And it turns out, the second listed author of the above paper, Jessica Rose, also has quite a history of involvement in peddling COVID vaccine misinformation:

 

Fact Check-VAERS data does not suggest COVID-19 vaccines killed 150,000 people, as analysis claims

"The website credits the findings to Jessica Rose, who was a postdoctoral researcher in biology at the Israel Institute of Technology from 2016-20, according to her resume posted online (here). ...

 

The blog article cites a paper titled: “Estimating the number of COVID vaccine deaths in America” (here), which Rose co-authored alongside Mathew Crawford, a statistician (here). Both appear to be members of a group questioning COVID-19 vaccines."

...

VERDICT

False. COVID-19 vaccines are safe and there is no evidence to suggest they have caused more than 150,000 deaths. The claim is based on misinterpreted data.

 

https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-coronavirus-usa/fact-check-vaers-data-does-not-suggest-covid-19-vaccines-killed-150000-people-as-analysis-claims-idUSL1N2R00KP

 

AND

As 2021 shambles to a close, the misuse of VAERS by antivaxxers continues apace

"So I thought I should write about Jessica Rose now, as she appears in an article from Sunday titled “What the VAERS Data Tell Us About COVID Jab Safety“.

...

"this interview with Jessica Rose illustrates the various techniques used by antivaxxers like Mercola (and Robert F. Kennedy, Jr., who has had a regular weekly “update” of VAERS reporting for several months now) and thus is worth writing about again, given that Jessica Rose appears to be a rising star in the antivaccine movement and a veritable font of antivaccine disinformation..."

 

https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/as-2021-shambles-to-a-close-the-misuse-of-vaers-by-antivaxxers-continues-apace/

 

@TallGuyJohninBKK - It's tell-tale that you attempt to discredit David Speicher (MSc, PhD, Former Associate Professor, Biology and Health Sciences – Redeemer University) because he is a member of the Scientific and Medical Advisory Committee of the Canadian Covid Care Alliance.

 

In May 2023 the CCCA published a 21-page report titled

The Building Case Against COVID-19 Vaccination of Students in Canada

 

< source: https://www.canadiancovidcarealliance.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/23MY3_Case-against-C19-vaccine-requirements.pdf >

 

in which they "strongly recommend against any future mandates of COVID-19 vaccination of students in primary, secondary and post-secondary schools and institutions".

 

The Scientific and Medical Advisory Committee that authored that study consists of 18 Authors, of which 13 are University Professors.

• Byram Bridle, MSc, PhD, Associate Professor, Dept. of Pathobiology at the University of Guelph
• Philip Britz-McKibbin, PhD, Professor, Dept. of Chemistry and Chemical Biology, McMaster University
• Glenn Chan, BAA, Patient Advocate
• Claudia Chaufan, MA, MD, PhD, Associate Professor, Health Policy, York University
• John Hardie, BDS, MSc, PhD, FRCDC (retired)
• Ondrej Helgas, MSc, PhD
• York Hsiang, MB, MHSc, FRCSC, Professor Emeritus, Dept. of Surgery, University of British Columbia
• Niel Karrow, PhD, Professor of Immunology, Dept. of Animal Biosciences, University of Guelph
• Bonnie Mallard, Msc, PhD, Professor of Immunogenetics, Dept. of Pathobiology, University of Guelph
• Kanji Nakatsu, PhD, Professor Emeritus Pharmacology, Queen's University
• Susan Natsheh, MD, Pediatrician (retired)
• Philip Oldfield, DPhil, CSci, CChem, FRSC (UK) (retired)
• Steven Pelech, PhD, Professor, Dept. of Medicine, University of British Columbia
• Patrick Provost, PhD, Professor, Faculty of Medicine, Université Laval
• Denis Rancourt, PhD, Former Professor, University of Ottawa
• Wendi Roscoe, PhD, Professor, Dept. of Health Science at Fanshawe College
• Christopher A. Shaw, PhD, Professor, Dept. of Ophthalmology, University of British Columbia
• David Speicher, MSc, PhD, Former Associate Professor, Biology and Health Sciences – Redeemer University

On 10/25/2023 at 3:04 AM, Red Phoenix said:

@TallGuyJohninBKK - It's tell-tale that you attempt to discredit David Speicher (MSc, PhD, Former Associate Professor, Biology and Health Sciences – Redeemer University) because he is a member of the Scientific and Medical Advisory Committee of the Canadian Covid Care Alliance.

