EU is expensive - everywhere!

[simon43]

After some ongoing 'hassles' with the police here in Laos concerning my radio amateur hobby (quite legal to do, but the local police disagree!), I started to look around for another country to move to.

 

Since I'm single and since my income is derived online, I could literally consider almost any destination as a new place to live.  So, bearing in mind some preferences (warm weather, nice food, ham-radio friendly etc), I looked at the cost of living in many different countries, especially the cost of renting a property and day-to-day food.  As I'm from the UK, I discarded distant destinations in central and south America etc.

 

I can sum things up as "What a crock of sh***!!".

 

Since I moved from the UK some 20 years ago, prices seem to have gone through the roof.  Maybe I've been spoilt by the reasonable rental costs in south-east Asia, and the cheap availability of tasty and healthy food.  But my idea of relocating back to an EU country was quickly rejected when I saw what kind of rental property I could get for my money.

 

Want a small but decent detached property? Typically, you need to pay upwards of $1,000 a month.  Many of the properties that I viewed online were not suitable for a dog!  It seems that some owners had kicked their dog out of its kennel and were now trying to rent that to humans ????!  Is the demand for accommodation so great that people are willing to pay these inflated sums?  Yes, I have the money to pay $1,000 a month in rent.  No, I won't be doing that for what my grand would give me to live in!

 

I used to live in Andorra and southern France.  Zero chance of me being willing to splash out $$$ to live in those locations nowadays.

 

Finally, I identified 2 countries which offer a nice climate, beaches, low cost of living and reasonable rental costs >> Turkey and North Cyprus.  Both are outside the EU, but offer easy residency and the ability to buy land and property.

 

I'm still undecided which country will be my new home, because I'm waiting on North Cyprus to OK my radio ham licence. I'm fine to live on the sunny Turkish coast, and my flight arrives in Istanbul anyway.

 

Overall, if you're thinking of returning/moving to the EU from south-east Asia, the price differential may shock you!

 

 

[BritManToo]

13 minutes ago, simon43 said:

Want a small but decent detached property? Typically, you need to pay upwards of $1,000 a month.  Many of the properties that I viewed online were not suitable for a dog! 

Plenty of 'fixer upper' farmhouses in France for sale at 12-20KEuros.

I thought of buying one and living in a tent/caravan in the garage while fixing it up.

Not sure how good the internet is in some of the places though.

 

https://www.french-property.com/

 

Brittany, E20k

https://www.french-property.com/sale-property/119-PERRET6285

Edited November 12, 2021 by BritManToo

[johng]

12 minutes ago, simon43 said:

Finally, I identified 2 countries which offer a nice climate, beaches, low cost of living and reasonable rental costs

 

What happened to Thailand ?

[Old Croc]

 

 

I've seen plenty of Brits buying cheap properties in sunny Portugal on YouTube.

I don't know about your specifics with ham radio licenses there.

Edited November 12, 2021 by Old Croc
possible in

[Will B Good]

Italy...are there not villages offering houses for one euro?

 

The villages are 'dying' as the elderly population pass away.

 

Doesn't sound too exciting having said that....but perhaps better than Pattaya at the moment?

[BritManToo]

9 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

Italy...are there not villages offering houses for one euro?

The villages are 'dying' as the elderly population pass away.

Doesn't sound too exciting having said that....but perhaps better than Pattaya at the moment?

No, there never were, it was purely an advertising scam.

The properties available advertised at E1 were in an auction and E1 was the base price.

You were also required to renovate (to their specifications) within 2 years or lose the property.

Also internet is not as widely available in Europe as it is in Thailand.

Edited November 12, 2021 by BritManToo

[david555]

5 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

Italy...are there not villages offering houses for one euro?

 

The villages are 'dying' as the elderly population pass away.

 

Doesn't sound too exciting having said that....but perhaps better than Pattaya at the moment?

With many conditions ...., example must starting some shop or other small business to fight the dying of those small villages , not really city's, also some age limits as they wish to bring new life to those dying villages , not importing " old life " which has not much future ...

Nothing for nothing .... especially for 1 € ????

[Will B Good]

1 minute ago, BritManToo said:

No, there never were, it was purely an advertising scam.

Also internet is not as widely available in Europe as it is in Thailand.

DAMN....so I don't own a whole Sicilian high street?

[simon43]

4 minutes ago, Old Croc said:

Outworn your welcome in yet another country Simon?

 

So you settled on Turkey or the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus?

 

I've seen plenty of Brits buying cheap properties in sunny Portugal on YouTube.

I don't know about your specifics with ham radio licenses there.

I don't recall me outwearing my welcome in any previous country! 

 

I'm very welcome to stay in Laos, just don't do ham radio ????

I'm very welcome to stay in Myanmar, just don't do ham radio ????

I'm very welcome to stay in Thailand, but stay away from Phuket if you like your kneecaps!!

 

@johng, Thailand in general no longer appeals to me, especially the visa requirements etc.  Ham radio is allowed (I have a Thai ham licence), but it is still somewhat restricted.

 

TBH, after 20 years, I'm rather 'jaded' by south-east Asia.

