Electric Vehicles in Thailand

[Pib]

Based on above news since EV sellers must "complete" the vehicle regristration process (I.e., get the white tags for the vehicle) before they can actually receive the subsidy and since this process can easily take 30 (or more) it makes sense why BYD said their current reduced/discounted price for the Atto 3 I'm buying is only good till 30 Nov.  

 

Hopefully the deadline extension till 31 Dec will be approved (and additional extensions after that).  But if its not, EV sales numbers are probably going to spike over the next two months (a last call to get the subsidy type thing) as buyers take advantage of the current subsidy and then the sales will plummet without a subsidy as EV sellers raise prices back to pre-subsidy level.

 

And the "draft/unapproved" replacement EV 3.5 Subsidy Program for 2024 to replace the current approved EV 3.0 Subsidy Program is as mentioned still just a draft/unapproved program for 2024 which will determine subsidy and possibly excise tax savings for 2024.  But I expect EV 3.5 (which is currently not as generous as EV 3.0) to be approved in the final weeks of Dec as governments typically wait till the 11th hour to approve a lot of things.

 

[Pib]

11 hours ago, Andrew Dwyer said:

September EV registrations:

 

 

 

BYD top two places ( might be 3 next month as the Seal seems very popular).

 

Also seems like the MG EP has never ending stock, almost feels like they rushed the release of the MG ES.

Sales for the BYD Dolphin released in Thailand in July have really shot up since a sale takes spprox 30 days (or more) to complete the govt regristration process and then show-up in regristration stats.

 

The Dolphin was the best selling EV in Thailand for Sep....really burst onto the scene! 

 

And I expect the just released BYD Seal will be showing some very healthy sales/registrations in the Oct/Nov stats....I'm going to guess in the 300-500 ballpark come Nov stats....something lower for Oct stats due to registration lag time.

 

Right now BYD is the elephant in the room when it comes to Thailand EV sales.

[vinny41]

2 hours ago, Bandersnatch said:

Thailand pledges support for ICE vehicle production amidst EV transition.

 

“Thai prime minister highlighted Japan’s position as the top foreign direct investor. However, he raised concerns that the evolving Thai EV market might disadvantage Japanese businesses, given their slower pace in adopting EV technology”

 

https://thethaiger.com/news/business/thailand-pledges-support-for-ice-vehicle-production-amidst-ev-transition

 

Seems a strange comment consider the massive recent investment by Chinese companies in Thailand.

 

In addition to the fuel subsidy what are they going to do? 

 

Here are some of the incentives for ICE vehicle manufacturing

• Corporate Income Tax (CIT) exemption for up to eight years;
• Import duty exemption on machinery;
• Import duty exemption on raw materials used in manufacturing export products;
• Permit to bring skilled workers and experts to work in investment promoted activities;
• Permit to own land; and
• Permit to take out or remit money in foreign currency.
• https://www.aseanbriefing.com/news/thailands-automotive-industry-opportunities-incentives/

[Andrew Dwyer]

31 minutes ago, Pib said:

Sales for the BYD Dolphin released in Thailand in July have really shot up since a sale takes spprox 30 days (or more) to complete the govt regristration process and then show-up in regristration stats.

 

The Dolphin was the best selling EV in Thailand for Sep....really burst onto the scene! 

 

And I expect the just released BYD Seal will be showing some very healthy sales/registrations in the Oct/Nov stats....I'm going to guess in the 300-500 ballpark come Nov stats....something lower for Oct stats due to registration lag time.

 

Right now BYD is the elephant in the room when it comes to Thailand EV sales.

Yup, the 30 days registration estimate is usually very flexible, in my experience.

 

Honda - 2 months 

MG - 2 + 1/2 months 

Haval - 30 days 

 

An Atto 3 parked up at a nearby house has been on red plates since April !

[vinny41]

12 minutes ago, Andrew Dwyer said:

Yup, the 30 days registration estimate is usually very flexible, in my experience.

 

Honda - 2 months 

MG - 2 + 1/2 months 

Haval - 30 days 

 

An Atto 3 parked up at a nearby house has been on red plates since April !

I have come across people that have the white plates at home but choose to keep the red plates on yes they don't get their plate deposit back from the dealer but for some people red plates are a status symbol that they don't want to give up

[Pib]

I remember an EV subsidy news article from a month or two ago where a MG Company executive was requesting the govt extended the current subsidy deadline because the DLT was taking a lot longer than 30 days to complete the regristration after dealers submitted regristration paperwork.  And that was one main reason MG was only offering reduced prices till the end of Sep.  But I think MG has since extended their Sep deadline.

 

Now way back in late 2008 when I bought my new Fortuner it only took about 2 weeks for the Toyota dealership to complete the regristration and get my white tags.

