Pattaya is dead

[whitemouse]

Makro is packed. Tesco South Sukhumvit was the busiest I've ever seen. Incredible. Traffic has been bad for several days on Sukhumvit.

I tried to look for parking space for the car inside Big C Xtra today , no chance , had to park outside. It's very crowded here right now. Can't remember last time it was so busy.

Balo, when you say it really crowded here, do you mean crowded inside Big C and Tesco, or Pattaya is packed with tourists?

Dennis noted that around 6pm is not a good time to take a drive from Jomtien to Pattaya even during summer months. Do you think roads are jammed right now because of all the 2 week tourists decided to rent a cars in order to drive around for fun?

Groups of Indian men renting a nice mini van to cruise around Pattaya in the middle of the day, and popping in Big C to stock up household products for coming week.

Who do you think is clogging the roads? Visiting Russian holiday makers and families rent a Toyota, in order to drive to the beach and back to hotel, and maybe drive to go shopping at Tesco?

And to buy what, what are the 2 week package tourist buying in Tesco, I wonder. Toilet paper, dish washing liquid, laundry detergent? They could get all that in 711, but they prefer fun of Pattaya traffic!

Maybe they buy groceries for all the cooking they'll be doing in their hotel rooms. You know, owen roasted pork for Christamas, and baking Ginger Bread for New Years Eve. If its one thing Europeans like to spend their annual 2 week holiday in a beach resort, its renting a car in Pattaya, driving it from their hotel in Jomtien to Tesco in Pattaya, and cooking and baking in a hotel room, in beach resort in perfect weather +30C days lol.

But Big C and Tesco being crowded and full of tourists explains why traditional tourist areas are quiet, Beach Rd and Walking St especially. They are all at Big C, and Tesco!

[tropo]

Makro is packed. Tesco South Sukhumvit was the busiest I've ever seen. Incredible. Traffic has been bad for several days on Sukhumvit.

I tried to look for parking space for the car inside Big C Xtra today , no chance , had to park outside. It's very crowded here right now. Can't remember last time it was so busy.

Balo, when you say it really crowded here, do you mean crowded inside Big C and Tesco, or Pattaya is packed with tourists?

Dennis noted that around 6pm is not a good time to take a drive from Jomtien to Pattaya even during summer months. Do you think roads are jammed right now because of all the 2 week tourists decided to rent a cars in order to drive around for fun?

Groups of Indian men renting a nice mini van to cruise around Pattaya in the middle of the day, and popping in Big C to stock up household products for coming week.

Who do you think is clogging the roads? Visiting Russian holiday makers and families rent a Toyota, in order to drive to the beach and back to hotel, and maybe drive to go shopping at Tesco?

And to buy what, what are the 2 week package tourist buying in Tesco, I wonder. Toilet paper, dish washing liquid, laundry detergent? They could get all that in 711, but they prefer fun of Pattaya traffic!

Maybe they buy groceries for all the cooking they'll be doing in their hotel rooms. You know, owen roasted pork for Christamas, and baking Ginger Bread for New Years Eve. If its one thing Europeans like to spend their annual 2 week holiday in a beach resort, its renting a car in Pattaya, driving it from their hotel in Jomtien to Tesco in Pattaya, and cooking and baking in a hotel room, in beach resort in perfect weather +30C days lol.

But Big C and Tesco being crowded and full of tourists explains why traditional tourist areas are quiet, Beach Rd and Walking St especially. They are all at Big C, and Tesco!

LOLOL!

For over 10 years the thought of renting a car to drive around Pattaya has never crossed my mind. I didn't know that's what all the tourists are doing.

[whitemouse]

Another question - will the demeanor of Thais in Pattaya improve or worsen as business dries up?

For years they've taken foreign tourists and expats for granted and treated them poorly as they figured there's an endless supply of them. Having lived here full time for 10 years I conclude that the "LOS" terminology is someone's fantasy or merely a marketing campaign. In some areas (where I'm spending money) I have given up saying "hello" or "thank you" to save the embarrassment of being snubbed.

