Feel sorry for AN posters who bought electric

[Ralf001]

1 hour ago, JBChiangRai said:

Please feel sorry for me, I’m an EV owner.

 

Please feel very sorry for me because I have now bought 1 PHEV and 3 BEV’s.

 

Please feel sorry for me because my depreciation at resale was excellent.

 

Please feel sorry for me because I hate driving around in total silence with 530 hp under my right foot which is delivered instantaneously to all 4 wheels with a slight RWD bias allowing me to pull tricks and drift.

 

Please feel sorry for me because I only got an 8 year parts and Labour warranty.

 

Please feel sorry for me because I only got eight years free servicing.

 

Please feel sorry for me because it costs me nothing to refuel.

 

Please feel sorry for me because I can hardly contain the joy every time I get in the driving seat and floor the accelerator.

 

Please feel sorry for me because I keep making the same mistake and being delighted with it.

 

I really need your pity, I am clearly so unhappy.

 

Do you have a top knot haircut style ?

[JBChiangRai]

Just now, Ralf001 said:

 

Do you have a top knot haircut style ?

I do on my pubes

[CallumWK]

57 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Our solar, barely, sometimes not even produces enough energy to power the house, IF waned to run both ACs, so need to be conservative that day. 

 

57 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

That it does produce enough excess to power the EVs, at no extra cost, is a bonus. 

 

So what is it?

 

It doesn't produce enough energy to power the house, or it provides excess energy that you in addition to the house also can charge your EV's.

 

Please make up your mind

[richard_smith237]

1 hour ago, KhunLA said:

Yea, for some reason, they simply don't get it.  Our solar, barely, sometimes not even produces enough energy to power the house, IF waned to run both ACs, so need to be conservative that day. 

 

Means the cost of that system, was to power the house, not the EVs.  For us, we didn't even have the BEV (car).  Having solar was definitely added motivation to get a BEV (car).

 

That it does produce enough excess to power the EVs, at no extra cost, is a bonus.  So the EVs are energized at no extra expense = FREE in my world.

 

Didn't cost anything extra = FREE

 

Maybe this will help ...

"I'll have a coffee"

"Would you care for some pie?"

"No thanks, I don't have enough money"

"No problem, no extra charge"

"You mean FREE ?"

 

Yours is of course a great set up... 

 

This is not an anti-EV comment... (our next car will very likely be EV, because I think they are a now good product)...    But I'm not under any pretence that they are 'cleaner'...   

 

But... for the most part are these EV's being charged and contributing to the 'CO2' issue rather than resolving it ?

 

China's coal production and consumption has tripped in the last 10 years. 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coal_in_China#/media/File:China-energy-consumption-by-source.svg

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[richard_smith237]

1 hour ago, UWEB said:

Solar was installed to supply power for my two Houses, Pool and Irrigation System. To charge the Car is just a Bonus. Amazing... isn't it?

 

Agreed...  But what of all the people in an Condo...  

In area's of high footfall where car use is greatly elevated per SqKM ?... 

 

I guess public transport is the true answer....    (as per the quote: “A developed country is not a place where the poor have cars. It’s where the rich use public transportation")...

 

But...  In Cities - there such as Bangkok, Solar cannot power the cars, a great surcharge in demand for electricity at night time is going to cause issues...   Will transformers blow when all cars plug in for the night ?

 

Out in area's of less density, there is a dual win - both room for solar and the population sparsity means less demand on the power grid when 'everyone in the area plugs in in EV over night'... 

[vinny41]

6 hours ago, KhunLA said:

We renew ourselves this month, and I'm interested myself, what the total loss value will be.

 

As you know (for others), free 1st yr insurance was 960k vs 949k purchase price.

 

2nd year (1st renewal), value @ 840k,   New purchase MSRP price has gone from 949K to 869k down to very recent new MSRP price of 829k, with 599k promo, still going, if can find.   Best value out there IMHO, for B-class SUV (BEV or ICEV).

 

I'm thinking new total loss value will be 700-725k.