 

Yes, there are properties available for $1 in EU countries, but the conditions require you to be young, young family etc, not old and decrepid...

 

@BritManToo, we've talked about this before.  Nowadays, I don't think availability of fast internet will be a problem almost anywhere, especially with Starlink coming online in many locations.  Right now, I wouldn't want to buy a property to renovate, because I'm not yet sure if the environment will suit my lifestyle - so many things seem to have changed in the EU!  Sadly, I can't test out that idea in the Pyrenees (where I used to live), because of the silly rental prices....

 

[david555]

1 minute ago, Will B Good said:

DAMN....so I don't own a whole Sicilian high street?

you could ....if you are a young person and would start  food shop , barber shop , shoe repair shop , cantina etc. , so people do not leave those dead villages anymore ..... understand the context they like to happen .

[BritManToo]

1 minute ago, simon43 said:

Sadly, I can't test out that idea in the Pyrenees (where I used to live), because of the silly rental prices....

Yes, It's odd that French rental prices are all sky high, but some property prices are rock bottom.

[simon43]

Look what 400 GBP gets you to rent in north Cyprus >>> modern house with 3 bedrooms, 2 bathrooms and a private swimming pool...

 

Detached House To Rent in Çatalköy, Kyrenia - £400 - Property Id #221942 | 101evler.com

[Old Croc]

1 minute ago, simon43 said:

I don't recall me outwearing my welcome in any previous country! 

 

I'm very welcome to stay in Laos, just don't do ham radio ????

I'm very welcome to stay in Myanmar, just don't do ham radio ????

I'm very welcome to stay in Thailand, but stay away from Phuket if you like your kneecaps!!

 

@johng, Thailand in general no longer appeals to me, especially the visa requirements etc.  Ham radio is allowed (I have a Thai ham licence), but it is still somewhat restricted.

 

TBH, after 20 years, I'm rather 'jaded' by south-east Asia.

 

Yes, there are properties available for $1 in EU countries, but the conditions require you to be young, young family etc, not old and decrepid...

 

@BritManToo, we've talked about this before.  Nowadays, I don't think availability of fast internet will be a problem almost anywhere, especially with Starlink coming online in many locations.  Right now, I wouldn't want to buy a property to renovate, because I'm not yet sure if the environment will suit my lifestyle - so many things seem to have changed in the EU!  Sadly, I can't test out that idea in the Pyrenees (where I used to live), because of the silly rental prices....

 

I had amended my post just before your reply. My question was a little unfair.

I have been reading about your life, travails, businesses, etc on this forum for more than 16 years. You have a penchant for sharing many intimate details of your life beyond what most here would do. My recollections of your posts are that you have had various  difficulties in many places resulting in a mobile lifestyle.

[norfolkandchance]

Beware of buying in Northern Cyprus.  I dabbled a few years ago but decided against it. Land and houses may be actually owned by Greek Cypriots who fled south in 1974 after the Turkish invasion. Thinks might have changed since then.

I settled in Southern Italy. ( Basilicata). Houses and land are still good value. Large beer €2? Pizza €6.

[Denim]

Did you check out Malta ?  I haven't  ....just asking out of curiosity .

[Will B Good]

1 minute ago, Denim said:

Did you check out Malta ?  I haven't  ....just asking out of curiosity .

The trouble with these island destinations is traveling elsewhere ........you have the cost of a (usually expensive) flight to even begin your journey.

[Fat is a type of crazy]

It seems like your life is being limited by ham radio. Obviously it's something you love. I am just curious, if you like talking to people around the world, isn't the internet sufficient. Is it like a trip back in time or does it have some other appeal. 

Edited November 12, 2021 by Fat is a type of crazy

[Old Croc]

The situation with the United Nations  demilitarised zone in Cyprus might hinder the use of ham radios there. Just a thought.

Many may not be aware that many countries still send peacekeepers there. Australian police agencies have been providing personnel for decades. 

[simon43]

5 minutes ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

It seems like your life is being limited by ham radio. Obviously it's something you love. I am just curious, if you like talking to people around the world, isn't the internet sufficient. Is it like a trip back in time or does it have some other appeal. 

Actually, I find talking to other radio hams mostly boring!!  That's not what I use it for.  I like to design antennas and radio communications systems.  To test them, I need to have a ham radio licence.  In most territories, that's not a problem.  In some territories, it can be more difficult....

 

Malta has recently introduced a Nomad Visa.  But you need to commit to bringing $2,500 USD into Malta every month.  I prefer to spread my lowly income across several different bank accounts in different countries.  So Malta is not for me.

 

North Cyprus is of course, only recognised by Turkey.  At my age, I don't want to buy.  I prefer to rent.  This is especially the case when visa and ham radio rules can change...  The territory does (currently) allow radio hams ????

Edited November 12, 2021 by simon43

[Old Croc]

I recall when Simon leased property near Phuket Airport he had some sort of booster or backup system which enhanced the flight radar there. (I don't know details)

I do recall when he left the Island it was no longer possible to track planes on the taxiways with FlightRadar. 