Locals are not looking kindly at dwindling tourist numbers, and who's to blame? Of course the few that are here!

Ladyboys on soi 13/1 have become quite upset with me during past weeks, there are 4-5 ladyboy bars, and I pass this soi several times, day and night. Their bars are dead, girls look pretty, but no takers, not enough men who appreciate a fine ladyboy. They are upset, and of course whos to blame but the few foreigners who are here. They are now shouting insults, and make it as unpleasant as possible to walk pass the bars.

I could cut from 2nd Rd to Beach Rd next to Mikes, the Tattoo and Art soi, but I don't, I much rather observe how much more nasty will they become, sort of social study lol.

Girls have made up their minds, and seems it is my fault that fellow foreigners who frequent ladyboy bars are not represented in high enough numbers this high season. When I pass them, I walk head down, lookingand feeling guilty, I accept that slow business is the fault of foreigners, and me especially lol.

Their strategy is simple - insult and harrass physically the few remaining foreigners who are here, and feel adventurous enough to walk on soi 13/1 at 2am.

But Beach Rd girls are not unpleasant, not aggressive at all. Police trucks visit them now every night, and it seems Army is determined to end what Beach Rd used to be. That may be a good thing.

[theguyfromanotherforum]

I think the following is happening (but can not be sure, of course).

Thais prefer Hua Hin as their weekend getaway, but because hotels and real estate is getting more expensive there (traffic is crappy too) they are now migrating to their least favorite place.

Rest assured that in next several years sex tourism will further go down as Pattaya becomes a more family oriented destination thanks to Chinese and Thais. Think of Las Vegas.

[TaaSaparot]

Rest assured that in next several years sex tourism will further go down as Pattaya becomes a more family oriented destination thanks to Chinese and Thais. Think of Las Vegas.

I wonder how many years decades I have heard this said ?

[roo860]

Its always hard to get the truth on these things....lots of bloody bingo players with business interests talking up the place.

Have a look at Soi buakhao. Previous years there was no chance to get a shop. This year already at least 8 empty ones in prime locations .

I only prey I am wrong but I think by March of 2016, this number will triple if not more, that includes small guesthouse and hotels

about soi buakao, 4 years ago the 2 sawadee hotels were already falling apart ...beginning of december, for the mansion , were only 4 guest and around the pool of the second just one lesbian couple

did the managers find money to renovate ? or the buildings are already collapsed ?

The outside was painted , the inside untouched

Bloody lesbians, get everywhere!!!!!

[morrobay]

I think the following is happening (but can not be sure, of course).

Thais prefer Hua Hin as their weekend getaway, but because hotels and real estate is getting more expensive there (traffic is crappy too) they are now migrating to their least favorite place.

Rest assured that in next several years sex tourism will further go down as Pattaya becomes a more family oriented destination thanks to Chinese and Thais. Think of Las Vegas.

Bang Saen Beach near Chonburi used to be the favorite beach town for Thais from Bangkok and I wish it still was instead of Pattaya.

[jaybas]

where in Pattaya are you, in a hole somewhere. The last 5 nights, every bar I have stepped into along soi bakaow and beach road have been packed. Even in late afternoon, the bars are full. I dont know where this poster is coming from, but empty is not the issue. maybe he is on walking street, There I have no clus as I dont go there. But all bars along beach road, soi diana, bakaow are jam packed.

[morrobay]

where in Pattaya are you, in a hole somewhere. The last 5 nights, every bar I have stepped into along soi bakaow and beach road have been packed. Even in late afternoon, the bars are full. I dont know where this poster is coming from, but empty is not the issue. maybe he is on walking street, There I have no clus as I dont go there. But all bars along beach road, soi diana, bakaow are jam packed.

Yes Pattaya is very crowded with loads of people everywhere. Not sure how long this is going to last though. Maybe it would help if there were more specifics when referring to

" shops closing,restaurants empty, no foreigeners ". Ie. What exact businesses are doing well with what nationalities and what businesses are in trouble

In general the big stores are full of Thais and there is a hotel bubble.

