10 hours ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

One major point about health insurance being discussed is the fact that you must maintain it for the 10 years of the LTR Visa. Over that period of time the premiums would be very expensive

 

I thought this is an excellent point, and it is definitely something for those considering an LTR Visa to keep in mind, if they are of the mindset that they are not keen on health insurance, but prefer to attempt to safely self insure themselves.

 

A valid point also mentioned a number of times in this thread, is that everyone's financial situation is different.  

 

In my case, while my Global Health insurance is not cheap, one excellent aspect to it is that it is provided (and subsidized) as a perk to my pension from the same organisation. My Health Insurance payments are 'capped' to be that of a 65-year old, no matter how old I manage to live to. The government organisation in Europe that pays my pension pays to the insurance company anything extra, to ensure my payments do not exceed that of a 65-year old. So today at age-71 I pay the rate of a 65-year old. 

 

Some decades ago, when I first was told of the opportunity to apply for the this "government job", I was a contractor working for the same organisation.  Stopping my somewhat (in my view) lucrative contract and going for a government job meant a big salary drop for me.  The "government job" offered a pension (but frankly I could save the equivalent as a contractor to create my own pension), however the "government job" subsidized health insurance, ensuring I never paid more than a 65-year old, 'sealed the deal' for me. I did my calculations and I applied for the job, and I was very fortunate to get it.

 

Unlike myself, many face rising health insurance costs the older and older they get.

 

As for the LTR-WP visa, when mine expires in 2033, I will be 79, and even if it is available then for another 10 years, I may not go for another 10-years.  Very few in my family (relatives both sides) live to be in their 70s or 80s.  So why go for a 10 year visa if I will pass away in a few years.  

 

Likely for me at the point (if I should live to age-79) I have to consider renewing ... and I may not. I may go back to Type-O.  I think it may boil down to a question of my convenience vs a desire as to how much money to leave to my wife, and our nephews and nieces.  While the difference in amounts involved might be very trivial for me, it likely will not be for my nephews and nieces (my wife will have no issues re: money).

 

Regardless - I really like the LTR visa, and I plan to switch from self insured to using my European Global Health insurance - and once again a BIG thankyou to the forum member who explained to me (with a sample letter wording) how to go about getting my Health Insurance accepted by BoI.  I will put that to the test in just over a couple of years.

48 minutes ago, Pib said:

Regarding the health insurance self insure amount I expect Immigration  vs BOI has a bigger vote in what the self-insure amount will be although BOI has been able to provide an easier self-insure method and in the case of a dependent's self-insure amount much less. 

 

i thought that a good point.  While the Health Insurance requirements for the LTR visa does unquestionably look to be a big blocking point for some, compared to some other Thai Visas, it is not as difficult to meet.

 

Thankfully for many there is the Type-O visa (with no Health Insurance requirements) , and thankfully those married to a Thai also don't have Health Insurance requirements.  I suspect if not for those two possibilities (Type-O and married to a Thai person), the LTR Visa Health Insurance requirements might be better than a number of other visas.

19 minutes ago, oldcpu said:

Regardless - I really like the LTR visa, and I plan to switch from self insured to using my European Global Health insurance - and once again a BIG thankyou to the forum member who explained to me (with a sample letter wording) how to go about getting my Health Insurance accepted by BoI.  I will put that to the test in just over a couple of years.

That's really great that your EU Global Health Insurance can be used to meet the LTR insurance requirements. Good for you.

5 hours ago, Yumthai said:

It seems you're younger than I thought. Don't forget that in case of a serious health issue then self-insurance will be a one-off event as the next health situation adding costs could definitely outweigh the price of a healthcare cover. Now, if your liquid net worth is 8+ digits US$ you can probably face any health expense at a waste.

 

IMHO self-insurance is worth it only if nothing really serious happens (that's unpredictable). If not, maths do not add up.

I hear you - but the plan for us is that if anything serious happens, serious enough to drain the health fund, then it is back to Oz for us. I have been paying our medical costs on/off for over 10 years - so far we have spent less than one year's insurance premiums (touch wood). Likewise if either of us is diagnosed with something serious (cancer etc) then it is back to Oz.  The maths add up if you are not permanently locked into living and dying in Kansas. Whether we get sick or have an accident/illness or not, we are going back to Oz. There is no way I want the wife spending a small fortune on medical costs here in my last 3-5 years of life - we have always planned to return - it is just a matter of when.  I am hoping for about 10 more years here - which will make over 20 all up.  

