Thai gov. to tax (remitted) income from abroad for tax residents starting 2024 - Part I

[mokwit]

Just now, jesimps said:

Being an ex civil servant, my state and civil service pensions are taxed in UK at source. The government grabs it before the residue is paid to me. I assume this would make me exempt here, but who knows. It remains to be seen if I remain here or am forced to return to the dreaded land of my birth.

Most likely that you will be required to prove that in a worst case scenario.

[mfd101]

So in just 3 hours AN readers who can't be bothered to read the full original article have managed to generate 6 pages of comments based on ignorance.

[Isaan sailor]

Could be the straw that breaks the camel’s back.  Tax extra money we bring in (cap gains, dividends, interest)—and Thai wife and I  will shut down house, rent out farms, move to America and begin working on her citizenship.  She has a B-2 visa now.

[NorthernRyland]

Just now, paddypower said:

I've always found it odd that even though you are no longer residing in the US, you are taxed on your world income, based on your citizenship. although of course the upside is you qualify for US social security benefits...

This is why they're so desperate for immigrants. It's tax cattle. SS is a Ponzi scheme which is paid for based on current taxation and is going to be drastically cut as the current generation is slowly replaced by low-wage immigrants from the 3rd world. It's seriously f'd.

[QuantumQuandry]

9 minutes ago, PingRoundTheWorld said:

Sure- they could tax all bank transfers (though that would be literal suicide for the economy), but then people will just bring in cash. Sure- they can tax currency exchange (yet another financial suicide), but then people will just use credit/debit cards to pay for everything. Sure- they can tax all card trans....no, no they can't. Easily? nah.

Lot of foreigners in Thailand have retirement extensions for which they are required to put money into Thai banks.

[lordgrinz]

23 minutes ago, ChasingTheSun said:

Fairly easy to just tax all money coming in from overseas.

Would destroy a a huge part of their real estate and retirement sectors, but it can be easily setup.

This would be my fear, because how else would they be able to handle this taxation of foreigners? The only way to make it work would be to tax all incoming money, then make you apply for a refund through filing as a tax resident here in Thailand. So for instance a Thai tax applied to our Wise transfers, where we would then have to wait until the end of the year to request any refunds that apply.

[Wombo1]

Back story behind this decision

At the moment you are only taxed on foreign income that you remit to Thailand during the year that it is earnt.

 

So for example if I was to earn money in The Gambia in 2022, if I remit that within 2022 then it is taxed. But if I leave it outside the country and remit it in 2023 then it is not taxed.

 

Essentially they are closing a loop-hole that enabled people to not pay tax on foreign earnings. For example a Hi-So could setup a company overseas, pay themselves a big salary to an offshore account and then only remit that to Thailand 1 year later and pay no tax...

[retarius]

I'd like to see the details before I get too excited at this. I got all excited about the "medical insurance" scam and it turned out it didn't apply to non-0 retirement or marriage types. I have my US SS payments made over here to Bangkok Bank, worst comes to worst I may have to re-arrange that and have it paid into a UK or US bank..

[RocketDog]

2 hours ago, lordgrinz said:

In the USA we are tax residents of the USA no matter where we live, thankfully there is a tax treaty between the USA and Thailand.

Yep, along with Eritrea the only two countries in the world's that do it.

For USA citizens though, the first 100k$ from foreign income is tax free.

[Jelli]

I think we can expect more of this irrational taxation and fees both here in Thailand and our home countries.

 

Thailand is a very odd place. It certainly extends us no favors in trying to live here. Nevertheless, think of what would happen to the banking system if farang we're not banked.

 

 

https://www.thaiexaminer.com/thai-news-foreigners/2021/08/11/foreigners-have-nearly-600-billion-baht-banked/

 

 

[mokwit]

2 minutes ago, Wombo1 said:

Back story behind this decision

At the moment you are only taxed on foreign income that you remit to Thailand during the year that it is earnt.

 

So for example if I was to earn money in The Gambia in 2022, if I remit that within 2022 then it is taxed. But if I leave it outside the country and remit it in 2023 then it is not taxed.

 

Essentially they are closing a loop-hole that enabled people to not pay tax on foreign earnings. For example a Hi-So could setup a company overseas, pay themselves a big salary to an offshore account and then only remit that to Thailand 1 year later and pay no tax...

I agree with this interpretation, but we could still get caught in the net.

[mokwit]

15 minutes ago, Thaindrew said:

possible, but I think it would then be held up as discrimination by individuals who have paid for more expensive visas.

I don' see the Thai Government as being too worried about discrimination - not visited any national parks lately?

