The Chinese Online ESL Crackdown

[JustAnotherFarang]

8 hours ago, recom273 said:

For me, I’m fully booked at present, I have a lot of other things on the go at the moment, so limited my day to 9 hours - I’m sure I could get 20+ lessons a day, every day but I can’t handle the monotony, and there is the worry that as the months go on the company could

fold, I gather the Chinese Wall Street English declared bankruptcy or folded yesterday, the same could happen with any online company.

 

A lot of parents are either trying to run out their packages fearing the worst or in order to buy more before the deadline. Our company will continue to honour current purchases with western teachers until the lesson packages have expired.

 
It also looks like the schools will not go back on Sept 1st, kids who had f2f classes in holiday schools have all

moved to online. I am looking at another month of lessons from 7.00 am.
 

I am looking forward to try something new. Chinese parents want consistency, I have worked from 3.00 pm - 8.30 and sometimes 9.00 pm for over 4 years now, 10 hours every weekend day, it’s time to take that money and retrain and invest.
 

However, I feel we are entering into an interesting time, the Chinese want their kids to succeed, they invest in their kids future so that it will return in their old age, some aren’t just going to roll

over and accept the CCP legislation. I have a feeling they will look for ways around, I don’t know how this can work and the big issue is getting money out of China.

If we set up as independent operators , under the radar, the price per lesson may increase due to increased demand - due to fewer lessons, lesson planning and money “extraction” costs. Not all of these parents aren’t all middle income, the apartments I see are luxurious, I have given lessons with kids in Bentleys. I have a slight hunch that it’s not over yet, anyone else? 

 

 

Would it be okay to ask you for advice on how to get up and running on thsi online teaching and what resources you use.  I have been teaching for many years but never tried doing it online

 

JAF

[jdlancaster]

3 hours ago, arick said:

I guess thats what happens when your British and you vote Brexist. Wait the great positives of the Brexiteers will come soon and we will all be rich.

 

Working for a  foreign company has nothing to do with a retirement visa. 

I would like to know how none married under 50s non teachers teaching online stay in Thailand 

You can study at a local university and take a low number of credits (I enjoy studying). Cheap and easy, especially if you already have a few degrees. Has some fringe benefits if you're single. Could pay for the elite visa or country hop, but I'm pretty settled here.

 

My money comes from elsewhere but I did VIPkid a few years back, was easy money. If you have a Masters/PhD can also teach for online Universities but the work is less regular. Due to Purchasing Power Parity and reduced marginal tax rate making US$3000/month is similar to $9-10k a month back in the US with a lot less work. I've been able to save more off a smaller income living here.

 

 

[Speedhump]

9 hours ago, James26 said:

Not sure how to interpret this declaration. Most people could only wish their children were as diligent learners as Chinese kids.

It's obvious he was just being racist about Chinese people. Many knuckledraggers can't distinguish between the hateful acts of a government and the people of its country. Russia is another good example, a fine people misled by a scared and power-crazed tyrant. No, Boris does not fall into that category, before the delusional start to babble.... 

[unblocktheplanet]

On 8/9/2021 at 9:53 AM, MarcelV said:

I'd love to earn some of that sweet yuan renminbi, but I'm not a NES and being one seems to be a requirement for online schools.

NES?

[Scott]

Numerous off-topic posts and replies removed.   Please stay on topic.   Who owns what is really not relevant to the topic.   Keep the discussion civil.

 

[sleepwalker999]

19 hours ago, leeedwards said:

I sometimes find myself flabbergasted with the sheer lack of sympathy and empathy shown on here by some members. We haven't all been blessed with good fortune or bestowed with untold wealth, so some of us have to do this kind of work. Regardless,  for some of you more comfortably off, it seems that anytime a misfortune or difficult situation occurs you simply can't wait to throw in a knife and give a twist. For some it seems, even our tax and immigration status also seems of interest. There are some academics,  Sam Harris, Lawrence Krauss, Richard Dawkins for example, who refer to free speech as not being the entitlement of everyone, if what the person says is utter garbage. I used to disagree, but I think my mind is slowly changing on this. 

Seriously though, get off your high horses and give some thought to others less fortunate than yourselves.

It's a key feature of Thai Visa and one of the reason why I don't post very often. This forum is really looked down on by the younger generation of expats here and this post is a good summary of why - lots of hate filled, spiteful people. It's a shame as there are a lot of good people here with tons of experience and knowledge to share withj others. 

[brewsterbudgen]

13 hours ago, unblocktheplanet said:

NES?