 

To give you an example of why we are returning whatever happens.  Many years ago in Chiang Mai, I started suddenly having sharp pains in my shoulder and after a few weeks I could not move it much laterally. Went and saw a local GP who sent us to a Surgeon from a big private Hospital that specialised in shoulder/knee surgery in his private clinic. He said it was a torn tendon (golf?) and sent me for an MRI at a local MRI Clinic - 100K was the quoted cost.  When I arrived the MRI machine was something from the ark - I asked how old it was and the technician said 2 years - that was BS - it was out of the late 80s and probably about 0.35 Tesla - the software must have been upgraded.  I could not actually fit inside the aperture it was too small for my shoulders (OK for Thais). In the end I pulled the pin and left the clinic without getting an MRI. I went back to Oz - got an MRI in a 1.5 Tesla wide-aperture MRI and the problem was nothing to do with tendons - I got a cortisone injection into the shoulder (man that hurt) and a few days of physio and the problem was gone and has never returned.  The costs? About $500 AUD - the hospital and MRI was free.  This was all in Chiang Mai City and no names but not a small Hospital.  Back to Oz is the plan - when TBA.   

 

1 hour ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

but the plan for us is that if anything serious happens, serious enough to drain the health fund, then it is back to Oz for us.

 

There is the weak spot of your plan.

You are assuming that there is no urgent sickness/disease that will prevent you (and your wife), physically and mentally, to travel back to Oz, or that several hours (possibly days) delay before being taken care of in a hospital in Oz is OK.

 

Unfortunately, in terms of Health, time matters and delays in treatment could lead to severe health consequences. In this case you'll have no choice than to be treated and pay (assuming again there is no banking transfer issue/delay to bring extra funds if necessary) in Thailand where the bill could amount multiple years health insurance.

 

If you don't live full time in Thailand and keep Oz residency, why not considering an inexpensive travel insurance (paid month by month) that will cover any health issue + repatriation?

5 hours ago, oldcpu said:

 

I thought this is an excellent point, and it is definitely something for those considering an LTR Visa to keep in mind, if they are of the mindset that they are not keen on health insurance, but prefer to attempt to safely self insure themselves.

 

A valid point also mentioned a number of times in this thread, is that everyone's financial situation is different.  

 

In my case, while my Global Health insurance is not cheap, one excellent aspect to it is that it is provided (and subsidized) as a perk to my pension from the same organisation. My Health Insurance payments are 'capped' to be that of a 65-year old, no matter how old I manage to live to. The government organisation in Europe that pays my pension pays to the insurance company anything extra, to ensure my payments do not exceed that of a 65-year old. So today at age-71 I pay the rate of a 65-year old. 

 

Some decades ago, when I first was told of the opportunity to apply for the this "government job", I was a contractor working for the same organisation.  Stopping my somewhat (in my view) lucrative contract and going for a government job meant a big salary drop for me.  The "government job" offered a pension (but frankly I could save the equivalent as a contractor to create my own pension), however the "government job" subsidized health insurance, ensuring I never paid more than a 65-year old, 'sealed the deal' for me. I did my calculations and I applied for the job, and I was very fortunate to get it.

 

Unlike myself, many face rising health insurance costs the older and older they get.

 

As for the LTR-WP visa, when mine expires in 2033, I will be 79, and even if it is available then for another 10 years, I may not go for another 10-years.  Very few in my family (relatives both sides) live to be in their 70s or 80s.  So why go for a 10 year visa if I will pass away in a few years.  

 

Likely for me at the point (if I should live to age-79) I have to consider renewing ... and I may not. I may go back to Type-O.  I think it may boil down to a question of my convenience vs a desire as to how much money to leave to my wife, and our nephews and nieces.  While the difference in amounts involved might be very trivial for me, it likely will not be for my nephews and nieces (my wife will have no issues re: money).

 

Regardless - I really like the LTR visa, and I plan to switch from self insured to using my European Global Health insurance - and once again a BIG thankyou to the forum member who explained to me (with a sample letter wording) how to go about getting my Health Insurance accepted by BoI.  I will put that to the test in just over a couple of years.

