Israel is at War - General discussion (pt2)

[Nick Carter icp]

5 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

That guy believes if you are not an antisemite, you you can't say anything negative about Israel, even if they are killing thousands of children. Some people are so blinkered and polarized it's sad. 

 

  That is a lie .

That "guy" is me and I do not believe that .

I call out your anti Semitic posts  and I do not label people as being Anti Semite just because they criticise Israel .

   You have made extreme anti Semitic posts and when it gets pointed out, you hide behind the "I was just criticising Israel" lie

[Morch]

5 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

  At the present time, its a fact that Israel haven't committed any war crimes .

They haven't been convicted of any war crimes and we have the "innocent until proven guilty" rules to adhere to .

   There is the possibility that Israel did indeed commit war crimes and they may be prosecuted for those in the future .

  What have Israel done which could be considered to be a war crime ?

What actual war crime could Israel be convicted of in the future ?

 

No, that's just the semantics games you like to play.

 

Innocent until proven guilty does not preclude the possibility that war crimes were committed. It also does not imply a need to ignore how these things panned out on past instances.

 

I have addressed your 'points', such as they are, on my previous post (and on past exchanges).

[Morch]

6 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

I don't care about other posters, I'm asking you. Why on Earth can't you just tell me what I am lying about instead of playing silly, childish games? I don't have a rabbit, why do you say that? 

 

 

While I'm flattered you take that much interest in my views, I fear the Rabbit might get jealous. And we wouldn't want that, now, would we?

[Morch]

6 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

No, you are lying, I never said that. 

 

You were lying when you said I was biased. 

 

See, it's easy to tell someone what they are lying about, go on tell me what I am lying about, if you have any integrity. 

 

https://aseannow.com/topic/1312538-israel-is-at-war-general-discussion-pt2/page/8/#comment-18515417

 

[Nick Carter icp]

2 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

No, that's just the semantics games you like to play.

 

Innocent until proven guilty does not preclude the possibility that war crimes were committed. It also does not imply a need to ignore how these things panned out on past instances.

 

I have addressed your 'points', such as they are, on my previous post (and on past exchanges).

 

   OK, Its quite possible that Hamas committed war crimes because they took hostages and taking hostages is a war crime . 

   Your turn now, I will  start the sentence and could you finish the sentence off .

 

  Its quite possible that Israel committed war crimes because they did.......................

[Morch]

6 minutes ago, Jeff the Chef said:

Can I suggest if you don't like the content in a link that you just move on and ignore, no images or pictures were posted.

 

Obviously didn't read the full post as I had asked you a question and I'll ask it again:

How would you like to explain this then? For 16 years, Israel’s illegal blockade has made Gaza the world’s biggest open-air prison

 

I did comment on the link you provided, which is more than you bothered to do. May I suggest you think before you post?

 

I have addressed the issue of the blockade on numerous posts by now. Even in replies to yourself. You don't have anything on offer by way of discussion other than posting links. You do not address points made, questions raised or any in-depth queries into things. This goes back to the point about what's wrong with just posting links - this is a discussion forum, what you're doing ain't it. 

[Neeranam]

2 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

https://aseannow.com/topic/1312538-israel-is-at-war-general-discussion-pt2/page/8/#comment-18515417

 

Not sure why you post that, I think you have a comprehension issue. 

I asked you how you think I am biased, on what grounds. You forgot to answer me

That post highlights how some others can have bias. 

 

[Neeranam]

1 minute ago, Morch said:

This goes back to the point about what's wrong with just posting links - this is a discussion forum, what you're doing ain't it. 

Jeez, you and your thread. This is not your thread. You will not get discussion if you call people liars for not agreeing with you, or flaming people for what they post about. You are not a moderator, learn some basic manners.

[Nick Carter icp]

1 minute ago, Neeranam said:

Not sure why you post that, I think you have a comprehension issue. 

I asked you how you think I am biased, on what grounds. You forgot to answer me

That post highlights how some others can have bias. 

 

 

   This thread isn't all about you and whether you are biased or not , or whether you are an anti Semite or not or whether you are a liar or not or whether you have a rabbit friend or not .

   This thread isn't all about you , 

[Morch]

3 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   OK, Its quite possible that Hamas committed war crimes because they took hostages and taking hostages is a war crime . 

   Your turn now, I will  start the sentence and could you finish the sentence off .

 

  Its quite possible that Israel committed war crimes because they did.......................

 

No - Hamas did and does commit war crimes. There's less ambiguity there. Taking of hostages, deliberately killing civilians, atrocities involved in the attack, indiscriminate rocket launches, and using civilians as human shields. All these are well documented, and some are repeats of past actions declared as war crimes, or possible war crimes.

