British woman, 20, left for dead in hit and run motorbike crash faces being thrown out of Thai hospital despite horrifying injuries after being hit with £40,000 medical bill

[billd766]

4 hours ago, Skeptic7 said:

True that...good point. Should have prefaced my post with, "If true...".

 

That said, have been here long enough (quarter century) to know that there is no limit nor bounds to this country's ignorance, greed, xenophobic loathing, insulting & fleecing when it comes to foreigners. 

quote "That said, have been here long enough (quarter century) to know that there is no limit nor bounds to this country's ignorance, greed, xenophobic loathing, insulting & fleecing when it comes to foreigners."

 

I have been living here in Thailand, both in Bangkok and for the last 18 years in rural Kamphaeng Phet and I have not come across anything like your description of Thais ignorance, greed, xenophobic loathing, insulting & fleecing when it comes to foreigners.

 

As an example, certainly from my personal experience,

 

I went to my local state hospital (I am registered there) yesterday as I was short of breath and very dizzy. There must have been about 100 people waiting to see the doctors.

 

As soon as I got out of the pickup one of the staff asked if I wanted a rolling stretcher or a wheelchair.

 

I was sent straight to the emergency room where I was examined by a nurse and a doctor and given an ECG which said I was OK.

 

The hospital was very helpful and both Thai user and farang friendly.

 

The cost was 200 thb, yes two hundred baht for the ECG and 50 baht for the doctors fee.

 

Most Thais using the 30 baht scheme would have been treated for a total of 30 baht. I had no objection to paying the extra.

Edited February 17, 2023 by billd766
added extra text

[Hummin]

21 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Complete nonsense.

 

Is there different rules for brits than rest of the Europe? I need IDP when have Norwegian License, and my license shows multiple languages inc English 

[StayinThailand2much]

8 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

There are a high number of road traffic accidents in Thailand especially involving motorcycles. The World Health Organisation (WHO) rates Thailand as the world’s deadliest countries for fatalities on motorcycles.

No kidding. I'm a careful person, always looking left and right, but was hit by motorbikes twice over the years, just crossing the road! Fortunately, no damage done to me or the rider, except a small scratch on my leg the second time.

[BritManToo]

5 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Is there different rules for brits than rest of the Europe? I need IDP when have Norwegian License, and my license shows multiple languages inc English 

IDP is required in Thailand for tourists on short-term stays without m/c licences that are

1. in English or

2. Don't clearly state class of vehicle permitted to ride.

 

They are also required by corrupt Thai police extorting foreigners.

 

Edited February 17, 2023 by BritManToo

[sidneybear]

9 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

Why aren't the insurers paying out? I'm guessing no helmet or licence 

Some travel insurance policies exclude motorcycling. No licence would be excluded too.

[Hummin]

4 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

IDP is required in Thailand for tourists on short-term stays without m/c licences that are

1. in English or

2. Don't clearly state class of vehicle permitted to ride.

 

They are also required by corrupt Thai police extorting foreigners.

 

I always had insurance and IDP by recommendation from our own traffic department, so please show me the correct link with a valid inforation. I know several brits continue to say we do not need, and if it is a british agreement or not, you need to provide the proof 

[billd766]

2 hours ago, superal said:

I agree . Thai government hospitals will hit you with a farang price , even as an out-patient and often charge 5 times or more to a farang than that of a Thai person . Farangs are seen as an easy target for extortion .  

Not where I live in rural Kamphaeng Phet they don't.

[BritManToo]

26 minutes ago, Hummin said:

I always had insurance and IDP by recommendation from our own traffic department, so please show me the correct link with a valid inforation. I know several brits continue to say we do not need, and if it is a british agreement or not, you need to provide the proof 

https://www.tripadvisor.com/Travel-g293915-c133830/Thailand:Driving.License.Requirements.html

 

Section 42-2

 

MOTOR VEHICLE SAFETY ACT (Thai Law)

Section 42

• Anyone who wishes to drive a motor vehicle on public roads must possess an appropriate driver licence.
• The driver must carry the driver licence and a photocopy of the registration book and show them to competent officers upon request.
• This does not apply to those who are learning to drive a motor vehicle according to the provision of Section 57.
• If the driver is an alien who doesn't have an immigrant visa, he may drive a motor vehicle with a driver licence specified in the Section 42-2.
• In such a case, he must carry documents specified by the treaty between the Thai government and the government which issued such driver licence, and show them to competent officers upon request.

Section 42-2
 

• In case there is a treaty between the Thai government and a foreign government regarding mutual acceptance of driver licence, an alien who does not have an immigrant visa may drive a motor vehicle with a driver licence issued by such a foreign government, or an automobile association authorised by such a foreign government.

Once you obtain a non-immigrant visa or establish you are a resident (such as enrolling kids in school, buy a car etc,) and are no longer a toursit, you need a Thai drivers licence as your national license and international driving permit is only legally accepted if you are a tourist. Several insurance companies have  fine print stating that the driver should hold a valid Thai driving licence to be fully covered after a certain amount of time in Thailand.

