Opponents of 'no-deal' Brexit defeat PM Johnson, who promises an election

[cdnvic]

If you tell another poster to "suck it up" or discuss moderation, expect your posts to disappear at the very least. If you are incapable of getting your point across without insults or overly combative language, stick to reading.

[cleopatra2]

2 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

Got this in an email.

 

Have to say it has a depressing reality to it.

 

Johnson is going to take this right to the wire with Brexit and resign a couple of days before exit day. This way there will be no-one in a position to ask for an extension and we will default to no deal because no other deal has been passed.

 

There will then be another Tory leadership contest which Johnson will win.

 

The ensuing general election will be won by the Conservatives due to Johnsons popularity with the Brexit fundamentalists south of the border.

 

Sturgeon will ask for another independence referendum which will be refused.

 

Sturgeon will then try going through the courts to get a ruling to say she can have one. This will go all the way to the supreme court in London and get thrown out.

Cant appeal to the EU court of human rights any more so independence is now kicked in the nuts.

Sturgeon will then try using the Holyrood elections as a defacto independence referendum which downing street will refuse to recognize.

Holyrood will be shut down by Westminster. 

 

We will then face a generation of misery as country after country strikes trade deals with the UK which allows them to come in and carpet bag everything they want.

Say goodbye to the NHS.

Northern Ireland will turn back into a war zone.

 

The UK will be turned into a tax haven for the rich and shameless while workers rights are destroyed. English nationalism will be celebrated and rewarded. Knighthoods and peerages for all the rabid Brexiteers. 

 

The pound will trade on parity with the Zimbabwean dollar.

 

Eventually in about 20 years someone will have a really good idea and demand a referendum about joining the EU.

In the evenf of the PM resigning does not result automatic GE. Parliament business carries on untill a new PM is appointed.

 

Take the example  of TM resignation

 

in addition the extension as to be made 19th October

Edited September 7, 2019 by cleopatra2

[Bluespunk]

3 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Its called a General Election but its the remainers who don't want one. That's a vote. Not ignored like in your country.

Not true, as per. 

 

The opposition want an election, but not until the bill blocking a no deal exit is in place.

 

When that happens johnson can have his election once an extension is in place or a deal is brought to parliament and approved by them. 

 

Of course this will have to be after October 31st.

 

Best get your skates on johnson or start digging that ditch. 

[Rookiescot]

1 hour ago, brewsterbudgen said:

The option of Corbyn calling a vote of no confidence in Johnson's government is still there.  If the scenario you refer to is likely, the government will lose. And if the "Remain Alliance" can agree on a temporary Prime Minister, they will be able to form a government to extend Article 50.  Unfortunately the Remainers will need to accept Corbyn as PM, or Jeremy will need to accept a compromise candidate like Ken Clark or Margaret Beckett.  If the stakes are high enough, it could happen.

I dont think there will be time to even form one.

[transam]

5 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

Not true, as per. 

 

The opposition want an election, but not until the bill blocking a no deal exit is in place.

 

When that happens johnson can have his election once an extension is in place or a deal is brought to parliament and approved by them. 

 

Of course this will have to be after October 31st.

 

Best get your skates on johnson or start digging that ditch. 

We already have a that ditch, it is called "The English Channel"....Hooraaaa

[Rookiescot]

9 minutes ago, cleopatra2 said:

In the evenf of the PM resigning does not result automatic GE. Parliament business carries on untill a new PM is appointed.

 

Take the example  of TM resignation

 

in addition the extension as to be made 19th October

Sadly because we have no written constitution there is going to be no-one able to request an extension if Johnson resigns. There will be insufficient time to form a coalition of remain minded MP's.

There is no deputy PM.

[Bluespunk]

3 minutes ago, transam said:

We already have a that ditch, it is called "The English Channel"....Hooraaaa

Good, then johnson can choose drowning as his method of demise. 

[Rookiescot]

4 minutes ago, transam said:

Oh, no comment on my "Back door with terrorists" then...?

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-18607911

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-32786393

 

You can also add David Cameron, Tony Blair and countless other politicians doing the same thing.

[stevenl]

2 hours ago, DannyCarlton said:

under May's deal or no deal?

No answer, no surprise.

[Rimmer]

A baiting troll post removed, keep this up and you will be off on some hols

[cleopatra2]

11 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Sadly because we have no written constitution there is going to be no-one able to request an extension if Johnson resigns. There will be insufficient time to form a coalition of remain minded MP's.

There is no deputy PM.

Again if the current PM relinquished his role immediateky the next in line would take responsibility.

