Name the top three countries you would want to move to if you left Thailand other than your home country

[seedy]

31 minutes ago, WhiteBuffaloATM said:

Japs have the highest IQ of all and also invented nothing.Reliable vehicles

Germany would dispute that. They invented the internal combustion engine in 1884 ( Daimler & Benz) and all their motor vehicles since then have been extremely reliable. Not counting East German Ladas though !

German cars - reliable !!! 555

Highest cost of maintenance of ANY vehicle - look no further than BMW and their plastic engines.

Maybe once upon a time - but now ...

[spidermike007]

19 hours ago, mikebike said:

History.

I get that Thailand has alot of history. But, on a daily basis where does that manifest itself? Where are the museums? How does that history enrich our lives here? I am referring to the kind of participatory culture, that many other countries with history have. Enlighten me, please. I am starving for culture here. 

 

I do like the ancient archaeology, of which Thailand has a good amount. 

Edited October 8, 2021 by spidermike007

[The Fugitive]

23 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

I get that Thailand has alot of history. But, on a daily basis where does that manifest itself? Where are the museums? How does that history enrich our lives here? I am referring to the kind of participatory culture, that many other countries with history have. Enlighten me, please. I am starving for culture here. 

 

I do like the ancient archaeology, of which Thailand has a good amount. 

I know people from USA love castles, and so do I (from UK). There just aren't 12th/14th Century buildings, fortified walled cities and the museums to which you refer in Thailand. Spain and Portugal excel at those. 

[spidermike007]

11 minutes ago, The Fugitive said:

I know people from USA love castles, and so do I (from UK). There just aren't 12th/14th Century buildings, fortified walled cities and the museums to which you refer in Thailand. Spain and Portugal excel at those. 

OK, I get that. But, there are ancient temples, which counts for something.

 

I was referring to:

 

wine festivals

food festivals (once in a while)

art festivals and fine art museums

live theater (in English, please)

live dance performance (seen a few in Issan)

poetry

spoken word

live jazz

music festivals

independent cinemas that are not showing the amusement park Marvel drivel on four screens, on the same day!

film festivals and a vibrant local film industry (Thailand does create some good film, and there is some creative juice here)

Must I keep going? I could. 

 

I realize some of this means nothing to some of the ex-pats here. But, for some of us it means alot. 

[Hummin]

9 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

OK, I get that. But, there are ancient temples, which counts for something.

 

I was referring to:

 

wine festivals

food festivals (once in a while)

art festivals and fine art museums

live theater (in English, please)

live dance performance (seen a few in Issan)

poetry

spoken word

live jazz

music festivals

independent cinemas that are not showing the amusement park Marvel drivel on four screens, on the same day!

film festivals and a vibrant local film industry (Thailand does create some good film, and there is some creative juice here)

Must I keep going? I could. 

 

I realize some of this means nothing to some of the ex-pats here. But, for some of us it means alot. 

Jazz festival in Hua Hin and Chiang Mai, Chiang Khong The Mekong Jazz and blues festival, and if you just tune in to some few facebook pages related to each and one districts you like to travel to, you will be updated. Pattaya have Vegan festival at the moment if Im not wrong. Just popped up in my feed a few days ago. Sorry, vegetarian festival. Last time I was in Krabi, it was a huge food festival at Ao Nang and I think that was in february. There is festivals going on every weekend in this country. Not to forget fire work festival in Pattaya, the rocket fetivals in Isan and so on

[spidermike007]

32 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Jazz festival in Hua Hin and Chiang Mai, Chiang Khong The Mekong Jazz and blues festival, and if you just tune in to some few facebook pages related to each and one districts you like to travel to, you will be updated. Pattaya have Vegan festival at the moment if Im not wrong. Just popped up in my feed a few days ago. Sorry, vegetarian festival. Last time I was in Krabi, it was a huge food festival at Ao Nang and I think that was in february. There is festivals going on every weekend in this country. Not to forget fire work festival in Pattaya, the rocket fetivals in Isan and so on

Do not want to rain on your parade, but of all the jazz festivals I have seen over the decade plus I have been here, I have never heard of a single musician that performed. It is not only the event, but the caliber of the event, right? Otherwise it is simply a free pass, for the effort made. 

