Health insurance and travel insurance policies generally provide ZERO cover for epidemics or pandemics

[ukrules]

I like to have something approaching the best health insurance cover available at all times.

 

So I've been doing some digging on this.

 

I have a BUPA Global policy that provides me with £1.7 Million worth of cover per year.

 

I read the small print from the policy and came up with this little nugget :

 

 

The insurance industry appear to have learned a lesson after SARS back in 2003. Their solution - no cover for epidemics or pandemics.

 

You're on your own if you get infected and require treatment no matter how many thousands of pounds or dollars you pay per year for your policy.

 

My policy is one of the best comprehensive policies that I could find on the market but it provides zero cover once something is deemed an epidemic or worse.

 

Does anyone know if there are any insurance policies available which offer epidemic and pandemic cover?

 

I'm not looking for a replacement for the BUPA policy, the cover is excellent for pretty much everything else, I think I want a separate epidemic/pandemic only policy to make up for the shortfall in my existing policy.

 

I have a feeling this epidemic will turn into a pandemic at some point over the next few months and I would of course like to be covered just in case I have an issue.

 

From what I've been reading most but likely not all travel insurance policies also specifically exclude epidemic / pandemic cover as well. For me this won't work as I'm not traveling. I'm based in Thailand permanently or as near to permanently as you can get over here.

 

 

Edited February 6, 2020 by ukrules

[THAIPHUKET]

Fine print= traps

Good catch UK rules

[justin case]

and that why INSURANCE, specially forced, is nothing more than a SCAM

 

pay till you need it, than small letters will come about 

[natway09]

Justincase,,,,,, your comments are well taken but the problem is that a lot of people do not even 

manage to keep 800K in the bank from year to year & do not save the 4,000K a week that they may need in case of a medical or accidental hospitalization after 5 years.

Get run over by even a bike & need traction for 16 weeks or need bi pass surgery

& there goes 1.5 million.

Yes, I keep a good inpatient only policy for these eventualities

[khunPer]

The benefit with self-insurance is that there is no "small letters" to limit the the cover; however, there is a self-insurance limit, namely the moment one is running out of funds...

[ukrules]

There is a new list of countries in the 'hot zone' published yesterday by the British Government and Thailand is on that list.

 

From here : https://www.gov.uk/guidance/wuhan-novel-coronavirus-information-for-the-public

 

Based on the scientific advice of

SAGE the UK Chief Medical Officers are advising anyone who has travelled to the UK from mainland China, Thailand, Japan, Republic of Korea, Hong Kong, Taiwan, Singapore, Malaysia or Macau in the last 14 days and is experiencing cough or fever or shortness of breath, to stay indoors and call NHS 111, even if symptoms are mild.

 

I read about this on a news website earlier so this news is already published far and wide around the world - the above is just the government source.

 

Like others have suggested previously - Thailand is on a list of virus sources right next to China and this is by their own choice.

 

They're not quite at the 'self quarantine' stage yet but give it a few weeks and I have a feeling a warning similar to that issued against travel to China will be issued.

 

When a warning against all non essential travel is issued it affects travel insurance for travelers making a new journey. Essentially you need to renegotiate your insurance policy based on what I've read - this means it's cancelled and your trip should not go ahead without special arrangements.

 

Many other countries will follow this advice. These decisions are not made in isolation. The end of tourism is coming and it's just around the corner.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

12 hours ago, ukrules said:

The insurance industry appear to have learned a lesson after SARS back in 2003. Their solution - no cover for epidemics or pandemics.

 

I went thru my Pacific Cross TH policy booklet in EN last night and again just now... line by line... not the summary brochure, but the full legal policy document.

 

And while there are TONS of exclusions, I can't find any mention of epidemics or pandemics being among them.

 

[Chicken George]

So I go back to the UK and get sick with what may be coronavirus... I'm banned from using the NHS fir free as I do not spend 180 days a year there.. I pay tax and NI still there though.... I can't afford treatment there even a check up with a coronavirus kit!!!  

So its stay at home?????

Edited February 7, 2020 by Chicken George
Typo

[Elkski]

Can anyone take the time  to read all the fine print?  Last week for fun I yours to get  a price on travel insurance through geoblue.  The website would not give me  a quote online  like normal but said to call or send in s request for  quote.  In Dec I just logged in and bought a 3 week policy for my  Jan trip.  

