Hua Hin Immigration clarifies rules on foreigners carrying ID

[Psychic]

This from the Canadian government site and I'm sure other governments have similar language.

Lost, stolen, damaged or found passports
A Canadian passport is a valuable document that should be kept in a safe place at all times. Once a passport has been reported lost or stolen, it is no longer valid and cannot be used for travel. This is to ensure that it is not used for fraudulent purposes. The Government of Canada cannot be held responsible for any difficulties you may encounter at border crossings if you attempt to use a passport that has been reported lost or stolen.

Maintaining the reputation of the Canadian passport requires constant vigilance. As a passport holder you must play your part by taking care of this important travel document.

If you are forced to carry your passport at all times, in all circumstances you will clearly be unable to follow this directive. So which government directive should you obey, your native country's or Thailand which permanently considers you transient as they refuse to give you any degree of permanence such as an ID card might provide.
But this seems to be part of the general trend of "unwelcoming" westerners. The Thai health insurance that is now only being offered to countries that provide cheap labour (and China for some reason) is another example.

[pandip]

Wow, it's good news for persons using stolen passports to fly abroad.

Because now they will have unlimited chances to steal passports.

Should the officers not think about the risk and problems to be bear by foreigners.

[YaiJung]

 

 

I'm just in the process of applying for a visa for India. As I live in the South, it will take me 3 (THREE) flights to Bangkok, to finally get the visa.

Just the normal crazy Indian bullsh***.

My passport will be in Bangkok for approx. 8 days (without me). 

So, my question to the Immigration officers is: How can I please apply for a visa without breaking the law?

 

 

Indian Embassy have to make do with seeing and photocoying your passport .... they have no right to hold on to your passport.

They also have a natural right to not stick a visa in a passport unless they are given the original.

 

 

The Indian Embassy does not keep your passport while you wait the 5 business days.  You apply, then bring your passport back on the pick-up day, dropping it off in the morning and picking it up in the afternoon with the visa attached.  You will only be without your passport for about 2-3 hrs for one day and you will have a receipt from the Indian Embassy. 

 

 

[virtualtraveller]

A great way to earn money; set up a checkpoint on the beach and demand to see passports of tourists, fine them 2,000 baht. It's not beyond the imagination of some crooked officials. Jeez man, why didn't immigration think of this before.

[ll2]

i dont have a problem about carrying my passport. i can understand that.

but maybe in the future, they might ask us to carry our passports visible on our bodies like tax discs on motorbikes!

this way, they can be sure faster maybe

 

so, if things go this way, one day, i dont get surprised to hear this from immigration: "Foreigners are not allowed to enter Thailand!"

[zydeco]

 

 

Foreign nationals in the USA have to carry passports at all times. Does that count as a first world democracy?

 

That is simply false.

 

Absolutely true. Foreign nationals are required to carry proof of their legal status at all times. Individuals used to be issued certificates they were required to carry, but now it is simply a stamp in the individuals passport. 

 

 

Actually, I think the wording indicates that foreign nationals in the US must carry documentation that indicates their immigration status.  Of course, these days that could be a matricula consular from the Mexican embassy for many local police departments.  Many US cities actually forbid any civil servant from inquiring about immigration status. I seem to remember some California cities passing regulations that forbade cooperation with Homeland Security/ICE.

 

[Fullstop]

Carrying Passport is not an option---to replace UK passport is now 6 weeks +.
Can Thai Visa please point out these facts or else there will be NO Tourists coming here.

 
No.. they won't. That would take balls. Why risk some emotionally weak official losing face and pulling strings to pull the plug on a successful online cash cow? If I owned this site...I'd copy Thais and kowtow, grovel and smile too. Edited July 30, 2014 by Fullstop

[DrTuner]

They could issue an official ID card for foreigners that serves as residence certificate as well, like in any civilized country.

The problem: the issuer would likely be the same instance that does the Thai ID's, meaning they'd have to generate a key in the database for each ID. That's possible, ID numbers beginning with 6 are for temporary stay. Then that ID number should be connected to Immigration's database, most likely by the Alien marching into Immigration with his shiny new card and passport. But ... the Immigration hasn't even managed to make the 90 day reports online. I suspect their IT department is way, way behind the systems in use in the West. 

 

To fix this mess, the Immigration needs to first revamp it's IT and make it available to general law enforcement for purposes of checking the immigration status, then the ID policy must be cleared and Sections 37&38 of Immigration Act revamped. This is all part of a major overhaul needed in Thai immigration, naturalization and labor laws, which seem to hail from the late 70's. The junta has brought enforcement of archaic laws, but I'm waiting for the reforms .. which could go totally wrong as well.

[Thai at Heart]

Well, someone from one of the bigger embassies needs to go around to Immigration and sit them down for a cup of tea, because this rule is just a very simple way of criminalizing perfectly innocent people by accident.  I don't think there are too many tourist family countries that insist that tourists carry their passports absolutely everywhere with them.  

