Bye bye Thailand, thanks for nothing!

[charleskerins]

23 minutes ago, Walker88 said:

You seem as bitter as Neem Oil and as knowledgeable as a US Republican House member.

 

In one post you said nobody here is in a 35% tax bracket. Wrong. I'm in the highest US tax bracket just through TBill interest alone, never mind dividends and capital gains, and I suspect there are some other members here (maybe Mr Rolex himself) so burdened by good fortune and dumb luck.

 

I bought a Thai business during Covid, I make a nice profit, and I'm not miserable. My business pays Thai taxes, both VAT and income. I'd gladly be a sex tourist, but I have a lovely Thai girlfriend and am content with her alone.

 

Membership here varies considerably. Don't make assumptions or spout inaccurate generalizations.

 

Unless I'm mistaken, the only thing this new program will do to me is require many more forms and document submissions, as I already pay more than the Thai top income bracket, and the US has a tax treaty with Thailand. I bring no outside funds into Thailand either.

 

I do have sympathy to European pensioners, as it may cost them.

Yes!  "and as knowledgeable as a US Republican House member."

[foreverlomsak]

1 hour ago, Celsius said:

 

What idiot makes money in Thailand?

 

LOL

Those with color printers, and anybody legally employed, i.e. teachers

[noobexpat]

1 hour ago, Celsius said:

 

What idiot makes money in Thailand?

 

LOL

 

The ones who don't have to leave maybe??

 

You've not got too many years left to build a nest egg, so head down old chap, hit that grind. 

[freeworld]

1 hour ago, connda said:

Not sure where you are getting your information, but I've worked here, paid taxes, and trust me - I have no access to permanent residency and healthcare. 

After 3 years of working you could apply for perm residence.

[Henryford]

I very much doubt they will tax foreign pensions that have already been taxed or funds transferred to buy condos. If they did it would collapse the condo market and push hundreds of thousands out of the country (with their 800k).

[4MyEgo]

1 hour ago, bob smith said:

We rich folk have this great little thing called OPTIONS.

 

I can pretty much live wherever I want and not worry about how much it costs.

 

In the end if they do decide to enact such a ridiculous policy then it will be Thailands loss, not mine.

 

I too am like you, however, with a DTA between my country and Thailand, I am not bothered in the least as taxes are paid back in the old country, so if they ever implement what everyone is freaking over, I have nothing to worry about, perhaps some extra paperwork at best, i.e. if I remit annual funds from my "savings" account, which is separate to my share holdings, whereby dividends get paid into a different account as do any capital gains.

 

My savings are my savings, not income earned, and they pay a 10% withholding tax on any interest earned.

 

Most people have their nickers in a not, because they can't see past their bottle of Chang/Leo.

[topt]

26 minutes ago, RayWright said:

As @TorquayFan lawyer says, "Wait and see".

Take a read of Barry's article in today's Pattaya Mail.

https://www.pattayamail.com/latestnews/news/myths-about-thai-expats-and-those-income-tax-changes-starting-very-soon-447262

 

Thanks. A nice clear article although I would take issue with one of his comments depending on your perception -

Quote

nor off-shore bank accounts hiding their cash.

"hiding" suggests evasion whereas many people use off shore accounts quite legitimately. If a UK person is registered as non-resident for tax it could make sense to hold investments off shore and under the current Thai rules can pay no tax on the income generated. I know that is different for US folks.

When/if the new rules come to pass that option unfortunately disappears. 

[beautifulthailand99]

Gold bars are always good as cash !

[GypsyT]

Somebody's trying to do something;

 

https://www.pattayamail.com/travel/pattaya-expats-lobby-thai-prime-minister-for-better-visa-treatment-446213

 

[sungod]

1 hour ago, Celsius said:

 

What idiot makes money in Thailand?

 

LOL

 

I've done quite well for myself, not bad for an idiot actually.

[Moonlover]

2 hours ago, ujayujay said:

Why are pensioners with low pensions in particular penalized by the new tax system for foreigners!?

Perhaps you didn't read this article in The Thai Enquirer @ujayujay, which is where most of us first became aware of this tax issue.

 

https://www.thaienquirer.com/50744/thai-government-to-tax-all-income-from-abroad-for-tax-residents-starting-2024/

 

As far pensioners are concerned the most important paragraph is this one:

 

'The program will begin January 1, 2024 and apply only to tax residents in Thailand meaning tourists and short term workers will be exempt. Also exempt will be those who have been taxed in a foreign country that has a standing Double Tax Agreement with Thailand'.