 

And this is the 1949 UN treaty ratified by Thailand in 1962, and the UK in 1957 (and Norway in 1957)

Sadly Germany did not participate in this treaty so they will need a Thai driving license, as their German DL or German issued IDP is not valid in Thailand.

https://treaties.un.org/Pages/ViewDetailsV.aspx?src=TREATY&mtdsg_no=XI-B-1&chapter=11&Temp=mtdsg5&clang=_en

Edited February 17, 2023 by BritManToo

[Rimmer]

Unattributed libelous troll post has been removed

[Hummin]

5 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

https://www.tripadvisor.com/Travel-g293915-c133830/Thailand:Driving.License.Requirements.html

 

Section 42-2

 

MOTOR VEHICLE SAFETY ACT (Thai Law)

Section 42

• Anyone who wishes to drive a motor vehicle on public roads must possess an appropriate driver licence.
• The driver must carry the driver licence and a photocopy of the registration book and show them to competent officers upon request.
• This does not apply to those who are learning to drive a motor vehicle according to the provision of Section 57.
• If the driver is an alien who doesn't have an immigrant visa, he may drive a motor vehicle with a driver licence specified in the Section 42-2.
• In such a case, he must carry documents specified by the treaty between the Thai government and the government which issued such driver licence, and show them to competent officers upon request.

Section 42-2
 

• In case there is a treaty between the Thai government and a foreign government regarding mutual acceptance of driver licence, an alien who does not have an immigrant visa may drive a motor vehicle with a driver licence issued by such a foreign government, or an automobile association authorised by such a foreign government.

Once you obtain a non-immigrant visa or establish you are a resident (such as enrolling kids in school, buy a car etc,) and are no longer a toursit, you need a Thai drivers licence as your national license and international driving permit is only legally accepted if you are a tourist. Several insurance companies have  fine print stating that the driver should hold a valid Thai driving licence to be fully covered after a certain amount of time in Thailand.

https://london.thaiembassy.org/en/publicservice/84710-driving-in-thailand?page=5d6636ce15e39c3bd000734d&menu=5d6636cd15e39c3bd00072e2

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

1 hour ago, Ralf001 said:

Recently cost me 300K + for a 3 night ICU stay in a private hospital.

Discharging today from government hospital.

9 weeks in ICU followed by 3 weeks in private ward room , total cost  580,000.

 

Is 580k the real full price..... or is it discounted due to social security covering it ?

Government hospitals are supported at least partially by the taxpayer, so the fees charged are less than what would be charged if they were required to break even or make a profit. 

[TimeMachine]

I am saddened to hear stories like this.

In my fantasy world there would be no need for insurances. The amount of money received in taxes from VAT and employment would go to universal global health care. Humans caring for humans. It's a tough debate.

[Seeall]

10 hours ago, geisha said:

That’s the second girl in two weeks! Both on motorbikes and refused insurance. 

i gave up paying insurance decades ago....   they always find some small print BS to get out of it...

[pp00]

The hospital bill is sure inflated to the max.

[Expat68]

6 hours ago, Xonax said:

A 7 hour surgery will easily cost more than 1 million Baht.

It was 7 hours from myself leaving the ward and returning 

[freedomnow]

Doubtlful she has passed any of these license steps in UK to get IDP before leaving...

Yes, it's only guessing - but insurers not paying out it's either license/helmet or both.

 

 

[Tropposurfer]

12 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Maybe.

But maybe riding a bike was not covered in that insurance and maybe there are other limits.

Travel (health) insurances are cheap compared to real international health insurances - for a reason.

 

Obviously it's sad for her to be in such a situation, especially because she didn't cause the accident. But let's compare this with a Thai person who is hit like that by another Thai person on the road. Who pays? Often Thai people struggle to pay something, but expensive treatment is out of the question for many.

Yep OMF. AS far as I am aware internationally underwriters won't pay out of you don't stipulate you are going to ride bikes or drive a car when you apply for a policy. 

There may be some out there but in all my years of traveling and living in England, continental Europe, US, Japan, Indo, and Australia I never saw an underwriter that didn't ask specific crunch questions about riding or driving as a clear criteria and condition of covering a person. 

 

I hope she gets enough and speedy assistance with the GFMe page.

Edited February 17, 2023 by Tropposurfer

[scubascuba3]

1 hour ago, sidneybear said:

Some travel insurance policies exclude motorcycling. No licence would be excluded too.

Many don't include riding a motorcycle that's why people need to read the policy doc to check

[herfiehandbag]

3 hours ago, superal said:

I agree . Thai government hospitals will hit you with a farang price , even as an out-patient and often charge 5 times or more to a farang than that of a Thai person . Farangs are seen as an easy target for extortion .  

 

1 hour ago, billd766 said:

Not where I live in rural Kamphaeng Phet they don't.

Nor in Chiang Rai.

 

I am 18 months into treatment for a badly poisoned foot caused by a puncture wound (rebar wire sticking out of the ground)

 

2 weeks in hospital and 2

operations to remove infected tissue cost B32000. I stumped up B20k on discharge, the balance paid in installments over several months. Amicably and easily arranged.

 

Currently my twice weekly visit for "dressing wound" costs me B50 a time - a Thai would pay B30.

