SURVEY: Will the new financial requirements force you to leave?

[wgdanson]

1 hour ago, RichardColeman said:

The problem is not what they do so much now, but what they may do in the future. I am quite lucky, I can from this year get enough from renting my uk house out and combine it with my pension to meet 65k a month - and most importantly have an escape route by not madly selling my house and moving 100% to Thailand. This said , I do fear an exodus - from what I read of the poll above 30% would be leaving - that is not a small amount and will seriously impact on the local economy of small businesses. Also I would say at least  - at least - 90% of my friends will fall foul of this demand if they cannot use agents. They are not just Brits, but Aussies, Irish, Europeans and other country citizens - they all have family who are soon going to be potless and there is little they can do to support them. 

Could you live on £1600 a month in UK, when you have to find another place to live cos you rented yours out? Just asking, nothing meant by it.

[4MyEgo]

4 hours ago, theoldgit said:

No I will not have to leave but as I get older the constant rule changes with ever ever changing hoops to jump over are becoming tiresome, and I'm really at a loss to understand the reasoning, other than "because we can".

 

I can afford to live hear comfortably but I just want a nice quiet and stress free life.

Stress is how all about how you handle situations IMO.

 

As for what has changed, nothing really, it's pretty much been the same, i.e. 65,000 baht per month, or 800,000 per annum, that said, Big Joke has put on his best shoes and has said, we have had rules in place for the retirement extension for years, however, there are a lot of farangs out there that do not comply with our rules, i.e. they pay around 20,000 baht to agents illegally to make things appear that these farangs have the money in the bank. I don't know how its done but also know a few farangs that also pay to get their extensions done without having the 800,000 baht requirement met.

 

So in theory, he is now putting things in practice, all that is being done is the tightening of the noose to weed out corruption with these agents and some immigration officers, and those farangs that don't meet the criteria, who's to blame, not Big Joke, but Mr Farang for not meeting the criteria, cry all you want, but that's the reality of it, like it or not, if you have the 800,000 baht your in, if you have the 65,000 baht income per month and provide the documents of where it's coming from, eg, source of income, then again, your in, if not, your out, again, who's fault, yours, all things come to an end, some sooner than others, but with good planning and forced savings over the years, eg a mortgage over a house which would have increased over years, is really your superannuation to live a comfortable life in the LOS.

[Pharoticus]

2 hours ago, simon43 said:

I'm seriously thinking about moving back to live in the High Pyrenee region of south-west France, (where I used to live).  Just minutes from cross-country skiing, Navarra in Spain, fine French food and wine, the Med and Atlantic coasts a few hours away etc.  I used to go hiking in the mountains most days when I lived there.

 

I have a UK passport which is still 'good' to live in EU countries, and my Irish ancestry means I can also get Irish citizenship if I need it.

 

The last time that I bought a small stone cottage with land in that region, I paid the equivalent of $20,000 USD.  I just checked on prices in similar villages for a solid house that needs renovating (I love DIY!).  The price?  Still $20,000......... and I can own it 100%

Superb idea. I know the area you're referring to quite well. It's really beautiful.

[metisdead]

A troll post hinting at illegal solutions wink wink nudge nudge has been removed.

 

 

[garyk]

You are polling a captive audience, most people on TV have been here for years and are older.  I doubt these new rules will force them out.

New retiree's will be a different story. Of course no one from America would consider Thailand as a retirement option. So that will dry up IMO.

 

Really I say let Thailand raise the bar all they want! Since Thailand is now prosperous and flexing it's muscles, and alining with others. If they want to distance themselves from Westerners fine with me. I don't think it is a wise move on their part, but it is their country and I am only a guest. 

Fortunately I don't have to put up with it, So I am good to go...

 

 

 

[Surasak]

It doesn't bother me, I have sufficient funds in a Thai bank to cover the requirements. I also have a reasonable income from pensions, building up in a UK bank A/C  which I occasionally draw from. My wife and I run a small business which keeps the family at a reasonable standard, nothing fancy but we wont' starve. In my twilight years I would hope that my family will look after me and give the same support as I have given them. I have every confidence they will do so. When deciding to move from ones home country, reasonable finances are required to do so and one must look to the longer term. Money is the root of all evil, but without it?