 

 

[pandip]

 I reckon I'm going to breach this rule then and pay up the 2k when caught. Replacing the passport with all it's stamps if it's stolen is a far larger risk.

Yes, it's absolutely right for all .

I hope the officers will think again about their decision, they can't be so irresponsible.

[DP25]

They should just tattoo our immigration status on our arm. Add a new one every 90 days when go to immigration to check in.

[HerbalEd]

 I reckon I'm going to breach this rule then and pay up the 2k when caught. Replacing the passport with all it's stamps if it's stolen is a far larger risk.

You could still carry a photo copy of the photo page of your passport, and page(s) with your latest entry stamp and Thai visa. I'm betting  most policemen would accept this ... unless you're being checked because of some serious crime or issue.

[dominique355]

3. Immigration does not provide any kind of ‘stamp’ verification on a photocopy of a passport as announced at the meeting yesterday. Therefore, you are required to keep your original passport with you at all times as per point #1 above.

 

 

This is simply ridiculous!

 

Is the Immigration Department now openly supporting passport theft?

 

Probably another of this loud-mouth propagated regulations which will quickly die for lack of follow through and impracticability.

 

I certainly won't carry my passport on me at all times! I have Thai driver's license and a photocopy of my passport, that will have to do.

 

 

[Si Thea01]

Hello, the What if: I am not going to do it brigade are out in force.

 

The law is at it states but it appears some of you think you are above the law and do not have to follow the rules of your host country.  I am not going to!  I will pay the fine.  Who cares what you want to do, I am sick of the way people carry on about the rules and regulations. Can you tell me why you have an attitude such as this?

 

In countries all over the world you are required to carry your original passport.  Trot off to some of the extremist countries and see how far you attitude gets you and not having a passport on when stopped and checked.  No fines and  I can assure you and their gaols are not very nice.  Honestly, you have more chance of being run over by a bus then you have of losing or having your passport stolen.  Didn't your mummy teach you how to be careful and aware.  Obviously not from the rants on here 

 

You have elected to come and live in this country, no one invited you so abide by the bloody rules.  You all know what you can do if you do not like the situation.  Everyone came here for a reason but unfortunately some of you brought your poor attitudes and that chip.  Get rid of them both, play by the rules, instead of trying to beat them and maybe, just maybe, you will have an enjoyable time living here.

[bj42]

I am an Expat living in Jomtien since April this year and I just get confused-how to do-doing it right....???

[chrisinth]

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I have no problem being required to carry ID on me at all times in Thailand. However, carrying my passport with me at all times just isn't practical. What if it gets lost or stolen?

 

Isn't my Thai driving license and work permit already enough identification?

 

Or how about giving farangs some kind of ID card same as they do with people from Laos and Myanmar?

 

And on top of that, the Thai drivers license also shows the (foreigners) passport number and name written both in English and Thai...why make it so complicated?

This is really farang-unfriendly...
 

 

 

The problem that I see is that even though they will have the passport number, they have no system in place to verify the stamps/permission to stay that are in the original. Indeed, if you changed your passport during the validity of the driving licence then it would show the wrong number anyway. Unless of course you changed your licence to show the new number.

 

I am waiting until the first dozen or so police reports are filed over the next week for lost or stolen passports in Hua Hin, before it becomes nationwide, before there is a change in policy.

 

Lets see.........................

[watcharacters]

 I think most of us agree we are not against following the law but the carrying of what is the most important document most of us possess around with us 24/7 is impractical for all the reasons already outlined. 

Maybe if TV has the ability to see clarification from Immigration they may also be able to suggest ways of meeting the law and what the authorities hope to achieve by reintroducing it, what about....

Would it make sense to issue ID cards (for a fee) (Thai DL is only a few hunded baht) for pic, passport number visa details and expires at the same time the visa or extension does.

So in the case of a an expat on extension, it would be replaced at the extension renewal, for Non O will need replacing every 90 days, tourist visa 60 days and so on, Nil cost to the Government but an effective way to have the info they need when requested (easy to check overstayers/bogus visas etc) without causing the obvious security implications by lost or stolen passports.
Everybody satisfied

.

 

 

Gee.

 

 

Thanks for that clarification, i think.

[Aachen]

Did the good Colonel actually quote the law that requires this?

 

It's been a burning question here for years.

 

This is just common in many countries. The problem is how far this is enforced in a reasonable way...

[Jdiddy]

Well shit they really are on a roll, i wonder what its going to be like in 3 months? And to think theres probably loads of farangs here who dont read TV or keep up with events closely

 

 

Bring back the corrupt government.. while they cant do much good, they cant do much bad either or get on a roll like this, in my opinion

[Suradit69]

 I reckon I'm going to breach this rule then and pay up the 2k when caught. Replacing the passport with all it's stamps if it's stolen is a far larger risk.