 

I wonder if the guy having red tags since April is waiting to get some special, lucky auspicious tag number (like tag on back order) but the regristration process has completed enough for BYD to get paid the subsidy.  Over the years I've seen some new cars in my neighborhood have red tags for many months (like 6 months) but then one day they have white tags with a seemingly plain old random number.  Don't know why going from red to white tags took so long.

 

[Andrew Dwyer]

5 minutes ago, Pib said:

 

I wonder if the guy having red tags since April is waiting to get some special, lucky auspicious tag number (like tag on back order) but the regristration process has completed enough for BYD to get paid the subsidy.  Over the years I've seen some new cars in my neighborhood have red tags for many months (like 6 months) but then one day they have white tags with a seemingly plain old random number.  Don't know why going from red to white tags took so long.

 

Probably like Vinny says, the red plates are used as a status thing and they are hanging on to them.

Its not as if we are in the sticks and they would have to travel far to change plates, at the time the nearest showroom would have been about 30 minutes away.

[Pib]

17 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

I have come across people that have the white plates at home but choose to keep the red plates on yes they don't get their plate deposit back from the dealer but for some people red plates are a status symbol that they don't want to give up

Way back in 2008 when retiring to Thailand and buying a Fortuner a few weeks after arriving while being a newbie to red tags and since traffic police checkpoints were common I initially followed the red tags rules of documenting daily my trips in the red tag book and some other rules associated with driving a car with red tags.   

 

But after about a week I said heck with the red tag rules and just drove like I had white tags. 

 

And the wife was a little sad when putting on our white tags because as you said it was a status symbol to her....a visible status symbol of having money to buy a new car....a real HiSo.

[BKKBike09]

20 minutes ago, Andrew Dwyer said:

Probably like Vinny says, the red plates are used as a status thing and they are hanging on to them.

The longer it takes to get the white plates, the 'newer' the car is when registered i.e. you buy in Oct 2022 but don't get registration book/white plates issued till Apr 2023, car can be described as '2023' model when selling.

 

Also, red plates = no speeding tickets ...

[Bandersnatch]

16 hours ago, mistral53 said:

Is labor cost in Thailand really on par with industrialized countries for ceramic coating? I know the quality of a paint correction correlates directly with the skill of the workers deployed, and being skimpy can lead to a long lasting aggravation of swirls in the paint instead of the glitz I fancy - do I miss something here?

 

What are prices you guys are being quoted?

We bought a new SUV 2 years ago and were quoted ฿20,000 for ceramic.

 

We found another place in Buriram that does PPF  - quoted ฿45k for the seal and ฿42k if not wrapping the glass roof

[BKKBike09]

3 hours ago, Bandersnatch said:

Thailand pledges support for ICE vehicle production amidst EV transition.

 

“Thai prime minister highlighted Japan’s position as the top foreign direct investor. However, he raised concerns that the evolving Thai EV market might disadvantage Japanese businesses, given their slower pace in adopting EV technology”

 

https://thethaiger.com/news/business/thailand-pledges-support-for-ice-vehicle-production-amidst-ev-transition

 

Seems a strange comment consider the massive recent investment by Chinese companies in Thailand.

 

This speaks to the pressure on the Govt from the legacy car makers, especially Toyota (which has about a third of the auto market), Honda and Isuzu, none of whom have yet to embrace EVs or, alternatively, some other alternative to ICE.

 

These companies still dominate the Thai auto market and have massive clout with government, thanks both to domestic sales, export earnings and the whole associated auto parts supply chain.

 

Don't forget that the surging EV sales are still only a small % of the total market, which is expected to be around 850,000 this year. Toyota recently said their target for the year is 290,000 vehicles (including pickups). 

 

Total auto market in August 2023 was 60,234 (down nearly 12% y-o-y). That included:

 

Toyota - 20,871 (down 10.6%)

Isuzu - 11,380 (down 28.2%)

Honda - 7,084 (up 0.2%)

 

If these guys aren't very worried, they should be. Reminds me slightly of BlackBerry. "Ignore disruptive tech - we will tell consumers what they want".

 

I also think Tesla could be heading for a massive fall if it doesn't a) diversify its line-up ASAP and b) introduce a cheap and cheerful model (USD 25K or less) to attract younger buyers to the brand and build future loyalty to it.

 

All the fear about Chinese cars / spyware etc also won't mean much, if anything at all, to the next generation of car buyers, who will likely be hostile to the very thought of an internal combustion engine.

 

 

[Bandersnatch]

Check the speed of the charger before you plug in 

 

 

PTT has 160 kW 

 

Any others?