[poohy]

Believe you me many solutions illegal or not are already being discussed 

 

personally doubt anything will happen too many people make money out it (BJ included remember)and donr give me that s**t he honest you dont get jobs in thailand like that by being honest

 

For me my solutions become employed by a friends Thai company 3800 THB for a WP

[birddogger]

I've kept more than 800K in a Thai account for more than 8 years. Always considered it the cost of being allowed to live here. Is the next Immigration shoe to drop medical insurance? I'm covered on that as well but after 70 it's very expensive. If they don't rescind this latest rule and top it off with compulsory medical insurance there's going to be a bunch of cheap condos hitting the market.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[TheThai]

2 hours ago, nchuckle said:

Read the original police order more carefully-it IS transfers from abroad, hence the other threads about many fx companies like Transferwise transactions appearing on your statement as domestic because of the intermediary bank used before arriving in your Thai bank account. You could (if you have an account) use a normal bank to do the transfers but their charges are up to £25 (1000 baht) per transaction so an extra 12000 per year to use ,and a worse exchange rate. You cannot rely on statements from Transferwise to prove the transaction to immigration officers- for most it will be too complicated to understand.

My Transferwise transactions show as FOREIGN TRANSFERS (FTT) in my bank book.   

[overherebc]

2 hours ago, ozmeldo said:

High drama here

 

Life is based on similar situations and circumstances.

 

It's what often drives migration, families are routinely broken up so breadwinners can chase money to feed their families.

 

What do you expect from the country? Permanent residency for being broke? That's a serious question, not being flippant.

PR for being broke is a bit strong don't you think?

For many years I worked O&G contracts, paid by overseas companies. Generally those contract lasted one and half to two and a half years. All that money came into Thailand and tax was paid in Thailand.

All that counts for nothing regards getting any chance of applying for a long term stay in Thailand.

If I'd worked as a teacher earning 30,000 baht a month the money to pay me would not have come into Thailand from outside but I might have worked for 3 years non-stop and would have been able to apply for a long term stay, whatever, while being able to buy a second hand bike/scooter or go to work on the bus.

It would make me angry to work out how much I've brought in and paid tax to Thailand on.

We, she and me, are talking more and more about re-location, but not in Asia, and my wife has said she will be happy to come back to BKK and sort out visas etc for wherever we decide on.

Probably Europe somewhere, it was almost decided until Brexit reared it's ugly head.

At least we will know that the conditions regarding her getting visas etc will remain

( fairly ) constant and not change every year.

We don't have kids to worry about and I definitely don't need to support any family hanger ons.

[AjarnMartin]

4 hours ago, mfd101 said:

I moved in December from Old Method (1) Citibank debit card at atm [easily the cheapest way to bring funds] to Method (2) TW transfer of 70K฿ each month to BKK Bank account + Citibank debit card for the other 60 or 70K my b/f and his family manage to get through.

 

Method (3) 800K฿ in the bank remains a future fallback if necessary, but it just became a whole lot less attractive - unless one looks on it as health or other insurance resource.

 

Hi mfd101,

I too use TW but my SCB account shows it as a ‘domestic’ transfer. Does BKK Bank record it differently to the satisfaction of Thai Immigration requirements? Of course it’s only for my next Retirement Extension as local office have told me I need to deposit 800K for 2020 Extension. ???? Thanks.

[K in BKK]

Ive read the original marathon thread...phew, that was a struggle at times.

 

I can do the 800K so its not a problem for me. What is more of a concern is the shifting sands of immigration policy and the fact that policy appears to be made up on the run.

 

Thanks to everyone who keeps us mushrooms informed.

[Pravda]

3 hours ago, simon43 said:

After living in Thailand for almost 20 years, I too am seriously considering my options.  I currently live in Thailand on an Elite visa that is due for renewal (and 500,000 baht payment) in 18 months from now. 

 

 

 

Yes, we know. You men mention it in just about every post.