[newnative]

If I could squash a few myths before they become entrenched. First, that Chinese tourists don't contribute anything to the economy. Every tourist, even on a package tour, needs to sleep and be fed 3 times a day, not to mention being entertained. All the local businesses that are involved with that, and there are many, benefit. It's ridiculous to say that they are all staying and eating at Chinese owned hotels (tricky to rush back to the Chinese hotel for lunch when you are on the boat trip to the islands) but even if they were the economy would still benefit. Second, not all Chinese, Japanese, and Korean tourists are on package tours. Many are here on their own--walk down Pattaya Second Road and you will see plenty. Third, lots of tourists/short-termers on their own shop locally. There are plenty at Tesco and Big C. They might be renting a condo for a few weeks or visiting one they own and, yes, they are buying groceries, etc. We sold a condo to a Russian family and the parents and son take turns coming for a few weeks at a time. Last myth, none of the Asians are buying condos. I talked to a Chinese agent and he told me he has sold 55 condos to Chinese clients so far. I know, just 55 but remember that's only 1 agent and it's early days. I'm living in a new condo and on my floor, so far, there is a Chinese next door, a Japanese family down the hall, a Thai lady from BKK, and a young gay Thai couple from BKK--the BKK neighbors just come now and then on weekends.

[BeefSlapper]

I agree much less tourists.

[onemorechang]

If I could squash a few myths before they become entrenched. First, that Chinese tourists don't contribute anything to the economy. Every tourist, even on a package tour, needs to sleep and be fed 3 times a day, not to mention being entertained. All the local businesses that are involved with that, and there are many, benefit. It's ridiculous to say that they are all staying and eating at Chinese owned hotels (tricky to rush back to the Chinese hotel for lunch when you are on the boat trip to the islands) but even if they were the economy would still benefit. Second, not all Chinese, Japanese, and Korean tourists are on package tours. Many are here on their own--walk down Pattaya Second Road and you will see plenty. Third, lots of tourists/short-termers on their own shop locally. There are plenty at Tesco and Big C. They might be renting a condo for a few weeks or visiting one they own and, yes, they are buying groceries, etc. We sold a condo to a Russian family and the parents and son take turns coming for a few weeks at a time. Last myth, none of the Asians are buying condos. I talked to a Chinese agent and he told me he has sold 55 condos to Chinese clients so far. I know, just 55 but remember that's only 1 agent and it's early days. I'm living in a new condo and on my floor, so far, there is a Chinese next door, a Japanese family down the hall, a Thai lady from BKK, and a young gay Thai couple from BKK--the BKK neighbors just come now and then on weekends.

Take care i do believe some Estate Agents tell lies in Thailand.

[SheungWan]

Not really much of an answer, Chivas. By your reckoning Pattaya is dying because of a 'lack of a certain type of tourist which will go unnamed'. Well, the 'unnamed' are being supplemented by other tourists. So, Pattaya really isn't dying. And, anyway, the 'unnamed' still seem to be going fairly strong and are not on life support just yet. I walk around a fair amount in central Pattaya and, even though I am not a bar person, I'll notice one bar will be packed and the one next to it will be nearly empty. A mystery to me but I suspect the strong will survive and the weak will fold and Pattaya will end up with the number of bars it needs for the 'unnamed'.

and those other tourists are?

Only ones I've seen are the Chinese, and they stay in Chinese hotels, eat in those hotels, travel on company tour buses and buy nothing except on their bus expedition to Mike's.

Don't expect the Chinese to rescue the barbers, or the eastern Euros. As for rich people, LOL. They wouldn't touch Pattaya with a very long pole. I knew a Dr that holidayed in LOS. The idea of staying in a place like Pattaya would have horrified him. If they come to LOS at all, it's to the 5* resorts in Phuket etc.

Plenty of rich people in Pattaya, notwithstanding your extensive research with 'I knew a Dr.'

[tropo]

Another question - will the demeanor of Thais in Pattaya improve or worsen as business dries up?

For years they've taken foreign tourists and expats for granted and treated them poorly as they figured there's an endless supply of them. Having lived here full time for 10 years I conclude that the "LOS" terminology is someone's fantasy or merely a marketing campaign. In some areas (where I'm spending money) I have given up saying "hello" or "thank you" to save the embarrassment of being snubbed.