Thank you for your post! Sorry to hear that your relatives passed away quite early! In that case maybe a 10 year visa is not that bad as you do not have to go through the ordeal of reapplying for another visa every year when being in bad health at over 80. Just my 2 cents. All the best!

2 hours ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

I hear you - but the plan for us is that if anything serious happens, serious enough to drain the health fund, then it is back to Oz for us. I have been paying our medical costs on/off for over 10 years - so far we have spent less than one year's insurance premiums (touch wood). Likewise if either of us is diagnosed with something serious (cancer etc) then it is back to Oz.  The maths add up if you are not permanently locked into living and dying in Kansas. Whether we get sick or have an accident/illness or not, we are going back to Oz. There is no way I want the wife spending a small fortune on medical costs here in my last 3-5 years of life - we have always planned to return - it is just a matter of when.  I am hoping for about 10 more years here - which will make over 20 all up.  

 

To give you an example of why we are returning whatever happens.  Many years ago in Chiang Mai, I started suddenly having sharp pains in my shoulder and after a few weeks I could not move it much laterally. Went and saw a local GP who sent us to a Surgeon from a big private Hospital that specialised in shoulder/knee surgery in his private clinic. He said it was a torn tendon (golf?) and sent me for an MRI at a local MRI Clinic - 100K was the quoted cost.  When I arrived the MRI machine was something from the ark - I asked how old it was and the technician said 2 years - that was BS - it was out of the late 80s and probably about 0.35 Tesla - the software must have been upgraded.  I could not actually fit inside the aperture it was too small for my shoulders (OK for Thais). In the end I pulled the pin and left the clinic without getting an MRI. I went back to Oz - got an MRI in a 1.5 Tesla wide-aperture MRI and the problem was nothing to do with tendons - I got a cortisone injection into the shoulder (man that hurt) and a few days of physio and the problem was gone and has never returned.  The costs? About $500 AUD - the hospital and MRI was free.  This was all in Chiang Mai City and no names but not a small Hospital.  Back to Oz is the plan - when TBA.   

 

Same for me! In Hua Hin in the "best" hospital the x-rays are very very old and therefore espose you to high radiation. They recommended a CT and I declined after seeing the x-ray which was not even digital.

 

In case I get sick I get back to Germany where all of my health care is "free" and no limits exist. The only problem would arise if I had a stroke and could not move back myself, however some of my relatives would then get me back to Germany and I would "only" have to pay the transport and hospital in TH for 4 weeks. Transport part can be insured as well.

 

However it really sucks that I have to deposit 100K for the LTR and lose the investment opportunities.

1 hour ago, Yumthai said:

There is the weak spot of your plan. You are assuming that there is no urgent sickness/disease that will prevent you (and your wife), physically and mentally, to travel back to Oz, or that several hours (possibly days) delay before being taken care of in a hospital in Oz is OK.

 

Unfortunately, in terms of Health, time matters and delays in treatment could lead to severe health consequences. In this case you'll have no choice than to be treated and pay (assuming again there is no banking transfer issue/delay to bring extra funds if necessary) in Thailand where the bill could amount multiple years health insurance.

 

If you don't live full time in Thailand and keep Oz residency, why not considering an inexpensive travel insurance (paid month by month) that will cover any health issue + repatriation?

You missed the point - if an illness/accident happens in Thailand and needs treatment then we have the funds and some accident insurance to deal with it here. But after recovery, that could well be when we decide to return back to Oz.

 

Travel insurance has a maximum 12 months period of validity - we would have to travel back at least once a year to renew and that would blow away some Govt taxation and social security benefits that I/we have if we do not live overseas full-time.  The rules about pensions and taxation of super funds is not the same in Oz as they are in USA etc.    

 

44 minutes ago, stat said:

Same for me! In Hua Hin in the "best" hospital the x-rays are very very old and therefore espose you to high radiation. They recommended a CT and I declined after seeing the x-ray which was not even digital.

 

In case I get sick I get back to Germany where all of my health care is "free" and no limits exist. The only problem would arise if I had a stroke and could not move back myself, however some of my relatives would then get me back to Germany and I would "only" have to pay the transport and hospital in TH for 4 weeks. Transport part can be insured as well.

