10 minutes ago, Thorgal said:

I follow the facts line of MSNBS and BBC news (not limited to) :

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You earlier posted these clips as support for you words, ignoring that they were taken a short time after the blast, and before information was available. This was obviously intentional.

Just now, MrMojoRisin said:

Yes there is and there is a growing number of notable individuals starting to speak out about the awful Israeli occupation and oppression of Palestinians.

 

History did not start on October 7th.

What are you talking about, show me who is worse than the terrorists who killed 1,400 civilians in a bloody massacre in one day, torturing, murdering and kidnapping 200. 

7 minutes ago, MrMojoRisin said:

And there is plenty of Israeli's attending demonstrations calling for completing the Nakba.

 

There are equally despicable extremists on both sides.

World wide protests calling for completing the Nakba are simply not a thing.

I do not recall a mass demonstration in Israel specifically focused on this, even.

 

More deflections.

4 minutes ago, MrMojoRisin said:

Yes there is and there is a growing number of notable individuals starting to speak out about the awful Israeli occupation and oppression of Palestinians.

 

History did not start on October 7th.

Stupid post....................

Just now, Morch said:

 

You earlier posted these clips as support for you words, ignoring that they were taken a short time after the blast, and before information was available. This was obviously intentional.

Forum rules and moderators at AN require to backup facts.

 

That's what I did. Some forum member went even that far to send a PM to BBC to disagree...

 

To say that these clips came before information was available is pure speculation.

And I said it before : I can't promote false information. Sorry.

8 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Why are you posting these early video reports again when the information has now been updated with new evidence. Pure misinformation.................again.

Updated information..... or manufactured misinformation.

Neither you nor I can know for sure the level of truthfulness of what either side says.

 

The very fact that it is a plausible possibility that Israel bombed the hospital and added another 500 innocent victims to their already in the many thousands kill count - tells every rational person all that they need to know about the morals of the IDF. 

Those peaceable Palestinian demonstrators, bringing terror to the streets of Europe, doing everything they can to widen the conflict

 

Report from the Times:: Hundreds of pro-Palestinian protesters clashed with police in the Berlin district of Neukolln last night; setting fire to cars, rubbish containers and a lorry, throwing projectiles and bottles at police and setting off firework rockets. Police made 174 arrests, and 65 police officers were injured by the protesters as they chanted “Free Palestine” and “Allah akbar”  …… they walk among us.

18 minutes ago, MrMojoRisin said:

You will have to be a bit more specific, by terrorists do you mean Hamas or the IDF as both are clearly terrorist organisations.

 

As far as who bombed the hospital....does it matter?

 

The fact is that it is entirely plausible that either side committed this atrocity either deliberately or accidentally. 

 

Anyone proclaiming the moral superiority of either side is 100% wrong - they are both, the IDF and Hamas, in the gutters of inhumanity.

 

Other than in your posts and imagination, the IDF is not a terrorist organization, and is not considered such internationally - leaders of the Western world arriving to Israel to express support should give you a clue.

 

Yes, it does matter who caused the explosion. Remember your earlier comment about truth and facts? And no, the damage control waffle you offer is not 'entirely plausible'.

 

Same same doesn't apply.

 

 

4 hours ago, Morch said:

Post operation, could be better.

Is there a particular reason you keep misspelling my forum name?

And no, I have no need to partake in all the various attempts to derail the topic - which is about the war. Before you go on with some 'cop out' comment, do yourself a favor and search back - you'll find many comments made on the issue on past topics.

I'm sorry you are not feeling good post op, I hope you get well ASAP

I sincerely apologies for getting your name wrong Morch, my fault for not reading it properly, again my apologies

One sides war is another sides genocide, this will never be sorted to either parties satisfaction no matter how much comment is written on this and I bet many other platforms. You have your views and I have mine.

As far as I'm concern this will never be solved by killing one another, somewhere along the line compromises will have to be made be both sides, after 75 years it is still all a disaster for the whole of mankind.

Can I also say the Hamas terrorists who took part in the 7th of October atrocity are nothing less than sub-human.

