O/A visa and insurance experience today

[kingofthemountain]

6 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

There is still a universal principle of fairness and equity and people need to be reminded of it.

Thailand is a well know exception

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

4 minutes ago, jackdd said:

I think so far we didn't have a report of somebody who went to get an extension after 31.10. and who initially started with an OA visa.

Imho the insurance requirement should not apply to extensions, because there is only one "retirement extension". If they consider this to be two different retirement extensions (one for non-o and one for non-oa), then it should be possible to just switch to the "non-o retirement extension", because there is nothing prohibiting you to switch to a different kind of extension.

 

Try this... just one page back on this same thread:

 

 

 

[Peter Denis]

57 minutes ago, cookieboy said:

I went to my local IO (Phetchabun) to enquire if I needed a Health Insurance Policy when my current extention finishes nex month. I entered thailand 2007 on an O-A visa and have had yearly extentions since then. 

I changed from a retirement extention to an extention based on married to a Thai 12 months ago. I was told that because my initial entry was on O-A then I would need the health Insurance to do my next extention.

> Deleted.  My concern adequately addressed in post #489 by sometimewoodworker.

Edited November 8, 2019 by Peter Denis

[jackdd]

3 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Try this... just one page back on this same thread:

He didn't actually apply, he just asked about it. If he actually applies for the extension the outcome might be different.

Especially because he isn't even applying for a retirement extension but one for marriage.

[sometimewoodworker]

5 minutes ago, jackdd said:

I think so far we didn't have a report of somebody who went to get an extension after 31.10. and who initially started with an OA visa.

Imho the insurance requirement should not apply to extensions, because there is only one "retirement extension". If they consider this to be two different retirement extensions (one for non-o and one for non-oa), then it should be possible to just switch to the "non-o retirement extension", because there is nothing prohibiting you to switch to a different kind of extension.

You can certainly switch, but only by exiting and returning with a Non-O. 
 

You can change the reason for an extension but you cannot change the the Visa the extension is based on.

 

There is no provision for issuing a Non-O in thailand if you are already on a long term extension. Yes for the short Visas and VE 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

3 minutes ago, jackdd said:

He didn't actually apply, he just asked about it. If he actually applies for the extension the outcome might be different.

Especially because he isn't even applying for a retirement extension but one for marriage.

 

There have been multiple reports here by various members of being told exactly the same thing by their Immigration Offices. The post I quoted above is hardly the only one of its kind. That seems to be the way the wind is blowing.

 

However, the surprising part about that post is the guy indicating that he's being told it also will be required for a MARRIAGE extension that dates back to a prior O-A visa....

 

Most of the posts of that kind thus far have been regarding retirement extensions that date back to O-A visas being told that insurance will be required.

 

Immigration added language to the retirement extensions police order recently including the insurance requirement. But they did not make the same insurance requirement change to the requirements for marriage extensions. Which makes the advice the poster received very perplexing....

 

 

Edited November 8, 2019 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[sometimewoodworker]

6 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

I do not doubt your report, but this opens yet another can of poison worms.

So even after having changed your Visa-type (in this case to a Non Imm O based on  marriage), you are still required to meet the health-insurance requirement because somewhere in the past you had an OA?

For sure that must be a mistake by the Phetchabun IO!

The Visa type was NOT changed. The reason for the extension was changed.

 

To the best of my knowledge Visa types are/can never be changed.

 

You can get an extension of permission to stay for any Non-O type (O, OA, OX) for marriage, support of Thai national, retirement 
 

The police order specifically addresses extensions for 2.22 (retirement) not 2.18 (In the case of being a family member of a Thai national (applicable only to parents, spouse, children, adopted children, or spouse's children))

So it would probably be an expansion by a Phetchabun IO and may not apply when you come to apply for an extension under 2.18

Edited November 8, 2019 by sometimewoodworker

[LivinLOS]

2 hours ago, UncleFesterNightmare said:

My OA expired 3 years ago.  That date is well before the 31st of last month.  Why do I have to show anything?

Because at your next extension, of an OA visa class generated permission of stay, they will need it.

 

You know this right ?? 

[jackdd]

5 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

There have been multiple reports here by various members of being told exactly the same thing by their Immigration Offices. The post I quoted above is hardly the only one of its kind. That seems to be the way the wind is blowing.