 

The PM is obliged to request extension by 19th October

[Rookiescot]

1 minute ago, cleopatra2 said:

Again if the current PM relinquished his role immediateky the next in line would take responsibility.

 

The PM is obliged to request extension by 19th October

Who is next in line?

There is no deputy PM.

[cleopatra2]

5 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Who is next in line?

There is no deputy PM.

The question that would matter is could the opposition form a co alition to form a majority government. 

In essence the PM resigning could lead to the conservatives not being in government anymore without an election

Edited September 7, 2019 by cleopatra2

[Airbagwill]

31 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Sadly because we have no written constitution

Why do people repeatedly roll out this cliché? We do have a constitution, it just isn't all written in one place like the USA. 

A lot of UK law is convention ruled though but this allows for flexibility and of course abuse.

BJ is well aware of this and has plenty more abuse up his sleeve.

 

Eventually though one will gave to get used to the idea that Brexit isn't going to happen, Boris will be thrown out and even if the UK crashed out, it would just have to crash back in again....... You cant rule that the earth us flat ... Its about time Brexiteers got over that.

Edited September 7, 2019 by Airbagwill

[sandyf]

31 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Sadly because we have no written constitution there is going to be no-one able to request an extension if Johnson resigns. There will be insufficient time to form a coalition of remain minded MP's.

There is no deputy PM.

I do not think that is true, it is the government that must request an extension and there will always be a head of government, even if only temporary.

 

Speaking to The Independent, Sir Malcolm predicted that Mr Johnson would “grit his teeth” and accept the “humiliation” of the U-turn on his pledge rather than wave goodbye to Downing Street. Or he said Mr Johnson could even stand aside for a matter of weeks and appoint a caretaker PM to undertake the painful job of requesting a further extension before his return to No 10, in order to avoid personally breaking his promise.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-no-deal-bill-vote-house-lords-boris-johnson-law-parliament-latest-a9094741.html

[tebee]

4 hours ago, sanemax said:

people have already voted on that though and they voted to leave the EU

over three years ago now though. Roughly 1 million people die each year and one million are born. So 3 million of the people who voted are dead now and a different 3 million have turned 18 and can now vote. Six million different people. Let that sink in.

 

Why should we still me bound by that vote ?

[vogie]

4 minutes ago, tebee said:

over three years ago now though. Roughly 1 million people die each year and one million are born. So 3 million of the people who voted are dead now and a different 3 million have turned 18 and can now vote. Six million different people. Let that sink in.

 

Why should we still me bound by that vote ?

Why should we still me bound by that vote ?

 

Because that was the result of the referendum and the same reason we have to be bound to respect Chelsea beating Man United in the FA Cup.

You can't go through life relying on people dying just to get your own way, it's just not right tebee.

[DannyCarlton]

11 minutes ago, vogie said:

Why should we still me bound by that vote ?

 

Because that was the result of the referendum and the same reason we have to be bound to respect Chelsea beating Man United in the FA Cup.

You can't go through life relying on people dying just to get your own way, it's just not right tebee.

Get it right. The last time Chelsea played us in the cup (last February) we beat them 2-0 at their's. Respect.

 

The referendum was advisory. No respect.

 

We'll all be dead one day and our children will still be suffering from the consequences of Boris' no deal Brexit. Not on my watch.

 

 

Edited September 7, 2019 by DannyCarlton

[Laughing Gravy]

1 hour ago, Rookiescot said:

Sadly because we have no written constitution there is going to be no-one able to request an extension if Johnson resigns. There will be insufficient time to form a coalition of remain minded MP's.

There is no deputy PM.

Or as it is suggested in some papers today he ignores it completely and be a martyr.

[Laughing Gravy]

22 minutes ago, tebee said:

over three years ago now though. Roughly 1 million people die each year and one million are born. So 3 million of the people who voted are dead now and a different 3 million have turned 18 and can now vote. Six million different people. Let that sink in.

 

Why should we still me bound by that vote ?

What a charmer you are. Not everyone who dies is over 18 and unless you are better than Mystic Meg, would vote for remain. So I guess your posts is nonsense.

 

The last sentence of your posts shows just how deluded many are. The vote (yes remain lost) hasn't even been acted upon.

 

It took 40 plus years to get a vote and you want another one because you lost and citing people are dead so we should vote again. On your idea we should have one every year then. Let that sink in.

 

Unbelievable.

Edited September 7, 2019 by Laughing Gravy

[vogie]

1 minute ago, DannyCarlton said:

Get it right. The last time Chelsea played us in the cup (last February) we beat them 2-0 at their's. Respect.