 

1 minute ago, MrMojoRisin said:

Updated information..... or manufactured misinformation.

Neither you nor I can know for sure the level of truthfulness of what either side says.

 

The very fact that it is a plausible possibility that Israel bombed the hospital and added another 500 innocent victims to their already in the many thousands kill count - tells every rational person all that they need to know about the morals of the IDF. 

Updated information..... or manufactured misinformation.

 

No updated information with video evidence and onsite evidence

9 minutes ago, MrMojoRisin said:

Yes there is and there is a growing number of notable individuals starting to speak out about the awful Israeli occupation and oppression of Palestinians.

 

History did not start on October 7th.

There are always people speaking out about the Israeli occupation etc. That's nothing new, and nothing that started just now. Plenty of mention of UN resolutions and whatnot all over the topic.

 

History did not, the subject matter of the topic did.

Focus.

2 minutes ago, Thorgal said:

Forum rules and moderators at AN require to backup facts.

 

That's what I did. Some forum member went even that far to send a PM to BBC to disagree...

 

To say that these clips came before information was available is pure speculation.

And I said it before : I can't promote false information. Sorry.

Literally NOTHING you post can be trusted.  I don't know why you are still posting.  You have zero credibility except to those looking to confirm their own biases.

4 minutes ago, Thorgal said:

Forum rules and moderators at AN require to backup facts.

 

That's what I did. Some forum member went even that far to send a PM to BBC to disagree...

 

To say that these clips came before information was available is pure speculation.

And I said it before : I can't promote false information. Sorry.

No, it is not speculation. These are reports from just after the blast. There was not much information available other than Hamas claiming it to be an Israeli attack.

6 minutes ago, MrMojoRisin said:

Updated information..... or manufactured misinformation.

Neither you nor I can know for sure the level of truthfulness of what either side says.

 

The very fact that it is a plausible possibility that Israel bombed the hospital and added another 500 innocent victims to their already in the many thousands kill count - tells every rational person all that they need to know about the morals of the IDF. 

This boils down to- an accusation is made by one side with no evidence to support it and is then disproved, you believe said propaganda, then you project that on to prove your thesis.  It doesn't work well.

6 minutes ago, MrMojoRisin said:

Updated information..... or manufactured misinformation.

Neither you nor I can know for sure the level of truthfulness of what either side says.

 

The very fact that it is a plausible possibility that Israel bombed the hospital and added another 500 innocent victims to their already in the many thousands kill count - tells every rational person all that they need to know about the morals of the IDF. 

 

There's plenty of information and analysis available. You do not like the outcome, hence the 'we cannot know' obfuscation. Look at the pictures, appreciate the garden, wonder how the cars are largely intact, admire the masonry. Then look at pics posted about actual Israeli bombings in the Gaza Strip - mountains of rubble, torn vehicles...find the differences.

 

It is not a 'plausible possibility' other than in your damage control mode narrative. You don't even know if there were actually 500 killed - that's the figure Hamas provided, and within an hour of the blast.

5 minutes ago, Morch said:

Other than in your posts and imagination, the IDF is not a terrorist organization, and is not considered such internationally - leaders of the Western world arriving to Israel to express support should give you a clue.

 

Yes, it does matter who caused the explosion. Remember your earlier comment about truth and facts? And no, the damage control waffle you offer is not 'entirely plausible'.

 

Same same doesn't apply.

 

 

There are plenty of people around the world who believe Hamas is not a terrorist organisation as you seem to believe the IDF is not a terrorist organisation - both they and you are wrong.

 

Not to the dead does it matter, for they are dead now and forever.

 

Same same is the exact description of the morals of the IDF and Hamas.

13 minutes ago, Thorgal said:

Forum rules and moderators at AN require to backup facts.

 

That's what I did. Some forum member went even that far to send a PM to BBC to disagree...

 

To say that these clips came before information was available is pure speculation.

And I said it before : I can't promote false information. Sorry.

To say that these clips came before information was available is pure speculation.