 

However it really sucks that I have to deposit 100K for the LTR and lose the investment opportunities.

Same planning as myself there stat - no guarantees of course - but that is the plan. Returning back to a 1st world medical system that is basically free, and get away from a 3rd world medical system that charges almost as much as USA medical costs - it is all about timing.

 

I have a feeling that with the failure of LTR, they will reduce the requirements next year/next Govt - or maybe roll it back into Immigration itself.  The BOI claimed they would get 500k to 1 Million LTR Visa holders, and the latest numbers are only about 43K overall and only 6K for the 'wealthy pensioners'.  I am certainly not planning for either of those events - but either of them could happen.  They could even do what Thai Elite did and up their prices and requirements, and thereby smash down the demand.

 

But because of the need for me to give them so many of my financial details, to prove my income because most of it is not taxed and therefore not in an annual tax return, I will sit tight for a while and see what happens - if anything. 

 

14 minutes ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

Same planning as myself there stat - no guarantees of course - but that is the plan. Returning back to a 1st world medical system that is basically free, and get away from a 3rd world medical system that charges almost as much as USA medical costs - it is all about timing.

 

I have a feeling that with the failure of LTR, they will reduce the requirements next year/next Govt - or maybe roll it back into Immigration itself.  The BOI claimed they would get 500k to 1 Million LTR Visa holders, and the latest numbers are only about 43K overall and only 6K for the 'wealthy pensioners'.  I am certainly not planning for either of those events - but either of them could happen.  They could even do what Thai Elite did and up their prices and requirements, and thereby smash down the demand.

 

But because of the need for me to give them so many of my financial details, to prove my income because most of it is not taxed and therefore not in an annual tax return, I will sit tight for a while and see what happens - if anything. 

 

 

Where are you getting your LTR stats....the part of your post I put in bold text? 

57 minutes ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

Travel insurance has a maximum 12 months period of validity

 

Not wanting to shoot your plan down, but i recommend you check the fine print of your Travel insurance contract.  Most travel insurance plans that i have investigated might be valid for 12-months, BUT that is not 12 months of travel. Rather it is only something like 3 to 6 weeks of travel within the validity period.

 

Its GREAT if your travel insurance covers you for full 12 months of travel, but be certain to check the details.  Because if you file a claim, it is MOST LIKELY the insurance company will check the details (to see if they can avoid paying) and if they find adequate cause to refuse payment, IMHO they will refuse such.

 

Best wishes. 

32 minutes ago, Pib said:

 

Where are you getting your LTR stats....the part of your post I put in bold text? 

 

Indeed.

 

There is an article in The Nation with headlines:

 

Quote

 

LTR Visa contributes over THB20 billion to economy in 3 years: BOI (date 11-Sep)

 

Narit Therdsteerasukdi, Secretary-General of the Board of Investment (BOI), has announced the success of the economic and investment stimulus measures aimed at attracting high-quality talent to Thailand. 
...
Launched on September 1, 2022, the LTR Visa has already been granted to more than 7,000 individuals. This includes applicants from Europe (42%), the United States (19%), and Asia, including Japan (9%), China (5%), and India (4%). 
...
The program has contributed over 23 billion baht to the economy, generating income through four main channels: visa fees, estimated spending by visa holders in Thailand, direct investments, and tax revenues from high-skilled professionals.

 

 

I won't post the link here as such has run me into trouble before on this forum.  Further, other than the headline, I could read nothing to support the 20-billion baht figure in the text content. 

 

Never-the-less, it is a senior Thai government official who is claiming such.  Possibly as credible as some senior RD officials noting their wish for a global taxation system.  ... How quickly should one dismiss such comments? or should one take such serious?

1 hour ago, stat said:

In case I get sick I get back to Germany where all of my health care is "free" and no limits exist. 

 

i assume that is because when you lived in Germany, you remained on the German public system.

 

When I lived and worked in Germany, i moved to the private system. It meant good tax deductions and surprisingly at times, it also meant possibly quicker treatment when i went to get medical treatment in Germany. I know, quicker treatment is not supposed to happen, but i believe it does (or rather it did 10 to 20 years ago) ... where for German doctors, to be compensated for the public health care services they provided, takes forever for the government to pay (the doctor) their money, ...  but the doctor's often get very very quick payment from those on private Health insurance.

