6 hours ago, stat said:

So what is the internal rate of return for your pension AFTER costs, which actuarial tables did you use? Did you buy a 30 year CDS option to cover the risk that the insurance company goes bankrupt?

 

Those pensions never make any sense to a person that is attached to his money like I am. 😉Why should I pay a company for a sub par performance result?

 

BTW if you move to another country they will likely tax your self created pension. But to each their own .

smart thinking for sure - just like in the US, many companies have or used to have pension programs for their employees.  Thing is a lot of companies go bankrupt due to many reasons and what happens to those employee pension funds.  The US govt does have a program to take on those pensions but not at the same monetary level - sometimes less than half that originally promised.  And in today's world it is becoming more and more difficult in my opinion to "trust" govt, businesses, individuals, et al.  Good luck, I do truly hope that everyone reading this is more optimistic than I am.

On 5/1/2024 at 3:45 PM, Ben Zioner said:

I don't think that's right, BOI know when a tax return should be available. For instance when you apply while living in your home country, or a US citizen. In my case, where I applied after living 7 years in Thailand and as a non US citizen, they understood that I couldn't show a tax return. 

How did you avoid paying US taxes - as a US citizen you can't escape paying their taxes no matter where you reside?  Just wondering

3 hours ago, SingAPorn said:

look above 🤞

once a year you must notify your place of residence to the BOI or local immigration.

I personally feel that one should be aware of the benefits as well as the requirements for the LTR.  I am not going to go through them for anyone as they are easily available online.  As for the the BOI LTR that I received in March 2024, it very clearly explained to me that I need to report my residence once a year to the BOI or the local immigration office.  All you need to do to confirm this is call the BOI or wherever you obtained your LTR and ask them or read the documentation on that particular visa.  Ignorance of the reporting requirements will not excuse one and might be a cause for withdrawal of that visa.

2 hours ago, Presnock said:

How did you avoid paying US taxes - as a US citizen you can't escape paying their taxes no matter where you reside?  Just wondering

Where did I write that I was from the US?

3 hours ago, Presnock said:

once a year you must notify your place of residence to the BOI or local immigration.

Only if you don't leave Thailand during that time.  Once you leave the clock resets.  I've had my LTR since 2023 - never been back to BOI or Immigration (apart from airport stamps) since.  

36 minutes ago, SHA 2 BKK said:

Only if you don't leave Thailand during that time.  Once you leave the clock resets.  I've had my LTR since 2023 - never been back to BOI or Immigration (apart from airport stamps) since.  

I am only telling you my experience and meetings with the BOI reps.  In my passport is a note indicating that I am to report where I am living once a year.  If it does not apply to you, I am not concerned, just wanted you to know what I have been instructed by the BOI folks.  good luck stay safe

1 hour ago, Ben Zioner said:

Where did I write that I was from the US?

 

Just now, Presnock said:

I am only telling you my experience and meetings with the BOI reps.  In my passport is a note indicating that I am to report where I am living once a year.  If it does not apply to you, I am not concerned, just wanted you to know what I have been instructed by the BOI folks.  good luck stay safe as for US citizen, my wrong on that ...sorry

 

9 minutes ago, Presnock said:

I am only telling you my experience and meetings with the BOI reps.  In my passport is a note indicating that I am to report where I am living once a year.  If it does not apply to you, I am not concerned, just wanted you to know what I have been instructed by the BOI folks.  good luck stay safe

No offence taken cobber and same with the luck and safety.

FYI Folks from the BOI Website on annual reporting of ones' address - also on this link how to get (renew) ones' Drivers Licence:

 

1-YEAR REPORTING TO THE IMMIGRATION BUREAU
AT THE ONE STOP SERVICE CENTER FOR VISA AND WORK PERMIT

---

LTR Visa holders staying in Thailand for a period longer than 1 year consecutively are required to report the current address to the Immigration at One Stop Service Center for Visa and Work Permit (OSS) either in person, or by authorizing someone to report for you on your behalf. This report must be done on a yearly basis counting from LTR Visa issuance date (15 days before or 7 days after the date specified on 1-year report notification card). However, in the case of re-entering the Kingdom, the report will be due in 1 year from the date of the latest arrival.

The documents required to be submitted to the immigration are as follows.

• TM.95 Form (completely filled out and signed)
• Passport *
• T.M. 6 Card (arrival/departure card) (if any) *
• 1-Year report notification card (if any) *
• TM.61 Form (For authorized person reporting at Sub-division 3 Immigration Division 1 Visa and work permit service center,Chamchuri Square Building on behalf of LTR visa holder who lives in Bangkok)

* If LTR Visa is issued at Royal Thai Embassy/ Consulate-General, LTR Visa holders will not receive a 1-year report notification card. In such case, the report will be due in 1 year from the latest arrival date specified on the arrival stamp.