Locals are not looking kindly at dwindling tourist numbers, and who's to blame? Of course the few that are here!

Ladyboys on soi 13/1 have become quite upset with me during past weeks, there are 4-5 ladyboy bars, and I pass this soi several times, day and night. Their bars are dead, girls look pretty, but no takers, not enough men who appreciate a fine ladyboy. They are upset, and of course whos to blame but the few foreigners who are here. They are now shouting insults, and make it as unpleasant as possible to walk pass the bars.

I could cut from 2nd Rd to Beach Rd next to Mikes, the Tattoo and Art soi, but I don't, I much rather observe how much more nasty will they become, sort of social study lol.

Girls have made up their minds, and seems it is my fault that fellow foreigners who frequent ladyboy bars are not represented in high enough numbers this high season. When I pass them, I walk head down, lookingand feeling guilty, I accept that slow business is the fault of foreigners, and me especially lol.

Their strategy is simple - insult and harrass physically the few remaining foreigners who are here, and feel adventurous enough to walk on soi 13/1 at 2am.

But Beach Rd girls are not unpleasant, not aggressive at all. Police trucks visit them now every night, and it seems Army is determined to end what Beach Rd used to be. That may be a good thing.

My wife, who is an "Asian Farang" spends quite a bit of time shopping at markets around Pattaya - Thepprasit, The Avenue, Hollywood, Soi Buakhao - all over town. She is not new at this and has been plying the markets for 10 years. The general market stall holders are downright rude if she looks at clothes or other items and then walks on without buying. As business dries up they are becoming more bad tempered than ever. She normally doesn't talk to them in case they discover she's not Thai, because that is when they get even more angry.

Most of them straight out refuse to allow fitting. As most market clothes are "one size", fitting for a 40 kg woman is quite important. This costs them a lot of sales over time.

There was a time when most could do well no matter how rude they were. Now, when they need to offer better customer service they are doing the opposite. Sometimes she teases the rude ones - picks up a number of items and then walks away. It's her little "social study".

[tropo]

where in Pattaya are you, in a hole somewhere. The last 5 nights, every bar I have stepped into along soi bakaow and beach road have been packed. Even in late afternoon, the bars are full. I dont know where this poster is coming from, but empty is not the issue. maybe he is on walking street, There I have no clus as I dont go there. But all bars along beach road, soi diana, bakaow are jam packed.

Just in case you missed it, the OP started this thread on December 18. The last 5 days are supposedly the busiest of the whole year, and not the right time to judge a peak tourist season. There's too many Thai "tourists" in town right now. Let's give them a few weeks to clear out and revisit this assessment.

[papayasalad]

where in Pattaya are you, in a hole somewhere. The last 5 nights, every bar I have stepped into along soi bakaow and beach road have been packed. Even in late afternoon, the bars are full. I dont know where this poster is coming from, but empty is not the issue. maybe he is on walking street, There I have no clus as I dont go there. But all bars along beach road, soi diana, bakaow are jam packed.

Just in case you missed it, the OP started this thread on December 18. The last 5 days are supposedly the busiest of the whole year, and not the right time to judge a peak tourist season. There's too many Thai "tourists" in town right now. Let's give them a few weeks to clear out and revisit this assessment.

just wait another week and Pattaya will be like a dead pond.

until now I have seen only a few Germans, and only Chinese bus on the sukumvit. it seems packed because people get free days and go out more frequently, it doesn't mean there are more people(tourists) coming in town.

[thaibeachlovers]

I think the following is happening (but can not be sure, of course).

Thais prefer Hua Hin as their weekend getaway, but because hotels and real estate is getting more expensive there (traffic is crappy too) they are now migrating to their least favorite place.

Rest assured that in next several years sex tourism will further go down as Pattaya becomes a more family oriented destination thanks to Chinese and Thais. Think of Las Vegas.

The only thing that will stop the mongers, is if financial problems back home make them too poor, or the government shuts down all the barbeers in Thailand, and what's the chance of that?

