Chiangmai.

. I arrived at my bank branch at 0825 and received queue no. 3, by 0845 I was out with my Bank letter and updated bank book and on my way to Immigration .

After photo copying my latest page in the bank book, I went into the building at 0915 and got queue no 6.  The papers had all been examined and the copies of my Tabien Ban Farang and my pink ID which had been required last year were rejected as unnecessary, but all pages of the bank book going back 2 years were wanted.

We were called inside after about 20 mins. and required to sign the SM2 forms again in front of the IO. Then all the pages submitted had to be stamped and signed by both of us in blue ink and we waited again for about 10 mins, then 'i was photographed and the fee paid. we left at 1045. with the " under consideration" stamp.

Total paper submitted was 32 pages x 2. One set for local records and one for HQ.

[The Hammer2021]

Yes I keep my last passport handy as 15 years ago Inused it and it's linked to bank accounts and Sims etc...but the point the OP is missing..why didn't he do the decent  thing and use an agent?

[The Hammer2021]

5 hours ago, CharlieH said:

Perhaps you could share your wisdom on the possible need for copies of passport/travel information for 5 years prior to even setting foot in Thailand and over 15 years ago ? What possible relevance can that have on application made this week ?

Or the need to print a full 3 word name 94 times ? Also whilst doing so, knowing the clock is ticking and if it runs out,  the financials have to be redone at the bank the next day.

I would be very interested in your justification (excuse?) of that requirement that has NEVER been required in the 15 years prior.

Unfortunately forum rules disable further comment.

if a process was initiated by an older passport its quite normal to reference that old passport even though it's not in use as a current  travel document. I always have my last passport available.  Never thrown one away. They are a history of memories of over 50 years of travel in over 50 countries. The Afghan visa granted at the Khyber Pass took two full pages of passport and the Libyan one used postage stamps with signatures traceable back to individual officers and officials. 

[Saraburi121]

3 hours ago, fishtank said:

Good post.

People having problems are having them because they do not provide the easy correct documents.

Never had a problem in 17 years.

Immigration are easy to deal with.

Simple as that.

At your immigration office maybe, move to my province and do a marriage extension without an agent and then tell me it is simple and easy. 

[Scott]

Inflammatory post reported and removed.

 

[tgw]

On 4/22/2021 at 10:54 PM, CharlieH said:

There arent any in this neck of the woods that I am aware of.

And frankly I would prefer not to take that route, to each their own on that choice.

 

does Thailand have some kind of agency battling the waste of taxmoney ?

 

while I wish immigration authorities in Western countries were more restrictive, but what Thai immigration is doing is often just clownesque, what benefit does the country Thailand get from putting up hassles for extensions that should not be denied unless for imperious reason?

 

what if the old passport had just been lost? would they require a police report for the loss of lost passport, or would they require the embassy to replace an expired passport?

 

might be a case for the administrative court.

Edited April 23, 2021 by tgw

[fishtank]

5 hours ago, Saraburi121 said:

At your immigration office maybe, move to my province and do a marriage extension without an agent and then tell me it is simple and easy. 

Have used 3 different offices.

Never had a problem apart from Samui's creative price list back in the day.

[CharlieH]

5 hours ago, tgw said:

what if the old passport had just been lost? would they require a police report for the loss of lost passport, or would they require the embassy to replace an expired passport?

 

A letter would be required by my wife explaining why it wasnt available and pleading for the approval of the visa extension.

[brianthainess]

On 4/22/2021 at 10:50 PM, poohy said:

So you wasted a day surely paying an agent is better you probably dont even have to show up

For my retirement visa i dont have to go near a immigration office

On 4/22/2021 at 11:49 PM, DavisH said:

Once I saw a guy in the Nonthaburi office trying to do his marriage extension. They didn't want to do it until his wife arrived at the office. Not sute if that's normal or not. 

 

Yes normally the wife needs to be present, how else would they know who is in the required photos (Trat IO 2copys of six photos) and they interrogate her for 30min trying to glean info on you, what you do all day etc. etc. I will go in June, last year the missus asked them "why you not do everything on computer?" answer "next year" LMA&FO. ????????????

 

     Edit: phooy this is about a marriage extension as far as I know even if you use an agent, you and your wife will still need to attend. And I'm guessing you don't have money in the bank.

Edited April 24, 2021 by brianthainess