 

Israel's actions are more in line with international law - as much as some posters are reluctant to accept, and despite the usual comments from human rights organizations, pro-Palestinians commentators and so on.

 

There's a history of several past rounds of fighting to draw on.

[NoshowJones]

On 11/25/2023 at 11:04 AM, Bkk Brian said:

No truer words from the Israeli Government Spokesman

 

"By the time we’re done with it, Hamas will never lay its dirty hands on our people again. This war will end with the end of Hamas."

 

https://twitter.com/EylonALevy/status/1728171375075197253

 

I do not know much about this war but I understand that Israel are the aggressors just as Russia are the aggressors in the Ukraine war. But what I do not understand is the Hama's situation, I do know that Hama's are Muslim terrorists. Are they just causing their usual terrorism against Israel for religious reasons and not actually sticking up for Palestine, or is there more to it?

[Morch]

3 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Jeez, you and your thread. This is not your thread. You will not get discussion if you call people liars for not agreeing with you, or flaming people for what they post about. You are not a moderator, learn some basic manners.

 

I wasn't even replying to you, and that quote is out of context.

Unless you missed it, the topic is not about you and your issues.

[Morch]

Just now, NoshowJones said:

I do not know much about this war but I understand that Israel are the aggressors just as Russia are the aggressors in the Ukraine war. But what I do not understand is the Hama's situation, I do know that Hama's are Muslim terrorists. Are they just causing their usual terrorism against Israel for religious reasons and not actually sticking up for Palestine, or is there more to it?

 

Israel is responding to the Hamas 7/10 attack. I don't think you missed that.

Try harder.

[Nick Carter icp]

8 minutes ago, NoshowJones said:

I do not know much about this war but I understand that Israel are the aggressors just as Russia are the aggressors in the Ukraine war. But what I do not understand is the Hama's situation, I do know that Hama's are Muslim terrorists. Are they just causing their usual terrorism against Israel for religious reasons and not actually sticking up for Palestine, or is there more to it?

 

   You could try reading up on the situation ?

You cannot expect posters you tell you the whole situation . 

Read up on the history and then come and join in the discussion when you have a bit of knowledge about the subject 

[NoshowJones]

5 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Israel is responding to the Hamas 7/10 attack. I don't think you missed that.

Try harder.

You try harder and try and understand what I am asking. OK I will put it simpler for you. Where is Palestine involved in the Hamas 7/10 attack on Israel?

 

6 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Israel is responding to the Hamas 7/10 attack. I don't think you missed that.

Try harder.

 

[Nick Carter icp]

1 minute ago, NoshowJones said:

You try harder and try and understand what I am asking. OK I will put it simpler for you. Where is Palestine involved in the Hamas 7/10 attack on Israel?

 

 

 

   Hamas are the Palestine Government in Gaza . 

The Hamas terrorists came from Gaza and went back to Gaza and Israel went to Gaza to find them 

[NoshowJones]

2 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Hamas are the Palestine Government in Gaza . 

The Hamas terrorists came from Gaza and went back to Gaza and Israel went to Gaza to find them 

I did not know that, thanks for telling me.

[Morch]

8 minutes ago, NoshowJones said:

You try harder and try and understand what I am asking. OK I will put it simpler for you. Where is Palestine involved in the Hamas 7/10 attack on Israel?

 

 

 

I've no idea what you meant by that.

[Eloquent pilgrim]

8 minutes ago, NoshowJones said:

I did not know that, thanks for telling me.

 

You have my sincere best wishes for a speedy recovery; you have obviously been in a coma for the last two months ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Eloquent pilgrim]

1 hour ago, Neeranam said:

You are lying. I have no bias here. What ground do you think I have for having bias?

 

Not sure what grounds you have for being so biased, or more accurately, antisemitic, but this comment you made on the first thread looks remarkably like bias to me

 

“How can the world sit and watch the Netanyahu wipe out over 2 million people by refusing them food and water? How can some even support it? This is pure ethnic cleansing and he is a Fascist war criminal”

 

You also applauded an appalling comment comparing Israel to to the Nazis of WW2

 

What I don’t understand is why you continually deny your antisemitic bias; there is no law in Thailand against it, and certainly no forum rule against it, but you seem to live in a constant state of delusional denial.

[Bkk Brian]

International security analyst Michael Horowitz also told U.K.-based newspaper The Telegraph that he believes the family is now being held by the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine

 

Hamas Gave 10-Month-Old Hostage to Another Terror Group: IDF

Israel claimed on Monday that Hamas is slow-rolling the release of its youngest hostage, a 10-month-old baby who was kidnapped on Oct. 7 alongside his parents and four-year-old brother.