 

The wound is slow to heal, as I am diabetic. For that reason my health insurance declined to pay.

 

The treatment is good, the facilities in my local hospital are adequate. Decor a bit tatty but so what.

 

Thais are covered by a range of schemes, ranging from the B30 basic through various degrees of work related social security up to full blown private insurance. Most treatments require some sort of co-payment. As a foreigner you are charged the "cost price" for treatment and medications. I haven't experienced any "gouging".

 

When my daughter had COVID, and I was waiting outside as she was treated before admission, a civil servant from the local Ministry of Public Health office approached me and demanded B10,000 up front (cash, a nice round figure!) as she "was a foreigner". I challenged that, pointing out that she was Thai (she has an English name). A senior nurse (who knows us) spoke to him, he beat a hasty retreat, and was not seen again. Whether that demand was "officially sanctioned" I very much doubt - no one from the hospital ever mentioned money whilst she was treated.

Edited February 17, 2023 by herfiehandbag

[ukrules]

I wonder if they've made much progress in the hunt for the runaway driver who caused this problem?

[nigelforbes]

4 minutes ago, herfiehandbag said:

 

Nor in Chiang Rai.

 

I am 18 months into treatment for a badly poisoned foot caused by a puncture wound (rebar wire sticking out of the ground)

 

2 weeks in hospital and 2

operations to remove infected tissue cost B32000. I stumped up B20k on discharge, the balance paid in installments over several months. 

 

Currently my twice weekly visit for "dressing wound" costs me B50 a time - a Thai would pay B30.

 

The treatment is good, the facilities in my local hospital are adequate. Decor a bit tatty but so what.

 

Nor in Mae Rim!

 

Large puncture wound to foot, treated at local hospital, anesthetic to probe wound for debris, Tetanus Shot, dressings, 179 baht! I expected 6k. Replace dressing every day and inspect for infection, 79 baht. An outstanding surgical nurse, great English and personality, everyone very professional, hospital decor OK+, ER a bit like a battle zone and a short wait, but OK. One of my better medical experiences here.

[ThailandGuy]

This is Thailand at their best? Nothing changed in all these years. It just got worst.

[KhaoYai]

11 hours ago, ukrules said:

Normally you would expect the other drivers insurance to pay out third party injuries.

Yes you would expect so but one thing people don't realise is that all insurance policies have payout limits. However, whilst in the West the limits for medical treatment are so high they'll cover any eventuality, in Thailand they can be very low.

 

I was hit by a taxi that was insured 3rd class with a 3rd party maximum payout of 100,000. That came nowhere near my treatment costs, never mind the other losses I suffered.  I was amazed that a taxi was allowed to have such poor insurance.

[snowgard]

A simple matter of regulation. All motorcycle and car rentals need to be regulated:

1. All drivers must have a required driver's license.

• if the driver fails to prove this at a police check, the vehicle will be seized & the car/motorcycle rental company will have to pay the seizure (towing costs & parking fee) plus 50,000 THB fine.
   
• if the driver causes an accident without a driver's license, the car/motorcycle rental company must be liable for all personal injury and property damage.

2. Each vehicle in a car/motorcycle rental requires 1st class insurance.

• If the driver cannot prove this insurance at a police check, the vehicle will be seized & the car/motorcycle rental company will have to pay the allowance (towing costs & parking fee) plus 100,000 THB fine.
   
• if the driver causes an accident without 1st class insurance, the car/motorcycle rental company is liable for all personal injury and property damage.

And the problems are gone.

Edited February 17, 2023 by snowgard

[Dogsredrocket]

Fund your own holiday and poor decisions sweetie.

[bradiston]

4 hours ago, Jonathan Swift said:

Based on my brief wiki search it appears that Bangkok Hospital Group Co. Ltd. is a private for profit hospital and not government subsidized.

Yes. They moved him out from there to the local government hospital.

[nigelforbes]

2 hours ago, Etaoin Shrdlu said:

Government hospitals are supported at least partially by the taxpayer, so the fees charged are less than what would be charged if they were required to break even or make a profit. 

Government hospitals have a four tier charging system, each hospital sets it's own baseline charges. Tier 1 is Thai nationals, Tier 2 is ASEAN citizens, Tier 3 is Tourists and Tier 4 is Foreign Expats and retirees.

[Jaybott]

11 hours ago, SuperSilverHaze said:

GoFundMe cut off the campaign for Canadian truckers during covid. Never see a satang from me.

Same here, I'll never give a penny to any GFM campaign.

[xylophone]

11 hours ago, proton said:

Will the 300 baht landing fee cover this sort of accident after June the 1st? somehow I think not

Who knows what the shortly to be introduced landing fee will cover, however it would be a good bet that there would be some restrictions on what it covered, and they would include the fact that the driver must have a current driving licence or international driving permit; that they are of a certain age; that no alcohol is involved; that passengers are a no-no........and so on??

[Elkski]

But isn't it outrageous that they demanded 3000 pounds before providing pain meds.  Should be a crime.  Sure is a national disgrace.   I bet she can was in massive pain.  Such a sad story.  So nice people donate.  I have never looked on fo fund me.