So... the people you haven't managed to double jab are now on your list for not being double jabbed?

 I will use Kalasin again as an example. 68.2% yet to be fully vaccinated. If these people cannot access employment or services it's down to him and the govt.

When I read "DPM Anutin" it always makes me think his title is "Damage Per Minute Anutin".

57 minutes ago, Geoffggi said:

This was not the discussion, it was if vaccinated people can carry and pass on the virus which there is no doubt they can

As my post evidenced, they can but the viral load dropped quicker than those who had not been vaccinated so the conclusion is? They are not as infectious as a non vaccinated person after a week. 

A misleading and off topic post has been removed

They [the vaccinated] spread it LESS and put a LOT LESS stress on the health system. So yes they are putting people more at risk. Just accept the facts. Is it so hard to accept that non vaccinated people do pose a health risk and do burden the health system more as those that are not vaxed. 

 

This has been proven already by people who know what they are doing. 

 

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/vaccinated-people-are-less-likely-spread-covid-new-research-finds-n1280583

Again blame in this thread seems to be pointed at the unvaccinated but the greatest % of these will be due to lack of access not personal choice.

1 hour ago, robblok said:

They [the vaccinated] spread it LESS and put a LOT LESS stress on the health system. So yes they are putting people more at risk. Just accept the facts. Is it so hard to accept that non vaccinated people do pose a health risk and do burden the health system more as those that are not vaxed. 

 

This has been proven already by people who know what they are doing. 

 

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/vaccinated-people-are-less-likely-spread-covid-new-research-finds-n1280583

You are perfectly at liberty to believe what you wish to believe

People understand it that vaccinated can still spread, nobody ever said they can't however studies have shown that they spread it LESS. 

 

Its like saying but drunk driving isnt that bad because non drunk drivers have accidents too. But everyone knows that the risk of accident while drunk is much higher. 

 

Its the same for vaxxed vs not vaxed. 

 

I think its hard for antivaxers to accept that they are part of the problem. (especially so in Europe where the health system is being overwhelmed mainly by non vaxxed as its proven that people have like an 8 times less chance to get in hospital when vaxxed) In my country the doctors and nurses are not happy at all with the antivaxers as they make their life harder, cause operation to be postphoned.

3 minutes ago, Geoffggi said:

You are perfectly at liberty to believe what you wish to believe

I don't believe, believing is for idiots, I trust science and experiments and experts like in the article i linked. There are many like that. Believing is what antivaxers do as they have no proof so its a bit like religious people despite the lack of proof they believe. 

 

People like me don't believe we trust the science and tests that have been done. Your group on the other hand trust crackpot sites because no serious person will back you guys up.

 

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2294250-how-much-less-likely-are-you-to-spread-covid-19-if-youre-vaccinated/

 

A recent study found that vaccinated people infected with the delta variant are 63 per cent less likely to infect people who are unvaccinated.

 

This is only slightly lower than with the alpha variant, says Brechje de Gier at the National Institute for Public Health and the Environment in the Netherlands, who led the study. Her team had previously found that vaccinated people infected with alpha were 73 per cent less likely to infect unvaccinated people.

What is important to realise, de Gier says, is that the full effect of vaccines on reducing transmission is even higher than 63 per cent, because most vaccinated people don’t become infected in the first place.

4 hours ago, robblok said:

The discussion is going on in every country, I am all for a segregated society.

Historically, that's never ended very well.

 

3 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

Again blame in this thread seems to be pointed at the unvaccinated but the greatest % of these will be due to lack of access not personal choice.

That only goes for the people who live in Thailand,In Europe or the US there is no lack of access.

 

3 month bank statement + 6 month proof of vaccination for your next marriage/retirement extension.

 

 

 

 

1 hour ago, huangnon said:

Historically, that's never ended very well.

 

 

You know the difference being is that taking a jab is a choice. You guys choose not do something while a simple jab will let you do all you want. That is seggregation by choice.

1 hour ago, robblok said:

 

You know the difference being is that taking a jab is a choice. You guys choose not do something while a simple jab will let you do all you want. That is seggregation by choice.

But you are the one calling for a similarly-segregated society..

All you can argue until you're blue in the face but here's the truth.  If the government decides that proof of vaccination is necessary to stay in the future, then [deleted] or get off the pot.  Many people here are fond of saying "their country, their rules".  It really doesn't matter if you think it's just or even scientifically proven or not.

 

I'm in the pro-vaccine camp myself and got it back home and hopefully getting a booster before the end of Christmas break.  Granted, I work with students every day so it's a matter of necessity at that point but regardless would want it.

 

 

1 hour ago, huangnon said:

 But you are the one calling for a similarly-segregated society..

Nothing similar about it, on one side you got people who could not do anything to be segregated (Jews, gays, gypsies, mental patients). while now we got people who can with a jab become part of the other group. A jab that billions have taken with really low risk compared to covid. 

 

So yes the comparison is stupid because one is forced segregation with no option to be excluded while on the other hand with a simple jab you can get out of the group.

 

Even more telling is that those who are not taking the jab pose an greater risk then those jabbed about spreading the infection and a many times bigger chance of clogging up the hospitals. 