 

Got it now?

[Celsius]

2 hours ago, bob smith said:

We rich folk have this great little thing called OPTIONS.

 

I can pretty much live wherever I want and not worry about how much it costs.

 

In the end if they do decide to enact such a ridiculous policy then it will be Thailands loss, not mine.

 

Well said Bob.

 

They will miss us white skinned Farang really soon!

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, Moonlover said:

Perhaps you didn't read this article in The Thai Enquirer @ujayujay, which is where most of us first became aware of this tax issue.

 

https://www.thaienquirer.com/50744/thai-government-to-tax-all-income-from-abroad-for-tax-residents-starting-2024/

 

As far pensioners are concerned the most important paragraph is this one:

 

'The program will begin January 1, 2024 and apply only to tax residents in Thailand meaning tourists and short term workers will be exempt. Also exempt will be those who have been taxed in a foreign country that has a standing Double Tax Agreement with Thailand'.

 

Got it now?

That's meaningless!

Do you believe everything written in newspapers?

Egads.

Do you realize how often major lost in translation stuff gets published here?

Countries with double taxation treaties are subject to unique treaties for their country. 

Exempt?

Meaning what?

Totally exempt or only exempt for the amount of tax paid if any in the home country?

Your link doesn't resolve anything.

[mokwit]

1 hour ago, Moonlover said:

Also exempt will be those who have been taxed in a foreign country that has a standing Double Tax Agreement with Thailand'.

Best case scenario: they use that as a way to not have to use RD resources chasing small sums from non Thai speakers.

Worst case scenario: They insist on proof of home country payment and no excess payable in Thailand.

 

 

[sirineou]

4 hours ago, ujayujay said:

Why are pensioners with low pensions in particular penalized by the new tax system for foreigners!?

You are jumping the gun. 

What country is your pension from?

Most countries have a reciprocal tax agreement with Thailand. I have only looked int my country, USA,and according to the agreement my pensions can only be taxed in the US.

My pensions are more than adequate for me to live here.

     what remains is savings. 

Would they tax me if I bring in some of my savings to invest in Thailand?

 That would be more than idiotic because it would make investing in thailand not profitable, and no one invests in unprofitable investments. 

 

So hold your horses and wait to see how this thing plays out. 

 

 

 

 

[Morch]

2 hours ago, Celsius said:

 

Well said Bob.

 

They will miss us white skinned Farang really soon!

 

I think it's a pretty sure bet both of you will stay put, regardless of what happens.

After all, this would create too many new opportunities for complaints etc. - would be a shame to miss out, wouldn't it?

[Prubangboy]

5 hours ago, Jingthing said:

My level considering most of my income.is US social security which is treated advantageously has no US tax so double tax credits do  nothing for me in Thailand. 

 

 

You're right. Low income people (below $25K a year) do in fact pay no tax in the US and therefore have no credit to apply against a Thai tax credit. 

 

With no tax credit to apply against a $25K remittance, the annual tax due to Thailand as per the above table is 91K baht ($2,588, $215 a month).

 

No one likes an extra bill, but recall that you're also not paying state income tax and getting much cheaper medical insurance and care here. Plus cheaper-everything like phone utilities etc.

 

 

 

 

[ujayujay]

1 hour ago, sirineou said:

You are jumping the gun. 

What country is your pension from?

Most countries have a reciprocal tax agreement with Thailand. I have only looked int my country, USA,and according to the agreement my pensions can only be taxed in the US.

My pensions are more than adequate for me to live here.

     what remains is savings. 

Would they tax me if I bring in some of my savings to invest in Thailand?

 That would be more than idiotic because it would make investing in thailand not profitable, and no one invests in unprofitable investments. 

 

So hold your horses and wait to see how this thing plays out. 

 

 

 

 

I am Swiss and Switzerland has a double taxation agreement with Thailand like the USA. Unfortunately, these agreements will no longer apply from January 1, 2024, according to rumors! It is ridiculous that this law is supposed to come into force in about 3 weeks and the flow of information is limited to personal opinions from unreliable sources and not to a binding announcement from the Thai government!

[ujayujay]

6 hours ago, steve187 said:

op you will be missed, but please stay in touch with more wisdom,

OK, I didn't expect a witty comment from you either

[Tarteso]

Well; We’ll always have Nigeria, Zimbabwe, Botswana..