[mfd101]

9 minutes ago, AjarnMartin said:

Hi mfd101,

I too use TW but my SCB account shows it as a ‘domestic’ transfer. Does BKK Bank record it differently to the satisfaction of Thai Immigration requirements? Of course it’s only for my next Retirement Extension as local office have told me I need to deposit 800K for 2020 Extension. ???? Thanks.

(1) Yes, currently - will it last? - TW transfer into BKK Bank shows as TFF and, I'm told, will show up in your bank declaration of monthly monies as 'International transfer'. So, as far as anyone can tell, if you're going to do the TW path, then you need a BKK Bank account.

(2) If your local TI folks have said you HAVE to do 800K in the bank next time round, then they are - I think - wrong. Either they are mistaken/confused/ill-advised, or they're trying to push you to the 800K method and use of an agent (which means backhanders for them).

[Lee65]

I could easily meet the new financial requirements but will not subject myself to even greater insult by the Thai authorities.  Lock up 400,000 baht in Thailand?  Never.  Jump through more hoops?  No.

 

Thailand, once cheap and interesting, has become ever less pleasant.  The traffic, pollution, noise, number of tourists, the cost of living, and many other issues, have all worsened markedly in the last decade.  These new regulations will be the final push for me to find a better, more hospitable place in which to spend my money.

[elliss]

       800k in a thai bank,  suits  two purposes  for me , to satisfy visa requirements ,

        secondly as a source of income for emergency medical costs , hope i never need 800k.

         Then I will be , really  sick.

 

             Where will the hammer fall next , marriage  visas ?,  what wife. 555

 

         

     

Edited February 3, 2019 by elliss

[mngmn]

5 minutes ago, Lee65 said:

I could easily meet the new financial requirements but will not subject myself to even greater insult by the Thai authorities.  Lock up 400,000 baht in Thailand?  Never.  Jump through more hoops?  No.

 

Thailand, once cheap and interesting, has become ever less pleasant.  The traffic, pollution, noise, number of tourists, the cost of living, and many other issues, have all worsened markedly in the last decade.  These new regulations will be the final push for me to find a better, more hospitable place in which to spend my money.

You will be accused of hijacking this thread to moan about Thailand but I agree that the decision to go or stay has many aspects. Simplifying this into three financial options tends to over simplify the decision process (just ask David Cameron).

[Khaeng Mak]

38 minutes ago, Surasak said:

It doesn't bother me, I have sufficient funds in a Thai bank to cover the requirements. I also have a reasonable income from pensions, building up in a UK bank A/C  which I occasionally draw from. My wife and I run a small business which keeps the family at a reasonable standard, nothing fancy but we wont' starve. In my twilight years I would hope that my family will look after me and give the same support as I have given them. I have every confidence they will do so. When deciding to move from ones home country, reasonable finances are required to do so and one must look to the longer term. Money is the root of all evil, but without it?

How did you get your work permit while on a retirement extension?

[Khaeng Mak]

4 minutes ago, elliss said:

       800k in a thai bank,  suits  two purposes  for me , to satisfy visa requirements ,

        secondly as a source of income for emergency medical costs , hope i never need 800k.

         Then I will be , really  sick.

 

             Where will the hammer fall next , marriage  visas ?,  what wife. 555

 

         

     

Yeah but under these new rules you wont be able to access the money for any emergency. 400K has to remain in the account at all times. And the 800K is only accessible for 7 months due to the seasoning requirements.

[holy cow cm]

And what was said maybe a few - several weeks ago? Retirement visa changes to help the expats more? Something like that. 

[Chongalulu]

2 hours ago, wgdanson said:

Not if you highlighted say £1000 on a Transferwise statement on 1st Feb, and a deposit into your Bkk Bank for Bht 40xxx on 2nd Feb. Surely even an IO would understand that

I recently extended my visa on income letter and raised this subject with the IO showing her a complete paper audit trail - I might as well have been talking Greek- now imagine showing 12 sets of audit trails at the next renewal......

What you THINK would be common sense and what is acceptable....well TIT ! 

[Chongalulu]

1 hour ago, TheThai said:

My Transferwise transactions show as FOREIGN TRANSFERS (FTT) in my bank book.   