In May 2023 the CCCA published a 21-page report titled

The Building Case Against COVID-19 Vaccination of Students in Canada

< source: https://www.canadiancovidcarealliance.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/23MY3_Case-against-C19-vaccine-requirements.pdf >

in which they "strongly recommend against any future mandates of COVID-19 vaccination of students in primary, secondary and post-secondary schools and institutions".

The Scientific and Medical Advisory Committee that authored that study consists of 18 Authors, of which 13 are University Professors.

• Byram Bridle, MSc, PhD, Associate Professor, Dept. of Pathobiology at the University of Guelph
• Philip Britz-McKibbin, PhD, Professor, Dept. of Chemistry and Chemical Biology, McMaster University
• Glenn Chan, BAA, Patient Advocate
• Claudia Chaufan, MA, MD, PhD, Associate Professor, Health Policy, York University
• John Hardie, BDS, MSc, PhD, FRCDC (retired)
• Ondrej Helgas, MSc, PhD
• York Hsiang, MB, MHSc, FRCSC, Professor Emeritus, Dept. of Surgery, University of British Columbia
• Niel Karrow, PhD, Professor of Immunology, Dept. of Animal Biosciences, University of Guelph
• Bonnie Mallard, Msc, PhD, Professor of Immunogenetics, Dept. of Pathobiology, University of Guelph
• Kanji Nakatsu, PhD, Professor Emeritus Pharmacology, Queen's University
• Susan Natsheh, MD, Pediatrician (retired)
• Philip Oldfield, DPhil, CSci, CChem, FRSC (UK) (retired)
• Steven Pelech, PhD, Professor, Dept. of Medicine, University of British Columbia
• Patrick Provost, PhD, Professor, Faculty of Medicine, Université Laval
• Denis Rancourt, PhD, Former Professor, University of Ottawa
• Wendi Roscoe, PhD, Professor, Dept. of Health Science at Fanshawe College
• Christopher A. Shaw, PhD, Professor, Dept. of Ophthalmology, University of British Columbia
• David Speicher, MSc, PhD, Former Associate Professor, Biology and Health Sciences – Redeemer University

 

No response by the provax cultists, of course. It's best to just close your eyes, cover your ears and go "la la la".

12 hours ago, rattlesnake said:

 

No response by the provax cultists, of course. It's best to just close your eyes, cover your ears and go "la la la".

Shills are going to keep shilling, no matter what evidence is presented.  If good evidence is presented, it will be from a " not a credible source" or " not allowed source" or else a "fact check says it's not true".  All three excuses have been used ad naseum here.

No further response is required....

 

The best the above posters can do is continually present dubious claims by sources with documented histories of peddling COVID misinformation, and/or people associated with organizations with documented histories of peddling COVID misinformation.

 

As a result, their claims are and should be judged in that context and the sources recognized for what they have shown themselves to be -- non-credible.

 

 

2 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

No further response is required....

 

The best the above posters can do is continually present dubious claims by sources with documented histories of peddling COVID misinformation, and/or people associated with organizations with documented histories of peddling COVID misinformation.

 

As a result, their claims are and should be judged in that context and the sources recognized for what they have shown themselves to be -- non-credible.

 

 

Yes, it's one of those irregular verbs, isn't it?

 

I post absolute truth as determined by the government
You post things from non-credible sources
He is a purveyor of dangerous misinformation

4 minutes ago, Eleftheros said:

Yes, it's one of those irregular verbs, isn't it?

 

I post absolute truth as determined by the government
You post things from non-credible sources
He is a purveyor of dangerous misinformation

 

Yes, when there's no arguments left/no legs to stand on, there's always the alphabet and("those irregular verbs"). Don't forget the kitchen sink and left over spaghetti also. Try harder.