But all virus medical care for thai is taken care of by the government.  I think this was an announcement to stave off utter revolt. 

[geisha]

Easy enough to know, just 

call any travel/ health insurance company, they will know.

[DJ54]

Read this yesterday 

[Kinnock]

16 hours ago, ukrules said:

There is a new list of countries in the 'hot zone' published yesterday by the British Government and Thailand is on that list.

 

From here : https://www.gov.uk/guidance/wuhan-novel-coronavirus-information-for-the-public

 

 

 

 

I read about this on a news website earlier so this news is already published far and wide around the world - the above is just the government source.

 

Like others have suggested previously - Thailand is on a list of virus sources right next to China and this is by their own choice.

 

They're not quite at the 'self quarantine' stage yet but give it a few weeks and I have a feeling a warning similar to that issued against travel to China will be issued.

 

When a warning against all non essential travel is issued it affects travel insurance for travelers making a new journey. Essentially you need to renegotiate your insurance policy based on what I've read - this means it's cancelled and your trip should not go ahead without special arrangements.

 

Many other countries will follow this advice. These decisions are not made in isolation. The end of tourism is coming and it's just around the corner.

Interesting that the UK Government advice is based on flight arrivals from China.

 

"These areas have been identified because of the volume of air travel from affected areas"

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

14 hours ago, Elkski said:

But all virus medical care for thai is taken care of by the government.  I think this was an announcement to stave off utter revolt. 

 Thai citizens in Thailand are covered by their national health insurance.

 

Farangs in Thailand are not, with the exceptions of those who have it via employment or who take out their own private policies.

 

I've never heard one peep about who footed the extensive hospital bills for the various Chinese tourists who came down with CV here.

 

 

[Haecksler]

On 2/7/2020 at 4:32 AM, ukrules said:

I have a BUPA Global policy that provides me with £1.7 Million worth of cover per year.

 

I read the small print from the policy and came up with this little nugget :

I am in the same boat but don't be bothered to go through the small prints. I just send them an e-mail. I will post it here

[stevenl]

OP, on basis of your extensive research (one health insurance policy) you conclude 'Health insurance and travel insurance policies generally provide ZERO cover for epidemics or pandemics'.

 

Why don't you do some real research to justify a statement like that.

[gearbox]

9 hours ago, stevenl said:

OP, on basis of your extensive research (one health insurance policy) you conclude 'Health insurance and travel insurance policies generally provide ZERO cover for epidemics or pandemics'.

 

Why don't you do some real research to justify a statement like that.

Make that two. I just went through the PDS of my travel insurance and pandemics/epidemics are explicitly excluded. Oh, whatever.

[Beggar]

If an insurance accepts your premium even for years don't expect them to pay anything. Suddenly you might find out that a "friend" turns into an enemy. I just made such an experience. I regret every Satang I ever gave to them. I am right but I don't want to fight endless in court here in Thailand and even lose more money to get my right and money. 

[unblocktheplanet]

My last year of Thailand Travel Shield, sponsored by TAT. When a Canadian friend tried to buy this yesterday, he got this error message. 

 

TTS is made up of five Thai insurance companies (mine is Muang Thai) underwritten by Allianz Global in Switzerland.

 

They must be hedging their bets!

[richard_smith237]

I’ve checked for my Wife and Son and have received written confirmation from LUMA that they are covered should they contract Covid-19. Of course, both policies commenced a few years back. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[LivinLOS]

I took out a travel guard policy with AIG yesterday. They have confirmed via email that 

 

https://www.travelguard.com/travel-news/coronavirus-advisory

 

Is the current policy and the conditions under which the policy was sold to me. 

 

Quote

Am I covered if I contract Coronavirus? 
If you contract Coronavirus prior to your departure, you would be covered for Trip Cancellation if there is a confirmed diagnosis, including proof of illness from your doctor that states you are medically unable to travel at the time of departure. If you become ill with Coronavirus while on a covered trip, you would be covered for Medical Expense and Trip Interruption/Curtailment benefits if there is a confirmed diagnosis, including proof of illness from a doctor. These coverages are subject to the terms and conditions of your insurance policy. Please click here to access a copy of your insurance policy.