You must have a Bangkok bank account which for the moment is showing FTT. I’m Kasikorn and it’s 'domestic transfer'. A poster contacted Transferwise who advised them that they used Bangkok bank as the intermediary which is why it it showed up that way but they also told her they have options to use 2 other banks so could not guarantee that would remain the case. You’ve only got to be caught out once like that in a whole year and the basis of your next application is voided.

[marcusarelus]

1 hour ago, garyk said:

You are polling a captive audience, most people on TV have been here for years and are older.  I doubt these new rules will force them out.

New retiree's will be a different story. Of course no one from America would consider Thailand as a retirement option. So that will dry up IMO.

 

Really I say let Thailand raise the bar all they want! Since Thailand is now prosperous and flexing it's muscles, and alining with others. If they want to distance themselves from Westerners fine with me. I don't think it is a wise move on their part, but it is their country and I am only a guest. 

Fortunately I don't have to put up with it, So I am good to go...

I'm from America and in the 20 years I've been retired here no rules have changed that effect me so I am not going anywhere. 

[Thaidream]

I won't be leaving only because I have a Thai family who I support and love. if I was single- I'd be out of here in a flash. While I can meet the requirements- as someone who first entered Thailand almost 50 years ago- I am not only offended but seriously saddened by  the approach Thai immigration is taking. 

 

-Nothing wrong with requiring a 65K per month income but the way they want one to do it is ridiculous- transfer of funds only when I can pull unlimited funds from a Thai ATM  and show a few pieces of paper to prove I have the income.  Then there is the  issue of Transferring not showing  foreign transfers.. Add in the issue of Immigration Officers not being familiar with the coding for every bank and the fact they will need  alot of time to scrutinize many transaction  in the bank books and this system will not work easily.  A better system- 65K in a Thai bank every month- source not important. Simply scrutinize the Bank book for the 65K amount and add the total.  

 

2.  Depositing 800K and seasoning for 2 months- then apply and get an under consideration stamp for 90 days- return wit bank book and show 400K remaining but can't use it- leave it there- put in another 400K next year to make the 800K- absurd and not workable. The purpose of the income method is to show income and the purpose of the money in the bank is to show one has enough to live on  for the year- not to lock it up as some bond.

If they want to stop the agents for putting the money in the bank- make a rule that the applicant has to appear in person and do not waive the seasoning requirement. Any agent sponsored  extension then is subject to a review after 90 days. The rest of the applicants- self funded need to be left alone.

 

I find it ludicrous that long term expats with or without families have purchased condos or homes plus cars and other fixed assets and are subject to this nonsense.  I

 

[mokwit]

If TAT is actively marketing Thailand as a "retirement" destination I think we should contact them and suggest they kindly stop as some kind of security of residence is required for people getting older. Changing the deal on people completely undermines that.

 

 

[NanLaew]

7 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

If they want to stop the agents for putting the money in the bank- make a rule that the applicant has to appear in person and do not waive the seasoning requirement.

Since the need for the applicant to present the application in person is a legal requirement and has been printed on just about every TM-whatever form for several years already, I am pretty confident that any claims that this is all about forcing agents out of business is BS.

[cyril sneer]

is this thread worth reading back or is it just people gloating about how much money they have?

[Suradit69]

1 hour ago, AjarnMartin said:

Hi mfd101,

I too use TW but my SCB account shows it as a ‘domestic’ transfer. Does BKK Bank record it differently to the satisfaction of Thai Immigration requirements? Of course it’s only for my next Retirement Extension as local office have told me I need to deposit 800K for 2020 Extension. ???? Thanks.

I believe all TW transfers come to Bangkok Bank first so if you have an account there it's shown as an international transfer.. If you use a different bank, the money is then transferred from Bangkok Bank to your banK so it appears to be a domestic transfer as far as your bank is concerned.

[ozmeldo]

The poll is interesting. It's remained constant. If you haven't taken the poll, please do so.

[flexomike]

1 hour ago, TheThai said:

My Transferwise transactions show as FOREIGN TRANSFERS (FTT) in my bank book.   

Real nice,  how about letting people know what bank you are using,  my guess Bangkok Bank