I'm too lazy to read all this nonsense, so sorry if this has been posted already: https://news.yahoo.com/false-claims-recirculate-harmful-dna-184043727.html

 

Scientists have repeatedly refuted the claim that Covid-19 vaccines can alter a person's genome, but social media posts suggest DNA contamination in the injections could lead to harmful effects such as cancer. This is false; there is no evidence of significant amounts of genetic material in the shots -- and even if there were, experts say they could not alter cells.

 

The claims circulated after University of South Carolina biologist Phillip Buckhaults appeared before a state panel September 13, 2023 to discuss his research on messenger RNA (mRNA) Covid-19 vaccines.

 

On 10/28/2023 at 12:57 PM, gargamon said:

I'm too lazy to read all this nonsense, so sorry if this has been posted already: https://news.yahoo.com/false-claims-recirculate-harmful-dna-184043727.html

 

Scientists have repeatedly refuted the claim that Covid-19 vaccines can alter a person's genome, but social media posts suggest DNA contamination in the injections could lead to harmful effects such as cancer. This is false; there is no evidence of significant amounts of genetic material in the shots -- and even if there were, experts say they could not alter cells.

 

The claims circulated after University of South Carolina biologist Phillip Buckhaults appeared before a state panel September 13, 2023 to discuss his research on messenger RNA (mRNA) Covid-19 vaccines.

~

Depends on which experts you rely to dismiss the possibility of alteration of the human genome.

 

A common sense approach re this matter would be to urgently start studies to find out if any of this DNA got integrated into any human genomes.

 

In addition to testing a lot more vials, filling in the data gaps for the dose response curve to prove causal effects of DNA:SAEs (if they exist), we need to test injected people’s stem cells and germ line cells for integration of any of this DNA. Once it is proven in a large enough sample of injected individuals that integration did not occur, we can finally breathe a sigh of relief...

 

5 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

Depends on which experts you rely to dismiss the possibility of alteration of the human genome.

A common sense approach re this matter would be to urgently start studies to find out if any of this DNA got integrated into any human genomes.

My experts don't post on social media. 

On 10/24/2023 at 2:38 PM, Red Phoenix said:

A new preprint study was issued Thursday last week by McKernan, Rose and others, providing more evidence of COVID-19 vaccine contamination in vials from Ontario, Canada.

The title of the study speaks for itself:

DNA fragments detected in monovalent and bivalent Pfizer/BioNTech and Moderna modRNA COVID-19 vaccines from Ontario, Canada: Exploratory dose response relationship with serious adverse events.

https://osf.io/mjc97/?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email

 

As long as the same unsourced samples are examined, the results will be the same.

 

Meanwhile, vials all over the world are examined, and no DNA is found.

On 10/25/2023 at 8:04 AM, Red Phoenix said:

@TallGuyJohninBKK - It's tell-tale that you attempt to discredit David Speicher (MSc, PhD, Former Associate Professor, Biology and Health Sciences – Redeemer University) because he is a member of the Scientific and Medical Advisory Committee of the Canadian Covid Care Alliance.

In May 2023 the CCCA published a 21-page report titled

The Building Case Against COVID-19 Vaccination of Students in Canada

< source: https://www.canadiancovidcarealliance.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/23MY3_Case-against-C19-vaccine-requirements.pdf >

 

That's five minutes of my life wasted.

 

These authors miss the point - university students indeed rarely die from Covid, but they do get infected and pass it along to people who die. That's why vaccination is required to stem an epidemic.

9 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

As long as the same unsourced samples are examined, the results will be the same.

Meanwhile, vials all over the world are examined, and no DNA is found.

~

Source please that "Meanwhile, vials all over the world are examined, and no DNA is found."

6 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

That's five minutes of my life wasted.

 

These authors miss the point - university students indeed rarely die from Covid, but they do get infected and pass it along to people who die. That's why vaccination is required to stem an epidemic.

~

These authors miss the point???

