On 6/30/2022 at 6:24 PM, Mac Mickmanus said:

He did Pledge to get the UK out the E.U. and kept to that pledge 

Except he clearly has not, otherwise he’d not be messing around with the Brexit treaty he signed.

6 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Except he clearly has not, otherwise he’d not be messing around with the Brexit treaty he signed.

The U.K has left the E.U , the Ireland issue is just a side issue that needs to be sorted out ,( It OK though, I wont be bringing it to anyones attention that you wrote something that isnt true )

6 hours ago, Loiner said:

Doubtful, but they could do worse. In fact they did as part of the old united soviet. 
The British Empire was the best thing to happen to the whole world since the Romans. 

Tell this good news to those hundred millions souls killed during conquering and maintaining empire and through constant wars with the other empires. Starting with scotland and ireland, to american indians, australian aborigins, slavery trade, opium trade, african concentration camps, to two world wars (yes, they were also part of maintaining an empire). 
For the last 70 years maintaining post-imperial order. Including wars, arms trade, cold war. 
why boris went twice to kiyev in secret talks and within short time? Why just one courtesy visit was not enough? why not much more convenient video conferences, phone calls - as the rest of diplomacy is done in a war torn country. Thats to sell/exchange arms and military aid for ukrainian food. And he didn't want to be recorded, taped or overheard in yet another scandal. 

there would be many more atrocities with participation of the british government and its arms diplomacy. Most of the victims would be ukrainians themselves, escalation into neighbouring countries and european war

 

https://www.justiceinfo.net/en/79636-colonial-crimes-the-empire-on-which-justice-almost-never-sets.html

 

https://www.theguardian.com/news/2016/aug/18/uncovering-truth-british-empire-caroline-elkins-mau-mau

33 minutes ago, internationalism said:

Tell this good news to those hundred millions souls killed during conquering and maintaining empire and through constant wars with the other empires. Starting with scotland and ireland, to american indians, australian aborigins, slavery trade, opium trade, african concentration camps, to two world wars (yes, they were also part of maintaining an empire). 
For the last 70 years maintaining post-imperial order. Including wars, arms trade, cold war.

???? Sounds a bit biased?

 

As they say there are only two kinds of people in the world. Brits and those who wish they were.

32 minutes ago, VocalNeal said:

???? Sounds a bit biased?

 

As they say there are only two kinds of people in the world. Brits and those who wish they were.

Nope. In Canada we are happy to be free of them. 

???? Take off, eh!

1 hour ago, VocalNeal said:

???? Sounds a bit biased?

 

As they say there are only two kinds of people in the world. Brits and those who wish they were.

never heard that expression, but probably exists that, or very similar, in any language. Just nationalistic jingoism, good for maintaining social and political order, and for motivating troops to fight against other soldiers fed the same swill - for the pure benefit of the ruling class.

The UK is the second global arms dealer. Any war, anywhere, is good for them.

Even, if they have to send their own troops as a cannon fodder - still, a lot of money to be made on their death. New soldiers, those recruits from unemployed, poor council estates (including those in scotland and ireland), will be born and slaughtered.

Johnson will fight for their global market share to the last dead soldier.

Even better, if they are Ukrainian nationalists.

Britain has their own imperial soldiers heroes. Ukrain has Bandera neo-fascist heroes. 

 

https://caat.org.uk/news/new-stats-show-uk-government-is-the-second-biggest-arms-dealer-in-the-world/

10 hours ago, internationalism said:

Tell this good news to those hundred millions souls killed during conquering and maintaining empire and through constant wars with the other empires.

 

No, I'm telling you that the British Empire was the best thing to happen to the whole world since the Romans. Anybody who was around at that time is not available to tell you that your hand wringing revisionist history is just soppy rhetoric.

 

Turn the volume down on your violins and have a recount on your hundred millions. It sounds far too exaggerated. 

10 hours ago, internationalism said:

Thats to sell/exchange arms and military aid for ukrainian food. And he didn't want to be recorded, taped or overheard in yet another scandal. 

Why would that be a "scandal" ?

The U.K openly buys Ukrainian food now and also sells arms to Ukraine 

1 hour ago, Loiner said:

No, I'm telling you that the British Empire was the best thing to happen to the whole world since the Romans. Anybody who was around at that time is not available to tell you that your hand wringing revisionist history is just soppy rhetoric.

 

Turn the volume down on your violins and have a recount on your hundred millions. It sounds far too exaggerated. 

Come om! I don't know how many people have been killed, but It's well known that the British, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Belgian, Italian etc... colonial empires have been established and maintained based on killings and oppression. There has been some positive impact in terms of education, infrastructure or institutions, but it cannot be said that autochtones were happy to be colonised.

2 hours ago, Loiner said:

No, I'm telling you that the British Empire was the best thing to happen to the whole world since the Romans. Anybody who was around at that time is not available to tell you that your hand wringing revisionist history is just soppy rhetoric.

 

Turn the volume down on your violins and have a recount on your hundred millions. It sounds far too exaggerated. 

Odd that the colonies were so eager to kick the British out.

1 hour ago, candide said:

Come om! I don't know how many people have been killed, but It's well known that the British, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Belgian, Italian etc... colonial empires have been established and maintained based on killings and oppression. There has been some positive impact in terms of education, infrastructure or institutions, but it cannot be said that autochtones were happy to be colonised.

Empires based on killings and oppression were a fact of life and had been so for thousands of years. Nothing new there but the apologists seem to think Britain invented it. Nobody would be bothered about the autochtones, although they would probably have been better off under the British Empire than most others. 