[Hugh Cow]

Simon, it doesnt seem to make sense to me that you consider South America too far when you have gone half way around the world to Asia but then I've often wondered why Brits do that. For me it is is still 8 hours from Oz but at least a direct flight. Certainly if rents are an issue Oz is out of the question. $1000 AUD would at best get you a small one bedroom flat in an outer suburban area of Brisbane and more than that in Melbourne or Sydney. House values here are going up at an insane rate.

[norfolkandchance]

18 minutes ago, Old Croc said:

The situation with the United Nations  demilitarised zone in Cyprus might hinder the use of ham radios there. Just a thought.

Many may not be aware that many countries still send peacekeepers there. Australian police agencies have been providing personnel for decades. 

Plus the Turks might have something to say about ham radios. They got the best side of the Island.

One of my War stories. I was on duty in Operations at RAF Akrotiri  on the night of the Turkish invasion. Scary times.

 

[simon43]

1 minute ago, norfolkandchance said:

Plus the Turks might have something to say about ham radios. They got the best side of the Island.

One of my War stories. I was on duty in Operations at RAF Akrotiri  on the night of the Turkish invasion. Scary times.

 

Ham radio is very well established in mainland Turkey and also in north Cyprus.  I have all the 'rule books' and have already applied for my ham licence that is given without any fee ????

[Old Croc]

20 minutes ago, simon43 said:

Malta has recently introduced a Nomad Visa.  But you need to commit to bringing $2,500 USD into Malta every month.  I prefer to spread my lowly income across several different bank accounts in different countries.  So Malta is not for me.

 

Malta's checkered banking history and links with many shady Russian characters has been heavily publicised in the past.  

 

[Jeffr2]

44 minutes ago, Denim said:

Did you check out Malta ?  I haven't  ....just asking out of curiosity .

Visa requirements recently changed and it's financially prohibitive to get a yearly one.  But what a beautiful place!!

[Jeffr2]

My friends are hanging out in Alanya, Turkey, and love it.  You can see some of their videos here:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCUZ_ruZiGLQuIbG99UwvbZw

 

They have a condo in Pattaya, but since it's a ghost town, got a beautiful penthouse apartment for 600 Euros.  As you say, visas are easy.  Weather is good, but quite hot in the summer.  We were headed there last month, but couldn't make it.  COE issues.

 

Cyprus is great.  As mentioned above, I wouldn't buy property in N. Cyprus, but it's quite nice there.  Cyprus is OK also, but over run with Russians and the mafia.  It's pretty bad.

 

We went back to the US for the first time in a decade.  My oh my how prices have gone up.  Especially recently.  Stunning.

 

If interested, my friends have a agent that can help with rental properties.  And long term visas.

 

Best of luck!!

[BE88]

58 minutes ago, simon43 said:

Look what 400 GBP gets you to rent in north Cyprus >>> modern house with 3 bedrooms, 2 bathrooms and a private swimming pool...

 

Detached House To Rent in Çatalköy, Kyrenia - £400 - Property Id #221942 | 101evler.com

Northern Cyprus seems to me an excellent idea also because you don't want to buy there and anywhere, the place is cheap and beautiful, if you no like is easy change another place in Europe.  

 

[Rimmer]

A troll giant emoticon has been removed, this is a discussion forum not a cartoon forum, also removed a troll post from the same person

[TimBKK]

A wildcard entry:  Mauritius?  Immigration seems reasonable (to me at least):

 

https://www.sovereigngroup.com/mauritius/immigration-and-residency-in-mauritius/residency-by-retirement/ 

 

“A Retired Non-Citizen can apply for an initial ten-year Residency Permit. The requirements are to make an initial transfer of at least USD1,500, or its equivalent in freely convertible foreign currency, at the time of issuance of the permit to his/her local bank account in Mauritius.

 

A Retired Non-Citizen Residence Permit holder is then required to transfer at least USD1,500 per month or at least USD18,000 per year on aggregate during the ten-year validity of the Residence Permit.”

 

Hits on your on your weather/beach requirements and after a quick look at cost of living online it seems reasonable, even cheap, for a single person.  Beautiful country too.

[simon43]

3 minutes ago, TimBKK said:

A wildcard entry:  Mauritius?  Immigration seems reasonable (to me at least):

 

https://www.sovereigngroup.com/mauritius/immigration-and-residency-in-mauritius/residency-by-retirement/ 

 

“A Retired Non-Citizen can apply for an initial ten-year Residency Permit. The requirements are to make an initial transfer of at least USD1,500, or its equivalent in freely convertible foreign currency, at the time of issuance of the permit to his/her local bank account in Mauritius.

 

A Retired Non-Citizen Residence Permit holder is then required to transfer at least USD1,500 per month or at least USD18,000 per year on aggregate during the ten-year validity of the Residence Permit.”

 

Hits on your on your weather/beach requirements and after a quick look at cost of living online it seems reasonable, even cheap, for a single person.  Beautiful country too.

Yes, that island was on my list.  But it's not top of the list because I am considering worst-case scenarios.  Suppose my online income dried up?  That would make a problem to afford even $1,500 each month to keep my residency permit... I'm trying to be ruthlessly realistic about the unknown future..