 

anyway ... I diverge.

 

Given i was on private insurance in Germany, my understanding is I can never go back to public health care service in Germany.

 

Hence while this is true for you (where you can get German public health care if you return) i do not believe it true for those in Germany who had switched to private healthcare. 

1 hour ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

..... if an illness/accident happens in Thailand and needs treatment then we have the funds and some accident insurance to deal with it here. But after recovery, that could well be when we decide to return back to Oz.

You're not thinking worst case. Massive stroke etc, you ain't flying back to Oz commercial -- unless after a long, expensive recovery time. And maybe not even then..... Or if then, will you end up in a vegetable factory?

 

I'm fully covered medically over here (Tricare). But a key factor in our retirement here was -- long term care. It's very expensive in the US, particularly if (like me) you held off getting a policy in younger years. But the cost of LTC here in Thailand is considerably less than in the US -- and completely self-doable with my portfolio -- helped, of course, by the money I saved on not having paid LTC premiums over these years. 

 

Anyway, my package of medical insurance coverage, and LTC self coverage -- is a perfect combo here in Thailand. If I had to head home, due to lack of medical insurance -- that might have been the least of my problems -- but paying for the vegetable factory might have been. So, all's well that indicates it will end well.

 

Out of curiosity -- how does Oz handle LTC? Is that part of govt health coverage?

10 minutes ago, JimGant said:

You're not thinking worst case. Massive stroke etc, you ain't flying back to Oz commercial -- unless after a long, expensive recovery time. And maybe not even then..... Or if then, will you end up in a vegetable factory?

 

Thats a good point.  A Thai friend of my wife and her older German husband were visiting some small island, I think off the coast of Pattaya (I am not sure if off coast of Pattaya or elsewhere). Her husband had a stroke. There was no hospital. She was quick on her feet. Hired a small boat on the spot ( $$ ) and quickly motored him to land, (with ambulance waiting) and rushed him to a hospital.  

 

His stars were precisely aligned in the heavens, as that day there happened to be a specialist from Bangkok visiting, where his specialty was dealing with strokes.  An urgent injection into his heart (?) ( or close by - the story is 3rd or 4th hand coming from my wife) and that saved his life.  He was in the hospital for some time before considered safe to move him.

 

Eventually, he was well enough to fly back to Germany (albeit extra expense needed in case he had a relapse and plane had to be diverted) where he went to a specialist hospital in Germany. No time to re-register in the German health care system, but fortunately he was only visiting Thailand so he never left the German system.  It was over a year before full recovery.

 

The point is, his medical bill outside of Germany was very large.  If travel insurance is for only 90 -days within a 1 year validity, and if one is outside the 90-days, the the travel insurance will not pay.

 

so one really really needs to look at the fine details of the contract if one plans to spend almost all their time in Thailand.

 

 

.

16 minutes ago, JimGant said:

 

Out of curiosity -- how does Oz handle LTC? Is that part of govt health coverage?

 

You know, ...  your question has me thinking.  Ok ... not Oz but worth thinking about. My private Global  Health insurance is from a 'European' government organisation (they contract to a private company) , where the office is located in Germany, ...  but i pay a separate amount for LTC.  I think the LTC covers me in Thailand, but i need to double check.   Probably I checked in the past and forgot.

1 hour ago, JimGant said:

You're not thinking worst case. Massive stroke etc, you ain't flying back to Oz commercial -- unless after a long, expensive recovery time. And maybe not even then..... Or if then, will you end up in a vegetable factory?

Indeed, that is totally my point. On one hand not willing to pay health insurance premiums to save money, on the other hand being OK to pay a possible massive bill that could outweigh the cost of a comprehensive enough health coverage in Thailand for 2 people during 20 years or so.

Here in the UK , someone needing full nursing care in a private care home might be shelling out £ 5000 / week *. The state only contributes once the person`s savings have dwindled to ~ £ 16 k . So even with the cost of health insurance , spending ones latter days in LOS looks a lot cheaper .

 

* I know not everyone will need this , but there`s no way of predicting it .