Sure, the bars are being relocated towards Sukhumvit, but I can't see Pattaya becoming a pitiful as Hua Hin. The mongers will follow the bars, so the cheap hotels on Beach/ 2nd will face problems. No doubt they will be replaced by expensive hotels, as has been happening already, but who will be staying in them, I wonder? There are many far superior beach destinations in LOS than Pattaya, and the rich don't come anyway.

[thaibeachlovers]

Not really much of an answer, Chivas. By your reckoning Pattaya is dying because of a 'lack of a certain type of tourist which will go unnamed'. Well, the 'unnamed' are being supplemented by other tourists. So, Pattaya really isn't dying. And, anyway, the 'unnamed' still seem to be going fairly strong and are not on life support just yet. I walk around a fair amount in central Pattaya and, even though I am not a bar person, I'll notice one bar will be packed and the one next to it will be nearly empty. A mystery to me but I suspect the strong will survive and the weak will fold and Pattaya will end up with the number of bars it needs for the 'unnamed'.

and those other tourists are?

Only ones I've seen are the Chinese, and they stay in Chinese hotels, eat in those hotels, travel on company tour buses and buy nothing except on their bus expedition to Mike's.

Don't expect the Chinese to rescue the barbers, or the eastern Euros. As for rich people, LOL. They wouldn't touch Pattaya with a very long pole. I knew a Dr that holidayed in LOS. The idea of staying in a place like Pattaya would have horrified him. If they come to LOS at all, it's to the 5* resorts in Phuket etc.

Plenty of rich people in Pattaya, notwithstanding your extensive research with 'I knew a Dr.'

Oh, that's all right then. No doubt you were having a chat with David Beckham down a Soi 8 bar last night, and is that Mick Jagger in the next room to you? Please say hi to Ivana Trump when you see her at the yoga later.

[thaibeachlovers]

where in Pattaya are you, in a hole somewhere. The last 5 nights, every bar I have stepped into along soi bakaow and beach road have been packed. Even in late afternoon, the bars are full. I dont know where this poster is coming from, but empty is not the issue. maybe he is on walking street, There I have no clus as I dont go there. But all bars along beach road, soi diana, bakaow are jam packed.

Beach Rd, LOL. The numbers of barbeers on Beach is low now, compared to 20 years or even 10 years ago. It wouldn't take many to fill all them up. Buakhao does well because that's where the expats go now.

To say the barbeer business is doing well, you'd have to check out the ones up past Dolphin roundabout on Naklua Rd, the ones on Soi 1 and opposite, plus all the little ones down all the long sois to Beach Rd. Did you start at the north end of Beach or just from Central- there's quite a few small ones north of Central Rd, then all the barbeers on Second Rd from Big C to Central Rd and on down 2nd Rd, not forgetting the complexes that go back between 2nd Rd and Buakhao. Then there's Boystown and the sois next to it, Soi Post Office and Yamato- oops, forgot Soi 6, 7 and 8. Then did you go on the sois off Walking Street to all those ones and down to Sunee Plaza?

The barbeers on Beach and Buakhao are just a very small part of the whole.

[guzzi850m2]

I think the following is happening (but can not be sure, of course).

Thais prefer Hua Hin as their weekend getaway, but because hotels and real estate is getting more expensive there (traffic is crappy too) they are now migrating to their least favorite place.

Rest assured that in next several years sex tourism will further go down as Pattaya becomes a more family oriented destination thanks to Chinese and Thais. Think of Las Vegas.

The only thing that will stop the mongers, is if financial problems back home make them too poor, or the government shuts down all the barbeers in Thailand, and what's the chance of that?

Sure, the bars are being relocated towards Sukhumvit, but I can't see Pattaya becoming a pitiful as Hua Hin. The mongers will follow the bars, so the cheap hotels on Beach/ 2nd will face problems. No doubt they will be replaced by expensive hotels, as has been happening already, but who will be staying in them, I wonder? There are many far superior beach destinations in LOS than Pattaya, and the rich don't come anyway.