Danderman123 vs 18 academics of which 13 University professors. 

 

On 10/28/2023 at 1:59 PM, Danderman123 said:

That's five minutes of my life wasted.

 

These authors miss the point - university students indeed rarely die from Covid, but they do get infected and pass it along to people who die. That's why vaccination is required to stem an epidemic.

 

Safe and effective? Thought that had been debunked by the jab makers.

 

3 hours ago, Red Phoenix said:

~

These authors miss the point???

Danderman123 vs 18 academics of which 13 University professors. 

 

We all know that argument by authority fails when the quoted authorities ignore basic science.

11 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

We all know that argument by authority fails when the quoted authorities ignore basic science.

~

Do provide a source with examples where these 18 University professors and academics are 'ignoring basic science'. 

4 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

As long as the same unsourced samples are examined, the results will be the same.

Meanwhile, vials all over the world are examined, and no DNA is found.

~

Anxiously waiting for the credible source of that nugget you quoted that 'vials all over the world are examined, and no DNA is found.' 

Deafening silence, because it is obvious that you made that up. 

 

11 hours ago, gargamon said:

My experts don't post on social media. 

 

What's your take on this? Authored by 4 PhDs.

 

https://correlation-canada.org/covid-19-vaccine-associated-mortality-in-the-southern-hemisphere/

 

The paper is based on 17 countries in the Southern Hemisphere and equatorial region. A definite causal link is shown between many peaks in all-cause mortality and rapid vaccine rollouts. The authors quantify the fatal toxicity risk per injection, which is exceedingly large in the most elderly.

1 hour ago, eisfeld said:

 

Not published in any major journal, not peer reviewed.

 

That being said I had a look inside and read the study. IMHO completely worthless. It's just a time correlation study without control groups, no breakdowns for different vaccines etc and not even comparing vaccinated vs not vaccinated, just using country wide totals. And the best is half of their own graphs show that the ACM (all-cause mortality rate) in many countries peaked BEFORE the vaccines were administered. How one can draw the conclusion that the mortality rate increased due to vaccines is a bit of a mystery. Guess what? During a pandemic people die.

 

But one paragraph just shows immediately that this study is completely shady:

 

 

That is so obviously nonsense and none of their data and analysis support that claim even in the slightest. Completely absurd.

 

So let's take a look at the people behind this study.

 

The first guy, Jeremie Mercier, that I looked at seems to be an anti-vaxxer who on his website peddles a membership to his "private health club" completely with the usual scam crap like zoom sessions and youtube videos. I'm not making this up, take a look: https://www.jeremie-mercier.org/cps-club-prive-sante/ his site is linked to from the paper!

 

The first author of the paper, Denis Rancourt, has a PhD alright just not in anything related to medicine - it's in physics. Why he thinks he can act as an expert on medical issues is a mystery. The university where he got his PhD and was a tenured professor btw took the extraordinary measure of formally dismissing him. That doesn't happen easily. He has all kinds of crazy published content on his site like this piece of garbage in which he actually, seriously claims that the pandemic never happened and that it was a hoax. https://denisrancourt.ca/entries.php?id=130&name=2023_06_22_there_was_no_pandemic_essay

 

In summary: the mentioned study is some of the worst content I've seen related to Covid-19. The authors should be ashamed but somehow I have a feeling that they wont seeing as to what other shady stuff they are involved in.

 

You omitted Marine Baudin, PhD in microbiology, in good faith no doubt.

 

This study, which has not been refuted so far (plenty of critics but no specifics), shows there were no excess deaths during Covid but an explosion of it after the Covid "vaccines" were rolled out. The data in every country is the same that there was no increase in excess deaths during 2020 and even a decrease in some countries when it was supposed to be a pandemic. And why did excess deaths then take a sharp rise in comparison with years before immediately after the Covid shots were rolled out in every country at the start of 2021?

 

The synchronicity between the many peaks in ACM (in 17 countries, on 4 continents, in all elderly age groups, at different times) and associated rapid booster rollouts allows a firm conclusion regarding causality.