4 hours ago, oldcpu said:

Launched on September 1, 2022, the LTR Visa has already been granted to more than 7,000 individuals. This includes applicants from Europe (42%), the United States (19%), and Asia, including Japan (9%), China (5%), and India (4%). 

Interesting to see the different nationality breakdown of the LTR visa compared to the Thai Elite/Privilege Program which also contains many affluent people.  This is their breakdown with Chinese e.g. accounting not for only 5%, but 45%:

 

 

 

6 hours ago, Pib said:

Where are you getting your LTR stats....the part of your post I put in bold text? 

 

Here is what BOI quoted on their website on launch -  The Thai government has set the target of attracting one million wealthy or talented foreign residents into the country over the next five years. https://ltr.boi.go.th/

 

Jan 2025 - To date, over 6,000 LTR Visas have been granted to high-potential foreign individuals worldwide. The largest group of recipients comes from Europe (2,500 individuals), followed by the United States (1,080), Japan (610), China (340), and India (280).

https://pkfthailand.asia/thailands-ltr-visa-criteria-improvements/#:~:text=Progress and Impact,drive innovation in multiple industries.

 

Since its launch in September 2022, Thailand’s Long-Term Resident (“LTR”) Visa program has attracted significant global interest, receiving over 6,000 applications worldwide, according to data from the Office of the Board of Investment. The majority of the applicants hail from Europe, followed by the United States, Japan, China, and India, with numbers continuing to rise.※1 Despite its attractiveness, some criteria and conditions appeared to be burdensome, with certain financial requirements not fully aligning with the actual financial capabilities of many potential applicants.

Following our previous article outlining the qualifications, criteria, and conditions for the LTR Visa, the Thai cabinet further approved the amendment of certain material criteria and conditions for the LTR Visa on 13 January 2025. These changes introduce relaxations to several material requirements, aiming to make the LTR Visa more accessible and appealing to wealthy individuals and highly skilled foreigners to live, work, or invest in Thailand

https://www.noandt.com/en/publications/publication20250527-1/#:~:text=Background,capabilities of many potential applicants.

I am not sure where I got the 43K number from - read it somewhere on a website about LTR.  Just checking it again seems that number is very wrong and it was not 6000 wealthy retirees, but 6000 across all types of LTR.  I think they will be lowering the bar again soon. 

4 hours ago, JimGant said:

You're not thinking worst case. Massive stroke etc, you ain't flying back to Oz commercial -- unless after a long, expensive recovery time. And maybe not even then..... Or if then, will you end up in a vegetable factory?

 

I'm fully covered medically over here (Tricare). But a key factor in our retirement here was -- long term care. It's very expensive in the US, particularly if (like me) you held off getting a policy in younger years. But the cost of LTC here in Thailand is considerably less than in the US -- and completely self-doable with my portfolio -- helped, of course, by the money I saved on not having paid LTC premiums over these years. 

 

Anyway, my package of medical insurance coverage, and LTC self coverage -- is a perfect combo here in Thailand. If I had to head home, due to lack of medical insurance -- that might have been the least of my problems -- but paying for the vegetable factory might have been. So, all's well that indicates it will end well.

 

Out of curiosity -- how does Oz handle LTC? Is that part of govt health coverage?

Perhaps that will happen - massive stroke - but I would hope that either kicks me 'upstairs'. If not - then the directive is we only spend the million baht or so we have in Thailand and maybe bring over a little more - and the directive is also to 'pull the pin if I am a vegetable thanks'. 

 

LTC is part of the Government health coverage in Oz. 

 

Yes - compared to USA the insurance here is not that expensive on the surface. But it is very expensive compared to what you get in the USA with regards to the level of quality care available here.  It is all the same price here - whether living next to a very good hospital in Bangkok, or in the Provinces where at best it is 2nd class, but mostly 3rd class. Compared to everywhere else in the world, medical insurance here in Thailand is very high.  It is a scam IMO. 

 

I will also say that in doing more research for all this LTR stuff, I have found a global medical insurance company this week that seems to offer what I am seeking. High excess and only hospital coverage for an extreme medical problem - such as a stroke - nothing else covered - just that one time only in a year - not for a car or at home accident (have that already) - and at a reasonable price.  Will chase them up next week or two and see what they really have.     