 

 

https://ltr.boi.go.th/page/how-to-manage.html

9 hours ago, SingAPorn said:

look above 🤞

 

Re: the one year report  - there is nothing new there.  Its NOT a financial report.  It is very similar to the 90-day report in content, and it is a a BIG improvement over the 90-day.

 

Further, the bit about 'caution about losing one's LTR visa' is in my view, only to remind one not to go for a 2nd visa while the LTR visa is still valid.  I see that as pure common sense.

 

ie. don't show up at immigration with a new passport (that does not have LTR visa stamp transferred yet) and enter Visa Exempt, or enter in a different Visa in the old or new passport (while one's LTR was still valid). ....

 

Or if one has a passport with MANY pages filled after the LTR visa stamp, one should pay attention at immigration, to ensure the LTR visa stamp is seen by the IO at the 'border' immigration.

 

My passport has a LOT of stamps from my travel. When I enter Thaliand @ immigration, and when I hand my passport to the IO, ... I have my passport opened at the LTR stamp page (which has my 'permission to stay' in Thailand date clearly marked) and I do my best to ensure the IO does not miss that LTR stamp. 

 

In my view any other interpretation as to an LTR visa becoming invalid is simply incorrect speculation.

 

I believe the one thing there is not 100% clear yet, is for those on a LTR-WP with self insurance ( >$100K US$ equivalent in a bank somewhere in the world) , when the 5 year point comes up (in one's permission to stay) and finances have to be proven again, does that $100k US$ equivalent have to have been maintained for the entire 5 years? or can it dip below the $100K US$ equivalent, and then only be topped up a couple of years before the 5-year financial check?   That $100K US$ equivalent maintenance is not an issue for some of us (after all this is a WEALTHY (emphasis) pensioner visa, but for those 'on the border line of meeting LTR' financial requirement that amount of money maintenance might be an issue.   My suspicion is if one does not have the $100K US$ equivalent (for self health insurance) at the 5 year point, that one will likely be allowed to buy health insurance a a work around.  There may be other possible ways as well to approach this.

 

If one does not have the money after 5 years, Thailand has many other Visas one can choose from.

10 hours ago, Sigmund said:

But what about all the latest posts showing that the LTR must be "maintained" and that requires annual visits to immigration who will ask to re check all updated documents ?

Not sure what posts you are talking about other than maybe my earlier post of a BOI webpage notice basically saying your LTR visa can be cancelled if you fail to maintain visa requirements.  Really zero news there as that immigration policy applies to "any" type of visa issued even Non O/OA type visas.   It's not like you can qualify for a visa and once it's stamped into your passport that you can discard all/any of the requirements the next day such as not having the required income, not having medical coverage, etc., if the visa had such requirements. 

 

HOWEVER, BUT, if a person was dumb enough to fail to maintain visa compliance requirements, it's not like Immigration is constantly watching/checking to ensure you maintain visa requirements....like checking once a year to ensure you still have medical coverage for  your LTR visa, whether you still meeting the income requirements, etc.   Just like Immigration don't run checks like maybe every 3 months that person still meets 1 year Non O/OA visa requirements for income, etc.   Now if a person ended-up running up a hospital bill say for $50K USD, couldn't pay it due to no health insurance polciy or self-insure capability (i.e., didn't have $100K USD in a bank) and Immigration Police got involved in trying to assist the hospital in getting you to pay your bill, well, Immigration now has justification to cancel your visa since obviously you didn't maintain one of the LTR visa requirements.

 

Now how many years BOI/Immigration will want to look back come the mid term 5 year renewal/extension point is really an unknown as the first batch of LTR issued visa will not come due their midterm extension until Sep 2027.    My gut feel is they will only look back one or two years maximum which is identical to the lookback period for some visa requirements when initially applying for an LTR visa.  However, just like when initially applying BOI/immigration can ask for additional documentation if they have concerns about your application....that is, want some additional proof beyond what is typically required.  No real news there either as that pretty much standard Immigration procedures.

 

The only annual requirement for an LTR visa is the annual address reporting where no checks of income/medical/etc., are done....you are only reporting your current address....identical to how people on a 1 year Non-O/OA type visa must do 90 days address reports.

 

If you have creditable posts saying otherwise please provide some links to them.  