 

The referendum was advisory. No respect.

I was talking about the 2018 FA cup final, my bad.

 

Where have I said that the referendum was anything else but advisory. But just to add, parliament agreed to act on behalf of the advice they received from the British electorate.

[tebee]

11 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

What a charmer you are. Not everyone who dies is over 18 and unless you are better than Mystic Meg, would vote for remain. So I guess your posts is nonsense.

 

The last sentence of your posts shows just how deluded many are. The vote (yes remain lost) hasn't even been acted upon.

 

It took 40 plus years to get a vote and you want another one because you lost and citing people are dead so we should vote again. On your idea we should have one every year then. Let that sink in.

 

Unbelievable.

I'm not saying the vote would be 6 million votes different this time, I'm saying there are 6 million different people in the electorate. Why should today's electorate be bound by an electorate that no longer exists ?

[vogie]

1 minute ago, tebee said:

I'm not saying the vote would be 6 million votes different this time, I'm saying there are 6 million different people in the electorate. Why should today's electorate be bound by an electorate that no longer exists ?

Magna Carta died years ago, but we still follow her rules. ????????????

[DannyCarlton]

18 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

It took 40 plus years to get a vote and you want another one because you lost and citing people are dead so we should vote again. On your idea we should have one every year then. Let that sink in.

We had an in out referendum 40+ years ago and remain won. Brexiteers spent the next 40+ years whining that they wanted another one. At least you've only had to put up with remainers whinging for 3+ years that we want another one. Where's your gratitude?

[vogie]

7 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

No mate, Magnus Carter.

 

I once took my son to see it in Hereford Cathedral. I made him read all of it and said, "Now you know why we have a parliamentary democracy and if anyone tells you that a people's referendum is binding, you can tell them where to go".

 

He voted remain and would tear a strip off you if you told him that the referendum was binding.

Didn't the Magna Carta give all free men the right to justice, from where I'm sitting there doesn't seem much of that about.

[tebee]

5 hours ago, sanemax said:

people have already voted on that though and they voted to leave the EU

So we leave the EU and re-join Efta - are you happy now? Mandate satisfied and we've only decimated half our economy.

[DannyCarlton]

1 minute ago, vogie said:

Didn't the Magna Carta give all free men the right to justice, from where I'm sitting there doesn't seem much of that about.

From where I'm sitting we're going to get it real soon. Expect a confirmatory vote coming to a polling station near you.

[vogie]

1 minute ago, DannyCarlton said:

From where I'm sitting we're going to get it real soon. Expect a confirmatory vote coming to a polling station near you.

You are letting your imagination run away with you again.

[DannyCarlton]

3 minutes ago, vogie said:

You are letting your imagination run away with you again.

Yes, I think it's trying to catch up with yours. Long way to go though.

 

 

Edited September 7, 2019 by DannyCarlton

[tomacht8]

11 minutes ago, vogie said:

I was talking about the 2018 FA cup final, my bad.

 

Where have I said that the referendum was anything else but advisory. But just to add, parliament agreed to act on behalf of the advice they received from the British electorate.

If I remember correctly, the British government negotiated Brexit for almost three years.

At the end then, Mays Brexit deal was not good enough.

So what was the reason?

 

Obviously, there were several versions of Brexit in people's minds.
You remember March 2019?
The eight Options?

No deal – DEFEATED 160 to 400
‘Common market 2.0’ – DEFEATED 188 to 283
EEA/Efta without customs union – DEFEATED 64 to 377
Customs union – DEFEATED 265 to 271
Labour plan – DEFEATED 237 to 307
Revoke article 50 – DEFEATED 184 to 293
Confirmatory public vote – DEFEATED 268 to 295
Contingent preferential arrangements – DEFEATED 139 to 422

To date, the Brexit is still unclear.
But one can not say that the UK government and Parliament have not tried to find a solution.
And if you are in such a deep hole, you should think about not digging further.
Until now, the Brexit has only brought strife and massiv economic losses.
And not only for the UK alone, but also for the other 27 member states.

 

So after 3.5 years you should draw a line and realize that a Brexit without a plan and without substantive consensus is a flop.

A failed experiment.
A failed experiment that has damaged and endangers the well-being of all in Europe.

If the majority of UK people want Brexit al a Boris no deal, then it should be.
But where is the proof?
Can it be that there is no more majority for any Brexit currently?
But where is the proof?

The task of the politicians is now to provide clarity quickly.