Personally I think Capital should have 2 values

Capital A for repair based on purchase price including subsidy

Capital B for return of capital if repair bill exceeds 80% this return of capital should be the price paid excluding subsidy

If we look at your purchase price of 949K  valued at 960K for 2nd year capital should have been B864K based on 10% off B960K or B854K based on 10% off B949K

3rd year (2nd renewal) Capital value should be B777K based on original B960K or B768,600 based on B949K original price

If you had a major accident that resulted in a huge repair bill the capital amount should be for the total cost of the car including subsidy

At the moment there are a few Neta V1 selling for B368K yet recently there was an article of a lady where her Neta V1 water entered the battery and the total repair cost was B430K

The biggest problem with these price reductions is the cost of parts remain unchanged from the original launch price

[Bandersnatch]

1 hour ago, Andrew Dwyer said:

But there’s a regular poster on here who charges his car with solar during daylight hours and uses the car to power his house at nighttime.

 

When people say stuff like "but your solar wasn't free, so your EV charging isn't free" they've just demonstrated their ignorance of how solar works.

 

As we live in the tropics here in Thailand there is excess solar production in the middle of the day after powering the house and charging house batteries. So if it wasn't used for charging an EV it would be wasted. It is not possible to feed back power to the grid here as the schemes have been closed to new applicants.

 

 

I have 2 EVs and an electric motorbike with no fuel bills. My house is off-grid with no meter, so no utility bills and yes my EV can power my house at night.

 

 

[CallumWK]

26 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

But... for the most part are these EV's being charged and contributing to the 'CO2' issue rather than resolving it ?

 

China's coal production and consumption has tripped in the last 10 years. 

 

Yet there was another poster in this thread claiming that the air in China now was less polluted because of the EV's.

Here is the reality.

 

[richard_smith237]

20 minutes ago, Bandersnatch said:

 

When people say stuff like "but your solar wasn't free, so your EV charging isn't free" they've just demonstrated their ignorance of how solar works.

 

As we live in the tropics here in Thailand there is excess solar production in the middle of the day after powering the house and charging house batteries. So if it wasn't used for charging an EV it would be wasted. It is not possible to feed back power to the grid here as the schemes have been closed to new applicants.

 

 

I have 2 EVs and an electric motorbike with no fuel bills. My house is off-grid with no meter, so no utility bills and yes my EV can power my house at night.

 

 

 

Outstanding set up...

 

If you dont mind me asking - how much would you estimate the 'whole set up fee' to be (ingoring cost of cars)...   For solar cells, batteries etc ???

 

IMO - there is scope for 'community power'...   i.e. All houses within a Moo-baan use their roof space for a battery....     And they batteries are 'interlinked' people use their own batteries, but they also feed a communal battery with excess'  juice that others can rely on at reduced usage rates. 

 

That should work for houses etc... but perhaps on Condos'....  but then, what about the cladding on condo's could that be made 'aesthetically pleasing' as solar cells ?

 

 

But... bigger issue IMO - how long does a solar installation last ? what is the cost of recycling ?

are we heading for another environmental issue with decommissioning millions of tonnes of expired solar cells... and also batteries ?

 

Is the 'environmental' can being kicked down the road instead of dealing with the end game now with 'carbon recapture' ?

 

 

 

 

[Bandersnatch]

Condo EV charging is being achieved in many countries.

 

 

 

It's important for non EV owners to understand that you don't need fast DC charging for overnight, a 3kW granny charger would provide plenty of power for most people's needs.

 

The best post I've seen on this topic was posted by @n8sail 

 

[Patong2021]

12 hours ago, CallumWK said:

 

Maybe try to read the fine print yourself.

 

 

 

Yes it is a safety issue. However, there are degrees of safety issues. Some are minor and have minimal potential to cause harm. There is a difference between a faulty warning light that goes off and a defective airbag.

[Bandersnatch]

1 minute ago, richard_smith237 said:

Outstanding set up...

 

If you dont mind me asking - how much would you estimate the 'whole set up fee' to be (ingoring cost of cars)...   For solar cells, batteries etc ???