Seems pretty crazy for a 35 quid 90 day policy, that offers 1,000,000 GBP medical cover

[richard_smith237]

18 hours ago, LivinLOS said:

I took out a travel guard policy with AIG yesterday. They have confirmed via email that 

 

https://www.travelguard.com/travel-news/coronavirus-advisory

 

Is the current policy and the conditions under which the policy was sold to me. 

 

Quote

Am I covered if I contract Coronavirus? 
If you contract Coronavirus prior to your departure, you would be covered for Trip Cancellation if there is a confirmed diagnosis, including proof of illness from your doctor that states you are medically unable to travel at the time of departure. If you become ill with Coronavirus while on a covered trip, you would be covered for Medical Expense and Trip Interruption/Curtailment benefits if there is a confirmed diagnosis, including proof of illness from a doctor. These coverages are subject to the terms and conditions of your insurance policy. Please click here to access a copy of your insurance policy.

Seems pretty crazy for a 35 quid 90 day policy, that offers 1,000,000 GBP medical cover

 

The information on the link seems not to address the question regrind ‘when’ travel insurance was / is taken out. 

 

i.e. IF someone were to take out travel insurance now, would they be covered for Covid-19 complications (i.e. unable to travel etc, or medical costs covered) - or would there be an exclusion?

 

 

[jacob29]

There's also the matter of if your country has do not travel advice, and you travel - I don't think insurance will cover it. I find it quite hard to believe insurers would sell (cheap) policies right now that cover CV19, given the risk it exposes them to.

[Gumballl]

On 2/7/2020 at 3:27 AM, justin case said:

and that why INSURANCE, specially forced, is nothing more than a SCAM

 

pay till you need it, than small letters will come about 

Exactly! A handful of years ago, I purchased airfare for myself and the family to go to Thailand. Travel insurance was generously provided through the transaction, however the fine print indicated that injury occurring while on the ground, and travelling via a non-taxi service, is NOT covered. <deleted>Whiskey Tango Foxtrot? In Thailand, I never travel via taxi; I have family to help me go from A to B. I'm not sure how good is their (car) insurance.

Edited March 19, 2020 by Gumballl

[GeorgeCross]

pacific cross has no exclusions for epidemics/pandemics - this was confirmed to me by email from a company agent last week. i've also just read the fine print (policy) and there is no exclusion there.

 

be aware that there IS a 30 day exclusion for all health claims (excluding personal accident claims) as is usual with health policies.

 

hope that helps and sorry for your bad luck with your policy. no-one could have predicted whats happening right now.

 

[ukrules]

My Bupa Global policy is due to renew very soon, like next week.

 

I emailed them and asked why I should not cancel the long running health insurance policy (not travel insurance) due to zero pandemic cover while their competitors provide pandemic cover for a similar cost and they replied saying this :

 

 

Quote

Thank you for your e-mail.
 

Please note that we care about our customers so currently we are not applying the epidemic or pandemic exclusion for customers who

 

 

•   has symptoms that may relate to COVID-19, or
•   contracts confirmed case of COVID-19,
   

 

 

Also costs for hospital treatment including admission into isolation wards as a result of COVID-19, or possible symptoms of COVID-19, are covered within the terms of your policy.


Please be advised to follow the guidelines provided by the health authority in your country.

If you need any emergency assistance please see below the contact details in the signature

 

Seems I am covered for COVID-19 after all as they're not invoking the epidemic / pandemic exclusion clause, not yet anyway.

 

If they do cancel it at any time in the future then I'm done with them, I'll cancel immediately and swap to a competitor who offer more cover which includes all pandemics for a similar cost.

 

I guess they're doing this so they don't lose all their customers because I know many people have been talking about similar things elsewhere on the web.

 

Edited April 9, 2020 by ukrules

[cerox]

I recently (two weeks ago) bought health insurance, compared different ones (the big majors) and most of them covered Covid. It seems to be that only travel insurances are the ones that exclude pandemics/epidemics.

 

Most health insurances I found to be fine. I am still concerned about the covid test however, do not know how I can get the test once Thailand opens its border again.