The Israel Defense Forces said Kfir Bibas had been transferred to the custody of a separate Palestinian group in the city of Khan Yunis, and is likely being used as leverage in Hamas and Israel’s talks to extend the current ceasefire agreement. The city, located in southern Gaza, is widely expected to be the site of a renewed bombardment campaign once the current ceasefire agreement ends later this week.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/hamas-gave-10-month-old-hostage-kfir-bibas-to-another-terror-group-idf-says

 

 

[Neeranam]

For those uniformed who say Hamas committed war crimes:

 

https://www.france24.com/en/middle-east/20231021-experts-say-hamas-and-israel-are-breaking-international-law-but-what-does-that-mean

[Wobblybob]

5 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

I don't believe there is Genocide yet, but there is most certainly the danger of it. 

Make your mind up, you have done nothing else but accuse Israel of genocide. 

[Nick Carter icp]

6 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

For those uniformed who say Hamas committed war crimes:

 

https://www.france24.com/en/middle-east/20231021-experts-say-hamas-and-israel-are-breaking-international-law-but-what-does-that-mean

 

   Why isn't the hostage taking by Hamas a war crime ?

Taking hostages is a war crime .

Hamas too hostages . 

How isn't that a war crime ?

[Bkk Brian]

15 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

For those uniformed who say Hamas committed war crimes:

 

https://www.france24.com/en/middle-east/20231021-experts-say-hamas-and-israel-are-breaking-international-law-but-what-does-that-mean

 

 

You are very uninformed then @Neeranam 

 

This has all been covered before though, weeks ago, why bring up what we already know?

 

Hamas, Islamic Jihad: Holding Hostages is a War Crime

Hamas and Islamic Jihad are committing war crimes by holding scores of Israelis and others as hostages in Gaza and say they will not free them until Palestinian prisoners in Israel are freed.
Civilians, including children, people with disabilities, and older people, should never be treated as bargaining chips. No grievance can justify holding anyone hostage.
The armed groups should immediately and safely release all civilians detained. Governments that have influence with Hamas should use their leverage to press for hostages to be treated humanely and freed.

https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/10/19/hamas-islamic-jihad-holding-hostages-war-crime

 

Hamas's War Crimes

Even Palestinian officials acknowledged Hamas’ rockets were war crimes. “Each and every missile against Israel constitutes a crime against humanity whether it hits or misses, because it is directed at civilian targets.”

https://www.standwithus.com/factsheets-hamas-war-crimes

Edited November 28, 2023 by Bkk Brian

[Hawaiian]

2 hours ago, Neeranam said:

From that link - 

 

 "We are calling on Israeli forces to immediately end unlawful attacks in Gaza and ensure that they take all feasible precautions to minimize harm to civilians and damage to civilian objects. Israel’s allies must immediately impose a comprehensive arms embargo given that serious violations under international law are being committed.”

 

I am puzzled why non-Israelis refuse to acknowledge that Israel are doing no wrong. The atrocities and war cries far far outweigh what Hamas did on Oct 7.  

What kind of scale are you using to weigh all of these atrocities?  Hopefully, not one made in Iran.

Edited November 28, 2023 by Hawaiian
Correction

[Hawaiian]

5 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

  That is quite an attenuation to say Hamas broke some rules .

Mass murder of innocent civilians , killing babies , murder and rape, attempted genocide and war crimes is breaking quite a lot of rules , its quite an understatement to just label those as just "broke the rules"

He is using an Iranian rule book authored by the mullahs.

[Neeranam]

5 minutes ago, Hawaiian said:

What kind of scale are you using to weigh all of these atrocities?  Hopefully, not one made in Iran.

The number of deaths for a start, 10-1 ish. 

 

No idea what Iran has to do with what I said. 

[Neeranam]

11 hours ago, Hawaiian said:

You also don't have to be an expert to know that hostage taking of civilians is still a war crime even if you treat your captives well and they wave good bye when they are released.

Hamas did not take these hostages during a war, it's not rocket Science. 

[Hawaiian]

8 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

The number of deaths for a start, 10-1 ish. 

 

No idea what Iran has to do with what I said. 

 

6 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Hamas did not take these hostages during a war, it's not rocket Science. 

The war began as soon as Hamas went on their rampage, albeit an undeclared war.

Seems as if you classify collateral deaths by targeted bombing and shelling as atrocities the same as the slaughtering of civilians, rapes and hostage taking of civilians.

Edited November 28, 2023 by Hawaiian
Additional comment.