7 hours ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

Perhaps that will happen - massive stroke - but I would hope that either kicks me 'upstairs'. If not - then the directive is we only spend the million baht or so we have in Thailand and maybe bring over a little more

How much is the threshold where you say: "Too much is too much, I'd rather die or be left in a care bed than give these ripoff Thai hospitals one more $"? Fascinating.

 

Health is priceless. Money is not more than a tool.

9 hours ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

 

I am not sure where I got the 43K number from - read it somewhere on a website about LTR.  Just checking it again seems that number is very wrong and it was not 6000 wealthy retirees, but 6000 across all types of LTR.  I think they will be lowering the bar again soon. 

 

You may have got that 43K number from some Elite/Privilege visa news article/advertisement where they have talked about having over 40K active members.  And somewhere in my brain cells I seem to remember one article using the 43K number.    The Elite visa program has been in existence since 2003 and according to some other stats new members over past two to three years have been predominately been from mainland China with around 45% of new Elite members being of Chinese nationality.  The Elite visa program has got a lot of attention this year from the Thai govt due to some grey business operations in Thailand being tied to Chinese with Elite visas....supposedly Elite visa background checks now take longer due the Thai govt doing more thorough background checks on applicants.

 

Buy anyway back to LTR visa stats, my earlier post below has the latest LTR stats (as of 31 Aug 2025) from the BOI LTR Facebook page. 

 

Since the LTR program modified parts of the program earlier this year below BOI LTR Facebook graphics does a good job showing current requirements and the recent changes in some of requirements, etc.   

 

The BOI LTR Facebook page often shows data, tips, Q&A, etc., that is not shown on the main/official  BOI LTR website or doesn't appear on the main website till later on.   Best for someone interested in an LTR visa to monitor both. 

 

BOI LTR main/official website...this is also the website where you create an LTR account in order to apply for an LTR visa directly with BOI.

https://ltr.boi.go.th/

 

BOI LTR Facebook page

https://www.facebook.com/LTRVisaThailand/

 

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/hashtag/ltr

Anyone ever wondered how many LTR applications end-up being actually "approved....or what BOI calls endorsed."   

 

Well, I've never seen any such stats but around two years ago BOI changed from publishing stats that only showed the total number of applications submitted (didn't say how many ended-up being endorsed), but when doing some examination/extrapolation between the old and new ways BOI reported LTR stats I think a person could calculate/extrapolate at least an "within the ballpark" approval rate.    My below Jan 2025 post was my "ball park" estimation of the approval rate. 

 

Now is my guesstimate close or not?  Well, each person can decide on that.   And of course my estimation does not take into account the last year or so of LTR stats where the approval (endorsed) rate could have changed greatly for various reasons like maybe fewer applications from those who could not provide documentation that satisfied BOI like proving income, medical coverage....or basically just submitted an insufficient application to see what happened hoping they get lucky and receive approval.   But from my experience with BOI they thoroughly review each document submitted to ensure it meets LTR requirements, but they do provide flexibility to requirements in some cases.

 

I also expect the approval rate to increase with more "certified agencies" (i.e., visa agencies approved by BOI) now being certified by BOI to assist LTR visa applicants.   Just recent the BOI increased the number of certified agencies from 4 to 8....just look on the BOI LTR main webpage for the list of Certified Agenies  https://ltr.boi.go.th/page/ca.html.   

 

Now a person does not need to use a Certified Agency because if a person has his/her ducks lined-up....that is, has the income and medical coverage documents to upload/attach to their LTR application....then an LTR application can be an easy & pretty fast process (less than 30 days).  And when doing it yourself you will not incur a certified agency fee which will probably cost more than govt LTR Visa issue fee of Bt50K if your application is approved (no govt fee if not approved).   Now I think when I briefly looked at one of the Certified Agency websites they said if you don't get LTR approved then the agency will not charge their agency fee....but I expect the agency would not even accept your business unless they feel you are a good candidate for LTR approval from an initial consultation.  

 

 

My earlier post where I guesstimate the LTR application approval rate.

 

1 hour ago, Pib said:

Since the LTR program modified parts of the program earlier this year below BOI LTR Facebook graphics does a good job showing current requirements and the recent changes in some of requirements, etc.   