 

Have you had things stolen/lost out of your pockets frequently?

 

I suppose it is a risk, especially for some late-night revelers, but the same thing could be said about driver's licenses, credit cards, cash, insurance id, etc.

[BudRight]

Foreign nationals in the USA have to carry passports at all times. Does that count as a first world democracy?
 
@ TV News: Do you have any clarification on the reporting of movements requirements? The way I read the movement reporting requirements they seem completely unworkable.
 
IE, I live in east Pattaya, same place for almost a year now. As I read the rules, If I went to Ban Chang for the weekend I would have to report to immigration in Rayong Province, and then report again to immigration here in Chonburi when I returned to my home. 
 
This seems crazy.

The part about the US is 100% bona fide bullshit.

[skippybangkok]

Guys... Simple....

Most cops could not be bothered cause the paperwork robs valuable time from the un- official money making jobs.

With traffic fines when they want to write out a fine, I say " knock yourself out ". 8 out of 10 just walk away when they know no pocket money to be had from this farang


Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa app Edited July 30, 2014 by skippybangkok

[PaulDee]

Has anyone asked for a legal opinion (not that of a TV member or some police major general

colonel supervisor), but an actual legal mind who knows the law and/or can access rules and

regs on the books?

 

And has anyone forwarded this nonsense to TAT for a reaction? On the heels of the coup

and subsequent curfew and media clamp down, Thailand is having enough problems luring

tourists . One would think that the impact on tourist income would be taken into account before

imposing more restrictions on visitors.

 

 

[Westaurel]

That they want it to be able to control your identity and if your visa is still valid or not !

 

If you present an ID card or driving licenese the policeman cannot control quickly the validity of the visa on place.

 

If you go to bathing you must carry a waterproof pocket to put your passport inside as Thai people use it to protect their mobile phone during Songkran !

Edited July 30, 2014 by Westaurel

[chrisinth]

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 I reckon I'm going to breach this rule then and pay up the 2k when caught. Replacing the passport with all it's stamps if it's stolen is a far larger risk.

 

Have you had things stolen/lost out of your pockets frequently?

 

I suppose it is a risk, especially for some late-night revelers, but the same thing could be said about driver's licenses, credit cards, cash, insurance id, etc.

 

 

I think the problem is more in the size of the passport than anything else. I envisage an increase in sales of bumbags (fanny packs) in the near future.

 

Followed swiftly by an increase in theft of said items......................

[Jingthing]

...
Honestly, you have more chance of being run over by a bus then you have of losing or having your passport stolen. 

...

That's absurd.

[DrTuner]

 

 I reckon I'm going to breach this rule then and pay up the 2k when caught. Replacing the passport with all it's stamps if it's stolen is a far larger risk.

 

Have you had things stolen/lost out of your pockets frequently?

 

Last one was a Nokia phone around 2008. I haven't carried anything in my pockets since. My driving license is in the car, the passport is in a safe.

[Carrerakiss]

Realistically, this will only be a problem during a police check, and those mostly happen when motoring. I haven't ever experienced any kind of police check at any other time. Although of course there was a brief period recently when immigration toured around places like Phuket checking for overstayers. I haven't heard about that happening recently, so assume it was the usual five minute wonder.

What may happen is that police may add a passport check on to the license check, in which case it will be another 200 or 300 baht to get it waived. Or, as they are police and not immigration, they may not get involved in it at all. Except if a crim is nabbed, he maya have a PP violation added to his murder charge, lol.

And/or Immigration will do occasional sweeps checking for PP's as and when it's their turn to announce a crack down on something.

To be fair to the immigration official quoted today, he can only state what the law actually is. He can hardly say " but don't worry we won't enforce it". That is far too blatant.

On the whole, I have no doubt that this is going to blow over. I certainly ain't going to take my PP out with me when drinking and likely to get more than a little tipsy. I may take a photocopy, although it still won't comply with the law.

If Thailand really wants to get tough on crims taking up refuge here, the authorities should change their approach and require everybody to undergo scrutiny before being issued a visa and entering the country. It's far easier to vet foreigners before they enter, rather than trying to keep check on everybody once they are here. Dunno what that does for the tourist industry, but hey, decide if you've got a big enough problem that warrants drastic action. I guess tourists could be given a max of 30 days and then entry and exit stamps married up, and if they don't, send out search parties for the missing tourist.

[monty1412]

what a goose, there is no exception to this

,Ohh really Im sorry Cheng Wattana you can't have my passport for three days to redo stamps,

Ohh Indian consulate that that visitors visa I was after you can't actual have my passport so be a good  man and just stamp it here and now,

Wake up goose, carrying passports all the time is dangerous , archaic and simply not practical

[Deacon Bell]

Thai Logic!

 

Thai ego of telling the farang what to do.