 

The cultural highlights in all these years, has been the Museum of Contemporary art in Bangkok, and one small film festival on Samui ten years ago. MOCA is amazing. 

 

https://mocabangkok.com

 

 

[WhiteBuffaloATM]

Thailand Culture / History / Sport: very little indeed….

yes limited annual artificial imported “ festivals”, compare events here with just SE England alone :

The Season- Opera- Open Air Theatre- Henley Regatta- Wimbledon Tennis- London Pro Football/ Rugby- Athletics- Cricket- British  Museum- Art : Tate / National Galleries. West End Theatre / Indy Movie Cinemas- Stonehenge- Roman Arch ( Bath) - Sailing Regattas- Massive Live Music Festivals.

Castles. Architecture. Kensington Scienve Museums. London Underground.

Spain, Italy, France; similar equivalents on smaller scale

[bojo]

23 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

OK, I get that. But, there are ancient temples, which counts for something.

 

I was referring to:

 

wine festivals

food festivals (once in a while)

art festivals and fine art museums

live theater (in English, please)

live dance performance (seen a few in Issan)

poetry

spoken word

live jazz

music festivals

independent cinemas that are not showing the amusement park Marvel drivel on four screens, on the same day!

film festivals and a vibrant local film industry (Thailand does create some good film, and there is some creative juice here)

Must I keep going? I could. 

 

I realize some of this means nothing to some of the ex-pats here. But, for some of us it means alot. 

Chiang Mai is the best I've found for experiencing culture, but I haven't lived in BKK. It's quite a small city in comparison, but holds quite a few events throughout the year which are enjoyable. They have theatre, but not sure if in any language apart from Thai. The international schools hold many events throughout the year, including concerts and other events. I found the schools a great way to find out what was going on culturally in the city through the parent network and just having a child study there...............................................There are universities which have their events' calenders and the city is quite musical, especially jazz. I remember there being mini concerts, again often jazz, together with perfoming arts around the city (many ballet and dance schools around the city) at smaller venues and often in shopping centres. ............................The city has a very popular magazine, City Life which I'm assuming is only digital now, so great for searching from afar, which is a mine of information for events and concerts, film festivals  etc throughout the city....................................................Many of the locals are very well educated too and have often spent extended time abroad studying and travelling and IMO have introduced/brought back (in addition to Thai and Lanna style cultural events) a  Western format and theme to events held throughout the city which I really enjoyed............................................I'm not saying that Chiang Mai is the cultural capital of the Kingdom, but I would imagine it hard to beat from an expat's perspective, together with a great vibe for older foreigners still wanting to enjoy an active social life with like minded souls....................................................................................Great place, but you really need to be amongst the city with your ears to the ground, hooking up with the schools network is recommended, to truly discover 'what's going on'................Oh and don't forget Chiang Mai cricket club at Gymkana with games held most weekends.................. there's loads going on...............................................................

[seedy]

57 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

live theater (in English, please)

Better go where English is the local language

No market for this here - or anywhere where English is not the norm

[seedy]

3 minutes ago, bojo said:

Chiang Mai is the best I've found for experiencing culture, but I haven't lived in BKK. It's quite a small city in comparison, but holds quite a few events throughout the year which are enjoyable. They have theatre, but not sure if in any language apart from Thai. The international schools hold many events throughout the year, including concerts and other events. I found the schools a great way to find out what was going on culturally in the city through the parent network and just having a child study there...............................................There are universities which have their events' calenders and the city is quite musical, especially jazz. I remember there being mini concerts, again often jazz, together with perfoming arts around the city (many ballet and dance schools around the city) at smaller venues and often in shopping centres. ............................The city has a very popular magazine, City Life which I'm assuming is only digital now, so great for searching from afar, which is a mine of information for events and concerts, film festivals  etc throughout the city....................................................Many of the locals are very well educated too and have often spent extended time abroad studying and travelling and IMO have introduced/brought back (in addition to Thai and Lanna style cultural events) a  Western format and theme to events held throughout the city which I really enjoyed............................................I'm not saying that Chiang Mai is the cultural capital of the Kingdom, but I would imagine it hard to beat from an expat's perspective, together with a great vibe for older foreigners still wanting to enjoy an active social life with like minded souls....................................................................................Great place, but you really need to be amongst the city with your ears to the ground, hooking up with the schools network is recommended, to truly discover 'what's going on'................Oh and don't forget Chiang Mai cricket club at Gymkana with games held most weekends.................. there's loads going on...............................................................