Native English Speaker

[arick]

On 8/14/2021 at 12:41 PM, chilly07 said:

Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit!

Brainless chilly07   I bet he will   

[arick]

3 hours ago, sleepwalker999 said:

It's a key feature of Thai Visa and one of the reason why I don't post very often. This forum is really looked down on by the younger generation of expats here and this post is a good summary of why - lots of hate filled, spiteful people. It's a shame as there are a lot of good people here with tons of experience and knowledge to share withj others. 

Yes many stupid comments if this was a facebook group they would be block. HOWEVER when I meet older and younger xpats they are polite and I continue on my way. 90% are not at the mark. 

[arick]

On 8/14/2021 at 6:52 AM, Gottfrid said:

Doesn´t matter how old your are when you relocate to another country. Just see to that you are financially secure. Otherwise, just stay home.

We are just staying home. What is there to do go out in Bangkok for dinner and a  drink.  555 we are staying home  what go on a flight  abroad. 

[simon43]

I used to teach science online from Thailand, (after I came back from in-class teaching in Myanmar).  I had an elite visa, but didn't like the grey area of legality about online teaching from Thailand.  So I moved to Laos, got a business visa and work permit for online teaching, and have stayed here now for about 2.5 years so far.  About 50% of my students are from China and I teach via iTalki profile listing website, (I don't like to work for imbeciles, which is what most online teaching organisations seem to be staffed/managed by).  I just checked my stats and have prepaid lesson bookings up to Xmas 2022, about $12,000 worth of lessons already prepaid by the students/parents, and I'll get that money after the lesson is completed.  So far, all is going well and I save $ each month in the local savings account here ????

[youreavinalaff]

A company that I was working for about 2 years ago have just announced that all teachers' pay will be reduced to $10 an hour. To put that into some kind of perspective, 2 years ago I was earning $19 an hour.

[carlyai]

On 8/9/2021 at 2:09 PM, Doctor Tom said:

How awful, I can't think of a worse teaching job than that. 

Chinese students are extremely smart, well mannered and a pleasure to teach. Never taught online, but a year in China teaching graduates. Definitely a pleasure.

[Doctor Tom]

21 hours ago, carlyai said:

Chinese students are extremely smart, well mannered and a pleasure to teach. Never taught online, but a year in China teaching graduates. Definitely a pleasure.

Graduates are not kids, not by a long chalk. Kids of any type are a pain to teach , online and Chinese, almost impossible.  I tired it for a week and damn near needed therapy afterwards, never again. 

[carlyai]

21 minutes ago, Doctor Tom said:

Graduates are not kids, not by a long chalk. Kids of any type are a pain to teach , online and Chinese, almost impossible.  I tired it for a week and damn near needed therapy afterwards, never again. 

Well there you go.

With a teaching degree and a diploma and certificate of TELFL, I worked at International schools here and Indonesia as well as at an Engineering college in Lam Chabang.

Teaching Asians is a pleasure.

You should try being a relief teacher in Australia. Horrible.

[youreavinalaff]

2 hours ago, Doctor Tom said:

Graduates are not kids, not by a long chalk. Kids of any type are a pain to teach , online and Chinese, almost impossible.  I tired it for a week and damn near needed therapy afterwards, never again. 

Maybe the fault was with the teacher or the curriculum.

 

I taught Chinese kids online for over 5 years. For the most part they were very good. Some exceptional. A small percentage were challenging.

[Doctor Tom]

5 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

Maybe the fault was with the teacher or the curriculum.

It may well have been the teacher (me), but not the curriculum.   But it was mainly the fault of kids who were being pushed to learn a language in which they obviously had no interest, by pushy Tiger Mums, at a time when they were probably hungry, tired and irritable, and with the attention span of a Nat.  I just felt sorry for them, and incidentally for me. 

[herfiehandbag]

On 8/9/2021 at 8:26 AM, CrunchWrapSupreme said:

So, who's on VIPKid/DadaABC/Magic Ears and is feeling the heat? Several of the expats I'd met out in Issan farang bars were.

 

What have you been hearing? What are your plans now?

I am on DaDa for a couple of hours two evenings a week and Saturday mornings. About USD100 a week - nice but not critical. It is all stopped now, with the sudden total ban on any lessons during the Chinese school holidays. That said DaDa have asked me to open up a couple of extra slots from 2 September.

 

My understanding is that classes will begin again in September - although not sure about weekends, or in quite what form they will be once the dust has settled and the new regulations are more clear.