 

 

2 hours ago, SHA 2 BKK said:

However, in the case of re-entering the Kingdom, the report will be due in 1 year from the date of the latest arrival.

 

Thanks very much for digging out this announcement to clarify for @Presnock or anyone else who might have missed it. I've been told the same in person, by email and in foreign chamber presentations. If you leave the country during the one year period, the clock for reporting starts over.  I've had an LTR visa since Oct 2022 and have not been required to file an annual report because I do travel outside Thailand from time to time.

 

If anyone still doubts this is the case, please go ahead and make the annual report - can't see any harm in doing so, and maybe the LTR unit will clarify for you that it's not necessary if you have left the country during the past year.  

3 hours ago, Pib said:

Now if a person ended-up running up a hospital bill say for $50K USD, couldn't pay it due to no health insurance polciy or self-insure capability (i.e., didn't have $100K USD in a bank) and Immigration Police got involved in trying to assist the hospital in getting you to pay your bill, well, Immigration now has justification to cancel your visa since obviously you didn't maintain one of the LTR visa requirements.

So what about if the person could pay the hospital bill and used his $100k USD deposit for this?  Depending on how the BOI looks at this in the future, they might well say you failed the requirements as you did not maintain the $100k USD throughout the visa period, throughout the last two years before the 5 year check-up etc.  So in the worst case, this $100k USD might well be untouchable.

On 4/3/2024 at 7:29 PM, stat said:

Is ist still Ok to show a brokerage account (Interactive Brokers) that shows cash over 100K USD for 12 month ? Much obliged!

My understanding was that it needed to be cash over 12 months, never mind which kind of account (current account, savings account, brokerage account). It then became an issue of showing at least 12 statements of account for at least 12 consecutive months up to the present.

17 minutes ago, K2938 said:

So what about if the person could pay the hospital bill and used his $100k USD deposit for this?  Depending on how the BOI looks at this in the future, they might well say you failed the requirements as you did not maintain the $100k USD throughout the visa period, throughout the last two years before the 5 year check-up etc.  So in the worst case, this $100k USD might well be untouchable.

Anything is possible but I would think that might only become an issue at mid point renewal time where they would look back 1 year and possibly be hard core on showing $100K over the past 12 months..  Having an actual policy would prevent such but when self-insuring I guess there is that possibility come renewal time.  

On 4/16/2024 at 12:47 PM, hcvc said:

A plea for help from someone who has already been through the process of obtaining a BOI LTR Visa for Wealthy Pensioners - would you please explain to me what it means to show evidence your current visa has been canceled.

 

In case the applicant choses to have LTR visa issued at One Stop Center for Visa and Work Permit (OSS) in Bangkok, the applicant will be required to update latest travel information and upload passport pages with all Thai stamps (The file must be scanned both left and right pages per one sheet AND ALL SHEETS MERGED IN ONE PDF FILE), particularly biodata page, current visa which has been cancelled with the remaining permission to stay sufficient to receive LTR Visa*

 

For further information about current visa termination, please contact the immigration office where you got the current visa.

 

As per instructions from the BOI my wife contacted our local immigration office. The immigration office said they were not familiar with / had never done a LTR Visa for Wealthy Pensioners.

 

I would be grateful for your guidance

Same with me back then. They can't stamp an LTR until the previous visa is cancelled. But you can choose to have your current visa cancelled on the same day and at the same place you get the LTR stamp, which is what anyone in their right mind would choose anyway.

6 hours ago, Presnock said:

I am only telling you my experience and meetings with the BOI reps.  In my passport is a note indicating that I am to report where I am living once a year.  If it does not apply to you, I am not concerned, just wanted you to know what I have been instructed by the BOI folks.  good luck stay safe

I am 99% sure the 1-year reporting requirement works like the 90-day reporting, only with 1 year instead of 90 days. Every time you come back to Thailand the clock gets reset. It would make little sense if it were otherwise.

7 hours ago, Pib said:

Not sure what posts you are talking about other than maybe my earlier post of a BOI webpage notice basically saying your LTR visa can be cancelled if you fail to maintain visa requirements.  Really zero news there as that immigration policy applies to "any" type of visa issued even Non O/OA type visas.   It's not like you can qualify for a visa and once it's stamped into your passport that you can discard all/any of the requirements the next day such as not having the required income, not having medical coverage, etc., if the visa had such requirements. 