[leclec]

17 hours ago, mistral53 said:

Is labor cost in Thailand really on par with industrialized countries for ceramic coating? I know the quality of a paint correction correlates directly with the skill of the workers deployed, and being skimpy can lead to a long lasting aggravation of swirls in the paint instead of the glitz I fancy - do I miss something here?

 

What are prices you guys are being quoted?

These prices are pretty high compared to where I'm from (Singapore) 

[Andrew Dwyer]

20 minutes ago, leclec said:

These prices are pretty high compared to where I'm from (Singapore) 

This guy says he will be travelling from Rayong to Singapore in his Seal, maybe he will take advantage of the cheaper coating while there.

 

 

It appears the license plate has been reversed and the SG ( or is it Malaysia? ) tag painted on the back.

Is this what they do when you take a car to another country, and how did he get the white plate so quickly ??

[JBChiangRai]

AAS gave me all the paperwork to register my car in Chiang Rai (mostly proof duty had been paid).

 

I got the car in June and went to the DLT mid February the following year.

 

That extra year helped with the 2nd hand value when I sold it after 2 years and I got no speeding/traffic light fines.

[Pib]

7 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

AAS gave me all the paperwork to register my car in Chiang Rai (mostly proof duty had been paid).

 

I got the car in June and went to the DLT mid February the following year.

 

That extra year helped with the 2nd hand value when I sold it after 2 years and I got no speeding/traffic light fines.

How long could a person legally, technically drag out (delay) switching from red to white tags assuming the dealer didn't demand the red tags back after X-amount of months.  Maybe until the annual regristration tax sticker is due which might be a year away.

[JBChiangRai]

7 minutes ago, Pib said:

How long could a person legally, technically drag out (delay) switching from red to white tags assuming the dealer didn't demand the red tags back after X-amount of months.  Maybe until the annual regristration tax sticker is due which might be a year away.

Somebody told me one month, but that’s not validated 

 

[macahoom]

18 minutes ago, Pib said:

How long could a person legally, technically drag out (delay) switching from red to white tags assuming the dealer didn't demand the red tags back after X-amount of months.  Maybe until the annual regristration tax sticker is due which might be a year away.

You'll probably think I'm making this up; I'm not.

 

12-13 years ago, my friend bought a new Fortuner in Bangkok. I actually picked it up and drove it down to Phuket for him.

 

He had red plates for more than two years. He kept pushing the dealership to change them but, for some reason, it took them forever.

 

He didn't have any problem from the police.

[vinny41]

15 minutes ago, Pib said:

How long could a person legally, technically drag out (delay) switching from red to white tags assuming the dealer didn't demand the red tags back after X-amount of months.  Maybe until the annual regristration tax sticker is due which might be a year away.

Many people have purchased cars from dealers and found out later that the dealer has provided them with fake red plates 

https://www.thairath.co.th/tags/ป้ายแดงปลอม

There is a case going through the courts where a dealer sold 34 cars and owners have requested white plates and after 2 years still have no white plates

https://www.khaosod.co.th/breaking-news/news_7475848

[Andrew Dwyer]

Veering slightly further off topic but ( hopefully ) interesting enough to be included !

On a trip to Hua Hin last year I lost my license plate, a quick visit to the police to register the loss/theft meant I could travel back to Yutya [sic] safely.

Visited the DLT and for the princely sum of 105 baht was told to return in 90 days.

Same thing happened to my bil a few months after but he was hit with a 850 baht cost, the only difference being his car on finance.

 

Nice mark up Mr Finance !

[Pib]

17 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

Somebody told me one month, but that’s not validated 

 

Yes...I pretty sure that is what the "unenforced" law/regulation says.

[Gweiloman]

1 hour ago, Andrew Dwyer said:

This guy says he will be travelling from Rayong to Singapore in his Seal, maybe he will take advantage of the cheaper coating while there.

 

 

It appears the license plate has been reversed and the SG ( or is it Malaysia? ) tag painted on the back.

Is this what they do when you take a car to another country, and how did he get the white plate so quickly ??

This is not a painted tag but a sticker. All the insurance agents on the border towns between Thailand and Malaysia can do this on the spot.

 

Yes, it’s very strange how he managed to get the white plate so quickly, unless it’s an old registration transferred from one of his other cars? That would logically speed up the process of getting the white plate.

[digbeth]

Tesla are only delivering cars with white plate, 

and in my experience of a few new cars and motorcycle the DLT isn't the hold up, if all the paper works are in order, you go to the DLT with registration kit, and you come home with the plate in a day, unless the plates are out of stock which is rare.