 

 

Thank you for your kind words

 

My system is a few years old now so I usually quote current prices, excluding incidentals like mount brackets, rails etc and the labour to fit.

 

Main Components (at todays prices) 
20,000 Watts of PV @ ฿5/W = ฿100,000
36kWh Batteries @ ฿5k/kWh = ฿180,000
20kW of Inversion @ ฿5k/kW = ฿100,000
Total = ฿380,000

[richard_smith237]

2 minutes ago, Bandersnatch said:

 

Thank you for your kind words

 

My system is a few years old now so I usually quote current prices, excluding incidentals like mount brackets, rails etc and the labour to fit.

 

Main Components (at todays prices) 
20,000 Watts of PV @ ฿5/W = ฿100,000
36kWh Batteries @ ฿5k/kWh = ฿180,000
20kW of Inversion @ ฿5k/kW = ฿100,000
Total = ฿380,000

 

OK.. So we're looking at about ฿400k extra...      

 

What are your thoughts on depreciation ? I've always been concerned that the value of an EV would drop off a cliff close to warranty expiration. But the value of an ICE doesn't...  but, engine parts are more readily replaceable than a knackered battery. 

That said - its reported that batteries last 15 years etc... 

 

Once there are modular batteries that can be easily switched out - the EV world is set - though I still question the overall bigger picture of them being environmentally friendly vs carbon recapture and H2.

[Bandersnatch]

22 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

But... bigger issue IMO - how long does a solar installation last ? what is the cost of recycling ?

are we heading for another environmental issue with decommissioning millions of tonnes of expired solar cells... and also batteries ?

 

Most solar panels are warrantied for 20-25 years. There is a very active second hand market for solar kit here in Thailand. 

 

The batteries in my house and EV have a LFP Cathode chemistry. The are less energy dense than NMC batteries but have a longer cycle life. My house batteries are quoted as 6,000 cycles and I do a cycle every 2 days. The car every 5 days 

 

20 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

What are your thoughts on depreciation ? I've always been concerned that the value of an EV would drop off a cliff close to warranty expiration. But the value of an ICE doesn't...  but, engine parts are more readily replaceable than a knackered battery. 

 

My Seal has the equivalent of over 6 Tesla power walls of backup power, in 10 years time that would be down to 5.

 

The Seal is a class D saloon the same as as a Honda Accord or a Toyota Camry so would probably have a similar depreciation even though it was cheaper new than the Accord or the Camry.

 

 

 

[MalcolmB]

2 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

Which implies, a link between climate deniers and those who'd argue against EV's...

There is a link between the climate deniers and those who argue against EVs.

 

The mere mention of EVs sends them nutty.

 

If you don’t think there is then I will let you believe that. You believe plenty of other things that doesn’t suit your narrative not based on any facts.

 

Now imagine if the bus that just killed 25 in Bangkok was an EV. That would send them all right off. The climate denying anti EV mob love a good vehicle fire.

If it is an EV.

 

 

[troy]

7 hours ago, impulse said:

You would have a hard time convincing me that a $500, 5KW Honda generator is more efficient than a late model $30,000 ICE

True. I can't force you to study engineering. mathematics, or physics, and should you choose to ignore all three to preserve your pre-existing beliefs it really doesn't bother me.

'You be you" as they say. My comment was intended for those who want to be informed.

[DavisH]

On 9/30/2024 at 6:33 PM, ukrules said:

 

I bought a Vios about 10 years ago, cost me 600k baht.

Zero problems on it over the full 10 years, only did about 22,000 km total, couple of scratches, good for a few more years I think

When I'm done with it I'll pop down to Toyota and order a new one then just toss the old one out like the disposable tool it is.

2014 sells for 200-300K now. So you its probably depreciated about 50% in 10 year...not too shabby! You can sell a vios any day of the week...well, in the past you could. But the market is depressed at the moment. People just aren't buying cars at the moment. 

[Gweiloman]

2 hours ago, CallumWK said:

 

Yet there was another poster in this thread claiming that the air in China now was less polluted because of the EV's.

Here is the reality.