 

B.S. There are such a thing as time stamps, these are old clips and you know it

10 minutes ago, Jeff the Chef said:

I'm sorry you are not feeling good post op, I hope you get well ASAP

I sincerely apologies for getting your name wrong Morch, my fault for not reading it properly, again my apologies

One sides war is another sides genocide, this will never be sorted to either parties satisfaction no matter how much comment is written on this and I bet many other platforms. You have your views and I have mine.

As far as I'm concern this will never be solved by killing one another, somewhere along the line compromises will have to be made be both sides, after 75 years it is still all a disaster for the whole of mankind.

Can I also say the Hamas terrorists who took part in the 7th of October atrocity are nothing less than sub-human.

 

Give up that 'genocide' nonsense. There is no 'genocide' in any meaningful way. People get killed in wars all over the world, why apply 'genocide' in this case? How come there are more Palestinian around each year if there's a 'genocide' going on?

 

This current topic is not about solving the conflict. This current war is not about solving the conflict. It is about dealing with an immediate situation, instigated by one of the parties.

14 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

Those peaceable Palestinian demonstrators, bringing terror to the streets of Europe, doing everything they can to widen the conflict

 

Report from the Times:: Hundreds of pro-Palestinian protesters clashed with police in the Berlin district of Neukolln last night; setting fire to cars, rubbish containers and a lorry, throwing projectiles and bottles at police and setting off firework rockets. Police made 174 arrests, and 65 police officers were injured by the protesters as they chanted “Free Palestine” and “Allah akbar”  …… they walk among us.

Don't forget the peaceful rally in Sydney, with the eloquent and peace-loving chants of "gas the Jews".

37 minutes ago, MrMojoRisin said:

You will have to be a bit more specific, by terrorists do you mean Hamas or the IDF as both are clearly terrorist organisations.

 

As far as who bombed the hospital....does it matter?

 

The fact is that it is entirely plausible that either side committed this atrocity either deliberately or accidentally. 

 

Anyone proclaiming the moral superiority of either side is 100% wrong - they are both, the IDF and Hamas, in the gutters of inhumanity.

You know what I meant. Stop the dumb play acting.

 

10 minutes ago, Morch said:

There are always people speaking out about the Israeli occupation etc. That's nothing new, and nothing that started just now. Plenty of mention of UN resolutions and whatnot all over the topic.

 

History did not, the subject matter of the topic did.

Focus.

No, the subject matter of the topic began long, long ago.

As much as it might suit you to dishonestly state otherwise.

The fact is, Hamas did not exist in a vacuum prior to October 7th.

1 minute ago, MrMojoRisin said:

No, the subject matter of the topic began long, long ago.

As much as it might suit you to dishonestly state otherwise.

The fact is, Hamas did not exist in a vacuum prior to October 7th.

This war against Hamas started on the 7th Oct, that is what the topic is about. Your dishonesty to deflect is the atrocities is noted.

Just now, MrMojoRisin said:

No, the subject matter of the topic began long, long ago.

As much as it might suit you to dishonestly state otherwise.

The fact is, Hamas did not exist in a vacuum prior to October 7th.

Then start your own thread regarding the history of the region, plus, this one is about Hamas attacking Israel..............

21 minutes ago, MrMojoRisin said:

The very fact that it is a plausible possibility that Israel bombed the hospital and added another 500 innocent victims to their already in the many thousands kill count - tells every rational person all that they need to know about the morals of the IDF

So you are judging the morals of the IDF by an explosion in a hospital car park, that all analytical experts are saying was almost certainly caused as a result of the misfire of a rocket launched by the Palestinian Islamic Jihad terror organisation …….. fine, so long as you don’t try and claim some kind of impartiality, or rationality further down the line.

2 minutes ago, MrMojoRisin said:

There are plenty of people around the world who believe Hamas is not a terrorist organisation as you seem to believe the IDF is not a terrorist organisation - both they and you are wrong.

 

Not to the dead does it matter, for they are dead now and forever.

 

Same same is the exact description of the morals of the IDF and Hamas.