[Jingthing]

31 minutes ago, Prubangboy said:

You're right. Low income people (below $25K a year) do in fact pay no tax in the US and therefore have no credit to apply against a Thai tax credit. 

 

With no tax credit to apply against a $25K remittance, the annual tax due to Thailand as per the above table is 91K baht ($2,588, $215 a month).

 

No one likes an extra bill, but recall that you're also not paying state income tax and getting much cheaper medical insurance and care here. Plus cheaper-everything like phone utilities etc.

 

 

 

 

Now that's total BS.

I pay for Medicare Part B and get nothing for it.

I'm uninsurable so when I do deal with the health system here I'm usually massively overcharged f-rang tax.

During Covid f-rangs were explicitly discriminated against for a very long time in getting vaccines.

On  non immigrant visa here, we have almost no rights.

Yes, of course money earned in Thailand should be taxed.

But I think being taxed on foreign sourced income as expats is a very unfair.

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, Tarteso said:

Well; We’ll always have Nigeria, Zimbabwe, Botswana..

Or Panama, Costa Rica, and many others.

[Tarteso]

Just now, Jingthing said:

Or Panama, Costa Rica, and many others.

Was Just a joke.. But you’re right.

[Prubangboy]

21 minutes ago, ujayujay said:

double taxation agreement -Unfortunately, these agreements will no longer apply from January 1, 2024, according to rumors! 

 

I just googled: What countries have ended a tax treaty?

 

2 names come up Russia (to punish countries for the sanctions) and The USA against Hungary for failing to sign on to a minimum corporate tax. 'Couldn't find any others.

 

It's a move by strong countries to punish weaker countries. I do not see mighty Thailand picking fights with The West on this.

[Prubangboy]

11 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

 

I pay for Medicare Part B and get nothing for it.

 

But I think being taxed on foreign sourced income as expats is a very unfair.

You can opt out of Medicare Part B. It would prob pay for your new Thai Tax bill.

 

Most countries have some kind of tax for remitted income. In Mexico and Brazil, they tax ALL world wide income, whether remitted or not. At crazy high rates that kick in early

 

Unpopular opinion: We live here, we use the road, police ect. So Thailand deserves some revenue for that.

 

 

[Lee65]

48 minutes ago, ujayujay said:

It is ridiculous that this law is supposed to come into force in about 3 weeks and the flow of information is limited to personal opinions from unreliable sources and not to a binding announcement from the Thai government!

 

What's also ridiculous is people posting thousands of personal opinions from unreliable sources - and others reading and fretting over them.

[Prubangboy]

19 minutes ago, Prubangboy said:

Unpopular opinion: We live here, we use the road, police ect. So Thailand deserves some revenue for that.

 

 

 

I have read on this forum dozens of times of Trump-types outraged that migrants in the USA get medical care, social services, education when they are not US citizens.

 

Therefore, I expect they will be first in line to pay Thai taxes with a smile, lest they be thought of as foreigner freeloaders.

 

If you believe in America First back home, (or no benefits for asylum seekers in Europe), then what's wrong with Thai people believing in Thailand First about us -we who are much, much richer than migrants and asylum seekers?

Edited December 8, 2023 by Prubangboy

[scorecard]

7 hours ago, Celsius said:

Hahaha.... this table must be a joke, right?

 

I mean, just look at it..... Thailand pretending to be a high income developed country that it isn't.

 

Thank god that after filing a tax return,  you mugs will have access to permanent residency and free healthcare!

 

And you don't have to worry about 90 day reports too!

 

WHAT A RELIEF!

 

"Thank god that after filing a tax return,  you mugs will have access to permanent residency and free healthcare!" 

 

Can you please expand the details of this. Thanks.

[BE88]

6 hours ago, bob smith said:

We rich folk have this great little thing called OPTIONS.

 

I can pretty much live wherever I want and not worry about how much it costs.

 

In the end if they do decide to enact such a ridiculous policy then it will be Thailands loss, not mine.

 

Well said Bob, we are not at all linked to Thailand where they don't want to integrate us due to pure racism therefore they always indicate on our non-immigration extension with regular checks to see if we are still where we live, which civilized country does this? Only in countries where dictatorship exists.

 

So if they continue to bust my balls I have no problem with changing country.

 

[Prubangboy]

2 minutes ago, BE88 said:

 

 

So if they continue to bust my balls I have no problem with changing country.

 

Will you change countries to save $215 a month?