 

That poster would be me. I take it that English is not your native language as you seem to have comprehension issues. My earliest post read:

 

It is however a fact that EVs significantly reduce air pollution in urban areas. Up until a few years ago, major cities like Beijing and Shanghai were perpetually covered in smog, in part due to emissions from ICEVs. Thanks to the EV revolution, this is no longer the case.

 

To get from the above to “the air in China now was less polluted because of the EV's.” shows a glaring lack of cognitive ability. 

 

[Gweiloman]

3 hours ago, CallumWK said:

 

 

So what is it?

 

It doesn't produce enough energy to power the house, or it provides excess energy that you in addition to the house also can charge your EV's.

 

Please make up your mind

Yes, a definite lack of comprehension. If you know anything about solar (doubtful), you will know that the production is not constant. Sometimes it is more, sometimes it is less (trying to use simple English here). When the sun is not very strong because there are clouds in the sky blocking the sunlight, then the solar panels do not produce very much electricity. When this happens, there isn’t enough electricity generated, sorry, produced to power aircons and to charge the EV simultaneously, sorry, at the same time.

 

However, if it is a bright, sunny day with clear blue skies, then the sun shines very powerfully and the solar panels are very happy and work very hard to produce lots and lots of electricity, enough to power 2 air cons and charge the MG at the same time.

 

If still not clear, I suggest enrolling in an English school. British English of course.

[CallumWK]

6 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

Yes, a definite lack of comprehension. If you know anything about solar (doubtful), you will know that the production is not constant. Sometimes it is more, sometimes it is less (trying to use simple English here). When the sun is not very strong because there are clouds in the sky blocking the sunlight, then the solar panels do not produce very much electricity. When this happens, there isn’t enough electricity generated, sorry, produced to power aircons and to charge the EV simultaneously, sorry, at the same time.

 

However, if it is a bright, sunny day with clear blue skies, then the sun shines very powerfully and the solar panels are very happy and work very hard to produce lots and lots of electricity, enough to power 2 air cons and charge the MG at the same time.

 

If still not clear, I suggest enrolling in an English school. British English of course.

 

Why not use Chinese CCP stooge?

 

He didn't say he had not enough energy for the house AND charging the EV. When the sun isn't strong you don't need aircon.

 

Simple enough for you?

[JeffersLos]

16 hours ago, JBChiangRai said:

lost 10% depreciation in 2 years

 

🤣😂😅

[Gweiloman]

5 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

I'd buy an EV for the novelty value but similar to your wife... My employer gives me a fuel with 10k allowance each month, pays for my insurance and vehicle servicing.

Another nonsense post.

 

One day, when you decide to retire, will your ex-employer still give you a fuel allowance, pay for your insurance and vehicle servicing? In most of my previous jobs, not only did my employers pay for my fuel, insurance and serving, they even provided the vehicle so I didn’t even have to think about depreciation.

[G_Money]

10 hours ago, KhunLA said:

All these threads & posts from experienced BEV owners, and you're still extremely ignorant (to be kind).

 

Nuff said ... 

 

Not just you, but so many of the anti EV / CN folks just repeating the same false drivel.   Do y'all really get that big a kick out of trolling the threads ?

 

Along with comparing TH to other countries EV development or lack of.

 

Nothing wrong with ignorance, as been there done that, but after 10's of threads and 100's of posts, you'd think some of it would sink in.

 So how much is the cost of your generator and carrier which you need going any farther than your local neighborhood and Big C?

 

You really think all those charging stations shown before are going to be operational when you venture past Big C?

 

They can’t get their online 90 days report website working half the time.  
 

What makes you think this will “be different “?

 

No no my fellow BM, the ignorant one is you.

[Gweiloman]

10 minutes ago, CallumWK said:

 

Why not use Chinese CCP stooge?

 

He didn't say he had not enough energy for the house AND charging the EV. When the sun isn't strong you don't need aircon.

 

Simple enough for you?

Hmm.. I ignore the first sentence as that’s not worthy of a response.

 

When the sun is not strong, it can still be hot. Do you live in Thailand? And you are still not understanding what he is saying (apologies to “Mind your language “).