Many cultural events in CNX. As stated City Life an excellent source.

I get a good dose in my email weekly from charityrooftopparty

[Jingthing]

8 hours ago, bojo said:

Very tempting for those that can embrace a foreign language and enjoy being totally immersed in a new culture........................ Those rental prices quoted are seriously cheap, and you mentioned earlier about 60K purchase prices for perhaps something similar, so no need to buy really...........................but I think many, myself included, can't get the idea of security, kidnap, killings and all those negatives that one reads/hears about in Mexico out of one's mind........................Hollywood hasn't helped with the likes of Denzel in Man on Fire and Sicario etc etc.................................To me, Mexico is exotic as was the thought of living in the Land of Smiles late 90's, maybe you're onto something. Time for more research...............................

I was talking about Colombia not Mexico.

Latin America is not a monolith and neither are the countries in it monoliths any more than the USA.

You're not moving to Latin America or a country. You're moving to a specific housing space in a specific area or specific neighborhood in a specific town or city. There are incredibly diverse options. You don't want to learn Spanish? Move to a gringo expat haven place like San Miguel Allende Mexico. Want to stay home and watch torrents all day? Nobody would stop you. The specific places I'd consider in Latin America are not riddled with beheadings and kidnapping and are statistically safer than much of the USA. 

Of course if someone sticks a gun in your face on the street you must give up your stuff and if you're hanging out with prostitutes or druggies or wandering around drunk at 3 in the morning your personal risk.would go way up. My advice is to focus on specific places not comic book impressions from movies or even the news. Monterrey Mexico is not Tijuana. The pacific coast of Colombia don't go there is not a tier 5 luxury neighborhood in Manizales. Also as a generalization Mexico is more expensive than Colombia but there are pros and cons to different places other than cost.

Edited October 8, 2021 by Jingthing

[bojo]

31 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

You don't want to learn Spanish?

If you're referring to me.....it's one of my favourites, bit rusty though not having used it daily for 3 decades

 

35 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

My advice is to focus on specific places not comic book impressions from movies

My point was that for many, it's extremely hard to change impressions from one's mind when one is constantly reminded of it through media and word of mouth...................................... In comparison, the reason many wannabe expats consider Thailand as an ideal place to live is because of what they've heard, seen or read. There's no smoke without fire...................................

 

41 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

The specific places I'd consider in Latin America are not riddled with beheadings and kidnapping and are statistically safer than much of the USA. 

I'm not sure that being safer than much of the USA is a good benchmark BTW..............................

 

Personally, if I'm going to live in a foreign land, I would like to get about alot and don't want to be holed up in a 'specific place' as you mention..............

 

Appreciate your feedback..................

My bad on country misunderstanding, getting lost in all the posts..........................

[Jingthing]

54 minutes ago, bojo said:

If you're referring to me.....it's one of my favourites, bit rusty though not having used it daily for 3 decades

 

My point was that for many, it's extremely hard to change impressions from one's mind when one is constantly reminded of it through media and word of mouth...................................... In comparison, the reason many wannabe expats consider Thailand as an ideal place to live is because of what they've heard, seen or read. There's no smoke without fire...................................

 

I'm not sure that being safer than much of the USA is a good benchmark BTW..............................

 

Personally, if I'm going to live in a foreign land, I would like to get about alot and don't want to be holed up in a 'specific place' as you mention..............

 

Appreciate your feedback..................

My bad on country misunderstanding, getting lost in all the posts..........................

OMG.

In case you weren't joking I wasn't suggesting that you would need to stay holed up in one place.

It's more about common sense.

Learn the places and parts of town to avoid similar to much of the world.

[seedy]

2 hours ago, bojo said:

If you're referring to me.....it's one of my favourites, bit rusty though not having used it daily for 3 decades

Mine too - rusty. But still remember -

La Zona Rosa por favour !!!