22 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

 

I looked at two people and found they had no experience in the relevant field and had very big red flags around them. They were the two authors that linked to their own websites in the paper. I stopped at that point because that's already a no-no.

 

 

No specifics? I specifically mentioned that half of their graphs show the opposite of their claim. They btw even admit to that in the paper. If half the data is for your argument and half is against then it's a toss-up and no conclusion can be made. They did so anyways. That's unscientific.

 

And I also mentioned the specific issue of them not even comparing vaccinated vs unvaccinated but just did a temporal view which of course will show increased deaths if we are talking a pandemic! How is that not specific?

 

You are either dishonest or didn't read the paper. Let's take Bolivia as an example because it's very clear. ACM spiked during 2020 before any vaccine shots were taking place. That's the blue line spiking before the orange one.

 

 

This is from the very paper. We see the exact same for Argentina, Brazil, Chile, Colombia, Ecuador, Paraguay, Peru, Phillipines and South Africa.

 

Again, in many of these countries the deaths increased sharply BEFORE the vaccines were rolled out. But even if that were not the case you can't conclude that increaed deaths are due to the vaccines. It's a frickin pandemic ffs. People die due to the virus. It's really not surprising is it? The way they try to blame the vaccine for the deaths is an utter joke. You could just as well plot on the graphs the number of people working from home instead of office and would see a correlation. But correlation is not causation and you couldn't blame work from home for excess deaths! But that's what they did in the paper. It's actually pretty funny because their group is called "Correlation Canada". They really should know better. I might have even thought it's bordering on satire if I didn't know better.

 

 

There is no synchronicity in ACM peaks in 17 countries. Not even the joke of a paper claimed that.

 

Let's take Bolivia as an example because it's very clear. ACM spiked during 2020 before any vaccine shots were taking place. That's the blue line spiking before the orange one.

 

We see the exact same for Argentina, Brazil, Chile, Colombia, Ecuador, Paraguay, Peru, Phillipines and South Africa.

 

What about Malaysia, New Zealand, Singapore, Suriname, Thailand, Uruguay, etc.? 

 

You mention Argentina and Brazil, here are their ACM and vaccination by month, 2017-2023. You can't argue with facts. Anyone with an honest, unbiased mind can only draw logical conclusions when reading the whole report (and not just the bits that fit one's confirmation bias and/or intent).

11 hours ago, eisfeld said:

 

Like I said, about half of their graphs show the complete opposite. That alone kills any conclusion.

 

 

Both of these graphs show clear increases in mortality before vaccination started. You can even see mortality decreasing after vaccination happened. And the rest is correlation. People around you die? Oh so maybe you decide to get vaccinated after all. As I repeatedly stated of course deaths will go up during a pandemic, duh. And of course when you at the same time start to vaccinate people you will see something that resembles a correlation to a certain degree. Again, correlation is not causality. Where is the comparison caccinated vs unvaccinated? Anyone with a bit of understanding of statistical studies immediately sees this for what it is - a dishonest effort.

 

I guarantee you this paper will not make it into any reputable journal. It wont pass peer review. The authors are probably aware of that and just use it to further their shady media campaigns.

 

Both of these graphs show clear increases in mortality before vaccination started.

 

No they don't. They show sharp increases in mortality at the time the vaccines were rolled out, in 2021. Not in 2020 during the height of the crisis.

 

You ask where the vaccinated vs unvaccinated comparison is? Great question. Indeed, where is it? All countries stopped reporting the vaccination status of people dying in hospitals several months ago. One can only wonder why, as they would not hesitate to post anything that remotely indicates the unvaccinated are dying.

 

UK example below (click on "Corrections and notices").

 

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsinvolvingcovid19byvaccinationstatusengland/deathsoccurringbetween1april2021and31may2023

 

 

 

2 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

 

No. I mean how can you see something different in those graphs. It's mind boggling.