 

The BOI LTR Facebook page often shows data, tips, Q&A, etc., that is not shown on the main/official  BOI LTR website or doesn't appear on the main website till later on.   Best for someone interested in an LTR visa to monitor both. 

 

BOI LTR main/official website...this is also the website where you create an LTR account in order to apply for an LTR visa directly with BOI.

https://ltr.boi.go.th/

 

BOI LTR Facebook page

https://www.facebook.com/LTRVisaThailand/

 

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/hashtag/ltr

 

That was an interesting page from BoI ... Given the discussions in this thread, I found the section at the bottom with a yellow back ground of interest, where it states "Insurance Requirements for all LTR Visa types".  I concede in the past, I did not look at all the details.

 

 Looking now what I missed was:

 

1.  Social security in Thailand.  It had me wondering, what sort of LTR visa holder would receive Social Security in Thailand?

 

2. Savings Deposit. Obviously I knew of the 'Savings Deposit $100,000' US self insurance (as that is what I currently use). I concede thou, I missed the 'per person" aspect, and also missed the "Dependents: USD 25,000/person".  I think that a stark reminder, this Visa is really only intended for foreigners 'of means'.

 

Perhaps not so relevant to this thread, but I have a European friend, with European wife, and two children. He 'self insures' (so he says) but he definitely does NOT insure to the BoI requirement. He considered applying for the LTR visa, but when I last chatted with him, he noted the Health Insurance requirements were higher than what he could comfortably meet.  I suspect the $100k + $100k + $25k + 25k = $250k US$ in a savings bank account exceeds his assets that he can comfortably set aside and not have any reduced income (of equity vs interest) irritate him.

 

Fortunately, he does ok on the Type-O visa.  My hope for him and many others like him, that the Type-O visa retains its current very good and not too demanding financial requirements.  The Type-O is well suited for those of lessor financial means.  He and his family are good people. I believe his children are now reasonable speakers of the Thai language (having been here for years).  And they contribute to the Thai economy by their purchases.
 

8 minutes ago, oldcpu said:

Perhaps not so relevant to this thread, but I have a European friend, with European wife, and two children. He 'self insures' (so he says) but he definitely does NOT insure to the BoI requirement. He considered applying for the LTR visa, but when I last chatted with him, he noted the Health Insurance requirements were higher than what he could comfortably meet.  I suspect the $100k + $100k + $25k + 25k = $250k US$ in a savings bank account exceeds his assets that he can comfortably set aside and not have any reduced income (of equity vs interest) irritate him.

 

I think both he and his wife have work visas (teachers at a school ... < unsure > ).  if his foreign wife was a dependent, he would need less for self health insurance (ie 'only' $100k + $25k + $25k + 25k = $175k US$ in a savings bank anywhere in the world - gaining only ~4% interest).

8 minutes ago, oldcpu said:

My hope for him and many others like him, that the Type-O visa retains its current very good and not too demanding financial requirements. 

 

Frankly the financial requirements for the LTR wealthy pensioner category are not very demanding either.Passive income of $ 80,000 is easily within the scope of many middle class retired professionals.Given that there are also significant tax advantages, this must be the optimal retirement visa going and anyone qualifying should go for it.The health insurance requirement is reasonable too.

 

One possible fly in the ointment in the future is the beady eyes of other government departments on the BOI's involvement - since immigration is not their responsibility.It's one thing for BOI to co-ordinate immigration status for companies/individuals bringing significant investment into the country, quite another when it's just reasonably well off pensioners.It wouldn't surprise me if this anomaly was dealt with in the future.But for now "wealthy pensioner" is an excellent option.

Dependents  of the primary LTR visa holder such as spouse and kids do not have to meet any income requirements....and each dependent will require to self insure at $25K (not $100K like the primary) or have a $50K medical policy.  

 

An even a farang who worked long enough in Thailand and paid into the Thai social security program could have medical coverage under the Thailand social security medical coverage which satisfies the LTR medical requirement.

1 hour ago, oldcpu said:

1.  Social security in Thailand.  It had me wondering, what sort of LTR visa holder would receive Social Security in Thailand?

Every type of LTR is eligible for a work permit except for the remote worker category.  So most LTR recipients could theoretically on in the social security program.