[grain]

On 10/7/2021 at 5:32 PM, spidermike007 said:

That is really an ideal lifestyle. I think I cannot spend most of the time here. Way too much nonsense for me. My Thai wife feels the same way. We both feel the backwards movement of the nation. However, there are still things I love about Thailand and many of it's people. So, two to six months of the year here would be alot more enjoyable, than nearly full time. 

That was the stage I had reached too, I just couldn't put up any longer with all their nonsense all year round, so we were splitting our time between Aust & Thai. It was very doable with cheap AA flights, and we own homes in both countries. Wonderful lifestyle, summers in Aust, then back here at the start of Aust winter, then back again to Aust for Xmas/NY. Plus we had stopover trips on the way, like a week in KL/Malacca. Then you know what happened. And I've been here again for the past 19 months.

[seedy]

Roja - told you I was Rusty

555

Edited October 8, 2021 by seedy

[swissie]

18 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Funny that you say that. 

Mexico changed their rules.

For the better.

For example if you can show about 30k USD in your home country bank (similar to Thailand's 800K baht) ONE TIME, you can begin temporary residence on a path towards permanent residence after five years or show much more such as in a typical retirement account and be qualified for permanent residence from the start.

This is a country by country situation. 

There are still numerous (albeit not unlimited and it never was close to unlimited) opportunities for the less wealthy, even for permanent residence including some UNDER 1000 income requirement per month. 

Your stereotyped monolithic description of life south of the USA border is pure comic book.

It's a matter of choosing a better location both the city you choose and exactly where you live in that city.

I'm tempted by smaller Colombian cities where three bedroom modern luxury apartments in high rises with full time security  in literally top rated (they have an official number rank system there) safe neighborhoods can be had for 300 - 400 dollars a month. 

I would only like to add the following: Why is it, that even natives of those countries (those having accumulated some sort of "wealth"), feel the need to live in well guarded gated-communities?

There must be a damm good reason for that.

........and here come the blue-eyed foreighners, thinking that the starving part of the population will show nothing but genuine hospitality toward the foreighners.
An extreme example is Venezuela: Local Newspapers do not report "low key" hijackings anymore. It's gotten so commonplace.

I myself might be a bit peculiar: I would not want to live in a country where I have to look and behave like a pennyless foreighner, only to avoid of becoming the target of a gang of juveniles, them wanting to buy a new i-phone. Or in other words: I would not like to become a victim of a "monolithic stereotype" in real life.

Why look so far? Might as well settle in the South Bronx or parts of Philadelphia.

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, swissie said:

I would only like to add the following: Why is it, that even natives of those countries (those having accumulated some sort of "wealth"), feel the need to live in well guarded gated-communities?

There must be a damm good reason for that.

........and here come the blue-eyed foreighners, thinking that the starving part of the population will show nothing but genuine hospitality toward the foreighners.
An extreme example is Venezuela: Local Newspapers do not report "low key" hijackings anymore. It's gotten so commonplace.

I myself might be a bit peculiar: I would not want to live in a country where I have to look and behave like a pennyless foreighner, only to avoid of becoming the target of a gang of juveniles, them wanting to buy a new i-phone. Or in other words: I would not like to become a victim of a "monolithic stereotype" in real life.

Why look so far? Might as well settle in the South Bronx or parts of Philadelphia.

OMG, you don't get it.

As an expat even with just 1000 dollars a month you can live in a wonderful and safe place in Latin America. Not everywhere in Latin America. That's the point of the importance of matching the specific destination to your situation and needs. A pleasant middle class or even higher life, wanting nothing.  You could eat out daily not at fancy places but still nice food. In the USA, you're totally screwed on that. You'd be lucky to find a place to live in slums you mentioned. Yes, I have an American perspective on this. You may not. 

 

Of course, it's stupid to make yourself an easy target for criminals anywhere. Even in "safe" Thailand, fools wearing gold chains get them snatched.

As far as gated communities, that's a thing in the U.S. as well. I don't consider a high rise in one  of the best neighborhoods in town with doormen/security guards to be gated communities. That's a better quality highrise ANYWHERE. Lots of expats live safely in Latin America in different kinds of housing, just as anywhere just as people live everywhere with different levels of risk. Obviously some choices are safer in Latin America than others, just as anywhere.