1 hour ago, tifino said:

they instead then become a "Carrier"  Much like how a Mum who contracted German Measles as a kid does not suffer herself through her life, but her new born Daughter ends up needing a Cochlear Implant, and beer bottle lens spectacles... 

Why the emotive language? They're infectious for maybe 10 days and that's it.

Research that i have posted in this topic now a number of times supports what i say. So maybe its time for you to read the right stuff instead of fringe sites.

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2294250-how-much-less-likely-are-you-to-spread-covid-19-if-youre-vaccinated/

 

A recent study found that vaccinated people infected with the delta variant are 63 per cent less likely to infect people who are unvaccinated.

 

This is only slightly lower than with the alpha variant, says Brechje de Gier at the National Institute for Public Health and the Environment in the Netherlands, who led the study. Her team had previously found that vaccinated people infected with alpha were 73 per cent less likely to infect unvaccinated people.

What is important to realise, de Gier says, is that the full effect of vaccines on reducing transmission is even higher than 63 per cent, because most vaccinated people don’t become infected in the first place.

De Gier and her team used data from the Netherlands’ contact tracing system to work out the so-called secondary attack rate – the proportion of contacts infected by positive cases. They then worked out how much this was reduced by vaccination, adjusting for factors such as age.

It has nothing to do with personal choice not when it directly affects me my life and my livelihood -not to mention the millions around the globe. And to all the deniers that will say that the vaccinated can also get the virus and pass it on, just look at the numbers look at the recovery and death rates and look at the symptoms

Happy.

This mob of miserable cronies that ban this, ban that have made Thailand the most unhappyest I ever seen in my 30 years of  coming here and residing for the last 13.

2 hours ago, Pouatchee said:

I have no issues getting vaccinated. However, I do want to have a say in which vaccine I will jab into my body. I want nothing to do with the local Astrazaneca nor do I want anything to do with the Chinese <deleted> that is being forced upon all residents of Thailand... I am willing to pay for Pfizer or even Moderna... but here where I live neither are available.

 

Funny thing is... the government jabbed the Matayom school boys with Pfizer... might that have anything to do with the fact that they will likely soon be drafted into the army? The Video Star seems to be taking care of his own...

I think Sinovac is the safest one out of them all...Hardly any side effects...

2 hours ago, Geoffggi said:

From the article you posted : Although fully vaccinated people were less likely to contract an infection, when they did — what’s known as a breakthrough infection — they can transmit the Delta variant at a similar level as unvaccinated people.

All your hollow arguments won't wash mate, pure balderdash. ????????

45 minutes ago, robblok said:

Just accept the facts. Is it so hard to accept that non vaccinated people do pose a health risk and do burden the health system more as those that are not vaxed. 

Yeah....I know, it's very confusing

 

P.S. Poor governments. They now have to convince the unvaxed to take the jab, because it works and convince the double vaxed to get their boosters because the first two shots didn't     

4 hours ago, Gandtee said:

Another shot?? That will be four!! Some poor buggers are still waiting for one! Privileged? Just a tad maybe.????

who's waiting ? now available to all, except if you feel you must have Moderna

So what's the point of this article....

 

I would say the point is to prime the pumps and getting people use to living in a possible medical apartheid state......

 

And every person who meekly bows down and shows their vax status to do something is going to be helping to make it worse and worse for everyone...

4 hours ago, robblok said:

The discussion is going on in every country, I am all for a segregated society. If you don't want to VAX that is ok just accept the consequences of it.  Personally i feel that being vaccinated and by doing so spreading the virus LESS, and putting up to 8 times less stress on the health system should be rewarded by having more freedoms. 

 

If vaxers can't accept that their choice has an effect on their life then they need to think what is more important for them. Its the soft forcing of people, who can still refuse just have to accept their limited options then.

 

9 minutes ago, Thaifly88 said:

who's waiting ? now available to all, except if you feel you must have Moderna

The 11 million in Thailand who have not even had the first shot yet due to not enough vaccines in rural areas may have something different to say about that.

57 minutes ago, soumanioco said:

It has nothing to do with personal choice not when it directly affects me my life and my livelihood -not to mention the millions around the globe. And to all the deniers that will say that the vaccinated can also get the virus and pass it on, just look at the numbers look at the recovery and death rates and look at the symptoms.

hear hear - the PC statement that both vaccinated and unvaccinated can carry and transmit the virus is true, however, the unvaccinated are far likely to contract the virus and pass it on. Also, the unvaccinated are a far greater burden on the health system than the vaccinated. It's not about personal choice, it's about the unvaccinated taking up valuable ICU spots that could have been prevented.  Singapore agrees that it is a personal choice to be vaccinated or not, and they now do not cover the unvaccinated in their national health scheme if they contract Covid. 

53 minutes ago, jvs said:

That only goes for the people who live in Thailand,In Europe or the US there is no lack of access.

 

Well yes and this is a Thai forum that's why I said it. 53.65% of the nation fully vaccinated. They have 6 wks to vaccinate the rest (basically half the popⁿ) if as has been said ad nauseam by someone whose presence on here is in no way missed by me, they are to reach their target. Not sure if 100% fully jabbed was their target but I'll go with it.