 

For me it is a side gig, and if it ends it is not too critical - although I know that for some it is their main (only) income.

 

As an aside, what are the bets that the chap holding forth about people coming here without enough money, and working online without permits; either couldn't hack it or was turned down for online teaching because he was neither a Native English Speaker nor qualified? It seems a strange topic to alight on if you have no interest in it ...

Edited August 28, 2021 by herfiehandbag

[gk10012001]

On 8/9/2021 at 12:06 AM, CrunchWrapSupreme said:

No. I think most people are wise enough to have sufficient primary incomes. But if you have a few hours a day to kill, instead of drinking or watching the dogs and chickens fight, why not make some money online, meeting some nice people and helping them?

 

Many in Thailand having been doing freelance online work without issues. Us teachers do online teaching. Friends of mine do coding, editing documents, and trading crypto.

I always was hoping to do some tutoring on the side in the engineering math or sciences.  I am still a practicing engineer but when I retire (which is imminent) a little tutoring keeps the brain active, and I enjoy teaching.  It just seems a wast to not be able to apply what I have learned and to help others for some nominal fee.  I was imagining 10 hours a week or so would be optimal.  While I do not need the money, there is nothing wrong with some extra on the side that pays my food or grocery bill every month or whatever

[CrunchWrapSupreme]

On 8/28/2021 at 4:22 PM, gk10012001 said:

I am still a practicing engineer but when I retire (which is imminent) a little tutoring keeps the brain active, and I enjoy teaching.  It just seems a wast to not be able to apply what I have learned and to help others for some nominal fee.  I was imagining 10 hours a week or so would be optimal.

Glad to hear. This I believe is the ideal attitude. I really don't understand the negativity some have toward this activity, or teaching in general.

 

Indeed, we've gotta use it or lose it. This is what my students say to me having traveled abroad to study English at some point. Now back in their home countries, they have few opportunities to practice or improve. I regret not speaking more Spanish with my grandparents when I had the chance as a kid.

 

Yup, I'm usually doing an hour before my regular teaching job, then an hour in the evenings, then a few more on the weekends, for about 15 hours a week. My highest weekly take was $160, usually it's about $120, but now it's come down to around $100. We're definitely being affected by those coming in from the Chinese platforms.

[simon43]

[quote]

... We're definitely being affected by those coming in from the Chinese platforms.

[/quote]

 

I've found the effect to be positive, not negative, because I made the smart move to get out of online ESL teaching and specialise in online Science lessons, in English. (The only reason why I taught ESL was down to my RP British accent and good level of general education - I have always been interested in Science since just a few years of age).

 

[youreavinalaff]

16 hours ago, simon43 said:

[quote]

... We're definitely being affected by those coming in from the Chinese platforms.

[/quote]

 

I've found the effect to be positive, not negative, because I made the smart move to get out of online ESL teaching and specialise in online Science lessons, in English. (The only reason why I taught ESL was down to my RP British accent and good level of general education - I have always been interested in Science since just a few years of age).

 

Regardless of what you teach, what platform you use and how you connect with the student on internet, if the kids are in China there will be problems.

 

New story on the news today is that the Chinese government are going to limit online game playing to an hour a day for students. If they have the technology to monitor that, they will have the technology to monitor every form of online teaching/studying.

[cdemundo]

On 8/13/2021 at 4:52 PM, Gottfrid said:

Doesn´t matter how old your are when you relocate to another country. Just see to that you are financially secure. Otherwise, just stay home.

Do I need your permission?

I didn't know.

[recom273]

18 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

Regardless of what you teach, what platform you use and how you connect with the student on internet, if the kids are in China there will be problems.

 

New story on the news today is that the Chinese government are going to limit online game playing to an hour a day for students. If they have the technology to monitor that, they will have the technology to monitor every form of online teaching/studying.

The tech is simple - all these games online games are on websites  such as https://m.360.cn - they all use the same login credentials from the same big organizations, either your wechat or qq - login - or maybe they will do it via your cellphone number - either way it’s quite simple and easy for the CCP.
 

I think they already tried this with PE / PUBG - the kids just use their older brothers / parents credentials to circumnavigate, but it is a massive move. 
 

I am hearing that in some provinces the kids will be kept in school until 5-7 pm, with very little additional teaching time, just extended afternoon nap, exercise period and homework assignment. It’s hard I see how they think this will replace the time spent on extra curricular education. 
 

The kids wont have time to play games or attend (online) classes - they will be in school or travelling - maybe the CCP has effectively destroyed the gaming industry too. 