[G_Money]

5 hours ago, Gweiloman said:

Pretty much all EV owners in Thailand have a wall charger included when they purchased their vehicle. Free installation too. It’s not my fault that the US lacks behind the rest of the world even when it comes to the electricity infrastructure.

 

As for far travelling/long distance, it’s all relative. If you’re doing 1,000 km trips regularly in the US, then don’t buy an EV as the charging infrastructure, much like the rest of the infrastructure is 3rd world. In Thailand, this is a walk in the park.

Looking forward to your trip report of the Thailand tour, Chang Mai, Issan etc all in your EV using current charging stations available.

 

Or is that just a little too optimistic?

 

Some generators can fit in the trunk.

 

I can fill my fossil fuel tank in about 1-2 minutes max.

 

How long will it take to charge your depleted batteries?

[Gweiloman]

4 minutes ago, G_Money said:

 So how much is the cost of your generator and carrier which you need going any farther than your local neighborhood and Big C?

 

You really think all those charging stations shown before are going to be operational when you venture past Big C?

 

They can’t get their online 90 days report website working half the time.  
 

What makes you think this will “be different “?

 

No no my fellow BM, the ignorant one is you.

Another revelation! I didn’t realise that EV Station Pluz/PEA Volta/Elexa are the people behind immigration’s 90 day online reporting website 

 

You really are clueless. That in itself is not a crime but to argue about something that you have no knowledge of is complete idiocy. First, you claim you have seen with your own eyes, an EV driving around with a diesel generator mounted on a rack at the back of the EV. Now you claim that most charging stations are not operational. I think you’ve just lost all credibility. 

[G_Money]

1 minute ago, Gweiloman said:

Another revelation! I didn’t realise that EV Station Pluz/PEA Volta/Elexa are the people behind immigration’s 90 day online reporting website 

 

You really are clueless. That in itself is not a crime but to argue about something that you have no knowledge of is complete idiocy. First, you claim you have seen with your own eyes, an EV driving around with a diesel generator mounted on a rack at the back of the EV. Now you claim that most charging stations are not operational. I think you’ve just lost all credibility. 

Prove me wrong.  I have seen a gasoline, not diesel generator mounted.

 

Fact is you’re afraid to venture past your comfort zone (30 kilometers) in your EV for fear of being STRANDED.

 

 

[NoDisplayName]

3 hours ago, Bandersnatch said:

 

..........

Main Components (at todays prices) 
20,000 Watts of PV @ ฿5/W = ฿100,000
36kWh Batteries @ ฿5k/kWh = ฿180,000
20kW of Inversion @ ฿5k/kW = ฿100,000
Total = ฿380,000

 

Whole house setup?  That's like adding the cost of building a petrol station to the purchase price of an ICE.

 

I've got a 2-car parking area with 20m2 of flat roof free of tree shadow.  What would I need to charge a small EV once/week, with any extra power used for perimeter wall lighting and charging honey-bunny's 3-wheeler?  No connection to house power to minimize the system.

 

What would be the cost of a simple, dedicated solar EV charging system?

Edited October 1 by NoDisplayName

[Gweiloman]

1 minute ago, G_Money said:

Prove me wrong.  I have seen a gasoline, not diesel generator mounted.

 

Fact is you’re afraid to venture past your comfort zone (30 kilometers) in your EV for fear of being STRANDED.

 

 

Gasoline or diesel generator, it makes no difference. The onus is on you to prove your claim, not for me to disprove something that doesn’t exist.

Fact is, you’re not ignorant, just clueless.

 

He who knows not and knows not he knows not, he’s a fool, shun him.

 

[G_Money]

7 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

Gasoline or diesel generator, it makes no difference. The onus is on you to prove your claim, not for me to disprove something that doesn’t exist.

Fact is, you’re not ignorant, just clueless.

 

He who knows not and knows not he knows not, he’s a fool, shun him.

 

You keep digging yourself into a deeper hole, contradicting yourself.

 

While you’re digging you may come across some lithium.  Save it, you’ll need it.