 

HOWEVER, BUT, if a person was dumb enough to fail to maintain visa compliance requirements, it's not like Immigration is constantly watching/checking to ensure you maintain visa requirements....like checking once a year to ensure you still have medical coverage for  your LTR visa, whether you still meeting the income requirements, etc.   Just like Immigration don't run checks like maybe every 3 months that person still meets 1 year Non O/OA visa requirements for income, etc.   Now if a person ended-up running up a hospital bill say for $50K USD, couldn't pay it due to no health insurance polciy or self-insure capability (i.e., didn't have $100K USD in a bank) and Immigration Police got involved in trying to assist the hospital in getting you to pay your bill, well, Immigration now has justification to cancel your visa since obviously you didn't maintain one of the LTR visa requirements.

 

Now how many years BOI/Immigration will want to look back come the mid term 5 year renewal/extension point is really an unknown as the first batch of LTR issued visa will not come due their midterm extension until Sep 2027.    My gut feel is they will only look back one or two years maximum which is identical to the lookback period for some visa requirements when initially applying for an LTR visa.  However, just like when initially applying BOI/immigration can ask for additional documentation if they have concerns about your application....that is, want some additional proof beyond what is typically required.  No real news there either as that pretty much standard Immigration procedures.

 

The only annual requirement for an LTR visa is the annual address reporting where no checks of income/medical/etc., are done....you are only reporting your current address....identical to how people on a 1 year Non-O/OA type visa must do 90 days address reports.

 

If you have creditable posts saying otherwise please provide some links to them.  

 

 

read the previous post several conversations prior to this - it specifies that one on the one-year report of address must also provide certain documents or the agent one sends to do the report.

20 minutes ago, Presnock said:

read the previous post several conversations prior to this - it specifies that one on the one-year report of address must also provide certain documents or the agent one sends to do the report.

 

If you are talking this post there is nothing special there....standard stuff of the TM95 1 year address reporting form, a TM6 "if" you have one, the 1 year notification card/slip you get when initially receiving your LTR or doing a 1 year report, and if having someone else doing the reporting for you an authorization form from you saying it OK.  Standard issue stuff....pretty much the same stuff for people doing an in person 90 day address report in Bangkok.  And I've already done my first 1 year LTR address report in-person and have done 90 day address reports in person when I was on a Non O type visa/extension.  Yeap...nothing special here....just standard forms immigration wants.

8 hours ago, JackGats said:

My understanding was that it needed to be cash over 12 months, never mind which kind of account (current account, savings account, brokerage account). It then became an issue of showing at least 12 statements of account for at least 12 consecutive months up to the present.

Brokerage account is not acceptable any longer.  Only was very eary on.

23 hours ago, Sigmund said:

So assuming one gets a LTR P visa and stays only in winter that is less then 180 days will that nevertheless mean that the BOI will be chasing the beneficiairy for his foreign pension and to put tax ? or even start asking for all kinds of statements if the pension is already taxed back home ?

 

Far to much a risk I guess in this LTR P. Not to mention that despite having the LTR one still has to do annual reports to immigration,  who have managed to push in a fine back door to harass and demand again and again all kinds of  updated absurd documentation on anyting they can come up with...who can really be sure ? Some are great of course, but we all know how some can make life hell for foreigners and retirees.

 

Surely there are far better options I guess for those who come over just for winter months in Thailand. This LTR is definately not what we may think as a hassle free visa valid 10 years (2x 5 yrs)  and wrongfully assume there woule be no more dealings with those fine immigration bureaucrats, .

No issues, and no hassles at all. Your Income is also not taxable with an LTR-P visa. All above board and nothing hidden. In the grand scheme of things, if you travel back and forth living here half time or whatever, it's still cheaper than obtaining a Non "O" or "OA" visa over a ten year period. Easy to file the annual report as well, instead of doing 90 days, but if you travel in and out an annual report to immigration will never truly be needed. No extra fees either

19 hours ago, Presnock said:

I personally feel that one should be aware of the benefits as well as the requirements for the LTR.  I am not going to go through them for anyone as they are easily available online.  As for the the BOI LTR that I received in March 2024, it very clearly explained to me that I need to report my residence once a year to the BOI or the local immigration office.  All you need to do to confirm this is call the BOI or wherever you obtained your LTR and ask them or read the documentation on that particular visa.  Ignorance of the reporting requirements will not excuse one and might be a cause for withdrawal of that visa.

My understanding is that if you leave the country within the year, return get new one year stamp. No need for reporting.  Wrong?

22 minutes ago, sabaiguy said:

My understanding is that if you leave the country within the year, return get new one year stamp. No need for reporting.  Wrong?

No need to file an annual if your constantly traveling in and out as your 1 year resets upon each entry.