57 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Odd that the colonies were so eager to kick the British out.

Obviously they had seen the trade and new opportunities in vastly improved countries. They could smell the money created by dear old Blighty. 

3 minutes ago, Loiner said:

Obviously they had seen the trade and new opportunities in vastly improved countries. They could smell the money created by dear old Blighty. 

It’s not to late to learn the history you have somehow missed.

7 minutes ago, Loiner said:

Empires based on killings and oppression were a fact of life and had been so for thousands of years. Nothing new there but the apologists seem to think Britain invented it. Nobody would be bothered about the autochtones, although they would probably have been better off under the British Empire than most others. 

Nobody has suggested Britain invented Empire based on killing and oppression.

 

 

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Odd that the colonies were so eager to kick the British out.

The British wanted to leave the colonies , just like leaving the E.U , Britain choose to leave .

   The former colonies still remain part of the Commonwealth (apart from the few that left) though

32 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

The British wanted to leave the colonies , just like leaving the E.U , Britain choose to leave .

   The former colonies still remain part of the Commonwealth (apart from the few that left) though

“The British wanted to leave the colonies , just like leaving the E.U , Britain choose to leave .”

 

Utter nonsense.

8 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

“The British wanted to leave the colonies , just like leaving the E.U , Britain choose to leave .”

 

Utter nonsense.

It was at the end of World War 2 and the U.K just wanted to return home to the UK , the U.K was bankrupt , we had taken everything we wanted from the colonies and it was time to go home 

Money for the boys...counting days till this shuffling clown gets kicked out.

12 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

It was at the end of World War 2 and the U.K just wanted to return home to the UK , the U.K was bankrupt , we had taken everything we wanted from the colonies and it was time to go home 

More nonsense.

 

I suggest you read up on independence campaigns across the British Empire.

 

 

5 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

More nonsense.

 

I suggest you read up on independence campaigns across the British Empire.

 

 

I am not saying that the colonies didn't want independence , am saying that Britain was quite happy to let them have it  

1 hour ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

I am not saying that the colonies didn't want independence , am saying that Britain was quite happy to let them have it  

The British had absolutely no choice, and British violent response to independence movements across the Empire only served to reduce the options the British had.

 

Again I suggest you read the history of what happened, not the British revision of what happened.

6 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

The British had absolutely no choice, and British violent response to independence movements across the Empire only served to reduce the options the British had.

 

Again I suggest you read the history of what happened, not the British revision of what happened.

You are talking about numerous Countries and numerous different situations  , Like the British GAVE independence to Burma after WW2 

The British just wanted to go home and rebuild our own Country , rather than helping other Countries to prosper

2 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

It was at the end of World War 2 and the U.K just wanted to return home to the UK , the U.K was bankrupt , we had taken everything we wanted from the colonies and it was time to go home 

Tell that to the Kenyans.

4 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Tell that to the Kenyans.

Yes, many of the poor Kenyans resented the rich British living in Kenya  

18 hours ago, internationalism said:

Tell this good news to those hundred millions souls killed during conquering and maintaining empire 

there would be many more atrocities with participation of the british government and its arms diplomacy. Mo european war

 

https://www.justiceinfo.net/en/79636-colonial-crimes-the-empire-on-which-justice-almost-never-sets.html

 

https://www.theguardian.com/news/2016/aug/18/uncovering-truth-british-empire-caroline-elkins-mau-mau

 

4 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Nobody has suggested Britain invented Empire based on killing and oppression.

 

There’s more than a hint of suggestion, to which my response was made. 
Would there be any reliable figures on comparative empires’ killing and oppression? I expect not but I expect it would have been substantially less under a British Empire. Both foreign and home grown apologist handwringing and half truths about colonialism is always tiresome. In reality we have never had anything to apologise to anybody about and should only be proud of the British Empire’s achievements. 

37 minutes ago, Loiner said:

 

There’s more than a hint of suggestion, to which my response was made. 
Would there be any reliable figures on comparative empires’ killing and oppression? I expect not but I expect it would have been substantially less under a British Empire. Both foreign and home grown apologist handwringing and half truths about colonialism is always tiresome. In reality we have never had anything to apologise to anybody about and should only be proud of the British Empire’s achievements. 

Never-mind your ‘hints’ give us evidence, a direct quote will do.

 

And please, no more whataboutary, the cruelty and violence of other empires is no excuse for that perpetrated by the British upon their empire.

8 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Never-mind your ‘hints’ give us evidence, a direct quote will do.

 

And please, no more whataboutary, the cruelty and violence of other empires is no excuse for that perpetrated by the British upon their empire.

That was the Way of the World back then , the rulers of Countries treated the people quite harshly , famines and hunger happen because of climate change , not because the British were the rulers 

Just now, Mac Mickmanus said:

That was the Way of the World back then , the rulers of Countries treated the people quite harshly , famines and hunger happen because of climate change , not because the British were the rulers 

Again, I suggest you read up on the history of the British Empire.

 

With respect to this your latest misinformed missive I recommend reading up on the part British policies in India had on creating famines.

 

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Again, I suggest you read up on the history of the British Empire.

 

With respect to this your latest misinformed missive I recommend reading up on the part British policies in India had on creating famines.

 

Yes I have already read it and know .

The famine in India was cause by :

A lack of rain and no crops growing .

Locals raising the prices and people couldn't afford to by food 

Food being sent to other areas which were suffering from food shortages .

Famines and droughts have happened throughout history