The rich don't come here??

Who drives all the Porsche's, big Bens and Bimmer's then and there are quite many +8000baht per night hotels here.

We were out riding the scooter this afternoon, Pattaya beach road was packed, real packed and the same on Jomtien.

Loads of people on the beach, perhaps app 65-75% Thais.

Looking forward to Monday the 4th Jan 2016, nice and quiet again and the schools opens again.

[newnative]

Umm. He didn't say there were a lot of FAMOUS people here, Thaibeachlovers. He said there were plenty or RICH people here--and he's right. And, both farang and Asian. Get out and look around. Lots of Mercedes, BMWs, Mini Coopers, and other luxury brands on the road. The most expensive 2 bedroom corner condos at my condo project sold out first. The high end condo projects in good locations are mostly doing well--with rich people buying. I was at The Palm condo sales office the other day and there are only about a dozen condos left for sale there out of 400+ units.

[thaibeachlovers]

I think the following is happening (but can not be sure, of course).

Thais prefer Hua Hin as their weekend getaway, but because hotels and real estate is getting more expensive there (traffic is crappy too) they are now migrating to their least favorite place.

Rest assured that in next several years sex tourism will further go down as Pattaya becomes a more family oriented destination thanks to Chinese and Thais. Think of Las Vegas.

The only thing that will stop the mongers, is if financial problems back home make them too poor, or the government shuts down all the barbeers in Thailand, and what's the chance of that?

Sure, the bars are being relocated towards Sukhumvit, but I can't see Pattaya becoming a pitiful as Hua Hin. The mongers will follow the bars, so the cheap hotels on Beach/ 2nd will face problems. No doubt they will be replaced by expensive hotels, as has been happening already, but who will be staying in them, I wonder? There are many far superior beach destinations in LOS than Pattaya, and the rich don't come anyway.

The rich don't come here??

Who drives all the Porsche's, big Bens and Bimmer's then and there are quite many +8000baht per night hotels here.

We were out riding the scooter this afternoon, Pattaya beach road was packed, real packed and the same on Jomtien.

Loads of people on the beach, perhaps app 65-75% Thais.

Looking forward to Monday the 4th Jan 2016, nice and quiet again and the schools opens again.

Who drives all the Porsche's, big Bens and Bimmer's then

The Thais do. Plenty of rich Thais in Bkk. But this thread is about farang tourists to Pattaya. Farang tourists don't drive cars in Pattaya.

As you note, most of the people on the beach are Thais- it's always been so. Farang tourists don't go to Pattaya for the beach. If they want to swim they go to Jomptien or Koh Larn.

Beach Rd is packed because it has a bottleneck at Walking St and too many baht buses- it has always been so.

Jomptien is packed because all the people from Pattaya are going there for the beach

and there are quite many +8000baht per night hotels here.

Actually very few, the Hilton and ...........................?

Mostly it's resorts that are full of people on package tours.

[thaibeachlovers]

Umm. He didn't say there were a lot of FAMOUS people here, Thaibeachlovers. He said there were plenty or RICH people here--and he's right. And, both farang and Asian. Get out and look around. Lots of Mercedes, BMWs, Mini Coopers, and other luxury brands on the road. The most expensive 2 bedroom corner condos at my condo project sold out first. The high end condo projects in good locations are mostly doing well--with rich people buying. I was at The Palm condo sales office the other day and there are only about a dozen condos left for sale there out of 400+ units.

You posted that while I was writing a reply, but I could just about cut and paste the same to you. This thread ISN'T about THAIS, it's about FARANG tourists.

THAIS drive cars in Pattaya, NOT farang tourists, and this thread isn't about farang EXPATS either- they drive cars in Pattaya, but not high end cars- probably utes. Farang tourists don't buy condos for their two week holiday in the sun either.

How many "rich" people do you see pulling up outside their favourite Beach Rd Gogo in their Porche, 5555555555555? Fancy getting a temporary guest into a Hilton room, LOL.