If this is really the way they will handle it, i wonder what would happen with somebody who once entered on an OA visa, but is now on an extension for working. Technically he would also have to buy insurance.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

11 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

So even after having changed your Visa-type (in this case to a Non Imm O based on  marriage), you are still required to meet the health-insurance requirement because somewhere in the past you had an OA?

 

What Immigration appears to be doing is looking back to the MOST RECENT /  LAST actual visa a person has...and looking at whether that was an O-A visa.

 

The fact that a person may have had one or five or 10 annual extensions of stay AFTER the visa doesn't change the fact that their LAST actual visa was an O-A.

 

And as I mentioned above, in doing the insurance requirement changes, Immigration specifically added language re the insurance requirement to the section on retirement extension requirements.  They did not, however, add that same language to the section on marriage extension requirements.... which as I said... make the advice the prior poster received perplexing...

 

[LivinLOS]

1 hour ago, Martyp said:

I'm came on an OA in 2017. I am not concerned about O's. That is not what I am waiting to hear. I want to hear about experiences of people who arrived on OA's but are now on 1-year extensions stay that they got at the Immigration office in Thailand. Are this category of people being asked to provide proof of insurance at the airport/border? Are they being required to provide proof of insurance when applying for a 1-year extension? I know what people have been told before Oct 31. I am waiting to see what is happening now.

Yes and yes. 

Get insured or change visa class to an O. 

[Peter Denis]

14 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

You can certainly switch, but only by exiting and returning with a Non-O.

The expiry date of my current OA Visa is June 26, 2020 and my permission to stay is valid till July 22, 2020.

Can I exit Thailand in course of coming weeks and apply for a Non Imm O based on retirement in a neighbouring country?

Or would the not-expired OA Visa prohibit this?

[LivinLOS]

55 minutes ago, cookieboy said:

I changed from a retirement extention to an extention based on married to a Thai 12 months ago. I was told that because my initial entry was on O-A then I would need the health Insurance to do my next extention.

Even for a marriage based extension.. Coming from an initial OA. 

 

REALLY tight control !!! 

[Mango Bob]

1 hour ago, Sheryl said:

 

the last report I have seen posted on CW Imm was by member Pib and said he was told all extensions that came in on an OA originally, no matter how long ago, will need insurance.  That contradicts what some others were told earlier so worth rechecking with them closer to the date, as well as following developments on this forum as the situation seems quite fluid.

 

But also worth making some contingency plans in case it is required.

 

I called the hotline Tuesday and they told me we do need insurance when there extension of stay ends..  For those who entered Thailand with an O/A visa and are on an extension of stay now.  So two different reports.

[Mango Bob]

I also just called the hotline now about a O visa based on marriage.  I stated that I had an O/A visa when I came to Thailand 13 years ago.  Now I am going to get married and go out of Thailand and apply for an O visa based on marriage.  I asked if I still needed insurance?  I was told no it only apply to those on an O/A or O/W visa.  Since I would have an O I did not need insurance.  

[sometimewoodworker]

10 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

The expiry date of my current OA Visa is June 26, 2020 and my permission to stay is valid till July 22, 2020.

Can I exit Thailand in course of coming weeks and apply for a Non Imm O based on retirement in a neighbouring country?

Or would the not-expired OA Visa prohibit this?

You cannot. You would not get a new visa with a current active one.

if you don’t have a reentry permit you can do it after June 26 2020. If you do have a reentry permit you need to exit before July 22 get the non-o and enter after July 22

Edited November 8, 2019 by sometimewoodworker

[LivinLOS]

36 minutes ago, jackdd said:

I think so far we didn't have a report of somebody who went to get an extension after 31.10. and who initially started with an OA visa.

Imho the insurance requirement should not apply to extensions, because there is only one "retirement extension". If they consider this to be two different retirement extensions (one for non-o and one for non-oa), then it should be possible to just switch to the "non-o retirement extension", because there is nothing prohibiting you to switch to a different kind of extension.

Have you been on a remote island for the last week(s). 

 

Theres many many reports.. ALL of which (amazingly for here) are consistent.. Extensions need it.. Arrivals need it.. 

The only part we lack decent feedback is will re-entry permits of existing extensions need it ? I lean to no but the more I think why would someone on long term extensions of the same class get the free ride when the holder of that class doesnt. The 'admit for 30 days' means they are not under duress to deport. 