 

One thing that is perhaps not a good idea in much of Latin America (again, depends on specifics) is living in rural isolated areas which as a foreigner would make them look like too tempting target. Again, common sense. Yes, for very sheltered people that grew up in very low crime countries, Latin America may be super scary to them, but again that doesn't describe most Americans. 

 

Someone prioritizing safety over everything else might choose Merida Mexico.

Yucatán capital named North America's second safest city (mexiconewsdaily.com)

Quote

 

The capital of Yucatán has been ranked the second safest city in North America by a business magazine.

Outranked only by Quebec City, Canada, Mérida was also ranked as the safest city in Latin America.

 

 

Also lower costs relative to other choices in Mexico such as Puerto Vallara, but unfortunately hot as hell. Personally I think it's irrational to not look at safety levels in a balanced way, it's one of many factors, just as if you were moving anywhere. Personally I would be happy with "pretty good safety" if a destination shined in other important aspects. 

 

Also, please give us a break. NOBODY is suggesting becoming an expat in Venezuela! That was absurd to even mention. 

 

Another point, if you're fair skinned and blue eyed and want to blend in there are plenty of places in Argentina and Chile (now a first world country) for that if it's a priority. Sprechen sie Deutsch? 

Edited October 8, 2021 by Jingthing

[WhiteBuffaloATM]

So I suppose there are so many North Americans resident in Thailand because they don’t understand how much better & wonderful it would be to live in Mexico or Colombia, right ? But yes there ARE nearly 800k USA immigrants in Mexico. Europeans about 25k. With 10 million native Mexicans choose

ongto live in USA ? Paradox ?

 

Merida might look good now but what if the cartels decide to move in there too ?

Lawlessness, serious crime, total corruption, extreme poverty, kidnapping, violence are prevalent in those two countries.

Why on earth retire to such dangerous places, especially being a white skin / blue eyes “ target” ……..

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, WhiteBuffaloATM said:

So I suppose there are so many North Americans resident in Thailand because they don’t understand how much better & wonderful it would be to live in Mexico or Colombia, right ? But yes there ARE nearly 800k USA immigrants in Mexico. Europeans about 25k. With 10 million native Mexicans choose

ongto live in USA ? Paradox ?

 

Merida might look good now but what if the cartels decide to move in there too ?

Lawlessness, serious crime, total corruption, extreme poverty, kidnapping, violence are prevalent in those two countries.

Why on earth retire to such dangerous places, especially being a white skin / blue eyes “ target” ……..

Or maybe 1 5 million.

 

 

https://www.businessinsider.com/american-move-to-mexico-2019-5?op=1

 

Thailand has a tiny number of American expats compared to that.

In general Americans move to Mexico for different reasons than Mexicans move to the USA. 

There are many on both sides doing that without permission. 

Any place can change for the better or worse. A good reason to rent rather than buying.

Merida is only one of several safer destinations in Mexico. Another one is Queretaro that has very well off locals relative to Mexican averages and mild year round weather but of course it's a higher cost option (but still good value) for expats.

 

For those that actually believe the negative stereotypes about Latin America are true everywhere in that large region, well, enjoy your perceptions. 

 

Also we're not all blonde hair and blue eyed and Latin American has different choices for ethnic demographics from heavily indigenous Ecuador to heavily European Argentina.

 

Edited October 8, 2021 by Jingthing

[Jeffr2]

7 hours ago, swissie said:

I would only like to add the following: Why is it, that even natives of those countries (those having accumulated some sort of "wealth"), feel the need to live in well guarded gated-communities?

There must be a damm good reason for that.

........and here come the blue-eyed foreighners, thinking that the starving part of the population will show nothing but genuine hospitality toward the foreighners.
An extreme example is Venezuela: Local Newspapers do not report "low key" hijackings anymore. It's gotten so commonplace.

I myself might be a bit peculiar: I would not want to live in a country where I have to look and behave like a pennyless foreighner, only to avoid of becoming the target of a gang of juveniles, them wanting to buy a new i-phone. Or in other words: I would not like to become a victim of a "monolithic stereotype" in real life.

Why look so far? Might as well settle in the South Bronx or parts of Philadelphia.