 

 

You failed to address the real point. Why did the study not go over this data? Data that is available for those timeframes. Simple because it would immediately disprove their claims. And it's so blatant that even laymen can see it. No wonder the guy got kicked out of university and felt the need to team up with people pulling subscription stunts for "alternative medicine". BTW their president also got kicked out of his job because he failed to follow regulations and they have another person on their team describing herself as a "herbalist" who is trying to get people "less dependent on authorities". And of course please donate. We all know where this is going 🙂

 

At this point I think you are also engaging in dishonesty. You completely ignore the obvious facts, don't engage in the specific issues raised and just try to throw mud until it might stick. I've debunked the study thoroughly but you don't have to take my word. Seems like there are plenty of experts who did so as well. Pretty weak show. I'm not surprised though. The anti-vaxxers will keep on publishing dishonest misinformation because their mind is set and they feel like they are fighting the good fight. Don't think the few people with such a reality distortion field will ever reconsider. Same like flat earthers. Just wont go away and keep on trying to keep humanity back forever. Luckily that wont work though as the BS is too easy to expose for anyone who doesn't get very easily blinded by the misinformation.

 

You haven't debunked anything and only select the names, graphs and facts which fit what you are trying to say, then make sweeping statements to dismiss the whole thing, which is a typical sophistical approach.

 

The study is there for anyone to look at, that is the main thing.

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17 hours ago, Red Phoenix said:

The study was performed on 27 vials coming from 12 lots, and ALL vaccines exceeded the guidelines for residual DNA by a factor of 188 to 509-fold.

"Methods: Using previously published primer and probe sequences, quantitative polymerase chain reaction (qPCR) and Qubit® fluorometry was performed on an additional 27 mRNA vials obtained in Canada and drawn from 12 unique lots (5 lots of Moderna child/adult monovalent, 1 lot of Moderna adult bivalent BA.4/5, 1 lot of Moderna child/adult bivalent BA.1, 1 lot of Moderna XBB.1.5 monovalent, 3 lots of Pfizer adult monovalent, and 1 lot of Pfizer adult bivalent BA.4/5)."

"Conclusion: These data demonstrate the presence of billions to hundreds of billions of DNA molecules per dose in these vaccines. Using fluorometry, all vaccines exceed the guidelines for residual DNA set by FDA and WHO of 10 ng/dose by 188 – 509-fold."

No, that's not the conclusion.

 

It's a sound byte from the conclusion, which isolated from the rest becomes disinformation. Let me explain(which perhaps you should have done).

 

1. They measured DNA concentrations two ways, qPCR and florescence.

2. Florescence is a cheap easy way.

3. PCR is most sensitive, as low as picogram quantities! [reference]

 

Their florescence measurements were off the charts, 100s X over limit.

Their qPCR  measurements were normal, below set limits.

 

Therefore they used qPCR to present their data, below:

The dotted red line at the top is the FDA limit, all measurements are below.

 

This graph shows little, not even good correlation with problematic VAERS. 

 

Note: there are various scientific principles related to the different concentration measurements and the difference remains unresolved. One point is that tiny busted up pieces are not easily detected by PCR but they're likely harmless as they've lost their genetic message.

 

Still, it is a worthy subject to pursue, but not as disinformation.

False claims recirculate on harmful DNA in Covid-19 vaccines

04 October 2023

 

"Scientists have repeatedly refuted the claim that Covid-19 vaccines can alter a person's genome, but social media posts suggest DNA contamination in the injections could lead to harmful effects such as cancer.

 

This is false; there is no evidence of significant amounts of genetic material in the shots -- and even if there were, experts say they could not alter cells."

 

https://factcheck.afp.com/doc.afp.com.33WW3U6

 

 

21 hours ago, Red Phoenix said:

"Conclusion: These data demonstrate the presence of billions to hundreds of billions of DNA molecules per dose in these vaccines. Using fluorometry, all vaccines exceed the guidelines for residual DNA set by FDA and WHO of 10 ng/dose by 188 – 509-fold."

 

'billions to hundreds of billions of DNA molecules per dose'

 

To help readers, how much is billions?  To make it easy, do you know how many DNA molecules (base pairs) are in a human cell?  Should be easy to look up... 

 

This thread is CLOSED. //