[george]

1 hour ago, Thaindrew said:

use an ATM card from your home country rather than transferring funds in that should negate any need to pay tax

Indeed. Very easy.

[Isaan sailor]

2 minutes ago, RocketDog said:

Yep, along with Eritrea the only two countries in the world's that do it.

For USA citizens though, the first 100k$ from foreign income is tax free.

Good thing I never bring in more than $100k per year!

[gamb00ler]

39 minutes ago, ChasingTheSun said:

Overseas debit cards usually charge between 7% to 10% FX fees/commissions  for thai baht transactions.

Your figures are exaggerated.  The difference between VISA/MasterCard exchange rates and those from WISE are on the order of 15 satang per US $ (about .4%).  Most US debit cards charge 1 - 2.5% in foreign transaction fees.  Some debit cards do not charge those fees.

 

The above assumes you don't choose the wrong option for exchange at the ATM or point of sale.

[mokwit]

6 minutes ago, lordgrinz said:

The only way to make it work would be to tax all incoming money,

Howsabout confirm all taxes paid at visa extension time as is done with WP linked extensions currently.

[Quit]

If you are in the 65 K pm category, you pay 25 percent income tax here. So it might actually be better than at home.

[gamb00ler]

4 minutes ago, RocketDog said:

Yep, along with Eritrea the only two countries in the world's that do it.

For USA citizens though, the first 100k$ from foreign income is tax free.

A minor point.... the exemption you gave is for wage income.  Self employment income also has the same exemption but is NOT exempt from employment tax.

[Thaindrew]

19 minutes ago, Thaindrew said:

possible, but I think it would then be held up as discrimination by individuals who have paid for more expensive visas.

actually I have just seen that currently the Elite Visa, from the IRS site of tax exemptions "individuals who are exempt from paying tax under a special law such as the Thailand Elite program", they could possibly change that for new applications but not for existing members

[NoDisplayName]

19 minutes ago, Hokeus said:

Checkout Wise. No overseas transaction fees. FX rates are also based on the interbank rate, minus a small fee. 

Lucky the Thai government has no access to or oversight of Thai banks, or they'd be able to enforce a 15% tax withholding charge on all incoming Wise transactions.

[mokwit]

2 minutes ago, Wombo1 said:

Back story behind this decision

At the moment you are only taxed on foreign income that you remit to Thailand during the year that it is earnt.

 

So for example if I was to earn money in The Gambia in 2022, if I remit that within 2022 then it is taxed. But if I leave it outside the country and remit it in 2023 then it is not taxed.

 

Essentially they are closing a loop-hole that enabled people to not pay tax on foreign earnings. For example a Hi-So could setup a company overseas, pay themselves a big salary to an offshore account and then only remit that to Thailand 1 year later and pay no tax...

I agree with this interpretation, but we could still get caught in the net.

[tandor]

2 hours ago, bdenner said:

I'm thinking a lot of you have your "nickers in a twist" over an item that will not effect you!

thank Buddha,  'i go Commando'

[Robbie2618]

I would imagine just like many other countries that tax foreign earned income most simply will not report it. There is always some workaround to repatriate the money, the more you earn the more options there is.

[scorecard]

2 hours ago, scorecard said:

Could also be that the individual amount of pension received by some folks is under the Thai personl tax threshhold.

What's confusing?

 

[No Forwarding Address]

1 hour ago, Mike Teavee said:

Less than 150,000b pa! - How do you live on 12,500b pm! (No don't answer that)!!!

 

For anybody who's interested here are the current Thai Tax Rate bands... 

 

Thanks for the graph........my pensions are taxed in USA before I get them, I assume Thailand, USA ,and many other countries, has a bi-lateral tax agreement.  So I assume pensions will be exempt, but if not, Vietnam and Cambodia are looking better all the time.  I love Thailand but this is becoming ridiculous.  I would expect the hundreds of You Tubers, and even more digital nomads will have to provide income records, if so, we will see fewer people walking around holding a stick with a cell phone on it, bumping into everyone.  I suppose we shall wait & see once they flesh this new 'law' out and provide specifics. 

[mokwit]

4 minutes ago, No Forwarding Address said:

I would expect the hundreds of You Tubers, and even more digital nomads will have to provide income records,

That will be fun - their money will be seen as coming from a Trust Fund rather than travel blogging.

[chang50]

Seems every 6 months to a year a nightmare scenario appears to disturb our tranquility in the LOS but rarely does anything come of it.I'm guessing/hoping this is just another

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, lordgrinz said:

So you're guessing my US tax situation now?! 

Oh behave.

[John Drake]

Prayuth, please come back!

[hotchilli]

If they insist on taxing pensions I think a lot of retirees will be changing locations.