Edited November 8, 2019 by LivinLOS

[sometimewoodworker]

16 minutes ago, jackdd said:

If this is really the way they will handle it, i wonder what would happen with somebody who once entered on an OA visa, but is now on an extension for working. Technically he would also have to buy insurance.

I rather think that he would be in breach of the “not permitted to work” conditions 

[LivinLOS]

18 minutes ago, jackdd said:

If this is really the way they will handle it, i wonder what would happen with somebody who once entered on an OA visa, but is now on an extension for working. Technically he would also have to buy insurance.

You cannot work on a OA class.. 

 

So moot point no ?? 

[Sheryl]

7 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

The expiry date of my current OA Visa is June 26, 2020 and my permission to stay is valid till July 22, 2020.

Can I exit Thailand in course of coming weeks and apply for a Non Imm O based on retirement in a neighbouring country?

Or would the not-expired OA Visa prohibit this?

 

As far as I've ever heard  they will not issue you a new visa while you still hold a valid one. I think you'd need to wait until after July 26.  Things might also be a little clearer by then.

 

If you can avoid it I would suggest you  not leave and re-enter before then  if the reports of them requiring this for entries even under OAs issued before the effective date continue. .

 

 

[LivinLOS]

10 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

The expiry date of my current OA Visa is June 26, 2020 and my permission to stay is valid till July 22, 2020.

Can I exit Thailand in course of coming weeks and apply for a Non Imm O based on retirement in a neighbouring country?

Or would the not-expired OA Visa prohibit this?

No you cannot re-apply for any visa until that one is expired. 

27th June 2020 you can get a non imm O. 

[Sheryl]

5 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

....The only part we lack decent feedback is will re-entry permits of existing extensions need it ? I lean to no but the more I think why would someone on long term extensions of the same class get the free ride when the holder of that class doesnt.
 

 

Sorry, I don't follow this?. People entering in a re-entry permit aren't getting any sort of free ride. They just come back to the same situation they were in before going out: an existing extension of stay that was issued before the effective date of 31 October, same as a person who newly entered prior to 31 October. In both cases they are exempt from the snsurance requirement for the duration of their existing permission to stay.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

26 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

The expiry date of my current OA Visa is June 26, 2020 and my permission to stay is valid till July 22, 2020.

Can I exit Thailand in course of coming weeks and apply for a Non Imm O based on retirement in a neighbouring country?

Or would the not-expired OA Visa prohibit this?

 

I don't believe you can apply for any other type of visa until AFTER your current O-A has expired. And if you were intended to change to a different type of visa, you also would not want to get any re-entry permit pertaining to your current O-A.

 

So I guess ideally, you could depart Thailand anytime between June 26 and July 22, assuming you don't have a re-entry permit, and then be free to apply for a different class of visa outside Thailand.

 

Sheryl's point above is also a good one.... you also might want to avoid leaving and returning to Thailand on your current O-A for the remaining duration of its term -- if reports continue that Immigration is applying the insurance requirement to pre-Oct. 31 issued O-As for entries occurring now. Otherwise, you could get caught out....

 

 

 

Edited November 8, 2019 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[sometimewoodworker]

3 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

snsurance

A wonderful slip

 

maybe that should be the official name 

 

thanks for that 

[Sheryl]

I have just had to remove a post that was abusive in tone towards another member.

 

Please let us keep this civil. We are all in -- or potentially in the future, in -- the same boat here and should be supportive of each other.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 hour ago, Martyp said:

I'm came on an OA in 2017. I am not concerned about O's. That is not what I am waiting to hear. I want to hear about experiences of people who arrived on OA's but are now on 1-year extensions stay that they got at the Immigration office in Thailand. Are this category of people being asked to provide proof of insurance at the airport/border? Are they being required to provide proof of insurance when applying for a 1-year extension? I know what people have been told before Oct 31. I am waiting to see what is happening now.

 

Thus far, as best as I can tell...two different scenarios....

 

--Re people with pre-Oct. 31 valid O-A visas, multiple reports of being required to show insurance upon post Oct. 31 airport arrivals. Though also some reports to the contrary.

 

--Re people with past O-A visas who are now on extensions of stay and arriving to the airport post Oct. 31, I haven't seen any reports of those folks being told insurance is required at the border entry point.

 

But, lots of folks on extensions of stay based on prior O-A visas being told insurance will be required at their next annual extension of stay renewal/application.