It's the delays in getting the paperwork from the manufacturers that's usually the hold up,

traditionally for legacy autos like Honda or Toyotas in Thailand, the car is delivered on consignment as in the dealers don't pay anything to the manufacturer like Honda until the customers take delivery, and only after the manufacturer has been paid, will they release the paperwork or 'registration kit' back to the dealers to register, so it's in the dealer's interest and cashflow to stall or delay paying the manufacturer, imported cars work under similar deals too where technically they don't pay customs etc until the customers register the vehicle.

 

But with the looming deadline of subsidy expiring, it's in everyone's interest to get customers out the door as soon as possible, looks like the sales team are already working overtime delivering cars which was rare 

[Pib]

About 5 years back the govt started puffing its chest regarding the registration being completed with 30 days like below 2017 and 2018 news articles.  That is you better get the registration done and white plates on your vehicle with 30 days or else!!!!!!  

https://www.nationthailand.com/in-focus/30328273

https://thainews.prd.go.th/en/news/detail/WNOHT6101150010001

 

I also remember other red tag related articles about 5 years ago which was more focused on getting dealerships to pay import/excise taxes paid when they "first receive" the car in Thailand vs delaying until they actually sell the car which could be many months to even years later like talked above by digbeth.  Now many car selling companies pushed back on having to pay the taxes immediately and I don't know if the govt and car companies ever reached a compromise or everything just ended-up staying as before after all the back-and-forth argument dust settled (all too typical for Thailand).

 

I wasn't in the market for a vehicle at the time and didn't follow it that close other than interested in trying to satisfy my curiosity as why some people use red tags for a "l....o......n.....g time" before eventually putting white plates on. 

 

I now remember asking one neighbor (who has since moved away) years back why he hadn't got the white plates for his new car as he had it for many months....he just said some paperwork issue between the dealership and DLT.  Now if this reason was the truth versus it just being a red tag status thing I don't know.  But if it was paperwork issue I expect the dealership hadn't paid the necessary taxes yet....completed all the necessary paperwork recording the car's entry into Thailand.  Maybe a game of delaying payment of import/excise taxes as it benefitted the dealership's cash flow more than the dealership's interest in getting the white plates to the buyer...like digbeth talked. Besides, maybe the buyer was perfectly happy to have red tags as long as possible....the new car status thingie.

 

[digbeth]

Some do it for the status too, seen in the Tesla groups that while their vehicles are delivered with white plate, some went to procure red plate and put them on just for the hell of it (probably fake plate too, due to them being in short supply) 

 

most that want to play keeping up with the jones/somchais next door are probably happy to have red plate for the first few months, the minority that don't or had bad experience being given the run around from dealers about white plate know to demand immediate delivery of white plate or registration kit to do it yourself and save the courier fee. 

 

Now with the EV subsidy, there's probably extra paperwork involved that needs to go back to the government or importer, so no dealer's gonna let you drive home with registration kit to do it yourself at the DLT, so it probably comes down to the courier/DLT agent they use, whereas in normal circumstance they could save the trouble and bundle up a few of the dealer customers and only go down to DLT once a month, but with the expiry date of subsidy looming, the agent might not be used to the workload, plus all these EV dealers are mostly new (save some that are existing ICE cars dealer) I'd expect there are hiccups in getting plates in time

[Andrew Dwyer]

It was only a matter of time:

 

[mistral53]

My first mod - even though it is fake carbon fiber, it looks soooo much better than the original cheap hard plastic! Moreover, the quality of this plastic molding is amazing, especially considering the low price.

 

[Bandersnatch]

1 hour ago, mistral53 said:

My first mod - even though it is fake carbon fiber, it looks soooo much better than the original cheap hard plastic! Moreover, the quality of this plastic molding is amazing, especially considering the low price.

 

 

Looks good, did you buy and fit yourself? How much?

[BKKBike09]

23 hours ago, Pib said:

How long could a person legally, technically drag out (delay) switching from red to white tags assuming the dealer didn't demand the red tags back after X-amount of months.  Maybe until the annual regristration tax sticker is due which might be a year away.

Legally, I don't know. In practice: I have a friend with a big Beemer (X4 I think) who's had it on red plates for more than 3 years. The dealer (in Bangkok) doesn't seem to care.

[BKKBike09]

On 10/7/2023 at 10:16 AM, Bandersnatch said:

 

PTT has 160 kW 

 

Any others?

Those speeds are total output per charging station.

 

I know from experience (with both PEA and PTT's EV Station) that once you connect more than one car to a station, the total output is shared between them. Some stations can charge 3 cars using different charging set ups so it's quite possible to be plugged in to a 160 kW charger and only get 50 kW (or a PTT 50 kW one and only get 20 kW).

 

If your car won't charge faster than say 80 KW (eg Atto) then not getting top speed isn't so much of an issue. But it must be frustrating to have a car that could take 120+ and only be getting 50 ...