[Gottfrid]

3 hours ago, cdemundo said:

Do I need your permission?

I didn't know.

Very stupid remark. Never said anything about that. Is it more you don´t know? Maybe I can help you sort things out.

 

I fix this one for you. What you read about was my opinion. Which is a very good advise, if you just take the time it takes to understand it.

Edited August 30, 2021 by Gottfrid

[CrunchWrapSupreme]

4 hours ago, youreavinalaff said:

Regardless of what you teach, what platform you use and how you connect with the student on internet, if the kids are in China there will be problems.

I only occasionally get Chinese kids. Most of my students are teens and adults from other Asian & European countries, and Brazil. My problem isn't with the students, but with all the teachers coming in from the Chinese platforms, who in need of work are now grabbing my students, haha.

 

20 hours ago, simon43 said:

because I made the smart move to get out of online ESL teaching and specialise in online Science lessons, in English

Hehe, definitely not the first time us lowly ESL teachers have heard "you should be teaching a subject". I'm a bit old now to backtrack and get a BA or credential in something else. I really do like English. It was my favorite subject as a kid. I loved to read and was always complemented on my writing.

 

The pro to teaching a subject is, as you've said, you can specialize in it, establish a niche, and possibly make more money. Yet the downside is that is you ever need to go looking for a job, or more private students, finding one in need of math, science, music, whatever, is up to luck, while you'll always find someone in need of English.

 

I've also found that, especially with adult students who are more advanced, I'm no longer just teaching English. I'm also doing a lot of counseling and life coaching. Many times I'm asked to draw upon the experience I've had with my career path and the places I've worked, to help them along their journeys. They've asked me about how to ask for promotions or transfers, how to travel in search of new work, job interview tips, how to deal with difficult coworkers or bosses. There's also much conversational skill to be taught beyond simply the language itself, such as with proper turn taking, showing an interest in those you talk to, staying positive, avoiding conflict, finding common ground. It sounds like common sense, but for many it isn't. I used to actually be much worse at this sort of thing myself, but have grown from the experiences I've had, and am now happy to help others with it.

[youreavinalaff]

5 hours ago, CrunchWrapSupreme said:

I only occasionally get Chinese kids. Most of my students are teens and adults from other Asian & European countries, and Brazil.

Sounds like you are on Cambly.

 

I gave up on that on months back. Once I worked out the actual hourly rate, taking into account waiting time and gaps between students.

 

Then the poor exchange rates given by PayPal. It amounts to between $5 and $7 an hour.

 

 

[simon43]

[quote]

..finding one in need of math, science, music, whatever, is up to luck, 

[/quote]

 

I have never gone looking for students ????  They look for me, based I suppose, on personal recommendations. I learnt many years ago that almost all young kids love science - boys and girls, so long as it is not taught in a 'boring' manner.  Unfortunately, IMHO, most science teachers are boring....

 

I'm almost up to 4,000 science lessons taught on iTalki, plus many other students via other channels.  I must be doing something right ????

[CrunchWrapSupreme]

18 hours ago, youreavinalaff said:

Then the poor exchange rates given by PayPal. It amounts to between $5 and $7 an hour.

That's correct. The pay rate is $10/hr, but that hour's usually not fully productive, with about 50-75% of it filled with pay talk time, resulting in that pay rate. My hours used to be filled a months back, not so now with the Chinese platform refugees. I was getting $600, yet can still be happy with a $400-500 monthly take. I also got my regular job.

 

My primary concern is my $250 car payment. My moo ban is stunned by the farang going into his room everyday, talking on his computer, and has a new car sitting in his driveway for it. ????????

 

Heh, I've been in Cambly debates way too many times and don't care to again. I'll just say, yeah it sucks. The pay is <deleted>. No support, frequent technical issues. However, upside is the flexibility. Just grab whichever hours you want to work. Zero lesson prep. No scoring or progress reports to do, or homework to give. Usually better students, as I've said, many older professionals and great conversations. As for the downtime waiting for students, heh, I was sitting in front of my computer anyway after work, reading news, watching YouTube, which I can still do with that time and now get paid for it as students show up.

 

Yet I'm by no means defending or shilling for them, they're much a necessary evil. I've put in apps to the other platforms, including that big European one with much better pay, which I have the qualifications, and even a reference for. But they and others were already full even before the Chinese platform refugees, and thus now seem impossible.

[Jillie Norman]

I have a friend teaching Chinese Students and according to her, Chinese pay less compare to Taiwanese and Japanese. Despite of this, she treats all classes equally fun.