You say 'plenty of people'. I say look at the parade of leaders arriving to express support for Israel. I'm pretty sure your own country is among them. Most countries in the world have relations with Israel and do not consider the IDF to be anything  but a national army of a another sovereign nation. All of them wrong, and you know better? I don't think so.

 

Deflect away all you will - suddenly facts don't matter, because it's inconvenient. It does not matter whether they were bombed, or whether burned to death by rocket fuel explosion etc. It matters who's responsible.

 

The IDF did not go into the Gaza Strip looking for civilians to kill. Not same same.

6 minutes ago, MrMojoRisin said:

No, the subject matter of the topic began long, long ago.

As much as it might suit you to dishonestly state otherwise.

The fact is, Hamas did not exist in a vacuum prior to October 7th.

This is a new section on an online forum. The topic is about a current situation. You and other insisting to turn it into a nitpicking blame-slinging match about competing historical narratives is another story.

 

No one claimed there is no context. There's such a think though as focus.

And here we go again with the implied justifications for Hamas.....

13 minutes ago, Slip said:

This boils down to- an accusation is made by one side with no evidence to support it and is then disproved, you believe said propaganda, then you project that on to prove your thesis.  It doesn't work well.

Hmmm.

No evidence?

Disproved?

Propaganda?

 

The New York Times, with all the resources available to them, have yet to get to the bottom of the mass murder at the Gaza hospital - perhaps it is a bit early for internet keyboard warriors to be spouting off, eh?

 

The competing claims have not been independently verified. The New York Times is working to assess the various accounts through an analysis of photos, video footage and other evidence, as well as on-the-ground interviews. - The New York Times

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/18/world/middleeast/gaza-hospital-israel-hamas-explained.html

2 minutes ago, MrMojoRisin said:

Hmmm.

No evidence?

Disproved?

Propaganda?

 

The New York Times, with all the resources available to them, have yet to get to the bottom of the mass murder at the Gaza hospital - perhaps it is a bit early for internet keyboard warriors to be spouting off, eh?

 

The competing claims have not been independently verified. The New York Times is working to assess the various accounts through an analysis of photos, video footage and other evidence, as well as on-the-ground interviews. - The New York Times

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/18/world/middleeast/gaza-hospital-israel-hamas-explained.html

“The Senate Intelligence Committee has received and reviewed intelligence related to the attack on al-Ahli hospital in Gaza. Based on this information, we feel confident that the explosion was the result of a failed rocket launch by militant terrorists and not the result of an Israeli airstrike,” Sens. MARK WARNER (D-Va.) and MARCO RUBIO (R-Fla.), the panel’s leaders, said in a statement.

https://www.politico.com/newsletters/national-security-daily/2023/10/18/u-s-intel-indicates-israel-didnt-bomb-gaza-hospital-00122197

1 minute ago, MrMojoRisin said:

Hmmm.

No evidence?

Disproved?

Propaganda?

 

The New York Times, with all the resources available to them, have yet to get to the bottom of the mass murder at the Gaza hospital - perhaps it is a bit early for internet keyboard warriors to be spouting off, eh?

 

The competing claims have not been independently verified. The New York Times is working to assess the various accounts through an analysis of photos, video footage and other evidence, as well as on-the-ground interviews. - The New York Times

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/18/world/middleeast/gaza-hospital-israel-hamas-explained.html

Keep digging, or retire gracefully............................😂

6 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

A questionable source exhibits one or more of the following: extreme bias, consistent promotion of propaganda/conspiracies, poor or no sourcing to credible information, a complete lack of transparency, and/or is fake news.

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/rt-news/

 

Your Russian friends

Ok, being RT sensible nowadays is understandable. It works like kryptonite...

 

I've another "friend" that I would like to meet in person : nothing more than his excellency the Jordanian Minister of Foreign Affairs (yes, yes, an unbiased US ally) that shares and promotes the same anti-fake news emerging after the hospital bombing in Gaza.

 

He's a diplomat and thus not from the newly baptized group : "He didn't had the information at the beginning"

 

If you don't agree with his findings, please contact him through his Office in Amman. Thanks.