 

Edited November 8, 2019 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[pookondee]

5 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

As I have yet to enter Thailand on my October 3rd issued OA Visa, and with what I am hearing from folks as well as on here, I placed a phone call to the Thai Consulate Los Angeles and spoke to one of the Visa Officers who reviews the applications to ensure everything that is needed for the requested Visa is in place.  He had only heard rumors regarding this issue until he spoke directly to me.  He indicated that the consulates and embassy's are not putting any notations on the O-A Visa or within the passport other than the stamp indicating the visa is for O-A long stay.  He did not understand why if as a condition for obtaining the O-A visa insurance needed to be shown at the time of initial processing, why the IO's at the airport were requesting to see the insurance certificate as well, and if one did not have it refusing entry on the Visa, and instead giving the individual a 30 day stamp and telling them they needed to buy insurance, leave the country and return in order to activate the OA Visa which had been issued by the consulate following the issuing guidelines.  He was very apologetic and understood that the way things are currently, this would cause the individual to incur extra costs when they had already shown proof of insurance, or in my case have a certificate from a company not on the list the IO's have. He has made notes per our conversation and kicked it upstairs to the Actual Visa Officer to look into this issue as it is now causing confusion for individuals it should not be and causing people with valid Visas to be denied entry.

 

I hope that by starting this on my end here in the States that somehow things might get reconciled.  He also did not understand why they were not making the insurance policy certificate be shown at a 90 day report or make the first report at 30days.

 

Just info for everyone.

So, in other words:

The bodies responsible for signing off on all this have not even informed the international Thai consulates, 

therefore have not set it up for the consulates to work in compliance to the orders.

(ie. it was to hard or they couldnt be bothered)

 

no great surprise there.

 

And after the assurance that foriegn insurance was ok,

the officers on the ground are rejecting any policy NOT Thai,

possibly because of the main obvious  reason, they cannot read English..

 

..but mainly for the reason they also have not been informed or trained properly..

 

no great surprise there either.

 

My only surprise is why people still persist in trying to stay here after all this BS.

 

If you are forced to submit to all this because of marriage, family, kids..i really feel sorry for you.

 

As a side-note:

Most countries see it as a human right to

allow people married to nationals..to be allowed to stay with their wife/husband, without all this hoo-haa.

 

Even if married in Thailand you must jump through hoops every year..

and for many, its a lottery each year whether you will still be elligable.

 

Maybe time for a change!!

 

 

 

 

 

[Hayduke]

1 hour ago, sometimewoodworker said:

I think so far we didn't have a report of somebody who went to get an extension after 31.10. and who initially started with an OA visa.

 

I initially started with an O-A. I successfully did a retirement extension and got a multiple re-entry permit yesterday (7 Nov) at CW. No one so much as mentioned the word 'insurance'. Everyone might want to calm down some...until there are more facts and fewer speculations.

 

 

Edited November 8, 2019 by Hayduke

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

3 minutes ago, pookondee said:

And after the assurance that foriegn insurance was ok,

the officers on the ground are rejecting any policy NOT Thai,

possibly because of the main obvious  reason, they cannot read English..

 

I may have missed some posts re this... But, AFAIK...

 

The problem isn't with Immigration officers at the airport being asked to, or being unable to, read English language insurance docs.  Under the rules, that was NEVER going to be the way the system worked.

 

Under the rules, a person with a foreign insurance policy needing to have it certified for O-A purposes needed to download the Thai "Foreign Insurance Certificate" form and have it signed and certified by their foreign insurer... (which apparently is often virtually impossible to do). 

 

Either to show at the Thai Embassies/Consulates where they also want to see copies of the applicant's foreign insurance policy documents, or presumably also at the airport Immigration checkpoints.

 

But thus far, there have been few if any reports here of anyone actually being able to obtain a signed/certified Thai "Foreign Insurance Certificate" from their out-of-Thailand insurer...at least...not yet.

 

Merely walking up to Thai Immigration at the airports with your foreign insurance policy in hand and trying to convince them to look at that and accept it -- even if it meets the coverage requirements -- is pretty much likely to be a non-starter.

 

 

[AAArdvark]

I am on year one of an O-A.  I will be re-entering at DMK on 26/11/19.  IF I am stopped due to lack of insurance, what happens next.  I need until 1/3/20 to either leave LOS or change to an O.  It seems that I would get a 30 stay of some kind.  What can I do to stretch this out until the end of February?

 

Does anyone know of Pacific Cross policies can be canceled?