[ttthailand]

I have a few farang friends from Bkk in Pattaya now for the holiday. They are not tourists but perhaps look the part. I would guess the majority of farang you see in Pattaya either live there or live someplace else in Thailand. Last time I was in Pattaya and hitting the bars around town I saw many guys over and over again doing the exact same thing, same faces appearing at all the farang areas. Oversea Tourists... I don't think so, local tourist yes .... But this is the high season so the numbers will go up.

[thaibeachlovers]

New topic on world news about the Rouble falling even further. Hopefully this will mean even less Russians in Pattaya and the collapse of the condo market. Be great if they had to demolish the atrocity at Bali Hi because no one is going to buy any condos in it anymore.

[papayasalad]

I checked the electrical counters in several condos, very few are running.

this let me think that many condos are dead empty.

I don't look at the lights , I look at how many people plugged their fridge. many people from Bangkok came for new years just for the beach, in 3 days, this place will be empty with lot of empty condo for sale.

don't buy, people telling you to buy are working in the real estate. go get a walk at these buildings, they are all empty. they have lied to us. they inflate the price telling you Pattaya is a good place to invest, in fact this place is becoming a ghost town

[thaibeachlovers]

I checked the electrical counters in several condos, very few are running.

this let me think that many condos are dead empty.

I don't look at the lights , I look at how many people plugged their fridge. many people from Bangkok came for new years just for the beach, in 3 days, this place will be empty with lot of empty condo for sale.

don't buy, people telling you to buy are working in the real estate. go get a walk at these buildings, they are all empty. they have lied to us. they inflate the price telling you Pattaya is a good place to invest, in fact this place is becoming a ghost town

IMO the whole "Pattaya is the place" is city hall BS. They push that agenda to get mugs to buy property <deleted> so they can get rich. In a sane world, they would have built Central/ Hilton etc in Jomptien and made that into a real first class tourist resort. It has all the required elements of a great beach, great view, plenty of space ( back then ) to lay out a proper infrastructure and could have been excellent for the richer elements to hang out with naughty monger's paradise over the hill. Instead, they try to change the pig's ear of Pattaya into the proverbial silk purse. Fail, fail, fail. Pattaya can never become what they want without demolishing the entire thing and starting again.

While they have ruined Pattaya as a monger's paradise, banishing the bars to dangerous Buakhao, they will never make it into the upmarket international destination they desire. Lose lose. Now the mongers are not coming and the rich tourists never came and never will, so we get threads about Pattaya is dead all the time now.

[Renter]

sounds like Pattaya is in a worse state than here in Phuket which is borderline disaster.

no spenders here just cheap gawkers & walkers oogling the shiny colored lights appearing to be mesmerized by all the action & excitement & raucous noises from the other quality tourists & natives.

i'm looking to relocate but after living in Pattaya for awhile some 20 years ago i would only reconsider it at gun point.

[Don Mega]

The rich don't come here??

Who drives all the Porsche's, big Bens and Bimmer's then and there are quite many +8000baht per night hotels here.

We were out riding the scooter this afternoon, Pattaya beach road was packed, real packed and the same on Jomtien.

Loads of people on the beach, perhaps app 65-75% Thais.

Looking forward to Monday the 4th Jan 2016, nice and quiet again and the schools opens again.

Who drives all the Porsche's, big Bens and Bimmer's then

The Thais do. Plenty of rich Thais in Bkk. But this thread is about farang tourists to Pattaya. Farang tourists don't drive cars in Pattaya.

As you note, most of the people on the beach are Thais- it's always been so. Farang tourists don't go to Pattaya for the beach. If they want to swim they go to Jomptien or Koh Larn.

Beach Rd is packed because it has a bottleneck at Walking St and too many baht buses- it has always been so.

Jomptien is packed because all the people from Pattaya are going there for the beach

and there are quite many +8000baht per night hotels here.

Actually very few, the Hilton and ...........................?

Mostly it's resorts that are full of people on package tours.

where in the OP is it mentioned this thread is only about "farang tourists" ?

[newnative]

Oh, dear. Sorry, but you are wrong again. The subject being discussed is whether Pattaya is dead. The number of farang tourists is just one aspect of the discussion.