On 5/3/2024 at 8:53 AM, Sigmund said:

So assuming one gets a LTR P visa and stays only in winter that is less then 180 days will that nevertheless mean that the BOI will be chasing the beneficiairy for his foreign pension and to put tax ? or even start asking for all kinds of statements if the pension is already taxed back home ?

 

Far to much a risk I guess in this LTR P. Not to mention that despite having the LTR one still has to do annual reports to immigration,  who have managed to push in a fine back door to harass and demand again and again all kinds of  updated absurd documentation on anyting they can come up with...who can really be sure ? Some are great of course, but we all know how some can make life hell for foreigners and retirees.

 

Surely there are far better options I guess for those who come over just for winter months in Thailand. This LTR is definately not what we may think as a hassle free visa valid 10 years (2x 5 yrs)  and wrongfully assume there woule be no more dealings with those fine immigration bureaucrats, .

Only in Winter, less than 180 days.  What are you talking about?  Just get a METV with extensions good for almost 9 months.  Lot less work than trying for LTR.

4 hours ago, sabaiguy said:

My understanding is that if you leave the country within the year, return get new one year stamp. No need for reporting.  Wrong?

I think that is correct...I chatted with the BOI officials after getting my stamps...I indicated that I would not be leaving the country so that issure didn't come up.  There is a note done 18 hrs ago by SHA 2 BKK that appears from the BOI about yearly reports, exiting the country and returning, etc plus what documents have to be filed with the yearly report - form 95 has to be filled in and blv that indicates pension and health insurance info and signed by the ltr holder.  This was reportedly from the BOI website.

9 hours ago, Pib said:

 

If you are talking this post there is nothing special there....standard stuff of the TM95 1 year address reporting form, a TM6 "if" you have one, the 1 year notification card/slip you get when initially receiving your LTR or doing a 1 year report, and if having someone else doing the reporting for you an authorization form from you saying it OK.  Standard issue stuff....pretty much the same stuff for people doing an in person 90 day address report in Bangkok.  And I've already done my first 1 year LTR address report in-person and have done 90 day address reports in person when I was on a Non O type visa/extension.  Yeap...nothing special here....just standard forms immigration wants.

Well it is only once a year so even if it is like a "90-day report" is only has to be done once a year versus many times if one remains in country all year.  This visa is just another visa so what is the problem?   I am happier with this visa than the retirement O and in the 10 year period, the cost is actually cheaper for me.  No one is forcing anyone to get any particular visa except the Thai immigration and meeting certain requirements to enter and stay in Thailand.

12 hours ago, JackGats said:

I am 99% sure the 1-year reporting requirement works like the 90-day reporting, only with 1 year instead of 90 days. Every time you come back to Thailand the clock gets reset. It would make little sense if it were otherwise.

that is correct based on what others have also noted and one from the website of the BOI.  Good luck, take care, stay safe.  BE HAPPY.

18 hours ago, JackGats said:

My understanding was that it needed to be cash over 12 months, never mind which kind of account (current account, savings account, brokerage account). It then became an issue of showing at least 12 statements of account for at least 12 consecutive months up to the present.

As pointed out - this was not the case when I applied.

 

For self health insurance, I tried two different accounts, both easily exceeded the $100K US cash equivalent. One was a 'pure' trading account, and despite exceeding the cash requirement, it was rejected as it was a trading account.

 

I then tried (what in Canada is called) a Registered Retirement Savings Plan (RRSP). ... sort of like a USA 401k, where that 'Savings plan' account also had the prerequisite cash by a large margin (multiples). That was also rejected by BoI.

 

In the end I pointed to a Foreign Currency Account in Thailand bank, that had the prerequisite amount and that was accepted.  I did not want to use that Thai bank account initially, as I wanted to be able to tap into that account (and lower it below the $100k US equivalent).  However, since I now use that account (for the $100K US$ self health insurance accepted now by BoI) I have restructured my finances a bit, such that I don't have to touch money in that account.   But I am curious to learn (maybe in 4 more years time) if that restructuring on my part was really necessary.

On 5/4/2024 at 8:17 AM, Presnock said:

I am only telling you my experience and meetings with the BOI reps.  In my passport is a note indicating that I am to report where I am living once a year.  If it does not apply to you, I am not concerned, just wanted you to know what I have been instructed by the BOI folks.  good luck stay safe

 

As has been pointed out , when one exits and re-enters Thailand, that resets the 1 year clock.

 

As for reporting where you live once per year, when you re-enter Thailand, you still must do an online TM-30 which indicates to immigration where you are staying. 

 

There is nothing new there.