We're in Lisbon now. Where my wife's purse was snatched 10 years ago. A few years later, I had a pick pocket attempt in Madrid. Helped a guy who had his passport stolen on the bus in Rome. And stopped a purse snatching in Paris .

 

Crime is everywhere. Mexico is a relatively safe country. Like Thailand, don't make yourself a target .

[Hanuman2547]

On 10/8/2021 at 1:41 PM, Jeffr2 said:

We're in Lisbon now. Where my wife's purse was snatched 10 years ago. A few years later, I had a pick pocket attempt in Madrid. Helped a guy who had his passport stolen on the bus in Rome. And stopped a purse snatching in Paris .

 

Crime is everywhere. Mexico is a relatively safe country. Like Thailand, don't make yourself a target .

Thailand is a lot safer than Mexico from street crime.  I for one would not live in Mexico.

[The Fugitive]

On 10/9/2021 at 3:41 AM, Jeffr2 said:

We're in Lisbon now. Where my wife's purse was snatched 10 years ago. A few years later, I had a pick pocket attempt in Madrid. Helped a guy who had his passport stolen on the bus in Rome. And stopped a purse snatching in Paris .

 

Crime is everywhere. Mexico is a relatively safe country. Like Thailand, don't make yourself a target .

Excellent point. Bag/purse snatching & pick pocketing occur everywhere. Some people don't even regard those things as real crime. Had my cash and credit cards stolen in Barcelona by what I guessed were young Eastern European women, dressed in black, using distraction techniques and making their getaway by the Metro. Spanish lady saw what happened and said; 'They're terrible people'. 

[Jingthing]

4 hours ago, Hanuman2547 said:

Thailand is a lot safer than Mexico from street crime.  I for one would not live in Mexico.

It depends on WHERE in Mexico.

[FruitPudding]

Saigon, Vietnam

Phnom Penh, Cambodia

Bali, Indonesia

 

Perhaps, if I were to leave SE Asia, I'd perhaps consider somewhere in Greece, Croatia, Northern India, or many even somewhere in the Caribbean like Jamaica.

 

For me it's a blend of cost of living and things to do. I come from a boring place so I like novelty and adventure and of course I don't want to spend too much.

 

I may answer differently if I were 65. I'd probably be happy to live in my home country then.

Edited October 10, 2021 by FruitPudding

[Jeffr2]

7 hours ago, Hanuman2547 said:

Thailand is a lot safer than Mexico from street crime.  I for one would not live in Mexico.

Agreed. Crime is a big issue in Mexico. But I think it's not as bad as the media makes it out to be. That's what my friends who live there say.

 

I've spent a lot of time in Mexico. Never had any problems.

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, Jeffr2 said:

Agreed. Crime is a big issue in Mexico. But I think it's not as bad as the media makes it out to be. That's what my friends who live there say.

 

I've spent a lot of time in Mexico. Never had any problems.

Neither have I.

The places I've visited there include Guadalajara, Puerto Vallarta, Oaxaca, Mexico City, Mazatlan, and Zihuatanejo. Including being out alone late at night with some Tequila in me.

 

[Jeffr2]

12 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Neither have I.

The places I've visited there include Guadalajara, Puerto Vallarta, Oaxaca, Mexico City, Mazatlan, and Zihuatanejo. Including being out alone late at night with some Tequila in me.

 

That's when you typically run into trouble! Filled up with tequila! 555

 

I lost a nice watch to a copper in Tijuana late one night. Doing something stupid and he saw us. It was an easy way out.  555

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, Jeffr2 said:

That's when you typically run into trouble! Filled up with tequila! 555

 

I lost a nice watch to a copper in Tijuana late one night. Doing something stupid and he saw us. It was an easy way out.  555

Tijuana is notorious. The place I've spent the longest there is Puerto Vallarta including a two month trip. I found it very safe. The government protects the tourism there. 

[GammaGlobulin]

On 10/10/2021 at 3:50 PM, Jingthing said:

Tijuana is notorious. The place I've spent the longest there is Puerto Vallarta including a two month trip. I found it very safe. The government protects the tourism there. 

If your primary objective is to be safe, then, probably, the safest place is in the womb.

 

Although, I guess, the womb cannot be considered a country, in the strictest sense.